[Discussion] Why is Link considered much better in SSB4? I think he's worse.

[Elessar]

Sorry for double post!

No prob man, no harm no foul. Next time, try editing your double post with a joke or a funny comment, just for the lulz.

Something like

 

[RoronoaTREY15]

To be honest, you put your videos in the critique thread and then proceeded to put those same videos on this thread, just because it was active. I gave some advice along with another user, Powerstar9 but you haven't replied since.

And the main reason why people pretty much lashed out at you was because:

1) You posted your videos twice, in which the second time you posted in a thread that was not for critiquing videos.
2) In your original post, you claimed that you had a 131-1 record in For Glory. Some users could think you're bragging about it for no reason.
3) You're challenging people to play you, saying that you'll upload your matches on your YT (which deters people from actually playing you).

If you wanna play people, try out Anther's Ladder at http://www.smashladder.com/
There should be some people willing to play. If not, try looking on reddit, 4chan or other places for Smash 4 matches. Or try the matchmaking threads within smashboards as well. I'm sure some exists. Don't just post your videos at a random thread that's not related to matchmaking and ask people to play you because it kinda invites a lot of people to disregard what you say.

I can honestly say you have been the most helpful person on the board.I actually posted in both forums around the same time. The ladder looks fun, and I'll try it but I thought this would be the easiest way to fight mirror. Sorry for not yet responding in the other thread, and I appreciate the advice.

Yep

Or you know... You can stop acting like a whiny, pompous, elitist butthole and actually help the guy improve. Since ya know....that's kind of the point of these boards. What I'm seeing in this thread right now is absolutely disgusting.

Do you somehow think that when you picked up the controller for the first time, that you were instantly "pro"? I'll answer that for you; No, you weren't, nor are you "pro" now. Every player in ANY Community had to start somewhere, and you are no different in that regard, so please desist your arrogant, ignorant, and condescending tone.

I mean, yes, he didn't post the video in the correct thread, but Flaming him for being a new player looking for critique? LOL

If you think tearing down players looking for help, instead of helping them improve is somehow going to improve your Metagame... It won't...ever. Please work on your leadership skills before you even consider the thought of talking down to people that are looking for ways to improve.

Just a thought.


@ RoronoaTREY15 , Don't listen to him. Everybody has to start somewhere. I'll help to critique your's (or anyone's) videos when I get home later on today. If Link is who you want to play, then you should stick with him.

Don't let anyone tell you any differently.

, appreciate the actual feedback. I don't mind harsh criticism, as long as it is explained. "You suck, but I can't even tell you why because I don't yet have the game" is different than "I believe you would be better if you did...". Please post your feedback in the other thread and I'll try to respond.

 

[Elessar]

Yep

, appreciate the actual feedback. I don't mind harsh criticism, as long as it is explained. "You suck, but I can't even tell you why because I don't yet have the game" is different than "I believe you would be better if you did...". Please post your feedback in the other thread and I'll try to respond.

No, because that would be like pandering to your spam. You want critique? Go the critique thread. Also, we can tell you why you suck, again, in the critique thread, not here. I actually did tell you one thing you do wrong, you don't move when you spam. You're stationary; that's like asking for a zoning char like Sonic or Fox to wreck you. And we do have the game, just that some (emphasis to help your subpar reading comprehension skills) not on the Wii U since that one still hasn't released in Europe. You're really dense, you know that. I'm starting to suspect you might be trying to troll us, but it can't be since it's too sad and bad to be a real attempt at trolling. Although maybe you're just as bad at it as in Smash. Yes, you are that bad a player.

Finally, don't double post, use the edit button genius. Or is even that too hard for you?

 

[RoronoaTREY15]

Yep

Or you know... You can stop acting like a whiny, pompous, elitist butthole and actually help the guy improve. Since ya know....that's kind of the point of these boards. What I'm seeing in this thread right now is absolutely disgusting.

Do you somehow think that when you picked up the controller for the first time, that you were instantly "pro"? I'll answer that for you; No, you weren't, nor are you "pro" now. Every player in ANY Community had to start somewhere, and you are no different in that regard, so please desist your arrogant, ignorant, and condescending tone.

I mean, yes, he didn't post the video in the correct thread, but Flaming him for being a new player looking for critique? LOL

If you think tearing down players looking for help, instead of helping them improve is somehow going to improve your Metagame... It won't...ever. Please work on your leadership skills before you even consider the thought of talking down to people that are looking for ways to improve.

Just a thought.


