Social Diddy Kong Social Thread

[Justin Little]

Why nerf him when we can just buff the other characters? I know some are going to hate me for saying this, but PM is still the better game. Every character seems usable and fun in PM. This game is just too damn slow, matches take a long time, and pulling off combos are rare and small. From what I've seen, Diddy has only a few combos. His uair is good, but not great. Why take away the properties of something so small when we can give other characters something as equally as satisfying or better, and give them something that can remedy Diddy's attack pattern (which some already have, he is predictable)? I think it is too soon for nerfs for Diddy and others. Let the game breathe for a moment so I can maybe adapt to the change in playstyle.

 

[Pluid]

Now I'm no expert, but I'm gonna say that buffing an entire 51 character roster for the sake of balancing one character is not a very easy thing to do at all, as well as extremely time consuming.

 

[Justin Little]

We are not buffing the entire roster, just the ones that suck ass (which feels like the entire roster, tsk tsk). I think nerfing characters would take the same amount of time as buffing them.

 

[Dragoomba]

I disagree, his jab is solid.

Nah, his jab is total garbage.

What up, guys! Fellow Diddy main here coming out of the woodworks. Hoping to be more active on Smashboards in this new iteration of Smash. :D

Oh heyyyy

 

[Dissent]

Nah, his jab is total garbage.

Falco, Fox, Luigi, Dr/Mario, MiiFighter, Peach, Pikachu, Mega Man and Sheik have jabs that connect one frame earlier than ours. Little Mac has two frames on ours, and Zero Suit has three frames on ours. So 12 characters have a faster jab than Diddy. There's no IASA frame data that I'm aware of but our jab appears to end at an average time, a little slower than Brawl.

Our jab is not garbage now, it's just not Brawl-level safe. It hits faster than our fastest tilt, DTilt, making it a better choice when the fastest move is absolute priority (Such as landing next to someone in shield).

 

[DtJ S2n]

Do you think people would respect my Diddy if I refused to use D-Throw and U-Airs?

Nah. They'd probably call you a scrub for not taking the broken option and if they loss it will be because Diddy is so broken he doesn't even need those moves. There are some people who will never respect you as a Diddy player unless he gets nerfed but many people still respect Zinoto for example because we know how much dedication he's put into the character and that'd he'd play Diddy even if he did get nerfed. Just keep doing what you're doing man.

Btw if the diddy skype chat is actually quite active, please add leeeyam

It's really not. Maybe it should be resurrected if the board does get talkative and it'd be nice to have a second place for casual discussion, but it started when there were only a handful of people playing Diddy and never really took off. I'm fairly frustrated w/ the Smash 4 community right now after all this crap and don't feel like being that involved, sorry. Sorry to Dragoomba too, I saw your request as well.

 

[Dragoomba]

Falco, Fox, Luigi, Dr/Mario, MiiFighter, Peach, Pikachu, Mega Man and Sheik have jabs that connect one frame earlier than ours. Little Mac has two frames on ours, and Zero Suit has three frames on ours. So 12 characters have a faster jab than Diddy. There's no IASA frame data that I'm aware of but our jab appears to end at an average time, a little slower than Brawl.

Our jab is not garbage now, it's just not Brawl-level safe. It hits faster than our fastest tilt, DTilt, making it a better choice when the fastest move is absolute priority (Such as landing next to someone in shield).

The speed isn't the problem, the problem is that you can't jab cancel (such as jab - grab like nearly every other character in the game) with him. You have to wait around a whole second after a jab before you do anything else. Plus the fact that you can literally just hold shield during the rapid portion of his jab combo and just punish him.

 

[xStJimmy]

So I wanted to play as Rosalina since the announcement, and people says she's broken and stuff so I tried a few other characters, i liked Diddy so I get in the forum, and read the last 2 pages just to see ppl are whining abour Diddy too? D:

So yeah, hey everyone, a new Dixie player here, trying to get better at mix ups and stuff :D

 

[Dissent]

The speed isn't the problem, the problem is that you can't jab cancel (such as jab - grab like nearly every other character in the game) with him. You have to wait around a whole second after a jab before you do anything else. Plus the fact that you can literally just hold shield during the rapid portion of his jab combo and just punish him.

