• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Falchion's Chosen - Marth Discussion Thread

burntfish44

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 22, 2014
Messages
53
I feel it's really hard to apply pressure to opponents or just simply poking them

spacing overall is really hard tbh, it feels like whatever I do my opponent just gets far too close or I don't know what to do against some attacks like Roy's F-til or Dedede's F-tilt

as for poking... I heard dtilt is the best poke. But as I'm dash dancing it's annoyingly how easy it is to make a dash attack instead of just dtilting
for stuff like roy/d^3's ftilts, if you sense them coming an easy thing to do is just make use of your dash dancing - dash away then dash back in and hit them. It's not guaranteed ofc and its hard to see these things coming but if you're constantly on the move then it makes you harder to hit

In general if people are in close hitting you it's hard to go wrong with shield grabbing

and yeah dtilt is an awesome poke, maybe wavedash into dtilt would be more practical depending on the situation
 

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
3. Cactus Dashing. This is where you use your wavedash to alter the momentum of your dash. The best example is to dash away from your opponent, wavedash towards them and then dash dance by moving away from the opponent first.
Sorry for being so late, but there is no cactus dashing in pm. All dashes momentum cancel, so dashing against wavedash momentum doesn't make your char move slower.
Oops, must have been testing imaginary game :)
 
Last edited:

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
Marths, side b reversals aka wavebouncing is REALLY good for recovering with marth. When you get sent of stage, just hold the direction you are going to (toward blast-zone) and wavebounce to use that momentum to your advantage. Also pivot utilts/ftilts are good to stuff approaches, and c-stick sdi is super good to escape combos.
 

NoLife

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Messages
161
Location
Ortonville MI
Marths, side b reversals aka wavebouncing is REALLY good for recovering with marth. When you get sent of stage, just hold the direction you are going to (toward blast-zone) and wavebounce to use that momentum to your advantage. Also pivot utilts/ftilts are good to stuff approaches, and c-stick sdi is super good to escape combos.
can i get a video of that
 

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
Sorry, I have no recording equipment, try it yourself :) I'm not sure about reversing momentum though, it seems you always lose a ton of it before hitstun ends, so it might not be beneficial. Could someone look into it?
 

UMR | donmk

RIP PM
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Messages
138
Location
Australia
Marths, side b reversals aka wavebouncing is REALLY good for recovering with marth. When you get sent of stage, just hold the direction you are going to (toward blast-zone) and wavebounce to use that momentum to your advantage. Also pivot utilts/ftilts are good to stuff approaches, and c-stick sdi is super good to escape combos.
I find myself using wavebounce side b a lot. It's a nice way to change up your recovery if your opponent is reading it well. However, I also find it useful when people are trying to follow up on you in the air, as it can mess up their spacing if they don't expect it. Don't expect it to revolutionise Marth's recovery though. It just gives a little extra horizontal movement.

The wavebounce side b isn't that useful for momentum changing after being hit because as you say, you lose most of your momentum before hitstun. However, you can reverse your momentum off of a short hop.

@ NoLife NoLife , I would suggest trying this out yourself, because it is difficult to capture its effect in a video. If you really want I could try to record one, but it'll take me at least 2 days due to real life commitments.

Also, as a side note, if people still want a hitbox thread I have the time to do one now. Is that something people are interested in, considering that most of the moves are the same as Melee?
 

KuroganeHammer

It's ya boy
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 15, 2012
Messages
15,985
Location
Australia
NNID
Aerodrome
I can assist you with a hitbox/frame data thread if you need it.

I actually just came in here to talk about that. =P
 

NoLife

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Messages
161
Location
Ortonville MI
i dont offically know what a wavebounce is isnt it where u reverse ur b and ur momentum shifts and u change direction (< probably wrong)
 

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
I think so. It might also just mean reversed b reverse, which is doing a b move forward, while getting momentum backward. Tbh I would just call them b reverses anyway.
 

