Official DLC Character Discussion Thread - Read the new sticky/announcement

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I like the name Mii Sorcerer the most.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I think it destroys the point of the Mii Fighters to add more, 3 allows them each to be balanced in different ways.
I WOULD, however, like to see them each get 12 more customs. The fact that they are supposed to be so unique and fitting for all these costumes, but actually have no more options than any other character, really seems to defeat the purpose.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I'm not against Mii's. They're pretty cool actually, giving characters that were pretty much screwed a place to stand(Chrom). But it seemed, and still seems, wasteful for Sakurai to spend so much development time on just Mii's. I feel the same way about Palutena. We might have gotten another character at launch if it wasn't for Sakurai spending development time on Palutena. Again, I love Palutena, I'm not against her at all. Unlike other characters though, where all their customs were simple alternations the the original, Palutena's had totally different properties, animations, and movements that needed to be programmed. That had to have taken up a lot of time that could have been used to at least put Wolf and Lucas in the base game.

Instead, we're now stuck having to pay extra for Lucas, and we still remain in the dark about Wolf.

P.S. Random rant, I know, apologies.

 

[JaidynReiman]

So Isaac is possible because of the ballot?

Isaac is possible even without the ballot, but with the ballot he's a lot more likely. The most likely candidates right now are first-party characters highly requested on the ballot. Doesn't matter what your personal bias is, that's the most likely scenario. Isaac is both (he's owned by Nintendo). Assuming you're referring to Golden Sun's Isaac, and most people around here tend to.

 

[NintenZ]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

By definition, Bandana Dee is not a darkhorse, which would be a contender no one sees coming. Everyone seems to be claiming he is the option. That is the opposite of a darkhorse.
And to continue, I am aware of who he is, I think I expressed specific points which you did not address, particularly the PERCEPTION of him, which is that he is a generic enemy. This is to people who do not know who he is, not to those who already know. I agree he would be a lot of fun, I just think he is not a money grabbing character, and would be ridiculously difficult to try to market.

Bandana Dee IS a a case of Ensemble Darkhorse though. I was talking about him in the actual Kirby series, he became very popular despite his minor role to the point he got promoted and fans love him. Kinda like how Ridley became much more popular than the other bosses in Metroid to the point he became the main antagonist

 

[Burruni]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

 

[NintenZ]

I mean who isn't in the game.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

Anything Rare made between the time Nintendo bought 49% of them and when Microsoft bought them

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

Professor Layton.

 

[Burruni]

I mean who isn't in the game.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Goemon eh? Isn't he basically Ninja Robin Hood?

 

[A Distant Demon]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

Banjo would be pretty high up there.

After that Probably Phoenix Wright of Layton. I suppose Layton has a slight edge from UMVC3

 

[NintenZ]

Professor Layton.

The answer I was expecting.

The answer I wasn't expecting.

 

[Troykv]

Smash could certainly benefit from someone who uses a bow more than .

I'd also do bloody well to get some better spellcasters than .

Black Mage for Smash.

Ashley for Smash.

Miigician for Smash 5 class.

Micaiah 4 Smash

Shamelessadvertising(?)

 

[Burruni]

Goemon eh? Isn't he basically Ninja Robin Hood?

He's got a stupid-huge series that went from like MSX/NES era to DS before Konami let that IP go stagnant too. Only 5 games got released outside of japan, though.

He's actually our solution to getting Goku in Smash.

 

[JaidynReiman]

He's got a stupid-huge series that went from like MSX/NES era to DS before Konami let that IP go stagnant too. Only 5 games got released outside of japan, though.

He's actually our solution to getting Goku in Smash.

That's not possible.


THIS is our solution to getting Goku in Smash: http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/Goku


Admittedly, though, Goemon looks closer to THAT Goku.



Regardless, I don't see how its Goemon. Bomberman is much bigger and has many, many more games. Sure, he doesn't have the sales of even Mega Man, but he's still pretty good in regards to history with Nintendo.

 

[Burruni]

That's not possible.


THIS is our solution to getting Goku in Smash: http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/Goku


Admittedly, though, Goemon looks closer to THAT Goku.



Regardless, I don't see how its Goemon. Bomberman is much bigger and has many, many more games. Sure, he doesn't have the sales of even Mega Man, but he's still pretty good in regards to history with Nintendo.

Because I wanted to bring up Goemon. Not that he's actually the right answer.
Since I appear to be one of the people who just brings out semi-obscure japanese stuff.

Also so I'd eventually be able to post this and have it be on topic.

