Did you like or not like Star Fox Zero?

[Nona]

I'm excited for Star Fox Zero. I've been doing personal speedruns on SF64/DS, always going the red route (because I cannot use a landmaster for the life of me) and I agree with @ Foxus that if there is anything they can draw from the later games, it should be Fox's personality. In Adventures he kind of had this "rebellious teenager that wants to show off to the world phase" I found really funny (his comment to Gen. Pepper: "Why can't I bring my blaster?!")

I also hope Fay and Miyu from SF2 make a canon appearance. They're super cute and Star Fox could use more females that aren't solely love interests >_>

 

[radio silent]

I also hope Fay and Miyu from SF2 make a canon appearance. They're super cute and Star Fox could use more females that aren't solely love interests >_>

If Miyu and Fay aren't in SFZ, there will be hell to pay.

Miyamoto, if you are reading this - this is not a joke. I trust you will make the right decision.

 

[IanTheGamer]

If Miyu and Fay aren't in SFZ, there will be hell to pay.

Miyamoto, if you are reading this - this is not a joke. I trust you will make the right decision.

Like in Paper Mario Sticker Star?, Sorry but Miyamoto these days has more bad ideas than good ideas

 

[Foxus]

Like in Paper Mario Sticker Star?, Sorry but Miyamoto these days has more bad ideas than good ideas

Like purchasing Rare.

Lets not forget, without Miyamoto, Star Fox there possibly might have never been a Star Fox to begin with (Miyanoto being Star Fox's creator) nor could we possibly have Donkey Kong or even Mario (as those are all Miyamoto's creations).

I do agree maybe its time for someone else to be in charge.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Like purchasing Rare.

Lets not forget, without Miyamoto, Star Fox there possibly might have never been a Star Fox to begin with (Miyanoto being Star Fox's creator) nor could we possibly have Donkey Kong or even Mario (as those are all Miyamoto's creations).

I do agree maybe its time for someone else to be in charge.

I don't mean Miyamoto is bad, I just think that he has more bad ideas than good ideas these days. (WHY THE HELL DID HE THINK THAT WII MUSIC WAS A GOOD IDEA??!!!)

 

[Planet Cool]

Miyamoto is past his prime. His accomplishments should not be understated, but he doesn't seem to realize that people's expectations of video games have changed since 1995, which is when he made his last great masterpiece. We want to see characters, not gameplay avatars. Settings, not boards.

 

[radio silent]

Miyamoto is past his prime. His accomplishments should not be understated, but he doesn't seem to realize that people's expectations of video games have changed since 1995, which is when he made his last great masterpiece. We want to see characters, not gameplay avatars. Settings, not boards.

I agree. It's about time we learn of the tragic backstory behind Wario. What makes that man tick? What drove him to become the man he is today? All these questions, but no answers in sight.

 

[finalark]

Miyamoto is past his prime. His accomplishments should not be understated, but he doesn't seem to realize that people's expectations of video games have changed since 1995, which is when he made his last great masterpiece. We want to see characters, not gameplay avatars. Settings, not boards.

I disagree. When you're designing a game, creating immersive settings and intricate characters is at the absolute bottom of your priority list. Things like cohesive mechanics, engaging level design and most importantly, making something fun that feels good to play is paramount. And as an armature game designer who has made his share of homebrew board games, I can confidently say that nailing that feel is hardest thing to do.

The fact is, not all games need a story. I played games like Soul Calibur, Halo and even Pokemon for years without ever realizing or even caring that there was a narrative at all. Hell, there are plenty of well loved games that have zero story. Mario Kart, Civilization and Smash are all widely loved and acclaimed games that have no narrative to speak of.

Not only that, but the bitter truth is that may video game stories aren't even all that fantastic to begin with. For example, the Metal Gear series is widely believed to have one of the best narratives in gaming. But if it were a series of books it would hardly even be a blip on the radar of most sci-fi/military fiction readers. Likewise for something like Dragon Age, which, if it were a series of books, would simply be dismissed as "been there, done that" by most fantasy readers.

