Dixie Kong's Barrel Of Support Spirits. Farewell Everyone, Thank You ALL For Making This Thread An Excellent Place For DK Fans!

[Ridley_Prime]

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Dread is like the Half Life 3 of Metroid, something no one thought would resurface. It’s definitely not impossible for Donkey Kong Racing, though I’m not counting on it, but like he said, one can dream.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

No Smash has ever been resold or been available on another platform (not on virtual console, nada), and I don't think that'll change with Ultimate. Nintendo doesn't want any previous games like Melee which still has a scene for example, to take away from the sales of the current and future Smash titles.

Not disagreeing with your core point, but Smash 64 was on the Wii Virtual Console, actually. Possibly Wii U but I can't remember on that one.

That said, they've never remade and resold it on any platform, and it was only Melee that was considered for that. They don't go for Deluxe versions with Smash. Whether or not that's a good idea is another story.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

I see. I either didn’t know or forgot about it, as I never saw it being talked about (the Smash 64 VC). Yeah, I’m sure Melee HD was considered, but didn’t happen for the reasons mentioned, and Ultimate will be no different. They don’t want any previous game to take away from any of the focus and sales of their current product.

 

[pupNapoleon]

You're starting to get ad hominem here. It's not cool that you demand we shown a complete vision when you haven't done so yourself.

No Smash has ever been resold or been available on another platform (not on virtual console, nada), and I don't think that'll change with Ultimate. Nintendo doesn't want any previous games like Melee which still has a scene for example, to take away from the sales of the current and future Smash titles.

I haven't seen any cohesion from you on the idea of a reboot either; just tossing around random small concepts. I'll respect whatever decision is made by Sakurai or whoever does the next Smash, even if it doesn't interest me enough to buy and I'll just stick to Ultimate in which case, but I'm glad you're not one of the people behind the wheel.

I actually did state what I expect of a reboot (regardless of the fact that you didn't ask). A full character story mode, a roster reduced to 40 characters plus DLC, significantly less third party, and completely reworked characters from the ground up- more individualization, more mechanics introduced to the game as a whole, and honestly- a new director.

I don't understand why you don't want to tell me what you envision, but it is difficult to carry the conversation further when there is just a vague idea of what you do expect. If the next game lacks most of the current third party characters, but adds some others, it is going to be seen as inferior by many people.

Here's my take.

I don't think we're necessarily going to have the explosion of a DK sub series like we did circa 97-2008, however I do think another game is coming quicker than many realize both because there's enough people at Nintendo whom have an investment in Donkey Kong as a property and because quite frankly there's likely more money to be made in DK than in Advance Wars or Metroid, and those have just gotten fairly big games announced.

Its fantastic that Dread is apparently doing strong pre-order business and given the Switch's momentum I'm confident it will do some great numbers at release. But Donkey Kong as a property (particularly the Country variety) has almost always done better than Metroid in terms of sales, and the former has rarely struggled in Japan like the latter has; more than anyone, Nintendo is aware of that. Throw in stuff like the DK section of Super Nintendo World, and there's every reason for the company to strengthen the brand sooner rather than later.

I'm as frustrated as anyone that its been such a long period for new DK content, however given Nintendo's profitable but sensible strategy with Switch releases? There is a logic to doing a port of Tropical Freeze first to maximize profits from a Wii U game (that underperformed due to the console's status), and then later doing a full blown new game that they don't have to rush to market because TF filled the void for a lot people. I think that's what's happened here and that Nintendo can and will use a new DK game to plug any perceived hardware gap in the next 12 months. Maybe that'll involve something significant for Dixie or maybe it won't, but there is financial gain to be had in Donkey Kong titles, and everything in the past four years demonstrates Nintendo knows how to capitalize on such opportunities.

I choose to believe that the game is taking a long time because they decided to rework it into K.Rool's favor, after his reception in Smash.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

I actually did state what I expect of a reboot (regardless of the fact that you didn't ask). A full character story mode, a roster reduced to 40 characters plus DLC, significantly less third party, and completely reworked characters from the ground up- more individualization, more mechanics introduced to the game as a whole, and honestly- a new director.