@ RoronoaTREY15 , Don't listen to him. Everybody has to start somewhere. I'll help to critique your's (or anyone's) videos when I get home later on today. If Link is who you want to play, then you should stick with him.

Don't let anyone tell you any differently.

, appreciate the actual feedback. I don't mind harsh criticism, as long as it is explained. "You suck, but I can't even tell you why because I don't yet have the game" is different than "I believe you would be better if you did...". Please post your feedback in the other thread and I'll try to respond.

What do you think? That we're scared or something? Not everyone is sitting in front of the pc and Wii U all day long just praying for a match, and some even live in Europe where the game still hasn't been released. You see, it's this attitude that makes us like you so much. Again, answer my question, have you watched any other vid in the critique thread?

Again, you only got this heat for being a) Arrogant about being supposedly good when you're really just a bad player; and b) spamming your crappy video because you were so eager to get a reaction out of your "mind blowingly good " Link. If not, why didn't you just wait or settle with the critique you got in the critique section?

Also, your so claimed 130 - 1 ratio, which magically increased to 180 - 3 is quite a low number of matches to really say that you're only fighting the best of the best. Specially from watching at your opponents.

Seriously, stop being a CbH, cut it with the baseless arrogance, you won't get recognition here like that.

i played more matches since then..... Check me out on miiverse, I have no reason to lie. On 3ds my record is 1225-213. Most of those were not with Link, but with Ike. Around 427 wins with Link (no way to actually know because it includes all of online), and 641 with Ike. I was not trying to brag, I was trying to measure up. That is the whole point of playing this game for me is to challenge myself.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

No, because that would be like pandering to your spam. You want critique? Go the critique thread. Also, we can tell you why you suck, again, in the critique thread, not here. I actually did tell you one thing you do wrong, you don't move when you spam. You're stationary; that's like asking for a zoning char like Sonic or Fox to wreck you. And we do have the game, just that some (emphasis to help your subpar reading comprehension skills) not on the Wii U since that one still hasn't released in Europe. You're really dense, you know that. I'm starting to suspect you might be trying to troll us, but it can't be since it's too sad and bad to be a real attempt at trolling. Although maybe you're just as bad at it as in Smash. Yes, you are that bad a player.

Finally, don't double post, use the edit button genius. Or is even that too hard for you?

You are right,but lets just let the hate end. You don't HAVE to insult their skill and you also don't have to insult their ability to read.

 

[Elessar]

I don't have to, but I can. The hate and insult came because of how he presented himself. We don't take it kindly to bragging here, specially from people who are clearly bad at the game.

Seriously, what's with all of this carebear "don't hurt his feelings" nonsense? Are people seriously affected by what random strangers say or think online? Grow up and grow some. So he got flamed, big freaking deal. Nobody said anything when we flamed CbH out of the boards, but now everybody comes in and not only defends this Derp, but threaten with the mods?

It's obvious that he called his support group because the mean Link mains said bad words to him.

This is the Link boards. Thicken your skin before you come in here.

 

[RoronoaTREY15]

No, because that would be like pandering to your spam. You want critique? Go the critique thread. Also, we can tell you why you suck, again, in the critique thread, not here. I actually did tell you one thing you do wrong, you don't move when you spam. You're stationary; that's like asking for a zoning char like Sonic or Fox to wreck you. And we do have the game, just that some (emphasis to help your subpar reading comprehension skills) not on the Wii U since that one still hasn't released in Europe. You're really dense, you know that. I'm starting to suspect you might be trying to troll us, but it can't be since it's too sad and bad to be a real attempt at trolling. Although maybe you're just as bad at it as in Smash. Yes, you are that bad a player.

Finally, don't double post, use the edit button genius. Or is even that too hard for you?

I appreciate the actual feedback. I actually have no problem with fox or falco. I posted theses vids because they were the closest. The one I lost was against a very good yoshi player. The other two I lost were with Ike, so there is no point in posting them. Feel free to add me on the 3ds as well, or don't if that is deemed too arrogant lol

I don't have to, but I can. The hate and insult came because of how he presented himself. We don't take it kindly to bragging here, specially from people who are clearly bad at the game.

Seriously, what's with all of this carebear "don't hurt his feelings" nonsense? Are people seriously affected by what random strangers say or think online? Grow up and grow some. So he got flamed, big freaking deal. Nobody said anything when we flamed CbH out of the boards, but now everybody comes in and not only defends this Derp, but threaten with the mods?

It's obvious that he called his support group because the mean Link mains said bad words to him.