 

[ChikoLad]

I disagree. When you're designing a game, creating immersive settings and intricate characters is at the absolute bottom of your priority list. Things like cohesive mechanics, engaging level design and most importantly, making something fun that feels good to play is paramount. And as an armature game designer who has made his share of homebrew board games, I can confidently say that nailing that feel is hardest thing to do.

The fact is, not all games need a story. I played games like Soul Calibur, Halo and even Pokemon for years without ever realizing or even caring that there was a narrative at all. Hell, there are plenty of well loved games that have zero story. Mario Kart, Civilization and Smash are all widely loved and acclaimed games that have no narrative to speak of.

Not only that, but the bitter truth is that may video game stories aren't even all that fantastic to begin with. For example, the Metal Gear series is widely believed to have one of the best narratives in gaming. But if it were a series of books it would hardly even be a blip on the radar of most sci-fi/military fiction readers. Likewise for something like Dragon Age, which, if it were a series of books, would simply be dismissed as "been there, done that" by most fantasy readers.

As a game designer myself, this is untrue.

What a designer prioritises is literally up to them. Games like Heavy Rain, Journey, Beyond Two Souls, etc, don't have much in the way of gameplay mechanics or level design gimmicks, but they are still definitely games - just they prioritise immersing the player in a world or story, over super deep game mechanics. They're still fantastic games.

As far as "many video game stories aren't even all that fantastic to begin with", that's in the eye of the beholder. I couldn't give a damn about Star Trek, no matter how great it's fans big it up to be, but I played MGS2 as a kid, and got immersed in the story, so I played other MGS games too and continued to be immersed.

That being said, when creating a new entry in a long running franchise, you've got to be aware of what fans want. Regardless of the fact Star Fox fans disagree in the gameplay department, most Star Fox fans do have a deeper appreciation for the characters, because they grew up with them and watched them grow and develop over the past few games. What's more, the route they are taking results in various characters being simply left out of the picture, like Krystal and Panther.

To just go back to "re-telling the Star Fox 64 story" is pure laziness and tone deafness at the same time. There is absolutely no reason to be doing that, since the last game in the series WAS LITERALLY Star Fox 64. People with a lot of nostalgia for that game are satisfied. I understand them wanting to play it relatively safe in the gameplay department (though they are playing it a bit too safe even there, as the gameplay doesn't add much beyond the gyro controls), but NOBODY wanted to hear the SF64 story over again. There is no reason they couldn't continue on from the previous games. Even if they had to retcon Command and simply continue from Assault (I could understand retconning Command due to the multiple endings problem), that would have been a much better idea than redoing the SF64 story (which in turn means we are visiting all of the same settings again).

Plus, story can effect gameplay. It's like, people aren't sick of the "Bowser kidnaps Peach" story in Mario because they expect Romeo & Juliet, it's because we've seen that Peach is capable of being part of Mario's team and defending herself with her own abilities. At this point, people would rather play as Peach than rescue her.

 

[finalark]

As a game designer myself, this is untrue.

What a designer prioritises is literally up to them. Games like Heavy Rain, Journey, Beyond Two Souls, etc, don't have much in the way of gameplay mechanics or level design gimmicks, but they are still definitely games - just they prioritise immersing the player in a world or story, over super deep game mechanics. They're still fantastic games.

Different strokes, I suppose. The last word I'd attach to Heavy Rain is "fantastic" from a narrative standpoint. The game play is pretty neat, though.

But yes, obviously there are some games where the story is a core part of the experience. VNs, adventure games and some RPGs are examples of this.

As far as "many video game stories aren't even all that fantastic to begin with", that's in the eye of the beholder. I couldn't give a damn about Star Trek, no matter how great it's fans big it up to be, but I played MGS2 as a kid, and got immersed in the story, so I played other MGS games too and continued to be immersed.

Yes, but when you're a kid you have zero basis for comparison. It's like scrapping your knee. As a child its the worst thing in the world because you've never experienced anything quite like it. But as an adult, it still sucks but you know it's not that bad so you clean it with some water and walk it off.

My first MGS game was Twin Snakes, which I got as a birthday gift from a cousin when I was twelve. I loved it to death, and to this day it's one of my favorite games. I then went on to play MGS2, 3 and 4 when that came out. Truthfully, I thought it was the most mind blowing thing I was a kid. After all, I really didn't get what was going on half the time, so it must be deep, right?