I don't understand why you don't want to tell me what you envision, but it is difficult to carry the conversation further when there is just a vague idea of what you do expect. If the next game lacks most of the current third party characters, but adds some others, it is going to be seen as inferior by many people.

You did not make a list of who those 40 characters would be though... Yet you call me half-assed for not making a complete list of 60ish characters that I all see returning off the top of my head.

What does this whole story mode consist of thematically? How exactly are the characters reworked? What exactly do you mean by more individualization? What mechanics would be added and how do they work? Who at Nintendo would be this new director?

It's easy to imagine these concepts for a reboot on a surface level, but you're not really going into any detail on them. I just see no reason to give you some elaborate vision when you're being vague yourself.

And a game that Thanos snaps an entire half of the previous roster wouldn't be seen as inferior? Hey, you know what also had a story mode and did exactly that? Marvel vs Capcom Infinite, and that game was universally panned! Fans of MvC did not see the story mode or anything worth losing that many characters over, and I don't see how it would be any different with Smash fans.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

We're arguing about reboots huh?

I really don't enjoy the idea of a 40 character roster tbh, not only would countless of my favorite veterans get cut, but that pretty much would make Dixie's chances FAR, FAR more unlikely since she would then have to compete for FAR fewer slots among both veterans and newcomers. I probably would most likely not even be interested in a game like that since it would very likely not include many of my favorite veterans and not bring enough newcomers I'd be interested in to make up for it, even with reworks or new mechanics.

 

[pupNapoleon]

You did not make a list of who those 40 characters would be though... Yet you call me half-assed for not making a complete list of 60ish characters that I all see returning off the top of my head.

What does this whole story mode consist of thematically? How exactly are the characters reworked? What exactly do you mean by more individualization? What mechanics would be added and how do they work? Who at Nintendo would be this new director?

It's easy to imagine these concepts for a reboot on a surface level, but you're not really going into any detail on them. I just see no reason to give you some elaborate vision when you're being vague yourself.

And a game that Thanos snaps an entire half of the previous roster wouldn't be seen as inferior? Hey, you know what also had a story mode and did exactly that? Marvel vs Capcom Infinite, and that game was universally panned! Fans of MvC did not see the story mode or anything worth losing that many characters over, and I don't see how it would be any different with Smash fans.

No, I asked for anything that you envisioned, as you were refuting that the roster could be subpar even with the likelihood of major third party cuts. But clearly there is no vision, so there is no point in further discussion, as I won't be responding.

 

[Lenidem]

Someone said Smash was never ported to another console. But wasn't it the same for Mario Kart until 8 Deluxe?

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Yes, but that only happened to cut costs from making a brand new Mario Kart right after the failure of the Wii U, so they gave MK8 a second chance, and it paid off, with much more having bought it on Switch.

There wouldn't be any such reason for porting Ultimate however, or at least it wouldn't be for the same reason if Ult did somehow get ported. I still remember before Ultimate was revealed, people were mostly expecting a Smash 4 port (combined with the content from Wii U and 3DS versions), simply adding Inkling and bringing back Ice Climbers and calling it a day... It would've sold plenty millions just on that alone, but how fortunate we are Sakurai didn't settle for the bare minimum like Nintendo did with Mario Kart etc, and went the longest extra mile ever taken, selling more with the latest Smash than he would have otherwise. Even if I see Smash 4 as mostly beta Ultimate now in hindsight, I'm more thankful for it happening now, as we wouldn't of gotten Ultimate without it existing first to work off of.

Regardless of the arguing as to what direction Smash should take in the future which will no doubt continue later elsewhere (but I'll let people fight over that while I just continue enjoying Ultimate), I'm still not really worried about the next one, and remain confident that Dixie will be added, especially if there's not all that many cuts which Smash has remained consistent with so far.

 

[BirthNote]

Hey everyone, I find the recent discussion about Smash's future contentious but not particularly hostile. So, I don't mind it if it keeps going. If it gets hostile then it'll be best to let it die down.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Speaking of Mario Kart, I for one can’t wait to finally get a real non mobile Mario Kart game with Dixie in it.