This is the Link boards. Thicken your skin before you come in here.

You are the only one that feels threatened, and I don't know why. I have repeatedly stated that I don't care about criticism, yet you keep complaining. If I post my record I would be bragging, but if I didn't I would be called a scrub. I don't know how to respond to you because I'll either be deemed arrogant or passive aggressive lol.

 

[Elessar]

You are the only one that feels threatened, and I don't know why.

Nobody feels threatened, trust me, specially me. I can't believe I will have to spell this out...and the people say I have no reason to insult your reading skills. You are being flamed for spamming your vid and for the attitude you have. Besides that, because it tickled our and my funny bone.

If I post my record I would be bragging, but if I didn't I would be called a scrub. I don't know how to respond to you because I'll either be deemed arrogant or passive aggressive lol.

Nobody said that. You assumed that because you think that your silly FG ratios actually mean something. They don't. Wifi has never counted for anything other than fooling around, same thing as friendlies. If you had taken the time to check threads and read what has been posted already before posting you'd realize that nobody has been called a scrub when thee come and ask for help. But you didn't ask for help, because you suck, and you have a pointlessly inflated ego apparently. This is not only based on your posts but also on what you actually say during your matches.

Also, I warned you the first time and I'll warn you again, for the last time. Don't double post, there's an edit button for a reason. Use it. You want to learn and be taught, then consider these your first lessons:

1) Don't double post...ever.
2) Don't spam nor derail posts.
3) Grow a thick skin and stop hiding behind friends.
4) Change your avatar, I don't like it.
5) L2Read
6) L2Play
7) If you came for help, then start by admitting you're bad and actually ask for help.
8) I really like lists with 10 items.
9) I like round numbers in general actually.
10) You suck.

 

[Catana]

You are the only one that feels threatened, and I don't know why. I have repeatedly stated that I don't care about criticism, yet you keep complaining. If I post my record I would be bragging, but if I didn't I would be called a scrub. I don't know how to respond to you because I'll either be deemed arrogant or passive aggressive lol.

Why are you still posting here? Stop infecting our boards with your stupidity and casuality.
Just face it already: you suck at the game. Theres nothing wrong with it if you do, as long as you dont think of yourself as a good player who understands how to play and brags about it.

Have you really been that much of a disappointment to your family that you need random people on the internet to suck your fat caveman boobs instead?

Stop being a pathetic little kid, learn to listen and learn to play or you really have no reason to be here as a scrub.

 

[RoronoaTREY15]

Nobody feels threatened, trust me, specially me. I can't believe I will have to spell this out...and the people say I have no reason to insult your reading skills. You are being flamed for spamming your vid and for the attitude you have. Besides that, because it tickled our and my funny bone.



Nobody said that. You assumed that because you think that your silly FG ratios actually mean something. They don't. Wifi has never counted for anything other than fooling around, same thing as friendlies. If you had taken the time to check threads and read what has been posted already before posting you'd realize that nobody has been called a scrub when thee come and ask for help. But you didn't ask for help, because you suck, and you have a pointlessly inflated ego apparently. This is not only based on your posts but also on what you actually say during your matches.

Also, I warned you the first time and I'll warn you again, for the last time. Don't double post, there's an edit button for a reason. Use it. You want to learn and be taught, then consider these your first lessons:

1) Don't double post...ever.
2) Don't spam nor derail posts.
3) Grow a thick skin and stop hiding behind friends.
4) Change your avatar, I don't like it.
5) L2Read
6) L2Play
7) If you came for help, then start by admitting you're bad and actually ask for help.
8) I really like lists with 10 items.
9) I like round numbers in general actually.
10) You suck.

Lol, too funny lol

 

[Xcano]

I don't believe this thread has any other use other than arguing over the ethics of player skill criticism. Can someone please lock this?

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Ah just perfect, just when I thought we could all just let it go. @ Elessar quit telling people to "thicken their skin", this isn't the spongebob with the salty spittoon where we ask you "how tough are ya?"

Why are you still posting here? Stop infecting our boards with your stupidity and casuality.

lol "infecting our boards",oh the irony.....

Can a mod PLEASE just close this thread?

 

[Elessar]

Ah just perfect, just when I thought we could all just let it go. @ Elessar quit telling people to "thicken their skin", this isn't the spongebob with the salty spittoon where we ask you "how tough are ya?"

Hey, it was some friendly advise so you could get over your group therapy mentality. If you don't like it, then please feel free to press the "My feelings got hurt" button in your browser. It's red and has a big X on it.

