Social "Friends being fought for!" Ike General Discussion

[Casval]

So I was stuck in Toha in Path of Radiance because people kept dying and I'd keep resetting, so I eventually said screw it and only sent out Ike, Titania, and Lethe. I was able to recruit Zihark and make it to the ship with no casualties.

I guess it's true, sometimes less is more.

I wasn't able to visit all the houses before they were burned down though. Did I miss anything important?

 

[Arrei]

Holy crap! Black Knight Mii Costume!!!

https://youtu.be/kERaZDelEYQ?t=52s

Ike: "Something's different about you. ...Did you lose weight?"


Also: well shoot, if Lloyd Irving's going to be a Mii costume I guess that means he's not going to get to be a fighter...

 

[McKnightlíght]

Anyone found any changes to Ike in this new update yet?

 

[Mario766]

Ike doesn't look to have gotten anything outside of landing lag/IASA changes.

 

[106Ghost]

It feels like Ike has a bigger sweetspot on his f smash I am having an easier time getting the sweet spot on fsmash

 

[Mario766]

Up Air does less KBG but has higher BKB.

 

[-RedX-]

Yo, Sheik dies at 84% if you do Uthrow->Uair with no rage.
Tested this on 3DS where blastzones are apparently bigger.

 

[Boo Mansion]

Is it just me or does it seem like dthrow kills later now?

 

[Xuan Wu]

Good to see U-air is a confirmed change. This one is irrelevant to competitive play but I'm surprised the visual glitch on Aether after using Great Aether went untouched, considering that they fixed Aether Drive in a previous patch.

The yellow highlights of Ragnell still disappear, and it still seems to have missing hitboxes. After using it once, Aether returns to normal. ^-^

 

[san.]

http://opensa.dantarion.com/s4/raw/diff-128-144/ for changes.

It doesn't include ending lag and some properties of special moves.

 

[Mario766]

Up Air being buffed makes Ike SCARY on Delfino. You'll get Rosalina level of salt if you air dodge against Ike now, with early kills up to as low as 40 percent.

 

[Champ Gold]

Is it just me or the FSmash has less lag than it did before?

 

[Mario766]

It has exactly the same endlag.

 

[Banjobeast158]

So what do the changes to dthrow actually do?

 

[Mario766]

Makes it better in teams due to it hitting others bettern

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

Today I had my first tourney, I lost all the sets, the first set I was defeated sorely, due to me being nervous, and OFC having an unfavorable match up, which is Luigi, I went to losers, where I had my second set, I actually held my grounds in this one, even though I had ness playing against me (another unfavorable matchup), I lost the first match due to an SD, the second game I played it on Dreamland which was a close win for me, the last match was the decider, where I controlled the game and I was gonna win, but lost because I found out that I was choker xD....anyways it was crowded, sweaty, nerve wreck yet fun experience.

 

[Mario766]

Sounds like you need more tournament experience.

My advice is to practice MUs and continue going. It's the only way to remove tournament nerves.

 

[Krysco]

For the first time ever, I have bought a dlc Mii Costume: the Black Knight. Visually, it looks amazing although there are a few problems I have with it: the cape isn't as large as the actual BK cape and when using the tallest and fattest Mii possible...he's still shorter than Ike. Has more range on moves like jab, dtilt and notably fsmash though! The most beautiful thing to me though is the Alondite <3 Or Ettard I suppose if you'd rather use the Japanese naming.

I suppose this could be better suited for one of the Mii Swordfighter threads but this is a social and I don't use Mii Sword enough to care for his board. Might post a picture or video to show the size difference.

 

[Quickhero]

Man, Sakurai definitely seems to be quietly lurking under my bedroom at night, because all my dreams have come true. My man Ike's weakest aerial got buffed from being "Good, but a bit on the weaker side in comparison." to "Holy crap. This is an insanely strong aerial that kills at like 100% with no rage from the left/right platform of BF." The Sheik nerf means that Ike has no bad match-ups anymore, Ike could actually challenge Sheik beforehand and now that Sheik can't juggle Ike with f-air that much Ike definitely does more than just "is 50/50 at top level", I think it's now just 50/50 in general.

I still use Sheik and Marth for specific match-ups such as ZSS and Rosalina, (respectively) but that's mostly for bias reasons. Ike has all the tools he needs to not only do well as a solo main, but a character as a whole; between his good kill-power, his good combos, the speed and power of most of his attacks, and his tankiness, Ike is just such a good character and I am surprised that so many few people play him lol.