Hopefully, she’ll be in it.

Please?

 

[Spatman]

Not disagreeing with your core point, but Smash 64 was on the Wii Virtual Console, actually. Possibly Wii U but I can't remember on that one.

That said, they've never remade and resold it on any platform, and it was only Melee that was considered for that. They don't go for Deluxe versions with Smash. Whether or not that's a good idea is another story.

and Brawl too:

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1407323027717697540?s=20

moreover, speaking about Melee considered for a (deluxe?) porting: that was Iwata's plan B if Sakurai wouldn't have wanted to work on Smash in that time. It could be the very same situation in the near future, with Sakurai that wants a pause/to work on something else, and Nintendo that chooses to do a deluxe porting of Ultimate rather than give Smash to another director (that would be like give a new numbered MGS to someone who isn't Kojima; authorial vision and so on)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

and Brawl too:

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1407323027717697540?s=20

moreover, speaking about Melee considered for a (deluxe?) porting: that was Iwata's plan B if Sakurai wouldn't have wanted to work on Smash in that time. It could be the very same situation in the near future, with Sakurai that wants a pause/to work on something else, and Nintendo that chooses to do a deluxe porting of Ultimate rather than give Smash to another director (that would be like give a new numbered MGS to someone who isn't Kojima; authorial vision and so on)

Very true. It's possible.

Though in the end, the actual problem is how much licensing to do. Sakurai was clear that it was very difficult to get this many 3rd parties together, and doing so again wouldn't be easy. A port alone is probably not likely due to that factor. Now, a port with all the Nintendo characters, all the Pokemon(technically speaking they're 3rd party, but nobody counts 'em that way. Being partially owned by Nintendo is important, after all~), and some easier to get 3rd parties(Sega, Capcom, Microsoft, at the very least, and Bandai-Namco I'm not sure would be beyond Pac-Man. Kazuya is probably safe?), along with tons of new Nintendo characters(like, you know, Dixie?) sounds good.

If this is a thing, it could be under a new Director. That means anything could change. Odd alt costumes(clones and echoes being reduced to this position), any old guidelines Sakurai follows being changed up, etc. For instance, Sakurai surely has some moveset ideas for characters not used yet. Or at least we have a confirmation it was a concept that was wanted in Dixie's case. Whether he actually cares about the whole tag team gameplay or not would mean little with another director. Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. But let's say he does for this hypothetical(no, I am not saying for sure he does, obviously). Now, we have a new director. They aren't going to have the same visions. These types of things are very different from other guidelines. Not changing movesets too much cause they alienate players? This'll probably stay on the other hand. Stuff like Echoes having rules about how they work(same bodyshape overall, with at most a pixel difference, same weight, same attributes) could change. They could re-label numbers and call any kind of Model Swap Fighter an Echo. It's silly, but that's how much could change very easily.

This is probably why people seem to be more interested in keeping the same director. Throwing out the normal stuff through the window can make things awkward. Of course, there's fans who want these changes and that's fine too.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Oh its beautiful.

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[Spatman]

About the Pushdustin tweet I posted before (I don't know why the preview isn't visible in my post, btw; how can I incorporate correctly a tweet in this site?) :
it DOES mean that, very likely, we were quite near to a timeline where Dixie was in Smash before the end of Brawl life.

In the same note: do you all know that, in prder to avoid leaks, Smash developing team made Xander Mobius and the announcers of every other language that have an announcer to register voice clips for hundreds of characters without saying them which ones would have been playable in the game? Well, it means that there is a voice clip where Xander Mobius says clear and loud: DIXIE KONG!

 

[Mushroomguy12]

About the Pushdustin tweet I posted before (I don't know why the preview isn't visible in my post, btw; how can I incorporate correctly a tweet in this site?) :
it DOES mean that, very likely, we were quite near to a timeline where Dixie was in Smash before the end of Brawl life.