Can a mod PLEASE just close this thread?

Not unless you ask plea...oh...you did ask please. Then just no. Feel free to stop coming here though if you don't agree with this. Don't worry, we won't miss you.

 

[Xcano]

Not unless you ask plea...oh...you did ask please. Then just no. Feel free to stop coming here though if you don't agree with this. Don't worry, we won't miss you.

No, he has a point. There's nothing left for this thread.

 

[Elessar]

No, he has a point. There's nothing left for this thread.

Oh I never said that he didn't have a point. In fact, he does. The answer is still no though. Sorry.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Not unless you ask plea...oh...you did ask please. Then just no. Feel free to stop coming here though if you don't agree with this. Don't worry, we won't miss you.

If you were to leave I'm pretty sure not many would miss you either considering how your idea of constructive criticism is nothing but a bunch of insults and MAYBE telling them what they should be doing to get better, but still not telling them how they can do what would help them. Besides that, are you a mod? I don't think so, I don't see why you are the one telling me "No" to me asking if this thread can be closed.

 

[Elessar]

If you were to leave I'm pretty sure not many would miss you either

Not true, @Zelkam will miss my sense of humor.

considering how your idea of constructive criticism is nothing but a bunch of insults and MAYBE telling them what they should be doing to get better.

Not true considering that I never even tried to give criticism, so you don't know whether I'm good or bad at it.

but still not telling them how they can do what would help them.

I did. I said to stop double posting and spamming.

Besides that, are you a mod?

Nope.

I don't think so

Superb observational skill! Kudos!

I don't see why you are the one telling me "No" to me asking if this thread can be closed.

Because I can. Why are you listening? What's more, why are you even still replying? You must really like me. Sorry though, I'm taken, but thanks.

 

[Demacrez]

I think the thread has gone long enough on this scenec route.

But I believe if I spoke on behalf of the Link board by saying this, Link is much better in Sm4sh than he was in Brawl, I believe I'd be right.

 

[Drunken_Master]

It's been said a thousand times, but if you come to the Link boards with soft, doughy feelings you will get ****in' offended. Our respect is earned, not bought with wifi replays. If you come in here acting like a pompous ass, this is what happens to you.

All present have been touched by the ghost of the Aurashade. His cold, callousy hands are working your doughy hearts into hard, crusty material unsuited for the pumping of blood or the feeling of feels.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

If you come in here acting like a pompous ***

Oh the irony!

 

[Drunken_Master]

Now you're getting it.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

"And everyone finally figured out how things go down at the Link boards. THE END."
Now let's just leave this thread and never come back to post on it. So many piles of ashes, it burns my eyes just look at them.

 

[Elessar]

All present have been touched by the ghost of the Aurashade.

All hail Aura. May his name be forever cursed.

 

[Seannu]

To be honest I'm not quite convinced Link is much better this game around. In fact I think it only feels that way because many of the champs in this game are not very great themselves. Don't get me wrong I love playing Link he's likely to be my main this time around (I played him in the others mostly for fun purposes) but I'd have to disagree with him being better this time around..

His Hookshot is annoyingly short, often times I wonder why they didn't just make him grab with his hands if they were going to make it shorter (I may be wrong about the length and I welcome correction). I also dunno if it's just me but the bombs seem to get ready to explode a lot faster than they used to. I don't know how much the %'s of his moves differ this time around but he for the most part feels like the same old link aside from those two things I mentioned.

EDIT : Actually now that I think about it his new dash attack is kinda a double edge sword for me.. I favor it over the old one in certain situations but I also miss the old one in others.

 

[Drunken_Master]

If everyone else gets worse Link gets better because all comparisons are relative.

 

[Seannu]

If everyone else gets worse Link gets better because all comparisons are relative.

That's not how it works.. If everyone in the NBA gets worse through injuries it doesn't mean the sole athlete to not get hurt got better just the competition isn't what it once was..

At best I'd say he's more viable but I wouldn't say Link got better. Hell I don't even think he was awful in Brawl despite popular opinion.

 

[BryE]

To be honest I'm not quite convinced Link is much better this game around. In fact I think it only feels that way because many of the champs in this game are not very great themselves. Don't get me wrong I love playing Link he's likely to be my main this time around (I played him in the others mostly for fun purposes) but I'd have to disagree with him being better this time around..

His Hookshot is annoyingly short, often times I wonder why they didn't just make him grab with his hands if they were going to make it shorter (I may be wrong about the length and I welcome correction). I also dunno if it's just me but the bombs seem to get ready to explode a lot faster than they used to. I don't know how much the %'s of his moves differ this time around but he for the most part feels like the same old link aside from those two things I mentioned.