Just a few months ago I replayed MGS4 with the mind of someone who has become a frequent reader and writer only to realize something - the story in these games is pretty terrible. Half the characters only exist to provide boss fights (the B&B core could be cut entirely from MGS4 and nothing would be lost from a narrative standpoint), Kojima is in desperate need of an editor, the dialog is in exercise in how to say absolutely nothing in a thousand words or more and the "philosophy" presented is as koan-tastic as possible.

But I still love these games because they're sentimental. I grew up with these characters and feel a special attachment. Same goes something like Kingdom Hearts. Yes, the story is beyond stupid, poorly written, obviously not well throughout, but I can't help but get really into it because I grew up with the characters and I feel attached to them.

But sentimental should never be confused for "good." Just like how the quality of a game can be blown out of proportion because of nostalgia the same goes for a story.

The fact is, if you had gotten into Star Trek as a kid you'd probably feel the same way about it as you feel about Metal Gear.

To just go back to "re-telling the Star Fox 64 story" is pure laziness and tone deafness at the same time. There is absolutely no reason to be doing that, since the last game in the series WAS LITERALLY Star Fox 64. People with a lot of nostalgia for that game are satisfied. I understand them wanting to play it relatively safe in the gameplay department (though they are playing it a bit too safe even there, as the gameplay doesn't add much beyond the gyro controls), but NOBODY wanted to hear the SF64 story over again. There is no reason they couldn't continue on from the previous games. Even if they had to retcon Command and simply continue from Assault (I could understand retconning Command due to the multiple endings problem), that would have been a much better idea than redoing the SF64 story (which in turn means we are visiting all of the same settings again).

I'm not going to disagree with you here. Star Fox Zero's biggest issue is that it's a rehash. We don't need what amounts to a remake of Star Fox 64 right after a remake of Star Fox 64. I don't want to see the same exact environments again, I don't want to hear the same exact dialog again, I don't want to go through the motions of playing what feels like the same exact levels again, and I certainly don't want to play the same game again.

Really wish Nintendo would expand on Assault's game play.

Plus, story can effect gameplay. It's like, people aren't sick of the "Bowser kidnaps Peach" story in Mario because they expect Romeo & Juliet, it's because we've seen that Peach is capable of being part of Mario's team and defending herself with her own abilities. At this point, people would rather play as Peach than rescue her.

Different strokes, I think. There's certainly people who want to see a different scenario while other seems satisfied to just have Bowser kidnap Peach so they can get on with the game.

Although with Mario 3D World it looks like Nintendo intends to make Peach a regular playable character and to leave Bowser's kidnapping business to fairies or something.

 

[ChikoLad]

I played MGS2 as a kid, but that doesn't mean I didn't have other points of comparison. I watched plenty of movies and shows, read plenty of books, and played many games. I still think MGS has a phenomenal story just fine.

Same with Kingdom Hearts. Kingdom Hearts is far from a mess, if you play every game, read every Ansem Report and other bonus material in the games, literally everything makes sense. It's very cohesive and it all comes together to form an extremely interesting, expansive narrative, plus you get tons of charming characters and emotional scenes to boot. While I wish certain parts of the story went a bit differently, nothing about the narrative doesn't make sense, all of the games are part of something bigger.

Speaking of Kingdom Hearts, it's actually a good point of comparison for Star Fox - the Gummi Ship mini-game is arguably a more advanced Star Fox game than Star Fox itself. Imagine if you could build your own ships in Star Fox.

 

[IanTheGamer]

The story for Zero is like Nintendo decided that they wanted to go completely back to SF64, most fans only wanted the gameplay of SF64 not the story too, I feel like EAD threw the baby out with the bathwater

 

[radio silent]

Different strokes, I think. There's certainly people who want to see a different scenario while other seems satisfied to just have Bowser kidnap Peach so they can get on with the game.

Although with Mario 3D World it looks like Nintendo intends to make Peach a regular playable character and to leave Bowser's kidnapping business to fairies or something.

