Fsmash: when do you use it?

[ckm]

I find myself rarely using this move due to its long(er) startup lag. Basically just for punishing my opponents mistakes, really. I rarely use it as part of combos or when I'm really on the offensive. (of course, dash-pivot cancelling has made me attempt it more, but I rarely land it =/). Id like to include it in my game, as a good player will maximize the usefulness of all of his character's moves, no matter how situational (also, more techniques = less decay on other moves) So... how do you guys work it into your game?

 

[SwastikaPyle]

A good player does not need to maximize the usefulness of every move. Typically, a sign that your good means that you don't use certain moves unless it's a really obvious situation for it.

Basically, I never use F-smash. The lag alienates me. It's d-smash or nothing.

 

[Kayzee]

I don't use it often, but when I do use it, it's an automatic K.O. I use it when my opponents are on the ropes (Coming down from above, or trying to recover.), and need a gentle nudge over the edge. I can even get kills at 90% off the edge of the stage with an uncharged fsmash. Because I hardly ever use the move, it doesn't decay, and is always at full power.

 

[R1ngo]

A good player does not need to maximize the usefulness of every move. Typically, a sign that your good means that you don't use certain moves unless it's a really obvious situation for it.

Basically, I never use F-smash. The lag alienates me. It's d-smash or nothing.

Maybe i'm just a bad player......

My favorite time to use it is in a dash pivot cancel, i don't use it often by it self tho, i use it most often in doubles tho, in singles i use it rarely but when i do people don't see it coming b/c of the low frequency, so it normally gets a kill, but dont' listen to me, because i;m a bad player

 

[IR.O.B.edC.Falcon]

I use it to knock dumb snake players out of their up b's. Makes me laugh when they die too.

 

[Alphabravo]

Actually, a good time to use the F-smash is when the opponent either roll or spot dodges.

Essentially, since the F-smash has start-up lag, you can use the small delay to time the hit so it strikes the opponent out of his/her roll or spot dodge. Predict then punish. It's best used at high percents if the move hasn't been used yet.

 

[ckm]

Actually, a good time to use the F-smash is when the opponent either roll or spot dodges.

Essentially, since the F-smash has start-up lag, you can use the small delay to time the hit so it strikes the opponent out of his/her roll or spot dodge. Predict then punish. It's best used at high percents if the move hasn't been used yet.

this is a great point.

 

[Quez256]

but dont' listen to me, because i;m a bad player

Your videos seem to suggest the opposite.

Personally, if I can see something obvious coming, I'll throw a f-smash. I guess that could be called punishing though. However, I tend to use dimensional cape for similar reasons, so that might kill a bit of my credibility.

 

[Master Raven]

Actually, a good time to use the F-smash is when the opponent either roll or spot dodges.

Essentially, since the F-smash has start-up lag, you can use the small delay to time the hit so it strikes the opponent out of his/her roll or spot dodge. Predict then punish. It's best used at high percents if the move hasn't been used yet.

This, I believe, is the best way to use Fsmash. It generally should be used when players least expect it.

 

[giuocob]

I almost never use it, except accidentally when I'm trying to do an Ftilt. Dsmash is almost as powerful, and has much better range and much less lag.

 

[SonicLucario]

I rarely use it.I try but I usually just use dsmash.I'll try using fsmash in killing situations more.

 

[Gargleman]

I tend to use it only when they trip or I mess up a f-tilt and then I get owned in the face.

 

[Ultimatum479]

AB said it. You spam MetaKnight's quick moves constantly, especially his aerials, so people get used to spot-dodging the moment you start an attack. Then throw an Fsmash at them, laugh as they spot-dodge the lag and come out of the dodge only to get wtfPWNT.

Similar tactics work with the Down-B: use it only by attacking out of it, then, when they start to expect that, suddenly teleport towards them without attacking out of it and quickly Fsmash to kill (or just Tornado to rack up damage if they're not in high percents).

 

[the great jonzales]

yer predicting = punishment (from you) i find it useful for when ppl roll, majority of times players wll roll behind you just fsmash the other way i've found neutral a then fsmash to be useful once or twice in a match, especially when ure neutral a has stopped someonne's rush, it's quickish that player that aernt aware all of the time will get hit, n plus u start with neutral a and most players don't tend to care if they get hit by that

 

[Olimarman]

What I've found useful about fsmash is that even though it has start up lag, its a small enough time to predict when it will hit. Ex. if someone is in a vulnerable free fall for w/e reason you can use it right before someone lands early enough that you know they will surely land where you will strike.

 

[Shears]

edgeguarding. charge it up and it has great KO potential. startup lag is spent during charge so it comes out fast when you release it.

 

[Ice9]

I RARELY use it. Like Kayzee said... its Dsmash or nothing.

 

[kirbstir]

I only use fsmash

 

[Ice9]

I only use fsmash

When i grow up I wanna be just like kirbstir.

 

[xiferp]

I liked how my playing changed a little after reading replies here. I rarely ever used Fsmash, unless you count accidental Fsmashes that were meant to be Ftilts. Then I started using it for punishing, especially on Cyphering Snakes.

Fsmash is nice for punishing, especially since it'll usually have no decay and it'll restore all your other KO moves that come out faster. Win-win.

 

[ckm]

One more decent use for F-smash:

After making someone trip with a Dtilt, take a step forward and F-smash their helpless, prone body.

Seems to work well for me, try it out!