EDIT : Actually now that I think about it his new dash attack is kinda a double edge sword for me.. I favor it over the old one in certain situations but I also miss the old one in others.

Even though his hookshot is shorter in this version, there's less lag and he can grab opponents in the air. But other than that, he has a bunch of differences between Smash 4 and Brawl.

• He's faster, so he can finally keep up with most of the characters that were giving him trouble.
• His recovery is tons better and he can mix up with his recovery options especially since his bombs explode faster.
• His Dair can now act as a meteor, which in some situations can prove pretty useful and provide a quick gimp.
• His Fair and Uair's landing lag was reduced.
• Can act of his bomb throws slightly faster. Most noticeable difference is his running bomb throw.
• Bomb has a shorter fuse, which means he can save himself a lot easier when being edge guarded.

I could go on and on about the positive changes in Smash 4 Link compared to Brawl. But if you want even more data, check out this thread. http://smashboards.com/threads/guide-its-freakin-link-a-look-at-link-in-smash-4.368190/


To be quite honest, I'm not sure why this thread exists when we have that thread to discuss about the changes of Link in Smash 4.

 

[Elessar]

To be honest I'm not quite convinced Link is much better this game around. In fact I think it only feels that way because many of the champs in this game are not very great themselves. Don't get me wrong I love playing Link he's likely to be my main this time around (I played him in the others mostly for fun purposes) but I'd have to disagree with him being better this time around..

Link, all around, better this time around. There is no point of comparison between both version at a competitive level. While some people mght claims that ither way he's still not high tier material it a moot point. Link in sm4sh is objectively better than Link in Brawl when comparing frame data, hitboxes, damage and knockbrack growth. Please note that these are hard data, not subjective opinions. However, if you find that Brawl Link fits your gameplay better, or you like him more, than there's nothing to really discuss, just expose.

I will however touch on your points briefly.

His Hookshot is annoyingly short, often times I wonder why they didn't just make him grab with his hands if they were going to make it shorter (I may be wrong about the length and I welcome correction).

While he clawshot may seem shorter as a grab it is actually about the same length. It may be a tad shorter but the difference is not enough to really create a noticeable difference in gameplay. This coupled with the fact that Zair is considerable longer, both as a spacing tool and for recovery, make the move more balanced this time around.

It is also extremely important to to note the improvements that the chain has received. If very well the only negative change is it's length, now the grab is more reliable since it grabs people out of the air, something that before was extremely hard even when timed right. The grab also comes out slightly faster and, more importantly, it recovers faster after a miss. A miss in Brawl qould mean almost certainly a stock lost when playing at upper levels, and this made a lot of Link mains quite hessitant about when going for a grab. A miss now might still be more punishable than non tether grabs, but the window to do so couple with the new rolls makes this less of a critical factor, at least in the current meta. Also, it being shorter isn't necessarily a "nerf" in itself, it's just different.

I also dunno if it's just me but the bombs seem to get ready to explode a lot faster than they used to.

The bombs used to explode in 7 seconds, now they explode in 4 seconds. This is perceived by more experienced players to be an overall possitive change since it means we can rely more on the bombs to help us survive if knocked out of the stage with one. While before you could do more things with a bomb in hand (meaning, you had more time before throwing them), the bombs themselves were decent but not great since they could harm you. This is a huge buff: bombs no longer harm Link when they explode on contact with the oponent, even if you're standing on their toes. This means a lot in regards to defensive and punishing methods as well as combo setups since now you can react immediately. The bombs also now tend to send the oponent in an arc over Link, so you can combo bomb until utilt at higher %.

Finally, I can't stress this enough, we can actually rely on bombs now to recover. This is huge since, while not exactly the same as melee's bomb recovery mechanic, it's still leaps and bounds superior to Brawl when you had to either always have a bomb in hand or pray to be hit at the right moment so you could make it back to the stage.

I don't know how much the %'s of his moves differ this time around but he for the most part feels like the same old link aside from those two things I mentioned.

He does feel like the old Link, but an improved version. Most of his hits have been retweaked and have had either dmg or knockback adjusted. I love the fact that now dsmash has two different knockback trajectories, vertical for the first hit and horizontal for the second one. This opens a lot of possibilities for stage couter picking since we can now adapt to blast zones with dsmash, which has always been our fastest smash and also a reat way to punish roll happy oponents. His fsmash not kills faster (at earlier %) than in Brawl if tipped, which is a great new mechanic, and his usmash also combos into itself now. This makes the move safer, which is something simply priceless at competitive levels of play.