In the same note: do you all know that, in prder to avoid leaks, Smash developing team made Xander Mobius and the announcers of every other language that have an announcer to register voice clips for hundreds of characters without saying them which ones would have been playable in the game? Well, it means that there is a voice clip where Xander Mobius says clear and loud: DIXIE KONG!

Click the three dots at the center of the top bar above comments, it'll reveal a dropdown menu. Click media, then copy paste the url of the tweet there.

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

A new Smash game thay cuts all the 3rd party characters and goes back to being just a celebration of Nintendo is A-OK in my book. The way Ultimate has headed has kinda bit off more than it can chew at this point. Its gonna be a licensing nightmare if they ever decide to port Ultimate, probably cost twice as much to get them if they make a new game given Ultimates success, and Ultimate has added SO many 3rd parties that the floodgates have opened so wide that it is virtually impossible to please anyone.

I like the idea of a smaller roster, a bigger gameplay shift, 100% reworked/revamped new movesets for Mario/Link etc., a story mode that isnt cheap and doesnt suck ass (World of Light) because they dont have to spend time/money bringing all 85 characters back. It would also be nice to get trophies and all the side modes we dont have back. Ultimate is a great multiplayer game but as a single player game it kinda...blows and I hope a new one would be more like Melee/Brawl.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

The 3rd parties I get, and I can live without them much as I like some, but I see no reason for most of the 1st parties to not remain at least. Maybe shave off some of the series that have a lot more characters than the rest like FE or Pokemon (the clones specifically so it's less redundant, though clones/echoes don't take that much resources either, so hence the maybe), but other than that, it's fine as is. Again too, the less cuts there are, the less Dixie has to compete with for a future or DLC spot. Make no mistake, fans of cut characters will be pushing to have them back, and support for them will in turn compete with Dixie support. Really depends on whose all cut though, as some would have more a push in support to have back than others.

Trophies I don't really miss still. They became worse and worse each game, especially by Smash 4 when unlocking most of them just became an RNGfest. If they ever come back then cool, but they're not a dealbreaker imo. As for side modes, break the targets I would only want back if it was somehow the original version and not the Angry Birds one. I would take another Melee style adventure mode that's replayable and gives you an incentive to go through with each character over one that you mainly just go through once like SSE or WoL. A spiritual successor to Smash Run would be fine too.

Already made my defenses of World of Light earlier, but the hate for it is overrated. I like a lot of what it offered. People act as though it has no redeeming factors whatsoever, while remembering Subspace just for the cutscenes and not the generic worlds and enemies it was composed of. Ultimate single player I admit isn't the best, but the worst? That would still have to go to Smash 4 Wii U if you ask me. Virtually no one liked Smash Tour.

Thinking about it more... Only Melee and to some extent Smash 3DS's single players kept my attention for that long. Once I went through SSE I had no desire to replay it, and Brawl's event matches were inferior to Melee's, both in number and in being memorable. Otherwise I'd just play Smash with friends or people online. I can understand if you have no one locally to play with or don't want to play online, and thus when a Smash doesn't have that much in single player, you don't have a desire to go back to it that often no matter the roster. I haven't had that problem though, still playing Ultimate three years later which won't stop anytime soon.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'm of the opinion that a reboot wouldn't bode well Dixie. A reboot means rework on all movesets, also Diddy, and Dixie's best bet is being a semi clone of Diddy of sorts. So the less they need to work on reworking Diddy, the better for Dixie. At least that's my take on it.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Pixel art.

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[BirthNote]

We're legit closing in on our 14,000th post. That's pretty cool.

 

[QQS]

Dixie for Smash! Hope to have Bonus Fighters like Dixie & Bandana!

 

[Mushroomguy12]

We're legit closing in on our 14,000th post. That's pretty cool.

I've said this before, but if Dixie by some miracle does get added she would have the second largest character social thread behind Banjo lol.

 

[QQS]

I've said this before, but if Dixie by some miracle does get added she would have the second largest character social thread behind Banjo lol.

I think Geno thread it’s the biggest among all the Smash threads ever my friend.