 

[angelspe3d]

welll sumtimes ill try to get a quick ko by doing a dthrow.... and just charging it ihopfully they tech into it :D worx on bad kids

 

[ckm]

welll sumtimes ill try to get a quick ko by doing a dthrow.... and just charging it ihopfully they tech into it :D worx on bad kids

haha cool, this is the kinda stuff I had in mind when I made this thread. So I can get SOME use out of the **** move, even if most is completely situational.

The cool thing about Fsmash is that although the startup lag sux, at least there is very little ending lag... meaning its not really punishable, unless you get hit before it comes out... so charging it and just hoping to get lucky is not really a terrible idea i guess.

 

[JJR.O.B.]

never! never! ever!

 

[ckm]

I was just watching a video of forte playing and he used it quite a bit.

One thing that I think he may have been doing is charging the fsmash, not really expecting to hit with it, but basically tricking the other person into attempting to punish. When they rushed in, he dsmashed.

 

[angelspe3d]

h3y i am going to go g3t a lil sd to usb thingy to uplad sum vids....
cuz i was watchin sum from th3 UCLA tourny and i us3d it a coupl3 tim3s in th3r3 its us3full..... but yahh plaus u can rat3 my m3taknight sinc3 kno on3 has s33n min3s :D

 

[Kiryu]

h3y i am going to go g3t a lil sd to usb thingy to uplad sum vids....
cuz i was watchin sum from th3 UCLA tourny and i us3d it a coupl3 tim3s in th3r3 its us3full..... but yahh plaus u can rat3 my m3taknight sinc3 kno on3 has s33n min3s :D

Only if you stop using 3s instead of Es.

 

[TheSMASHtyke]

h3y i am going to go g3t a lil sd to usb thingy to uplad sum vids....
cuz i was watchin sum from th3 UCLA tourny and i us3d it a coupl3 tim3s in th3r3 its us3full..... but yahh plaus u can rat3 my m3taknight sinc3 kno on3 has s33n min3s :D

Don't you ever find it annoying to try reading someone's post who replaces a simple vowel with 3?

I have to concur with most of the replies in this thread. I never use the F-smash unless there absolutely begging to be K.O.ed. It's almost always the Down smash for me (I accidentally use the U-smash instead of my U-tilt a lot though).

 

[angelspe3d]

:-( i cant yo!!!!
must i tak3 a pic to prov3 that it is brok3n??? i dont click copy pasting Es ....lol
and uploading is taking soo soo long

 

[LoyalSoldier]

Because of the delay the only time I find it reasonable to use when the foe is stuck in an equal delay. Generally you don't need to use Fsmash too much since his DSmash is his best smash, but it has its uses.

 

[the great jonzales]

i find it perfect after u've sidestepped dodged a tether grab, although ne move can take advantage of that kinda lag

 

[anar9kis]

Its Called Control-v, You Don't Have To Click Copy Paste Each 'e'

 

[Jarabe 93]

I only use Fsmash to punish laggy attacks, or against spot-dodge happy opponents (they spot dodge during the startup lag, only to take a direct Fsmash anyway).

 

[Jester Kirby]

I only use it when my opponent has no chance to escape....otherwise it's sooo slow! Not really to Meta-Knight's style....i prefer down smash unless I'm really having trouble koing...then I try and catch my opponent with my forward smash while they're lagging from a move or something.

 

[angelspe3d]

Its Called Control-v, You Don't Have To Click Copy Paste Each 'e'

lol ya but w/3 its all good but if anyon3 wants to s33 wh3n i fsmash in dubs h3r3s sum vids
critiqu3 it and w/3 ya wanna say.... b3 m3an or b3 nic3 i dont car3 :D

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=170799

VIDS AR3 INSID3

 

[R.Kefka]

It's important to consider that forward-smash makes you pull back *very slightly* and reduces your height *also very slightly.* This means you can sucker people into the hit by standing at the edge of their range; the downside is this does not work on bad players. Good players who focus on spacing their moves perfectly are susceptible to this.

Also, forward-smash hits higher than down-smash and KO's slightly earlier. It has very low ending lag as well (but somebody mentioned that earlier, citing Forte's usage of it). Its ending lag, given its range, is nearly unpunishable in my experience.

 

[C@sH Mooney]

I use it against scrubs, and randomly when I have a stock lead.

Otherwise, I would rather attempt to kill with dsmash, or something with less lag.

 

[ckm]

Ive been using this for mindgames a bit recently, thought i would mention it.

What is good about the Fsmash is that its ending lag is basically nonexistant. Its the startup lag that sucks, so sometiemes ill just charge up an fsmash and wait for them to either a) get hit by it, which is unlikely with good players, but it happens, or b) they wait for the smash to come out, then try to punish. This is when I Dsmash them in the face, because MK + Lag = does not compute.


Thanks for all the suggestions though, guys. I have begun to incorporate this move into my game alot more.

 

[grandmaster192]

You should not consider it a KO move, but rather a move that does good damage without staling your down smash. Try using it out of your Tornado's to trick people.

 

[the great jonzales]

It's important to consider that forward-smash makes you pull back *very slightly* and reduces your height *also very slightly.* This means you can sucker people into the hit by standing at the edge of their range; the downside is this does not work on bad players. Good players who focus on spacing their moves perfectly are susceptible to this.QUOTE]

hmm, i'd think stutter stepping would be easier no ?