Ben Hicks

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
23
Having trouble with throw options at high percents (80+). Recommendations? Having trouble following up on the throw. It has slowed my game tremendously.
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
Ok, Project M looks cool so I wanted to start playing it, and I'm coming into it as an experienced Marth user in Brawl. I'm gonna pick him up in this. What are the most essential advanced techniques for Marth in PM?
 

Ben Hicks

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
23
Lcanceling is a must. Not much of a brawl player but I heard there was no L canceling. DD is a must, and learning to work in WD and Wave lands.
 

Ben Hicks

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
23
watch the sepherothKen marth tutorial on youtube. it is a melee tutorial, but the info is very helpful
 

NoLife

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Messages
161
Location
Ortonville MI
Ok, Project M looks cool so I wanted to start playing it, and I'm coming into it as an experienced Marth user in Brawl. I'm gonna pick him up in this. What are the most essential advanced techniques for Marth in PM?
If u want to do decent in pm u should forget everything u no about brawl marth cept spacing and watch advanced how to play on ututbe master that **** then go to kens tutorial
 

CyberZixx

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 26, 2012
Messages
1,189
You must learn how to move as marth. You must also learn patience to play Math as you gotta bait and react to things.
 

DJ _ICE

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 20, 2013
Messages
179
Force yourself to play while thinking actively to not roll and then to shield less. Try to not put yourself in a bad position where you'll need to shield/roll, play safely, smartly and evasively with lots of good movement.
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
Okay guys, so I've been practicing dash dancing with Marth. Apparently his dash dance grab game i.e. dash dance tech chasing is a big deal for him, but I have been wondering something. How exactly does dash dancing help tech chases?
 

NoLife

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Messages
161
Location
Ortonville MI
Okay guys, so I've been practicing dash dancing with Marth. Apparently his dash dance grab game i.e. dash dance tech chasing is a big deal for him, but I have been wondering something. How exactly does dash dancing help tech chases?
since his dash dance is so good u can guess which way they r gonna roll and if ur wrong marths dash dance allows u to travel a good distance till u arent able to turn around. so that means if ur wrong u can react and still use his long grab range to make up the lost ground...if that made sense...
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
since his dash dance is so good u can guess which way they r gonna roll and if ur wrong marths dash dance allows u to travel a good distance till u arent able to turn around. so that means if ur wrong u can react and still use his long grab range to make up the lost ground...if that made sense...
Thanks, this cleared it up. Playing against CPUs, I really began to understood the power of dash dancing as it allowed me to chain a lot of grabs with good reflexes.
 

NoLife

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 10, 2013
Messages
161
Location
Ortonville MI
Thanks, this cleared it up. Playing against CPUs, I really began to understood the power of dash dancing as it allowed me to chain a lot of grabs with good reflexes.
yeah thats a good way to use it for tech chasing u should also use it to bait ur opponents into attacking
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
I've been working on my Marth, and after only starting Project M a few days ago, I'm seeing improvement. I've even landed some Ken Combos! Anyway, I wanted some advice on a matchup: Captain Falcon. I've been playing this guy who uses him, and we're both pretty bad, but I need help. Falcon always seems to kill me around 85 percent with the Knee. Ugh. I, on the other hand, seem to kill him at like 140 percent or so. How can I play this matchup to avoid his powerful attacks and get the win?
 

Ben Hicks

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
23
Unless he is sweet spotting the ledge falcon's recovery in my experience is pretty punishable with a FSmash or Dtilt. I good ole fashion ledge hog or ledge release to jump bair, or off map shield breaker.
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
Excuse my double post, but I was hoping to alert all you seasoned PM Marths for help. I heard you can usually string together short hop Fairs for a combo. However, when I try to hit them with multiple ones, they usually land right next to me allowing them to hit back and/or they aren't in hitstun long enough anyway. How are these Fair strings done? Do I need to tipper them or something? Or am I just not fast falling well? Fair to Dtilt always seems just about guaranteed, but Fair to Fair doesn't. I really want to start stringing Fairs, so I'd appreciate any help.
 