 

[TiaSilvia]

Isaac is possible even without the ballot, but with the ballot he's a lot more likely. The most likely candidates right now are first-party characters highly requested on the ballot. Doesn't matter what your personal bias is, that's the most likely scenario. Isaac is both (he's owned by Nintendo). Assuming you're referring to Golden Sun's Isaac, and most people around here tend to.

I hope he get's in. Voted for him, but i thought we wasn't that popular. Now I see he actualy is.

 

[Ikenna]

I hope he get's in. Voted for him, but i thought we wasn't that popular. Now I see he actualy is.

Isaac had a massive burst of popularity at the beginning of the DLC fighter ballot event. At least on GameFAQS. Miiverse, too, I think. I honestly thought he was in the same tier as King K. Rool.

 

[NintenZ]

Hello everyone, I have urgent findings.

That was what it was! That was why I didn't know if they'd be in the game. There are alot of problems with them in terms of 3DS limitationS, the ink could cause framerate drops and they'd be required to switch models ALOT during the transition from kid to squid. In fact, (don't beat me up for this as it's only speculation) but is it possible Inklings were planned as DLC as soon as five months ago but were scrapped due to hardware issues thus us getting the costumes and explaining why the trophy was so detailed? With advancements in technology however, Inklings could work in future handheld installments with ease. Everything I just said was only a theory and the reasons why I was seemingly against Inkling, which I wasn't, just unsure about them. Let me know what you think of this theory. Hate, like, love, detest? Love to know.

Probably the only thing holding them back.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Isaac had a massive burst of popularity at the beginning of the DLC fighter ballot event. At least on GameFAQS. Miiverse, too, I think. I honestly thought he was in the same tier as King K. Rool.

It's the general opinion that Isaac is the second most requested Newcomer. At least until Inklings came along... And all those Shovel Knight leaks.

But even still he is far up there. I personally believe that he will be one of the ballot characters along with K. Rool.

 

[IndigoSSB]

Hello everyone, I have urgent findings.

Probably the only thing holding them back.

That's a possibility. Not the trophy part though, I'm pretty sure it's the same model they use for the Inkling amiibos.

 

[Burruni]

That's a possibility. Not the trophy part though, I'm pretty sure it's the same model they use for the Inkling amiibos.

Yeah. We covered that yesterday (that it's the same model that is in Splatoon's data for when you plug in the amiibo before the statue lands and comes to life).

The three "real" cases against Inklings boil down to:
1) They're too new.
2) Nintendo would deliberately hold them back for Smash 5.
3) A moveset to properly incorporate ink would be too much for 3DS.

 

[JaidynReiman]

It's the general opinion that Isaac is the second most requested Newcomer. At least until Inklings came along... And all those Shovel Knight leaks.

But even still he is far up there. I personally believe that he will be one of the ballot characters along with K. Rool.

NINTENDO newcomer. He might not be higher than SK, but he's certainly top tier requested for Nintendo outside of Japan. Inside Japan is a different story, but Bandana Dee is a lot less requested in the west, so its a reverse situation between Bandana Dee and Isaac.


Inklings have probably topped Isaac by this point, though.

Yeah. We covered that yesterday (that it's the same model that is in Splatoon's data for when you plug in the amiibo before the statue lands and comes to life).

The three "real" cases against Inklings boil down to:
1) They're too new.
2) Nintendo would deliberately hold them back for Smash 5.
3) A moveset to properly incorporate ink would be too much for 3DS.

#3 is probably the best logical argument against them. If they want to stay true to Splatoon as much as possible, that'd be very difficult to incorporate. Too new is also an iffy argument, but due to Splatoon's massive success that's probably not a good reason anymore. #2 is incredibly unlikely unless they plan to release an NX port of Smash with all DLC pre-packed and add a few new characters. And that's ONLY if the NX launches next year.

 

[NintenZ]

Yeah. We covered that yesterday (that it's the same model that is in Splatoon's data for when you plug in the amiibo before the statue lands and comes to life).

The three "real" cases against Inklings boil down to:
1) They're too new.
2) Nintendo would deliberately hold them back for Smash 5.
3) A moveset to properly incorporate ink would be too much for 3DS.

Pretty much those are the things against Inklings. Hardware limitations are probably their worst case, if it wasn't for that then it'd probably be better for them. It could be argued that Roy appeared before his game was released, however he was from an established franchise.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

The actual conversation I wanted to bring up before was rather glossed over; many quoted me, but all in fanboy character responses (relax wit that word, move on to...)