Rapid jab isn't very good unless on the edge, if you just hold A you won't go in to it.

I can't say for certain at the moment, but I recall reading that most, if not all jab -> grab combos are either impossible or situational.

So I wanted to play as Rosalina since the announcement, and people says she's broken and stuff so I tried a few other characters, i liked Diddy so I get in the forum, and read the last 2 pages just to see ppl are whining abour Diddy too? D:

So yeah, hey everyone, a new Dixie player here, trying to get better at mix ups and stuff :D

This is what happens when a new game comes out. People quickly jump to conclusions instead of figuring out how to deal with certain things. When Brawl came out, Dedede was 3rd, GAW was 4th and ROB was 6th on the community tier list. These are characters that had gimmicks that nobody wanted to learn to deal with and thus inflated their performances. Once people learned the game, they began to drop repeatedly.

Diddy isn't unstoppable, just like in Brawl. Stay in his face, bait the banana pull, attack him before he grabs it and steal it and use it properly. This kills the Diddy.

If there are any more balance changes to come, Diddy will probably see attention to cater to the crowds of people that make the issue seem larger than it is. Rosalina was another instance of people not bothering to learn her. Many characters had options to go through most of her moveset and her gimpability was only impacted by us all playing with inferior control options on a 3DS. She still would have been very good, but she wasn't broken.

I learned from my three+ year stint at tournaments that you should just play who you like, community target or not, and have fun doing it. Haters are going to hate, and they are free to pick up the character and attempt to prove that they're so broken. That's when it really gets fun! Anecdotally, my Diddy crushed KirinBlaze (One of the top Mario mains at the time) Game 1 at a Clash of Titans. He took me to Rainbow Cruise, one of MK's best stages, and he went MK. This should have been an automatic loss, but I still managed to 3 stock him, and it felt damn good. If a character is truly broken, anyone can just pick him up and demolish with basic understanding. MK required skill and knowledge, otherwise situations like Vermanubis beating MK's with Ganon would never have happened.

The thing about Diddy also is that he is one of the least changed characters from Brawl that transitioned well to Smash 4's slightly less defensive environment. If you knew the character from Brawl, you were going to get the hang of him fast while many other character mains are busy trying to figure out their combo setups and adapt to changes. You seem to have been really excited to play Rosalina, and while I'm always happy to see another Diddy main around here, you should go for it if she's still in your interest. Diddy will get worse as people learn and techniques to counter Rosalina will pop up if need be. Don't let others ruin your good time, main whatever feels most natural and try to have fun

 

[GOofyGV]

People are lazy, complaining is much easier then learning how to deal with it properly. Why would you even care about it? just whop their *** and go to the next person. There is always someone who will respect you.

 

[Dissent]

Do you think people would respect my Diddy if I refused to use D-Throw and U-Airs?

There were Diddy mains that placed high in Brawl that hardly used bananas and played nothing but offensively, even though statistically defensive banana play was superior. I wouldn't worry about it, do what's fun for you. People will acknowledge you if you perform decently, if that's what you're looking for.

Also, one of the fun things about going against the grain is that it leads to a lot of punishes. If you refuse to use UAir in a situation that most players expect it, they'll likely spam airdodge which you can then punish.

 

[Dragoomba]

Do you think people would respect my Diddy if I refused to use D-Throw and U-Airs?

I wouldn't respect you. That's the scrubbiest **** I've ever heard.

 

[Strong Badam]

WHEN U WALK INTO THE CLUB W/ UR 3DS

"1v1 Any?"

 

[xStJimmy]

This is what happens when a new game comes out. People quickly jump to conclusions instead of figuring out how to deal with certain things.[...]

Yeah! that's exactly what I'm doing actually, aside from what people says I like playing as Rosalina and I found Diddy to be as fun as her too. And I wanted to play with a few other characters as well, so I guess I'm just doing my thing haha!
Sorry for the short answer to your text, but there's nothing I can add to that, it's exactly what I think

 

[Dissent]

Finally dropped a set over at Anther's Ladder, I beat Phuzix's Sheik Game 1 and then lost 2 and 3. Surprise; he knows how to use bananas and counter our SideB (which I've been saying people need to do from the start)! For what it's worth, he went 1-2 against JTails' Diddy. At one point, I managed to bair/uair (Still unsure, the trajectory was BAir but the power was UAir and UAir comes out much faster) while being hit in his rapid jab and kill him. Definitely something to look in to, I'll give it a shot in the lab tomorrow. I still refuse to believe SDI is gone/useless.