 

[Arrei]

Is the Sheik nerf that significant? Fair isn't the only reason Ike struggles against her.

Also Samurai needs to lurk under more of our beds then if that gets us buffs. I'll leave a plate of cookies and milk under my bed along with a note saying "Plz un-suck Dair thx".

Wait, my bed doesn't rise off the ground.

Dang.

 

[the king of murder]

I personally think dair is an alright move. I mean it does kill pretty early and it can edgeguard in specific scenarios.

All Ike needs now is a great buff to D-smash and you actually have an excuse to use every move in his arsenal.

 

[Arrei]

The problem is its awkward frame data. It's active for about the same as Captain Falcon's Dair, but like San went over in the patch discussion thread, it has unholy amounts of endlag during which Ike cannot respond at all because they kept the animation frames from Brawl's lingering hitbox, but removed the lingering hitbox itself. Strong as it is, that makes it just feel so incredibly unwieldy to use, after Little Mac's predictably bad Dair and Roy's Dair, which was copied from ours and is only worse because Roy has the air time of a sack of boulders.

I've actually had some success working Dsmash into my arsenal after finding out its front hit had as much knockback as Bair during the last patch. It's obviously still not a very safe move - the front hit is good but that back hit is ridiculously slow to the point it can't even punish rolls - but it's probably Ike's most powerful punish during that period where Bair and Dsmash could kill an opponent but Utilt and Ftilt can't yet. Sometimes I bait a getup attack by releasing Eruption a hair too early, giving me enough time to block and respond with Dsmash.

 

[san.]

You're *supposed to use dsmash as a ledge trap, but it doesn't have enough lingering frames and it's way too slow/short. It's easier to dtilt or ftilt from afar. Looking at Roy's dair, it's even worse LOL. At least Ike's dair is somewhat okay if you dair into the ground or platform, and there is decent reward when it actually hits.

Dsmash is best used if they try to grab the ledge twice, but there's a ton of other moves that punish that just the same. Arrei is correct about dsmash in his post.

Is the Sheik nerf that significant? Fair isn't the only reason Ike struggles against her.

Also Samurai needs to lurk under more of our beds then if that gets us buffs. I'll leave a plate of cookies and milk under my bed along with a note saying "Plz un-suck Dair thx".

Wait, my bed doesn't rise off the ground.

Dang.

Oh, it definitely is IMO. It's fast, has a lot of range, and gets Ike offstage for more punishment. If she had something like Palutena's fair, Ike could probably beat Sheik then, since Ike would be a lot more comfortable in the air, reducing the effectiveness of needles and the like.

I don't think the fair change really did much of anything though.

 

[Arrei]

Yeah, that's what I meant - they gave her Fair a little more endlag but I'm not sure that really changes anything. She can still challenge most characters in the air with ease and it's still super quick and difficult to punish.

 

[san.]

Yeah, fair is pretty much the same. I don't think landing lag was increased, was it?

 

[Linkmario00]

The Fair nerf was only about damage (from 4.5 to 3.5 I think) and a minimum Landing lag nerf (not sure about this, not that it is that important since she still can autocancel it from everywhere) so it basically changes absolutely nothing. It's hilarious how they are nerfing every single aspect that doesn't count in Sheik and they mantain her devastating neutral. Simply nerf Needles range and give Vanish less power so she doesn't have the 50/50 that kills from Dthrow and I'll be OK with her. Maybe a little Fair range nerf can be good.

 

[Krysco]

• Forward Air
  • Damage decreased 4.8%/5.5% → 4.3%/5.0%
  • Sweetspot growth increased 125 →132 (trivializing knockback differences between patches)
  • Sour spot hitbox now overlaps sweet spot hitbox (previously vice versa)
  ^ the changes to Sheik's fair, or at least the ones found so far. No change in endlag or landing lag

 

[Arrei]

So it does even less than we thought it did. I see the landing lag nerf was deconfirmed.