Yeah, I've never been too concerned with the story in traditional Mario games at all. Same with Star Fox, the characters and story just exist to justify the gameplay to me (as much as I love the original team and Star Wolf.) They're a charming little squad to fight alongside, and that's all I need.

 

[Foxus]

Actually imagine if Mario were kidnapped by Bowser, like he was totally disenchanted. Mario was already kidnapped by Boo once, spurring off Luigi's Mansion. A female protagonist, other than Samus, could benefit Nintendo greatly.

As someone who looks to develop games myself, putting emphasis on character development and adding dimensions to a characters personality is as important as the storyline. Its like a canvas and a paintbrush, are you going to paint it in only black and grey or in a vibrant palette of colors? A dull character will turn off the player, a interesting and dimensional character will allow the gamer to connect to them, similar to how someone could connect to Fox in Adventures, which I firmly believe was the pinnacle of Fox's greatness this far.

There is a point to be made when Star Fox Zero is pretty much Star Fox 64 3DS, except for the fact now you use the gamepad and its not on a handheld. I agree its pretty lazy on the behalf of the developer to just say "Hey, lets put out a remastered version of Star Fox 64, but use certain terminology to make it seem fresh." This is really a insult to the series, especially when we haven't gotten a true Star Fox game since Command, or more so Assault. Maybe someone will buy out the Star ox series and do better with it, because Nintendo has pretty much done nothing but treat it like trash.

Isn't Kingdom Hearts a Disney game?

 

[ChikoLad]

Mario was actually kidnapped by Bowser in Super Princess Peach.

Kingdom Hearts is basically a Disney RPG, though it has Square Enix and original characters too.

 

[radio silent]

A dull character will turn off the player, a interesting and dimensional character will allow the gamer to connect to them, similar to how someone could connect to Fox in Adventures, which I firmly believe was the pinnacle of Fox's greatness this far.

Sure, but this is entirely dependent on the type of game you're trying to make. In something like a 2D Mario game, nobody gives a damn about how deep the characters are. We don't need a million cutscenes explaining the inner workings of Luigi's mind, because nobody actually cares. Not every game needs to have a rich narrative or deep characters - sometimes it's fine for a video game to just be a video game.

Isn't Kingdom Hearts a Disney game?

It's a Square game with Disney characters in it.

 

[Foxus]

Sure, but this is entirely dependent on the type of game you're trying to make. In something like a 2D Mario game, nobody gives a damn about how deep the characters are. We don't need a million cutscenes explaining the inner workings of Luigi's mind, because nobody actually cares. Not every game needs to have a rich narrative or deep characters - sometimes it's fine for a video game to just be a video game.


It's a Square game with Disney characters in it.

True, putting a good number of cutscenes in Luigi's Mansion would be boring, because of the opening cutscene and the meeting of D.r Egdd basically summed up the game. In Adventures however, the cutscenes added to the games dimension (critics say the voice overs were overdone, but I think knowing a good number of the cast were British, it was fine). Plus the cutscnes improved Fox personality wise.

I meant to add in my last post I'm disappointed in both Nintendo and Platinum Games for such a sour project, I'm disappointed in Myamoto for making the decision to reboot SF64, do I mean to be so negative? No I don't, as much as I like Nintendo, the last two Mario Parties and now this show how downhill they've started to go.

Btw Nintendo, Rare knows how to make your games. Might wanna keep that in mind.

 

[radio silent]

I meant to add in my last post I'm disappointed in both Nintendo and Platinum Games for such a sour project, I'm disappointed in Myamoto for making the decision to reboot SF64, do I mean to be so negative? No I don't, as much as I like Nintendo, the last two Mario Parties and now this show how downhill they've started to go.

To be fair, I'm pretty sure Nintendo's A-team has never actually developed a Mario Party game. You can thank Hudson for that godforsaken series.

 

[ChikoLad]

Sure, but this is entirely dependent on the type of game you're trying to make. In something like a 2D Mario game, nobody gives a damn about how deep the characters are. We don't need a million cutscenes explaining the inner workings of Luigi's mind, because nobody actually cares. Not every game needs to have a rich narrative or deep characters - sometimes it's fine for a video game to just be a video game.