Sakurai has been working on the DLC for this game for a year, that is a SUBSTANTIAL amount of time. Is it really all that strange that, with enough time to develop a small game, we may actually be getting a HUGE update? What would it take for Sakurai to spend another year of his life on this game rather than moving on? What is the most cost effective way to develop content in this stage of the game? What would the equilibrium point be of cost of resources (time, etc) spent on this DLC, versus the supply and demand?
People in many rooms keep talking about 'what will make money;' if that is the case, we should be looking at this from an economics standpoint- there are an immense number of tools we could be utilizing to better assess the current situation.

Once again: I think now there is a strong possibility we will be getting an update the size of Super Luigi U or Mario Kart DLC. It almost sounds absurd, in an economic context, to think we would, after a year, merely have several characters, stages, and costumes. It isnt as simple as 1/3 the time, 1/3 the content, but a whole year for so little would be rather wasteful, in my eyes, on every developmental level.

______________________________________
Onto other less interesting topics, my responses... in a spoiler to minimize size.

Spoiler

By definition, Bandana Dee is not a darkhorse, which would be a contender no one sees coming. Everyone seems to be claiming he is the option. That is the opposite of a darkhorse.
And to continue, I am aware of who he is, I think I expressed specific points which you did not address, particularly the PERCEPTION of him, which is that he is a generic enemy. This is to people who do not know who he is, not to those who already know. I agree he would be a lot of fun, I just think he is not a money grabbing character, and would be ridiculously difficult to try to market.


This does not refute the points I made, it isnt really even a response to what I said other than maybe being inspired to respond. I'm, quite clearly, not a Fire Emblem fan- nothing against it, I just do not find it special. My thought is that true fans of the series, and not fanboys happy with any decision made but those with actual criticisms, would be disappointed with the fact that a series of vast possibilities is represented with characters who more or less are based around a single moveset. If Swordsmen are all the series has to offer, it is very well off in Smash. I just think it has more to bring to the table.


I dont think anyone plays 'for the Pokemon,' I think that is a gravely simplistic view. If that were the case, the main games would be outsold, or sold in equal numbers, to its spinoffs. We play to capture, train, and assemble Pokemon into a team. Of course, we are both talking about more than ourselves- so neither of us can be sure. That said, if it were merely about the Pokemon, the main games would not be the top sellers. See more on this point shortly...


You may enjoy the series, but you completely overlooked my point about what makes Pokemon special. It is NOT the general monsters, it is the gameplay mechanics. Obviously this is important to Sakurai who cares about the 'essence' of the game, and mentioned such as the reason for adding Robin. What makes Pokemon unique at all- capturing, training, battling, strategizing- it isnt a matter of some of these being overlooked, its a matter of not any of it being taken into consideration, at all, in any way- not in characters, not in items, not in stages, not in anything.

I think Ive stated a number of moveset ideas for the Pokemon Trainer (and I agree, he shuldnt touch the fishing rod at all; thats a terrible idea). He is the essence of Pokemon. What could he use? Pokeballs. Summons. Strategy. A few posts before this I had an idea that the summons could be equivalent to the nmber of rivals (as in, you get one summon at a time if it is 1v1, two if 1 v 1 v 1, etc. This reflects the strategy and the different styles of battle.

As it stands, Pokemon is represented by generic monsters who could be reskinned as anyone, and only the popular characters. There is not another series only represented by popular characters, not even the ones with avatar characters themselves. Obviously this isnt okay for them, why is it okay for the second best selling franchise Nintendo has in its arsenal? It isnt.

Additionally... Ive posted before on the fact that Pokemon is much more than a franchise, particularly the first two generations. It is studied by economists, sociologists, anthropologists, and in a wide variety of other fields, because it was a sensation from 96-2000. It is unmatched in craze. To anyone looking for an amazing read on the subject, or who could think there is any way to contest this, please read "Pikachu's Global Adventure: The RIse and Fall of Pokemon." It is much more than a game series, and that cannot be argued.


Not to be rude, but hasnt this been mentioned here numerous times?


It feels like all we talk about on this board is Fire Emblem. You'd think the series earned money for Nintendo before Awakening with how much attention it receive.


I'm not sure what points you are even making, honestly. All I see is that you agree that he is a necessary component for the roster. And of couse he is vital, like an anti-Dark Pit

I guess it would depend on what you're referring to with summoning. If you mean summoning for one move, that doesn't really work into the strategic part of Pokemon. If you're referring to summoning for an entire moveset (so what it was in Brawl), then based on hardware limitations it's simply not possible.