Another difference is that he is faster. True, he still a heavy char and thus slower than others but he is quite faster than his Brawl counterpart. This means we can actually go melee instead of relying only on spam and camp and melee only for a kill. We can actually recover now as well, and this is huge and quite a determinant factor when comparing boths Links. One of the main, if not the main factor for Link being so low in the tier list last time around was his recovery. It was just abismal and as such getting thrown off stage meant either a lost stock or an incredibly uphill battle to make it back, sometimes depending on the height and distance you were knockedback already meant you were dead, without the oponent even trying to gimp you. This doesn't happen anymore or at least not as commonly as before. Our survability has gone up tremendously and we retained our kill power. There were no real nerfs with Link, unlike other chars who have been nerfed since Brawl.

EDIT : Actually now that I think about it his new dash attack is kinda a double edge sword for me.. I favor it over the old one in certain situations but I also miss the old one in others.

The only benefit that the old one had was how fast it came out, but it's a fiar trade off when what you get in exchange is kill power. It's true that the new DA is slow and predictable, but that just means don't spam it. Be smart about when you use it and only use it when you know it'll land. This is really a great move since it also hits people in the air and off stage. When you manage to hit a recovering oponent with the tip of the DA off stage he is almost certainly dead. It's unsafer than Brawl, granted, but then again we can't have everything.

Two notes:

1. The reason I thnk many people are struggling with Link and still might feel he's worse is because they're still playing him as Brawl Link. This isn't Brawl, so don't play it as Brawl. He looks somewhat similar and feels similar, has the same moveset, but he is completely different in terms of capabilities. Take some time to learn him, learn his dmgs, his knockback, his speed. Don't try to play Brawl on Sm4sh because you will be stumped and your gameplay will suffer. Instead of shoehorning Brawl in here, take your time to learn the char we have now to maximize his potential. I feel that this is where many people are failing when picking up Sm4sh. As a comparison, look at Falco. If you try to play Brawl Falco as Melee Falco you'll fail, because the character is different and yet he was still top in both. If you try to play Sm4sh Falco like Brawl Falco you'll fail again, because the char is different. You need to adapt to what you have instread of trying to fit a aquare peg into a round hole. If you don't like Falco look at Bowser. He is a new char, you need to learn him mostly from scratch. well, approach Link with the same mentality and you'll see your game improve considerably.

2. I'm still surprised at all the people showing up and saying that Brawl Link wasn't bad, just misused, specially when this people then show that they didn't know half of Brawl Link's ATs or meta options, like Gale Guarding. This just speaks for itself regarding the level of play these people took their Link to, and thus were exposed to (since them saying he isn't bad means they that they were winning). Brawl Link wasn't a bad character, he was horrible. Bowser was a bad char, captain Falcon was a bad char, The Triforce Tier were legendary in just how awful they were. If not, please show me evidence of this. Videos, replays of this miraculous gameplay. There is a reason why Link never won any major tournament, and it's not misrepresentation.

To be quite honest, I'm not sure why this thread exists when we have that thread to discuss about the changes of Link in Smash 4.

It exists because newbies.

Also, get crit by Wall of Text I don't do tl;dr versions of my posts. Link mains do work. Now get to it.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

1. The reason I thnk many people are struggling with Link and still might feel he's worse is because they're still playing him as Brawl Link. This isn't Brawl, so don't play it as Brawl. He looks somewhat similar and feels similar, has the same moveset, but he is completely different in terms of capabilities. Take some time to learn him, learn his dmgs, his knockback, his speed. Don't try to play Brawl on Sm4sh because you will be stumped and your gameplay will suffer. Instead of shoehorning Brawl in here, take your time to learn the char we have now to maximize his potential. I feel that this is where many people are failing when picking up Sm4sh. As a comparison, look at Falco. If you try to play Brawl Falco as Melee Falco you'll fail, because the character is different and yet he was still top in both. If you try to play Sm4sh Falco like Brawl Falco you'll fail again, because the char is different. You need to adapt to what you have instread of trying to fit a aquare peg into a round hole. If you don't like Falco look at Bowser. He is a new char, you need to learn him mostly from scratch. well, approach Link with the same mentality and you'll see your game improve considerably.