It's a Square game with Disney characters in it.

I dunno man, people loved Super Paper Mario.

I personally think Mario should try a bit harder with characterisation. But not in a serious context, it'd be nice if you had funny gag cut scenes between worlds, just to give the game some charm.

The only character I want to have serious stuff going on is Rosalina, but that's because she debuted as this unusually in-depth Mario character with actual agency. I want her to get her own franchise for that though.

 

[Foxus]

To be fair, I'm pretty sure Nintendo's A-team has never actually developed a Mario Party game. You can thank Hudson for that godforsaken series.

Idk, MP 1 and 2 were pretty good. 3 was meh, 4 and 5 were the highlights imo, 6 was like 3 meh, 7 and 8 were good, but 9 was just a disappointment (the reasons being the original objective of collecting coins for stars for the cart mechanic). 10 seems to be a copy of that, employing the same mechanics.

Nintendo almost needs a complete restructuring. Like someone new needs to come in and completely freshen up things. Reggie seems to give me the impression he is really enjoying the publicity he gets more than caring for the quality of the games.

 

[Deleted member]

I personally am a bit disappointed that it's the second re-telling of SF64. I was really hoping it would be either a replacement for Command or maybe a sequel which would tell us which ending is canon. (I really didn't mind Command as a whole, the controls worked fine for me. I would have appreciated some voice acting and cutscenes though...)

I remember the first time I watched the Smash Taunts for the Orbital Gate Assault stage in SSB4. No Krystal, no Star Wolf, and it made it seem like they were rebooting the series (and yes, I know SF64 was a reboot.)

But at the same time I'm 99% sure I'm gonna get the game seeing as I love Star Fox, and that we haven't had an original title in almost 10 years

 

[IanTheGamer]

Nintendo really has a tendency to scrap everything if it doesn't work, not giving it a second chance, the gameplay of Assault could have been improved, but no, what's EAD to do?, Throw out everything, just to appease the purists, who need to shut the hell up and get it through their thick skulls, Star Fox can't survive as a solely on-rails shooter that has a very short completion time, Nintendo's going to need to move the series forward instead of constantly going back to SF64, OKAY WE GET IT!, SF64 is the best game in the series. But you don't have to pander to nostalgia and make every game just like it. It's the purists that made Nintendo afraid to bring back anything from Adventures or later,

 

[Planet Cool]

I agree. It's about time we learn of the tragic backstory behind Wario. What makes that man tick? What drove him to become the man he is today? All these questions, but no answers in sight.

Your searing sarcasm burned that strawman to a crisp. Just because Wario (who, incidentally, was not created by Miyamoto) doesn't need much complex characterization doesn't mean that people are going to be happy when Nintendo undoes years of history, progress, and characterization in Star Fox. I'm not saying there's anything particularly deep about Star Fox, and sure, there's the kind of player that cares about the gameplay and nothing else, but then there's also the kind of filmgoer that only cares about special effects, and the kind of book reader that only cares about the sex scenes. Bad things happen if we appeal to those people to the exclusion of everyone else.

If you want an example of a game that is literary and emotionally rich without being serious and realistic or forgoing the gameplay side of things, look no further than Super Mario Galaxy.

Also, just because many games don't need good writing or three-dimensional characters doesn't mean designers should be encouraged to ignore those elements and make the simplest games consumers will accept. It shows a disregard for the medium.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Ladies and gentlemen: The SF64 purists in a nutshell:
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5AvrBFlJeMs

 

[radio silent]

Your searing sarcasm burned that strawman to a crisp. Just because Wario (who, incidentally, was not created by Miyamoto) doesn't need much complex characterization doesn't mean that people are going to be happy when Nintendo undoes years of history, progress, and characterization in Star Fox. I'm not saying there's anything particularly deep about Star Fox, and sure, there's the kind of player that cares about the gameplay and nothing else, but then there's also the kind of filmgoer that only cares about special effects, and the kind of book reader that only cares about the sex scenes. Bad things happen if we appeal to those people to the exclusion of everyone else.

If you want an example of a game that is literary and emotionally rich without being serious and realistic or forgoing the gameplay side of things, look no further than Super Mario Galaxy.