As someone who gets on a Pokemon kick every few months (to where I become absolutely obsessed with it) the trainer is important, but not everything. The Pokemon series is called Pokemon...because they're a main part of the series. You catch legendary Pokemon. You train them to battle the Elite 4. You use them to compete in fashion shows. You breed them. You teach them new things. You create a bond with these digital creatures.

The whole statement you made about the ones in Smash being generic...assuming that's what you meant...is something that I absolutely must disagree with. 5/6 of the Pokemon we have in Smash are incredibly popular. They're fan favorites.

Yes, as a player, you are a trainer. You're important. But how feasible/balanced is a moveset based around the trainer really?

If we're going for accuracy, I don't know that a true trainer would use his Pokeballs on his opponents directly, or use escape rope to trip them. He would use his Pokemon. That is essentially what Brawl had. But the concept, while cool, didn't work well (wasn't balanced well) and now isn't possible because of hardware.

I'll agree to disagree on this particular topic. I think the concept is interesting, but not necessary to properly represent the series.

 

[A Distant Demon]

I know most people realize that Nikki and all of her hints were bs. . .but if you absolutely need proof. . .

There was a problem fetching the tweet

@XimaSpyro Well that's interesting] because I don't recall myself ever saying that to her.

— Sean Hicks (@SeanHicksART) October 18, 2015

@XimaSpyro So in short, no.

— Sean Hicks (@SeanHicksART) October 18, 2015

 

[SegaNintendoUbisoft]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

I'd say Bomberman.

 

[GaroMaster]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

I say Rayman because his game was first developed on the SNES before being shafted in favor of the Jaguar and PS1.
Besides having such a lengthy history on Nintendo's hardware, Rayman just seems like a Nintendo character due to his unique design, cheerful attitude, and his games having a bizarre world.
Honestly, it's either him or Mega Man.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Who is the most Nintendo third-party character?

Geno.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I say Rayman because his game was first developed on the SNES before being shafted in favor of the Jaguar and PS1.
Besides having such a lengthy history on Nintendo's hardware, Rayman just seems like a Nintendo character due to his unique design, cheerful attitude, and his games having a bizarre world.
Honestly, it's either him or Mega Man.

Its obviously Mega Man. I was assuming by default that Mega Man was discounted since he's already in the game.

 

[GaroMaster]

Its obviously Mega Man. I was assuming by default that Mega Man was discounted since he's already in the game.

Yeah.
I just thought that the character had to yet make a playable appearance in Smash, so I said Rayman.
If we were counting those that are already in the game, however, it would easily be Mega Man.

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

I know most people realize that Nikki and all of her hints were bs. . .but if you absolutely need proof. . .

There was a problem fetching the tweet

@XimaSpyro Well that's interesting] because I don't recall myself ever saying that to her.

— Sean Hicks (@SeanHicksART) October 18, 2015

@XimaSpyro So in short, no.

— Sean Hicks (@SeanHicksART) October 18, 2015

I will never understand Nikki. She has the trust of a lot of people due to her datamining, and she just abuses it for fun.

Also, another thing. Something thats been bothering me...

Whats with this sudden idea that Nintendo is going to pull a capcom and just rerelease Smash 4 for the NX? Thats incredibly greedy and I don't even think Sakurai is that kind of person.

I actually do believe the NX comes out next year, but I see no reason to rerelease the game just to add a couple of characters.

Smash bros is Nintendo's money and hype train. They wouldn't waste it on a rerelease.

 

[IndigoSSB]

I will never understand Nikki. She has the trust of a lot of people due to her datamining, and she just abuses it for fun.

Also, another thing. Something thats been bothering me...

Whats with this sudden idea that Nintendo is going to pull a capcom and just rerelease Smash 4 for the NX? Thats incredibly greedy and I don't even think Sakurai is that kind of person.

I actually do believe the NX comes out next year, but I see no reason to rerelease the game just to add a couple of characters.

Smash bros is Nintendo's money and hype train. They wouldn't waste it on a rerelease.