 

[Dissent]

$90 I'm rich!

 

[xStJimmy]

$90 I'm rich!

Woa, cool! not the money, but the feel of winning the tournament must be pretty cool, any replay to share? :D

 

[Dissent]

Woa, cool! not the money, but the feel of winning the tournament must be pretty cool, any replay to share? :D

Nobody saved replays! I'm going to put a sticker on my monitor next time that says to save them. The matches that would have been interesting to watch were the two sets versus LingLing (BJR and D3) and the crazy close dittos with Dr Boom (@ boomshakalaka ), everything else was either a slaughter or me repeatedly timing out a campy Villager named Murdabito for the two Grand Finals sets.

Magic the Smashening

Rank

Player

Characters

Points

Earnings

User

1st

vVv Dissent

30

$90.00

Dissent

2nd

Murda Bito

26

$45.00

3rd

LingLing

23

$15.00

Ling Ling

4th

POF

19

P. O. F.

5th

T

15

5th

dr BOOM

15

boomshakalaka

7th

Taz the Tyrent

11

7th

NAVEY SAGE

11

N NavySage

9th

kj

7

9th

JAMM

7

9th

T.O.T.H.

7

9th

kRESH

7

13th

HeavyGammer

5

13th

PINKAZ

5

13th

cheif

5

Oh right, I did some testing. If you repeatedly single stick SDI a quarter/half circle away from the opponent you can get out of rapid jabs much quicker and punish after.

 

[boomshakalaka]

Nobody saved replays! I'm going to put a sticker on my monitor next time that says to save them. The matches that would have been interesting to watch were the two sets versus LingLing (BJR and D3) and the crazy close dittos with Dr Boom (@ boomshakalaka ), everything else was either a slaughter or me repeatedly timing out a campy Villager named Murdabito for the two Grand Finals sets. .

GGs my friend, the rage after was nothing personal towards you jus got mad at myself haha. I'm happy to hear that you won though and sucks i had to play you so early on in the bracket and than again in losers . You're diddy is truely a savage, hope to play you again soon

 

[LiL.Will]

WHEN U WALK INTO THE CLUB W/ UR 3DS

"1v1 Any?"

Can someone make me an AVI of this?
@ Strong Badam Come to Oklahoma sir

 

[Dissent]

GGs my friend, the rage after was nothing personal towards you jus got mad at myself haha. I'm happy to hear that you won though and sucks i had to play you so early on in the bracket and than again in losers . You're diddy is truely a savage, hope to play you again soon

Hey man, no worries. I definitely understand, it's no fun losing to the same person twice in tournament...Next tournament I see you at (Next TkO?), I'll get some friendlies going if you wish, I'm sure we both have things to learn for the ditto considering how close our first set was!

Can someone make me an AVI of this?

Uh, you want a video file? I threw it in Photoshop to adjust the levels and kill the dots in the background, but CS6 dropped AVI support in favor of MP4 and I'm too lazy to download SUPER at the moment, so hopefully this suffices (Download it, the stream preview is poor quality and stretched); http://www.mediafire.com/view/axz881bkwirn8z7/XYoEcks2.mp4

 

[thelegacy]

diddy dallas paige aint getting no nerfs or buffs

 

[GDX]

So, anyone around here I'd still even recognize?

 

[Dre89]

Rapid jab isn't very good unless on the edge, if you just hold A you won't go in to it.

I can't say for certain at the moment, but I recall reading that most, if not all jab -> grab combos are either impossible or situational.

This is what happens when a new game comes out. People quickly jump to conclusions instead of figuring out how to deal with certain things. When Brawl came out, Dedede was 3rd, GAW was 4th and ROB was 6th on the community tier list. These are characters that had gimmicks that nobody wanted to learn to deal with and thus inflated their performances. Once people learned the game, they began to drop repeatedly.