CyberZixx

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 26, 2012
Messages
1,189
Are you short hop fast falling your fairs? You timing and spacing of fair strings will vary depending on the character weight and their precent. Sometimes you can only follow up with a tipper fair and sometimes you must land an inner fair. It takes experience. Knowing how to land two fairs in a short hop helps as well.
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
Are you short hop fast falling your fairs? You timing and spacing of fair strings will vary depending on the character weight and their precent. Sometimes you can only follow up with a tipper fair and sometimes you must land an inner fair. It takes experience. Knowing how to land two fairs in a short hop helps as well.
Ok... I might be messing up the fast falling. And I'll practice Short hop double Fair as well. I have another question that I hope you might be able to answer. So, you know how your character flashes white when you L cancel correctly? When this happens, does it signify that you can perform another action?(As in, the white flashes indicates end of lag).
 

CyberZixx

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 26, 2012
Messages
1,189
White flash is just a visual indicator that the L cancel worked. So your aerial's ending lag is halved. Weather you can follow up or not depends on lot of variables. None of which due with the flash itself.
 

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
White flash is just a visual indicator that the L cancel worked. So your aerial's ending lag is halved. Weather you can follow up or not depends on lot of variables. None of which due with the flash itself.
Thanks, that answered my question. I'm still struggling with the Fair combos though. The hitstun/speed of the Fair never seems enough to actually combo.
 

burntfish44

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 22, 2014
Messages
53
Having trouble with throw options at high percents (80+). Recommendations? Having trouble following up on the throw. It has slowed my game tremendously.
Depending on DI and falling speed, Fthrow off the stage -> jump -> dair spike, its pretty easy to pull off in general if you practice it a bit in training mode or something.
Elsewise f-throw -> fsmash is really strong in PM. At higher %'s you can fthrow -> wavedash forward ->fsmash depending. Just experiment with what movement you need to do to connect an fsmash

I roll too much. Any tips on breaking the habit?
Just really work on implementing wavedashing into your game. There's knowing how to wavedash and being able to do it, then there's actutally using it as part of your core kit - just focus on using it every time you want to reposition yourself quickly. Thats what worked for me anyways.

Ok, Project M looks cool so I wanted to start playing it, and I'm coming into it as an experienced Marth user in Brawl. I'm gonna pick him up in this. What are the most essential advanced techniques for Marth in PM?
Watch the ken tutorial (as mentioned), and any melee tutorial really, they're all relevant to PM marth. If i had to pick just a few of hte most important points theyd be:
-learn dash dancing (using it to bait stuff, using it for grab game,etc)
-learn wavedashing, and implement it into your game
-marths grab game is really good (fthrow > fthrow > fsmash is kinda broken)
-L CANCELLING is super-mega-important on marth, if you're not L-cancelling, and following your hits up, you're not doing it right. A simple one to learn is F-air > Lcancel > Fsmash
-blah blah spacing blah, blah hit people with the tip blah

For your question on vs captain falcon:
Out grab game him basically. This restricts his movement and doesn't let him just run around and go in when he pleases. A possibility is if he throws you and you know a knee is coming you can mash counter - this isn't super reliable but will get you out of a bind every now and then

With fairs:
Sadly the best answer i can give is a bunch of practice and experience. I would say just take bowser (i find he's really easy to beat up on - easy to combo and big so easy to hit) to training mode and work on fairs and fair followups. Marths fair can put someone like anywhere depending on %, tipper/non, DI, floatiness,etc, so its just feeling out what followups you can do after fairing someone.
Double fairs in a short hop is hard (imo) because you have to start your first fair like right as you leave the ground. I started to get decent at them by using Z for the ariel (my fingers are kinda slow) on low % bowser across FD.
 
Last edited:

Jackson

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
1,331
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
Good stuff, @ burntfish44 burntfish44 . I'm actually been 2 stocking the Falcon player consistently. I stay patient and keep him at bay with Dtilts, then get grabs and Uthrow to Utilt or Uair. Fsmash to edge guard and kill. Oddly enough, I rarely use aerials in the matchup, just because I found Dtilt and throw juggles work better.
 
Top Bottom