Also, just because many games don't need good writing or three-dimensional characters doesn't mean designers should be encouraged to ignore those elements and make the simplest games consumers will accept. It shows a disregard for the medium.

Gameplay should always take top priority, though. Some people only care about special effects or sex scenes, and I agree that catering exclusively to those people would be a terrible idea because those aren't essential to their respective mediums (for the most part, anyway.) However, every game developer should absolutely be catering to people who care about gameplay above all else because they're video games. Gameplay is what separates video games from every other medium out there.

I'm not saying you should ignore it outright. If you can make compelling characters and story along the way - cool. Fantastic. But that shouldn't be your primary concern, unless you're dealing with RPGs.

Ladies and gentlemen: The SF64 purists in a nutshell:
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5AvrBFlJeMs

We get it, dude.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Gameplay should always take top priority, though. Some people only care about special effects or sex scenes, and I agree that catering exclusively to those people would be a terrible idea because those aren't essential to their respective mediums (for the most part, anyway.) However, every game developer should absolutely be catering to people who care about gameplay above all else because they're video games. Gameplay is what separates video games from every other medium out there.

I'm not saying you should ignore it outright. If you can make compelling characters and story along the way - cool. Fantastic. But that's shouldn't be your primary concern, unless you're dealing with RPGs.


We get it, dude.

Again, the developers can prioritze whatever the hell they want to priortize. The SF64 formula is too dated, the gaming market has changed so much in the last 18 years,that SF64 would be considered "meh". Though I think that Platinum has absolutely no creative input, with Miyamoto in charge, he's the only one that gets MAJOR creative input. If I was developing a Star Fox game, and Miyamoto told me that he didn't like it, and kept suggesting ideas that I found stupid, I'd tell him "We are going to make the game how we want it, and if you don't like it, you can go eat sand"

 

[Foxus]

Again, the developers can prioritze whatever the hell they want to priortize. The SF64 formula is too dated, the gaming market has changed so much in the last 18 years,that SF64 would be considered "meh". Though I think that Platinum has absolutely no creative input, with Miyamoto in charge, he's the only one that gets MAJOR creative input. If I was developing a Star Fox game, and Miyamoto told me that he didn't like it, and kept suggesting ideas that I found stupid, I'd tell him "We are going to make the game how we want it, and if you don't like it, you can go eat sand"

Then he'd fire you. You have to reach a compromise when it comes to these things. Since Iwata passed away, Miyamoto, by process of elimination, is technically now the head of Nintendo. Whatever he says goes. We also need to consider it might not be just lack of creativity, but the reboot of SF 64 may be a business decision as well. In terms of profits, Nintendo hasn't been so hot in the past 3-4 years (Smash 4 really being the first Wii U title to gain any momentum and produce great numbers of $$$).

While the GameCube as a console didn't do so hot, the games were another story. Adventures, Super Mario Sunshine, Mario Party 4 and 5, maybe Nintendo now needs to look in the last decade for gaming ideas, because they're running on fumes now.

I know I'd love to do something with Star Fox, noting I'd probably treat the franchise so much better than its original creator has.

 

[finalark]

Gameplay should always take top priority, though. Some people only care about special effects or sex scenes, and I agree that catering exclusively to those people would be a terrible idea because those aren't essential to their respective mediums (for the most part, anyway.) However, every game developer should absolutely be catering to people who care about gameplay above all else because they're video games. Gameplay is what separates video games from every other medium out there.

I'm not saying you should ignore it outright. If you can make compelling characters and story along the way - cool. Fantastic. But that's shouldn't be your primary concern, unless you're dealing with RPGs.

You're entirely right here. Hell, there's even RPGs out there where the story is pretty clearly an afterthought (Pokemon and SMT series is a good example of this).

Making your story a top priority while making a game is like making your cover a top priority when writing a book. Yes, it's nice to have a really good cover by a really good artist, but you don't need it and your time and effort should be spent revising your work.

Plus every single video and article I have ever seen or read where devs talk about story in games can be summed up as, "If you want to tell a story, don't get into video games."