Diddy isn't unstoppable, just like in Brawl. Stay in his face, bait the banana pull, attack him before he grabs it and steal it and use it properly. This kills the Diddy.

If there are any more balance changes to come, Diddy will probably see attention to cater to the crowds of people that make the issue seem larger than it is. Rosalina was another instance of people not bothering to learn her. Many characters had options to go through most of her moveset and her gimpability was only impacted by us all playing with inferior control options on a 3DS. She still would have been very good, but she wasn't broken.

I learned from my three+ year stint at tournaments that you should just play who you like, community target or not, and have fun doing it. Haters are going to hate, and they are free to pick up the character and attempt to prove that they're so broken. That's when it really gets fun! Anecdotally, my Diddy crushed KirinBlaze (One of the top Mario mains at the time) Game 1 at a Clash of Titans. He took me to Rainbow Cruise, one of MK's best stages, and he went MK. This should have been an automatic loss, but I still managed to 3 stock him, and it felt damn good. If a character is truly broken, anyone can just pick him up and demolish with basic understanding. MK required skill and knowledge, otherwise situations like Vermanubis beating MK's with Ganon would never have happened.

The thing about Diddy also is that he is one of the least changed characters from Brawl that transitioned well to Smash 4's slightly less defensive environment. If you knew the character from Brawl, you were going to get the hang of him fast while many other character mains are busy trying to figure out their combo setups and adapt to changes. You seem to have been really excited to play Rosalina, and while I'm always happy to see another Diddy main around here, you should go for it if she's still in your interest. Diddy will get worse as people learn and techniques to counter Rosalina will pop up if need be. Don't let others ruin your good time, main whatever feels most natural and try to have fun

Diddy will stay top tier unless he gets nerfed. His frame data is just too good. Nothing that he relies on now is gimmicky except dthrow-uair strings, but those are super safe and reliable. Unless other characters get massive nana ATs that he doesn't, the only meaningful weakness that will be exploited as the meta develops is that uair is his only reliable KO option. Once again this is assuming no nerfs.

 

[Dissent]

If you do a tech that isn't known and you want to tell people, please don't "wait until later to write it down." I was showing my friend how to play and came across something very useful that made me practice it for 5 minutes and I forgot what it was :|

Also, I managed to sideB latch Shulk underneath Castle Siege's left starter platform and cancel the Jump (Not Attack) on the ledge above ala platform canceling in Brawl. Can't figure out how I did it.

Edit:
Be wary of third transformation of Castle Siege, if it's tilting upwards and you UpB recover it can tilt in to the bottom of your UpB if you've gone past the ledge and cause you to explode. This kills the Diddy.

 

[quibbloboy]

I don't know why people are so convinced uair is Diddy's only kill option. Fsmash is really good, too. You can easily banana someone -> read the getup -> fsmash. Also I've had some success with nair gimps, though this is admittedly much less reliable.

 

[W.A.C.]

As a Diddy Kong main, I definitely feel he deserves to be nerfed at least in some way. Compared to nearly everyone else, he feels kind of broken because of how difficult it is to punish him for mistakes. Yoshi previously had a similar problem where some of his moves were very difficult to punish, so they added landing lag to certain moves. He's still one of the best characters in the game but feels more balanced and punishable for mistakes. If they do the same for some of Diddy's kill moves where he's more vulnerable after making certain moves and make the down throw up air combo more difficult to pull off successfully, I feel like he would still be a top ten character and waaaaaaay less hated. Speaking of hate, I really hate that a lot of people are playing as him simply because he's probably the best character in the game. Diddy Kong vs. Diddy Kong matches are waaaaaay too common in tournaments now and a lot of people are picking him simply to win instead of choosing him because they really like the character.

Edit-

It's worth mentioning that ideally, I'd love to see every character in this game to be viewed as viable options at a tournament. Diddy in his current state kind of messes that up. Also worth mentioning that I don't think he's anywhere near as broken as Meta Knight. I have no idea how they screwed up his balance so bad in that game. Brawl Meta Knight is easily the most broken character in the history of the series by a longshot.

 

[Fliphopper]

Placed second at TGC 2 - 131 entrants I think. Took out some top Texas players while ultimately losing to MegaFox's Fox 3-1 in grand finals.