I can't see it being a good decision from a business standpoint either. The sales of the actual console should take priority over any money earned from re-releasing the same game, and I don't believe there are many people willing to buy the game again just for the sake of upgrading.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

As another reminder, Source Gaming's Smash DLC Poll Data can be found here. Old news, yeah, but considering their top-notch research and amazing ability to poll data in a way that isn't just looking at numbers based on demographics, I'd put these results above anything else we have in the way of determining the top members of the ballot. When we factor in the following:

• Not already being an Assist Trophy or stage hazard
• If they're 3rd-party, being within the Top 15 of the poll
• If they're from an already existing series, being within the Top 30 of the poll
• If they'd be the first of their series, automatically given a spot after all the above are accounted for

...We'd get a bingo board that looks something like this:

Tetra is a surprise to see on there, honestly. I'm surprised she's as high up as she is, but given that all of Midna, Tingle and Ghirahim are Assist Trophies, I guess I can see why.

Either way, I gotta admit that this is a pretty decent spread for Sakurai to pick from, even if there are definitely characters on there I don't agree with.

So what are your Top 5 picks among these 24? I would say Isaac, K. Rool, Inkling, Bandana Dee, and Paper Mario.

 

[SegaNintendoUbisoft]

As another reminder, Source Gaming's Smash DLC Poll Data can be found here. Old news, yeah, but considering their top-notch research and amazing ability to poll data in a way that isn't just looking at numbers based on demographics, I'd put these results above anything else we have in the way of determining the top members of the ballot. When we factor in the following:

• Not already being an Assist Trophy or stage hazard
• If they're 3rd-party, being within the Top 15 of the poll
• If they're from an already existing series, being within the Top 30 of the poll
• If they'd be the first of their series, automatically given a spot after all the above are accounted for

...We'd get a bingo board that looks something like this:
View attachment 78852

Tetra is a surprise to see on there, honestly. I'm surprised she's as high up as she is, but given that all of Midna, Tingle and Ghirahim are Assist Trophies, I guess I can see why.

Either way, I gotta admit that this is a pretty decent spread for Sakurai to pick from, even if there are definitely characters on there I don't agree with.

So what are your Top 5 picks among these 24? I would say Isaac, K. Rool, Inkling, Waddle Dee, and Paper Mario.

1.) Rayman
2.) King K.Rool
3.) Inkling
4.) Shantae
5.) Dixie Kong

 

[Dark Dire Wolf]

I doubt the Smashified guy knows anything worthwhile or set in stone either, but lol at what ensued after.

Update tomorrow, they should give us a Direct during the downtime.

 

[AlphaSSB]

As another reminder, Source Gaming's Smash DLC Poll Data can be found here. Old news, yeah, but considering their top-notch research and amazing ability to poll data in a way that isn't just looking at numbers based on demographics, I'd put these results above anything else we have in the way of determining the top members of the ballot. When we factor in the following:

• Not already being an Assist Trophy or stage hazard
• If they're 3rd-party, being within the Top 15 of the poll
• If they're from an already existing series, being within the Top 30 of the poll
• If they'd be the first of their series, automatically given a spot after all the above are accounted for

...We'd get a bingo board that looks something like this:
View attachment 78852

Tetra is a surprise to see on there, honestly. I'm surprised she's as high up as she is, but given that all of Midna, Tingle and Ghirahim are Assist Trophies, I guess I can see why.

Either way, I gotta admit that this is a pretty decent spread for Sakurai to pick from, even if there are definitely characters on there I don't agree with.

So what are your Top 5 picks among these 24? I would say Isaac, K. Rool, Inkling, Waddle Dee, and Paper Mario.

1) Wolf
2) Krystal
3) Ice Climbers
4) Snake
5) Inklings

Four of my Top 5 DLC characters made it on there. Poor Sceptile

 

[A Distant Demon]

As another reminder, Source Gaming's Smash DLC Poll Data can be found here. Old news, yeah, but considering their top-notch research and amazing ability to poll data in a way that isn't just looking at numbers based on demographics, I'd put these results above anything else we have in the way of determining the top members of the ballot. When we factor in the following:

• Not already being an Assist Trophy or stage hazard
• If they're 3rd-party, being within the Top 15 of the poll
• If they're from an already existing series, being within the Top 30 of the poll
• If they'd be the first of their series, automatically given a spot after all the above are accounted for

...We'd get a bingo board that looks something like this:
View attachment 78852

Tetra is a surprise to see on there, honestly. I'm surprised she's as high up as she is, but given that all of Midna, Tingle and Ghirahim are Assist Trophies, I guess I can see why.

Either way, I gotta admit that this is a pretty decent spread for Sakurai to pick from, even if there are definitely characters on there I don't agree with.

So what are your Top 5 picks among these 24? I would say Isaac, K. Rool, Inkling, Bandana Dee, and Paper Mario.

Strange little game
1. Wonder Red
2. Dixie Kong
3. Banjo
4.Tetra
5. Inkling