Hope one day Geno for us, and Dixie/Bandana/Waluigi/Crash/Rayman/Hayabusa can join one day

 

[Mushroomguy12]

I think Geno thread it’s the biggest among all the Smash threads ever my friend.

Hope one day Geno for us, and Dixie/Bandana/Waluigi/Crash/Rayman/Hayabusa can join one day

I was talking about the characters that are currently in the game, not in comparison to other support threads. (Also if Geno did get in they would probably convert the newer one into the social, not the closed down old one that's big).

 

[Ridley_Prime]

If only it were as simple as the loudest group of fans being the prevalent ones, but it's not always the case, for better or worse. Notable page # milestones can be a nice boast nonetheless.

Kazuya is a fine choice on his own, but before he was confirmed, I don't think he even had a full page in his support thread; likely because Tekken stopped being talked about as much here after Heihachi was deconfirmed, but still. Glad we got Kazuya over him, in any case.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Well, with Mario Golf releasing today, time for another several months of hoping for Dixie to be added to the roster of yet another Mario spinoff in the face of overwhelmingly unlikely odds. Pity the only one we were successful in was the poopy gacha game.

 

[ZeroJanitor]

I'm desperate for some context to talk about Dixie Kong besides "wouldn't it be cool if she was in a video game".

 

[pupNapoleon]

Very true. It's possible.

Though in the end, the actual problem is how much licensing to do. Sakurai was clear that it was very difficult to get this many 3rd parties together, and doing so again wouldn't be easy. A port alone is probably not likely due to that factor. Now, a port with all the Nintendo characters, all the Pokemon(technically speaking they're 3rd party, but nobody counts 'em that way. Being partially owned by Nintendo is important, after all~), and some easier to get 3rd parties(Sega, Capcom, Microsoft, at the very least, and Bandai-Namco I'm not sure would be beyond Pac-Man. Kazuya is probably safe?), along with tons of new Nintendo characters(like, you know, Dixie?) sounds good.

If this is a thing, it could be under a new Director. That means anything could change. Odd alt costumes(clones and echoes being reduced to this position), any old guidelines Sakurai follows being changed up, etc. For instance, Sakurai surely has some moveset ideas for characters not used yet. Or at least we have a confirmation it was a concept that was wanted in Dixie's case. Whether he actually cares about the whole tag team gameplay or not would mean little with another director. Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. But let's say he does for this hypothetical(no, I am not saying for sure he does, obviously). Now, we have a new director. They aren't going to have the same visions. These types of things are very different from other guidelines. Not changing movesets too much cause they alienate players? This'll probably stay on the other hand. Stuff like Echoes having rules about how they work(same bodyshape overall, with at most a pixel difference, same weight, same attributes) could change. They could re-label numbers and call any kind of Model Swap Fighter an Echo. It's silly, but that's how much could change very easily.

This is probably why people seem to be more interested in keeping the same director. Throwing out the normal stuff through the window can make things awkward. Of course, there's fans who want these changes and that's fine too.

Eventually, they cannot keep adding characters. Eventually, Sakurai is going to step down.
I do think, finally, this is the time. I think it is even possible that character negotiations for licensing included a clause for remasters and future ports of the game- I am damn well certain they had to have done this by Sm4sh, at the very least- by the DLC. I doubt that Nintendo would not be this forward thinking (as they play the long game), and it was clear they knew they would be starting Smash Ultimate by the time Sm4sh was wrapping.

Which is just another reason I think that this is the future of all Smash games as far as master-monster-rosters go.

As for Dixie... I honestly don't think I would want her if she were tag team, if not with Diddy. I don't want Kiddy and Dixie, or Dixie and anyone. I want her to feel similarish to Diddy- as different as they are in DKC, but not completely different world mechanics. I actually think I would rather her not get in, if we were to only have this option.

I think Geno thread it’s the biggest among all the Smash threads ever my friend.

Hope one day Geno for us, and Dixie/Bandana/Waluigi/Crash/Rayman/Hayabusa can join one day

Positive attitude my friend. That said- it is clear we do have character slots- likely always have IMO, and that characters do definitely stand as 'reps.'