2. I'm still surprised at all the people showing up and saying that Brawl Link wasn't bad, just misused, specially when this people then show that they didn't know half of Brawl Link's ATs or meta options, like Gale Guarding. This just speaks for itself regarding the level of play these people took their Link to, and thus were exposed to (since them saying he isn't bad means they that they were winning). Brawl Link wasn't a bad character, he was horrible. Bowser was a bad char, captain Falcon was a bad char, The Triforce Tier were legendary in just how awful they were. If not, please show me evidence of this. Videos, replays of this miraculous gameplay. There is a reason why Link never won any major tournament, and it's not misrepresentation.



It exists because newbies.

Also, get crit by Wall of Text I don't do tl;dr versions of my posts. Link mains do work. Now get to it.

Yes! Someone finally gets it. You, sir, deserve a full barrel of likes.

 

[Elessar]

Yes! Someone finally gets it. You, sir, deserve a full barrel of likes.

Well thank you sir. And to think you wanted to close this thread. See, even in the ashes of an empire the eternal cycle of life and death perseveres.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Well thank you sir. And to think you wanted to close this thread. See, even in the ashes of an empire the eternal cycle of life and death perseveres.

Yes, I see that. The Phoenix falls, but will always be reborn in a new form. And rebirth is lovely.

 

[Ephemiel]

TLDR Link is much better now.

 

[Warlock*G]

TLDR Link is much better now.

Aaaaand everybody should read Essar's "long" post anyway.

 

[Elessar]

This post that Zelkam made on another thread is extremely relevant to this discussion. As I said, here we can see hard concrete data that can't be argued with.

I finally finished my video comparing Link's moveset from Brawl to Smash U. Took way longer than I thought it would but I'm really happy with the way it turned out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNJe7GPL_vg

Don't forget to set it to 60fps! Also youtube let's you slow down the video to 1/4 speed which is super helpful for comparing moves. There's a full list of everything shown in the video with time stamps in the description so if you're wanting to see a specific move you can jump straight to it.

Here's a list of all the noticeable changes I saw while making this. Most of these have been mentioned before but I'll include them anyway for completions sake.

• Dash speed and air speed seem to be a tad bit faster
• Double Jump is higher
• Spot Dodge is slower
• Both rolls are faster, especially back roll.
• Up smash and both swings of forward smash have more ending lag
• Grab has less ending lag but also less range
• Nair seems to last longer (insert joke about sex kick lasting longer here)
• Due to Nair lasting longer, it no longer auto cancels when short hopped
• Uair and Dair both have less landing lag
• Zair has more range
• Bow charges up slightly faster
• Gale Boomerang has a much faster catching animation
• Gale effect seems to be weaker
• Bombs explode 1.33 seconds sooner
• Aerial spin attack goes higher

 

[Karaoke Man]

No, I was horrible when I picked up. But I certainly didn't go into the boards, spam my vids in the wrong thread crying out for attention (possibly hoping to get claims and awes) and announced myself to be amazing. I also presented a video, got trolled and mocked, and moved on. I wonder, has he even looked at any of the other vids in the critique thread to compare himself? Or is he basing his ego on his FG numbers?



Again, he didn't look for critique.




He did get critique, in the right thread. Also, he never asked for critique. He literally showed up and said "Hi, I'm an awesome Link player who rocks" and proceeded to show mediocre gameplay. That is not asking for critique, that's asking for mocking when the vids he shows don't support his claim.



Nobody told him anything differently here, just to not spam the boards with his videos.


Like seriously, where did we get such an audience?

Comparisons are only used for an estimation of where one's skill currently is and is also not the same as searching for pointers and constructive criticism. Not everybody is able to learn and grasp things on their own, because they need something/ someone to objectify the information with. Saying "Why doesn't he just use other videos to critique and compare himself?" Is a huuuuge middle finger and ultimately is recommending the polar opposite of what the thread was made for.


You didn't critique him either and the funny thing is that you STILL haven't . "Lol you're bad, go home kid" isn't constructive; that was just you being a butthole, because of course...you feel entitled to. Maybe he did come off as cocky, but he's not antagonizing others, like you are currently displaying. if he posted videos in the video critique threa, that is a request for the videos to be critiqued, because that's what the thread is asking for.

No, you went much further beyond telling him something different. I understanding reinforcing the policy of what's goes on in boards such as these, but none that has, and will never justify bullying. If you're trying to have a way to help people, that's never the way to do it, I promise you.

The audience is the Smash Community. Don't even go there. I'm not trying to be be a **** either, just trying to help you understand that you don't need to slander others to prove a point.