 

[Geoberos]

Which paid top 4 only, so you got a lot of money to your name. Meanwhile the rest of SA singing the same tune to losing their sets to Diddy's "shenanigans".

 

[Dissent]

Which paid top 4 only, so you got a lot of money to your name. Meanwhile the rest of SA singing the same tune to losing their sets to Diddy's "shenanigans".

To be fair, this was a thing in Brawl for a while, too. After ADHD popularized him, it took people nearly a year to realize that we would wait a moment for them to drop shield so we could glide toss -> smash. The calls of Diddy shenanigans being unfair were pretty high until Diddy's started to lose more and more. He's a very unconventional character to fight against and players typically don't have one to practice against.

 

[GDX]

Placed second at TGC 2 - 131 entrants I think. Took out some top Texas players while ultimately losing to MegaFox's Fox 3-1 in grand finals.

Flip is back whaaaaaaa

 

[Player-1]

I got 3rd at a tournament losing to reflex's jigglypuff game 5 and a falcon player who i beat in winners in bracket, sunday I won a tournament losing to the falcon player in winners, but winnings both sets of GFs. I'll post vids when they go on YT, but I found something by accident with barrels:

http://www.twitch.tv/TypohouseGames/c/5643717?t=17m7s

I hit the stage and should have bounced off the stage from the barrels and died, but had no lag upon landing instead.

 

[Fliphopper]

I got 3rd at a tournament losing to reflex's jigglypuff game 5 and a falcon player who i beat in winners in bracket, sunday I won a tournament losing to the falcon player in winners, but winnings both sets of GFs. I'll post vids when they go on YT, but I found something by accident with barrels:

http://www.twitch.tv/TypohouseGames/c/5643717?t=17m7s

I hit the stage and should have bounced off the stage from the barrels and died, but had no lag upon landing instead.

Good stuff P-1. I wonder if we can make replicate that to become an intentional recovery.

Flip is back whaaaaaaa

Back at it for now! Should we bring back the old school Diddy Backroom lol.

 

[Dre89]

Are people here exxecuting popgun cancels consistely? I'm having trouble with it. Also I'd like to double check that I'm doing it correctly. As far as I know, you're supposed to press B then shield/airdodge almost immediately after. I can never seem to do it if I just press B, I feel like I need to charge it for like 1 or 2 frames, then let go of B and shield at the same time. Is that correct?

 

[Justin Little]

I haven't found a good use for it. Is there?

 

[Geoberos]

Are people here exxecuting popgun cancels consistely? I'm having trouble with it. Also I'd like to double check that I'm doing it correctly. As far as I know, you're supposed to press B then shield/airdodge almost immediately after. I can never seem to do it if I just press B, I feel like I need to charge it for like 1 or 2 frames, then let go of B and shield at the same time. Is that correct?

I haven't used it much since Brawl but it should work the same. It sounds like you're letting go of B. You shouldn't have to, just shield while holding down B less than a second afterwards. Then you could aerial afterwards even if you're still holding B. Using a special afterwards would obviously mean having to quickly re input B again.

 

[GDX]

a backroom wont be necessary this time. Although I'm excited to see what new Diddys appear this generation

but I'll see both you and Hunter at Apex?

 

[Dre89]

a backroom wont be necessary this time. Although I'm excited to see what new Diddys appear this generation

but I'll see both you and Hunter at Apex?

I'm guessing a lot of Diddys will apear this gen because he's currently #1 and he's easier to play than Brawl. Personally I see him eventually dropping off #1 but still remaining top 5-10.

On another note, what ATs are worth practicing when you don't have anyone to play? I know fundamentals like spacing and stuff are more important to practice, but I can do that when I play people.I was trying to get down popgun cancelling but it's too hard for too little reward. Are there any other ATs worth practicing solo?

 

[GDX]

Uhh, make sure you can jump cancelled item toss 100% of the time

 

[Dre89]

Uhh, make sure you can jump cancelled item toss 100% of the time

Is there much difference between a forward throw JCT and just a regular dash toss? I know JCTs are good for throwing nanas at other angles whilst sliding, but I'm not noticing much difference between a forward throw JCT and a regular dash toss.