 

[Mushroomguy12]

I'm desperate for some context to talk about Dixie Kong besides "wouldn't it be cool if she was in a video game".

Well, we’ll just have to wait for her to get added to a video game for that context. (A real one, not a F2P mobile game, for that matter).

 

[pupNapoleon]

Well we’ll just have to wait for her to get added to a video game for that context. (A real one, not a F2P mobile game, for that matter).

So...much...waiting...for something...that seems...so obviously...an amazing choice...

 

[BirthNote]

Random thought, but nobody suggests a Dixie-Funky tagteam lol. I'm just spitballing right now and I've put almost no thought into it, but I'm trying to expect any curve balls we might get. Dixie's been paired with DK, Diddy, Kiddy and Funky each for only one adventure each, so on paper any of them are equal candidates with Diddy being the exception. He's usually paired with DK in the series and in spinoffs. Obviously I prefer Dixie to be solo and unique but I don't mind entertaining the idea lol.

Dixie for Smash! Hope to have Bonus Fighters like Dixie & Bandana!

Thanks for showing your support! I'll add you to the list in a few hours.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Oh man... I'm fearing a tag team Dixie.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

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Even if Dixie was in the new Mario Golf, she probably wouldn’t have much expressions. That DK comparison is depressing.

 

[pupNapoleon]

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Even if Dixie was in the new Mario Golf, she probably wouldn’t have much expressions. That DK comparison is depressing.

I see the point about the graphics of the nature... but I don't see Toadstool Tour DK being any less expressive in the new game. His face is more expressive to me, and his reaction is more contained, but is not minimal.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Honestly the new Mario Golf seems endemic of a problem that's become quite apparent with various first party non-port Switch releases.

It feels like there's two tiers and if you're not part of the first one which clearly feels like a major AAA title with great content at base release (Mario Odyssey, BotW, Smash, Three Houses, Luigi's Mansion, Xenoblade 2, Age of Calamity, Splatoon 2) you're probably in the second which amounts to titles that often feel like lesser versions of series we got before and sporting fairly sparse content that's at best going to be filled out later (Kirby Star Allies, Mario Tennis Aces, Super Mario Party, ARMS) or maybe even not at all.

Its unfortunate that even new Switch titles that aren't ports feel less overall impressive than the N64 and Gamecube variations we were playing 15/20 years ago.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I never felt the N64 versions of Mario Sports were all that special- particularly Mario Golf, which barely had any Mario characters in it (or at least, that is how it felt to me).

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I never felt the N64 versions of Mario Sports were all that special- particularly Mario Golf, which barely had any Mario characters in it (or at least, that is how it felt to me).

Strong disagreement there. Golf had 8 characters plus Metal Mario effectively as a bonus. Not huge compared to the explosion of spin-off rosters later, but still fine for the time period. That it had 4 plain humans (6 if you used the GBC connection) never struck me as that out there.

Moreover the nice thing about Golf and Tennis on 64 was that they had strong mechanics at their base. There was gimmicky stuff if you wanted, but playing a plain, technical version of either sport was always possible. Later sequels leaned into the gimmicks so much that the fundamental core was lost and the games suffered for it.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Strong disagreement there. Golf had 8 characters plus Metal Mario effectively as a bonus. Not huge compared to the explosion of spin-off rosters later, but still fine for the time period. That it had 4 plain humans (6 if you used the GBC connection) never struck me as that out there.

Moreover the nice thing about Golf and Tennis on 64 was that they had strong mechanics at their base. There was gimmicky stuff if you wanted, but playing a plain, technical version of either sport was always possible. Later sequels leaned into the gimmicks so much that the fundamental core was lost and the games suffered for it.

I'm sure that is true- I just remember going over so many friends houses, and since you start with the humans- and at the time, the other characters seemed to take a good amount of time to unlock- the majority of the time, it was primarily humans.
Why were there even regular people in the first place? Who plays a Mario game for that reason?

 

[Mushroomguy12]

14000 Posts reached!