Exclusive Snake Technique

[Corpsecreate]

The 'real' damage for all attacks are the numbers given in training mode. In vs mode, the damage of all attacks (with very few exceptions) is increased by 5% of what is shown in training. Oh and if an attack does 5.X dmg, the number is not rounded, the integer is always taken when it is displayed. So a move that does 10.7% damage will only display as 10% and will not round up to 11%.

Example: Snakes fresh F-smash does 22% in Training (exactly 22%). In vs mode, it does 23.1%, 22*1.05 = 23.1.

The way the program works, it will only give accurate "Current Damage" values if the value entered in the text field is the value shown from training.

 

[SuSa]

I see what you're getting at. :B

Explains a lot, thanks. <3
:leek:

 

[SuSa]

So I used this a lot.

OMFG can you freshen up your moveset fast in a neutral state.. many people are afraid to approach you if you're platform camping or just being really safe with your grenade play. There were so many times I was sitting there freshening my moves, and I don't think my opponent even knows about it.

This helped. A LOT for money matches. Sometimes when the opponent was off stage, just freshening up my moveset to completely freshen that uptilt I used 4 moves ago made all the difference in if I won or lost the game.

The game.
:leek:

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Yeah, I mentioned this back in march of this year.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=234484&page=975
^Continues onto the next page a bit.

I failed at trying to properly explain it, but the idea was there. Explosives decay each other therefore refreshing your moveset. Perhaps if I actually posted this stuff in a thread the moment I notice it, it would get more attention lol Actually, I think I might go do that. All the little stuff with snake we should all remember or try to remember.

 

[Corpsecreate]

Yeah its epic.

It seems like the fastest way to refresh all your moves is to Dsmash -> run away -> B-reverse Nikita drop.

I havent really updated the OP since I've been lazy

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

This is all incredibly useful and it looks like I have some more research to do for my Snake. I guess its about time we delve further into the more technical aspects of our play. Good **** for posting all this,

There is a KO percentage thread in this forum (directed @ SuSa) right? This thread and that one will be giving me some homework for the next few days or so.

Also call me crazy but in most MUs I like having my Grenades staled because I like having the option to grenade counter and get myself out of bad situations without the worry of killing myself. I'd rather have my projectiles staled than my CQC moves staled. I suppose in the end its comes down to your own personal style and using the info in this thread can help reinforce it.

EDIT: Oh I see Method 2 touches on that. Coolness.

 

[Kuro~]

I'm not really sure why people wouldnt use it. I have been using it and it is so useful its crazy. My look into diminishing made me make sure I always Pummel (Although you cant pummel too fast otherwise it wont refresh your attacks).


Edit: While posting this, the song in my huge playlist just went to the song where Piccolo fuses with Nail in DBZ. I think your avatar influenced my playlist Etecoon

So u arent suppose to pummel at maximum timing/efficiency to refreshen ur moves?
and also do grenade explosions themselves refresh moves?

I've been doing this inbetween stocks for a long time since velox brought it to my attention, people never fall for mine combos anymore anyway so it's a good way to use the time. but most snake's really aren't that progressive, like even now most snake's don't momentum cancel right even though the most effective methods of doing so(air dodge for horizontal, uair for vertical) have been tested and confirmed

I mean **** the highest placing snake at MLG uses fair to momentum cancel : p

wait...i always thought bair was best momentum cancel for vertical and horizontal especially vertical cuz uair would extend your body INTO the ko zone...how does airdodge help in horizontal? like DI, AD, to fastfall?

I havent tested using nikita, never really considered it since nikita is so slooow

I can confirm that when you throw a grenade at someone (or something) and it hits them (the grenade itself hits them, not the explosion), that hit counts as its own 'move' and will refresh all your attacks and will stale the 'getting hit by thrown grenade' move. So that means if you throw a grenade at someone, it hits them and then it explodes, that will stale your grenade hit once and your grenade explosion once.

Also each hit of AAA refreshes, each hit of Ftilt is considered 2 different attacks and so the 1st hit stales the 1st hit and the 2nd hit stales the 2nd.

@SuSa - Be careful not to pummel too fast, pummeling too fast will result in only ONE stale, the timing between each pummel is different for each character.

Oh and it takes 9 hits for a move to go from fully stale to fully fresh. Its been a while since I went into the stats involving diminishing but the result was something like this. Percentages given are now perfected and are how much dmg an attack does relative to being completely fresh.

1. 100.000 %
2. 85.714 %
3. 77.143 %
4. 69.524 %
5. 62.857 %
6. 57.143 %
7. 52.381 %
8. 48.571 %
9. 45.714 %
10. 43.810 %

This pretty accurately follows this formula: Damage = (Base Damage) * 0.936 * e^(-0.0914*X) where X is the number of times the move is in the list and e is the mathematical constant roughly equal to 2.7183.

interesting tidbits about the moves thx

 

[etecoon]

wait...i always thought bair was best momentum cancel for vertical and horizontal especially vertical cuz uair would extend your body INTO the ko zone...how does airdodge help in horizontal? like DI, AD, to fastfall?

nope, it doesn't really make sense but I tested it and that's how it is. air dodge works horizontally because it's faster than any of snake's aerials, you can't fast fall after, but you don't need to, that's for vertical attacks

 

[Kuro~]

....ill test it out in matches sounds interesting and reason i said ff is cuz ive been taught to DI up and opposite momentum cancel fastfall

 

[ChuteTheMessenger]

What about this?

DSmash
Short hop, pull nade
Land and PS the mine, drop nade at the same time
Short hop, C4 drop
Double jump, C4 detonate.

If I'm correct, this should stale Dsmash and C4, and it should give you two explosions with which to maneuver around.

 

[Corpsecreate]

The PS with the nade would destroy the mine and the nade resulting in one stale of the dsmash. The c4 would then have nothing to detonate on and would not stale.

 

[ChuteTheMessenger]

The PS with the nade would destroy the mine and the nade resulting in one stale of the dsmash. The c4 would then have nothing to detonate on and would not stale.

Oh? I could've sworn that the grenade survives intact.
Must be a mistake of my memory then, thanks.

 

[SuSa]

If it did, the mine wouldn't stale at all and the C4 would stale from exploding the Grenade.

Either way, one step is useless.

 

[Corpsecreate]

Well even if it did survive, if the mine didnt hit anything then it wont get staled in the first place.

@SuSa lol.

 

[SuSa]

Get ninja'd.

 

[Corpsecreate]

Our posts were probably about 1 second apart.

 

[lightvash]

this is a great thread guys.. I feel like I can't lose when I use this lol

 

[-LzR-]

This might sound stupid or has been mentiond before...

Does throwing a nade and then another nade near it put nade in the stale list if it explodes the other nade?

 

[Corpsecreate]

Yes it does.

 

[jbandrew]

What would be the best staling method that refreshes your tilts without refreshing your grenades?

 

[Darkshadow7827]

Interesting. I felt the need to post here so I can get updates in the user CP. Seems very worth it. This seems to be the best use for Nikita haha.

 

[Corpsecreate]

Yep, Nikita on the mine seems like the best option since it stales 2 different moves and it can be performed pretty fast if you dmash then run away and b-reverse a grounded nikita and immediately drop it with L.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

So Nikita isn't totally useless. Cool.