 

[Deathcarter]

The Fair nerf was only about damage (from 4.5 to 3.5 I think) and a minimum Landing lag nerf (not sure about this, not that it is that important since she still can autocancel it from everywhere) so it basically changes absolutely nothing. It's hilarious how they are nerfing every single aspect that doesn't count in Sheik and they mantain her devastating neutral. Simply nerf Needles range and give Vanish less power so she doesn't have the 50/50 that kills from Dthrow and I'll be OK with her. Maybe a little Fair range nerf can be good.

All I really want is for Sheik's needles to have fixed knockback so that at higher percentages she can't throw out a crazy hard to react to needle to pop-up opponents. That's just stupid period, even if it were on any other character.

 

[Xelion]

Sheik is just stupid good in general, especially that stupid recovery. Anyway I'm finding Up-Throw to Up-Air working so well now. And can someone tell me if Up-Air out prioritizes most of the D-Airs that go straight down? I'm finding it to be a little inconsistent, maybe it's just weird hit boxes, I'm not sure.

 

[Mario766]

Up Air has a massive horizontal disjointed hitbox, so it can beat every down air with proper spacing.

 

[Xelion]

@ Mario766 Thanks, maybe they were just hitting me before the start up. I need to get the timing down, I never used it much before. I usually opted for Fair or Bair, which is probably dumb.

EDIT: Also has the Frame Data thread been updated? This one: http://smashboards.com/threads/ikes-frame-data.408266/

 

[Mario766]

The main thing you don't want to do as Ike is to go directly under the opponent. You want to stay just slightly off to the side where you can hit them with F-Air's huge range and use up air's horizontal hitbox to space out any option the opponent has.

It uses accurate 1.0.8 frame data so the only things wrong would be Spot Dodge and Rolls.

 

[Troykv]

Hi people!

Ike isn't my favorite Fire Emblem Character in Smash (that actually is Roy), but I love use him, he style has a very powerful feeling.

Probably someone already say it... But his stats in Smash fits more with his Radiant Dawn Design and Stats, actually... I'm happy to see that Sakurai change him xD.

 

[Xelion]

The main thing you don't want to do as Ike is to go directly under the opponent. You want to stay just slightly off to the side where you can hit them with F-Air's huge range and use up air's horizontal hitbox to space out any option the opponent has.

It uses accurate 1.0.8 frame data so the only things wrong would be Spot Dodge and Rolls.

Thanks for the advice, I put it to use next opportunity I get.

Hi people!

Ike isn't my favorite Fire Emblem Character in Smash (that actually is Roy), but I love use him, he style has a very powerful feeling.

Probably someone already say it... But his stats in Smash fits more with his Radiant Dawn Design and Stats, actually... I'm happy to see that Sakurai change him xD.

He does fit Radiant Dawn more doesn't he. Last game he was similar to Path of Radiance if in remembering his stats from that game.

 

[Troykv]

Thanks for the advice, I put it to use next opportunity I get.


He does fit Radiant Dawn more doesn't he. Last game he was similar to Path of Radiance if in remembering his stats from that game.

Path of Radiance... He has Marth/Roy-like bases, and all around growths (good in everything)

 

[Xelion]

Hah, I remember, I think I had him at level 20 a little after you meet the Laguz. Is it me or do the Mages kinda suck in POR? RIP Soren, he didn't die, but couldn't hurt a fly.

 

[Troykv]

Hah, I remember, I think I had him at level 20 a little after you meet the Laguz. Is it me or do the Mages kinda suck in POR? RIP Soren, he didn't die, but couldn't hurt a fly.

Well.. Soren arrives in a low level with low bases... And Wind Magic is weak xDU (try with ElWind against flier if is possible).

 

[Arrei]

Yep, wind magic was real weak, but very accurate. Ilyana's thunder magic was strongest, but more inaccurate.

Which made it incredibly weird when thunder magic wound up being both weak and inaccurate in RD. With Ilyana's portrait art just looking... wrong, and no supports, she lost all reason to be included in your army...

 

[Troykv]

Yep, wind magic was real weak, but very accurate. Ilyana's thunder magic was strongest, but more inaccurate.

Which made it incredibly weird when thunder magic wound up being both weak and inaccurate in RD. With Ilyana's portrait art just looking... wrong, and no supports, she lost all reason to be included in your army...

Yep... Here the Fire Magic is the stronger one, Thunder Magic is a double-edge weapon because it's Crítical Rate but overall inferior (weaker than Fire, lower hit rate than Wind).

Al least in Radiant Dawn Ilyana is a dragon destroyer xDU