While the GameCube as a console didn't do so hot, the games were another story. Adventures, Super Mario Sunshine, Mario Party 4 and 5, maybe Nintendo now needs to look in the last decade for gaming ideas, because they're running on fumes now.

You're forgetting about the Nintendo cycle.

All Nintendo consoles get vindicated by hindsight. The N64 was widely disliked back in its day for it's controller, expensive games and for having one or two fantastic games a year and nothing else. Likewise for the GCN, and I imagine the Wii U will get similar treatment in about five or six years. Hell, we're already seeing the Wii get this treatment.

The fact is, the "running on fumes" criticism has been thrown at Nintendo since the N64 era. The games you grew up on are going to be the ones you like the best, but don't let your nostalgia make you myopic.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Then he'd fire you. You have to reach a compromise when it comes to these things. Since Iwata passed away, Miyamoto, by process of elimination, is technically now the head of Nintendo. Whatever he says goes. We also need to consider it might not be just lack of creativity, but the reboot of SF 64 may be a business decision as well. In terms of profits, Nintendo hasn't been so hot in the past 3-4 years (Smash 4 really being the first Wii U title to gain any momentum and produce great numbers of $$$).

While the GameCube as a console didn't do so hot, the games were another story. Adventures, Super Mario Sunshine, Mario Party 4 and 5, maybe Nintendo now needs to look in the last decade for gaming ideas, because they're running on fumes now.

I know I'd love to do something with Star Fox, noting I'd probably treat the franchise so much better than its original creator has.

Fine, I'll take his better ideas and ignore the rest, I think Nintendo has lost sight of what really matters, and that's making games that are innovative for different reasons,FYI: Japanese businesses don't really fire people, unless they give 30 day notices, at worst, I'd be sent into a punishment room

 

[Swamp Sensei]

This is becoming a circle jerk.

 

[ChikoLad]

Again, like I said, there is no written rule on what a developer should focus on. It's entirely up to them, the direction of their game is entirely up to them, so please don't say "developers should focus entirely/primarily on gameplay" or anything. What defines a video game is 1) interactivity 2) objectives and rules, and 3) a fail state. Nothing more, nothing less, that is the objective truth you will learn when going to a course in video game design, though it should be apparent to you if you've been playing games for years. Anything else your game consists of, such as "gameplay" and "story", is completely up to you, and nothing is objectively better than the other. For example, the Stanley Parable - all you do in that game is walk and press your hotkey from time to time, but it's still a game - it has clear objectives, you interact with things, and some of the endings are basically fail states (such as one ending being killing yourself, which you can do as early as within the first few seconds). The game is very much driven by it's narrative, story, and messages, more so than the game mechanics, but it's still defined as a video game as it meets the (only) three objective criteria for being defined as a video game. So please, the "gameplay should be the main focus" is not a claim with any substantial merit to it. It's an opinionated statement at best, and isn't a very good criticism on it's own.

On that note of what the developer wants being up to them, there is nothing wrong with what Miyamoto and his team are doing with Star Fox: Zero. However, since Star Fox is a long running, beloved franchise, that people have certain expectations for, what the game is doing simply isn't meeting people's (reasonable) expectations. The game looks great, but it doesn't look like the next epic installment in the franchise a lot of people wanted, it's not going to make the splash SF64 did back in the day, since what it's doing is not much of a step up from that game. Feels like a side-step more than anything, in both gameplay and story.

I came here to post the updated boxart for the game, though:

Also, release date:

Plus every single video and article I have ever seen or read where devs talk about story in games can be summed up as, "If you want to tell a story, don't get into video games."

Don't be so impressionable then, because that's a poor mindset and shouldn't be taken as gospel. There are many storytelling techniques only possible in video games, many types of stories that don't work that well in other mediums. I'd also suggest reading/watching opinion pieces outside of your usual comfort zone.

 

[finalark]

@ ChikoLad The thing is, I used to have the same exact opinion as you. But over time as I got older and learned more about game development and tried my own hand at it I learned that story isn't that big a deal when you're making a game. Maybe your experience was different than mine, maybe you're just steadfast in your opinions. Either way, I think we can just agree to disagree at this point.

 

[ChikoLad]

There isn't much opinion to my statement.