Mods please don't lock this thread. It can still be used for something positive.

 

[Elessar]

Comparisons are only used for an estimation of where one's skill currently is and is also not the same as searching for pointers and constructive criticism. Not everybody is able to learn and grasp things on their own, because they need something/ someone to objectify the information with. Saying "Why doesn't he just use other videos to critique and compare himself?" Is a huuuuge middle finger and ultimately is recommending the polar opposite of what the thread was made for.


You didn't critique him either and the funny thing is that you STILL haven't . "Lol you're bad, go home kid" isn't constructive; that was just you being a butthole, because of course...you feel entitled to. Maybe he did come off as cocky, but he's not antagonizing others, like you are currently displaying. if he posted videos in the video critique threa, that is a request for the videos to be critiqued, because that's what the thread is asking for.

No, you went much further beyond telling him something different. I understanding reinforcing the policy of what's goes on in boards such as these, but none that has, and will never justify bullying. If you're trying to have a way to help people, that's never the way to do it, I promise you.

The audience is the Smash Community. Don't even go there. I'm not trying to be be a **** either, just trying to help you understand that you don't need to slander others to prove a point.

Mods please don't lock this thread. It can still be used for something positive.

You're late to the party kid, and quite misinformed. I'm too tired now to deal with the rampant misinformation in your sad post. Go back and reread everything until it either makes sense or until you get so sick you don't want to come back. Either way is fine by me.

 

[Zane the pure]

They really must have missed out on the Link boards of Yore, otherwise this would make sense to them.
You should really stop trying guys, nothing is going to change. No amount of begging to the mods for social justice is going to stop you from getting hell from Link mains anywhere they go. If you can't handle that, you should probably give up, cuz anyone here who stuck it out with Link back in brawl needs no mention of their penchant (or lack thereof) for giving up.

 

[Karaoke Man]

You're late to the party kid, and quite misinformed. I'm too tired now to deal with the rampant misinformation in your sad post. Go back and reread everything until it either makes sense or until you get so sick you don't want to come back. Either way is fine by me.

I did read everything prior and I'm not no kid, my dude. The only thing that's sad in this thread is your apathetic, imperialistic mentality that you're expressing; you seem to think being better than others as players, also makes you "better" as a person. It doesn't. You are not worse or better than anyone. I can however, admit that I was wrong about you not giving him any constructive critique at least.

My point is: I get being assertive about regulating how the threads work cause' I mean... he did act a bit over confident, but relentlessly raggin' on people with stuff like " less than mediocre gameplay" or "try hard scrub" is stereotypically disrespectful, entitlement-driven, unnecessary and makes me wonder how these boards even get people to come in here at all. Also, don't give me that nonsense about "thicker skin" because as long as you are a human being, with a functioning/living brain, you will never be immune to emotional pain. Resilience =/= Invulnerability. The saying "stop being so sensitive" is biologically impossible. You don't understand the difference between the intent of your words, and the impact they actually have.

While I'm somewhat new to the Link boards myself, this is not the first time I've commented in the Link threads either. As I said earlier, I don't mean any disrespect; I've been learning Link for a little over a year now (from Brawl). I'm just trying to help with the learning experience and overall just have fun in doing so as I'm sure you guys do as well.

 

[Drunken_Master]

Also, don't give me that nonsense about "thicker skin" because as long as you are a human being, with a functioning/living brain, you will never be immune to emotional pain. Resilience =/= Invulnerability. The saying "stop being so sensitive" is biologically impossible. You don't understand the difference between the intent of your words, and the impact they actually have.

Stop right here. If someone is receiving emotional pain of any sort from a couple grumpy old men who expect their internet lawns to be kept immaculate, they are unfit to play on that lawn.

We are not threatening their well being, their lives or livelihood, or their families, we are not interacting with them on any personal or real level. The first step to getting in with the Link mains has always, and will always be, thick skin. You horse ****ing, toon link scum.

While I'm somewhat new to the Link boards myself, this is not the first time I've commented in the Link threads either. As I said earlier, I don't mean any disrespect; I've been learning Link for a little over a year now (from Brawl). I'm just trying to help with the learning experience and overall just have fun in doing so as I'm sure you guys do as well.

This is good. If you give respect you will earn respect in time. You will learn our culture, maybe become one of us, maybe rep Link at a tournament. You'll see we're exactly as bad not as bad as we seem. These are the Link boards, we do things differently.

 

[Zane the pure]

We're basically a European country, learn the language and assimilate the culture.
Just less fruity ^_^