Games don't NEED much story all of the time (that's not even what I want out of Star Fox per se), but it's an absolute fact that certain storytelling techniques are applicable to video games exclusively.

And either way, you always benefit from having some semblance of a good story or interesting characters in a game. It's one of the main things that makes a game memorable.

 

[Game Boy]

I'm glad Star Fox is getting a new game.

The problems I have with Star Fox Zero

It's a reimagining, so technically it's just Star Fox 64 but with a new coat of paint.
While it looks amazing, I kinda want a new game from where ever they left off in the continuity.

Problems other people have

1. The game apparently looks like it's GameCube quality? I personally don't see it.
   
2. The game seems lacking in certain parts.
3. WHEREARETHEVOICESASDFGHJKL::" (according to some people who looked for gameplay footage)
   And more, just these were the ones I noticed the most...?

Well, whatever problems others have, we can only hope that Nintendo can work on making this game what everyone wants to be from a Star Fox title.

However why is this reimagining a good thing?
This game takes 64 and elements from both SNES and SF2. and makes a lovechild out of it.
And because of that, we may have a chance for characters that never saw the light of day.

Younger audiences that never experienced Star Fox 64, or it's remastered 3DS version may find themselves being fans of Star Fox after playing this.

Star Fox 64 for the most part always felt like to me that you were playing an arcade game at home.
You're basically playing an On-rails shooter trying to get the most points while not trying to die.

New Transformation and vehicles means new ways to play.
With the Chicken Walker, and the Helicopter.. thing with the robot guy, this game may not be all on-rail, and you'll have some control to explore a little, as well as changing things up.

Remember that mission where you have to save Pepper in the tower from robot attackers? You could choose to take them all from the air or go into the Chicken Walker form and do it. And even that one boss that was shown. You got some options, you can either take down it's parts and go inside of it to take out the core. or you can shoot some things and win, however this would result in the bad guy escaping in a rocket he had in the center of it. If there's different ways to do things, I can see myself playing this a lot.

What do I also want?
I won't guarantee anything but.

Completing Story Mode - Unlock Star Wolf sub-story (Give us more to play!)

Completing 100% - Unlock new Characters to use in missions (like from SF2, or even playing as Falco, Peppy, Slippy, or Krystal? although this game is a bit away before Adventures happens)

Challenge Mode - Play the game again but with a new difficulty!

Online Multiplayer - How cool would it be to have FFA or team dogfights? Just let's not do that facecam thing SF64 3D did..

Amiibo Support - Amiibo themed Vehicles maybe?

 

[ChikoLad]

Walkers being brought back don't say anything about the scrapped characters being brought back.

 

[Game Boy]

Walkers being brought back don't say anything about the scrapped characters being brought back.

Like I said, I don't guarantee anything I'm hoping for will actually happen, while the game is bringing back the walker, I feel there's a chance, even if it is a really fat chance of it happening at all, this won't turn me down from the game regardless.

 

[ChikoLad]

If you're hoping for the SF2 characters to come back in Zero, that's not gonna happen. It's the same story as SF64, and therefore the same characters.

 

[Foxus]

I'm glad Star Fox is getting a new game.

The problems I have with Star Fox Zero

It's a reimagining, so technically it's just Star Fox 64 but with a new coat of paint.
While it looks amazing, I kinda want a new game from where ever they left off in the continuity.

Problems other people have

1. The game apparently looks like it's GameCube quality? I personally don't see it.
   
2. The game seems lacking in certain parts.
3. WHEREARETHEVOICESASDFGHJKL::" (according to some people who looked for gameplay footage)
   And more, just these were the ones I noticed the most...?

Well, whatever problems others have, we can only hope that Nintendo can work on making this game what everyone wants to be from a Star Fox title.

However why is this reimagining a good thing?
This game takes 64 and elements from both SNES and SF2. and makes a lovechild out of it.
And because of that, we may have a chance for characters that never saw the light of day.

Younger audiences that never experienced Star Fox 64, or it's remastered 3DS version may find themselves being fans of Star Fox after playing this.

Star Fox 64 for the most part always felt like to me that you were playing an arcade game at home.
You're basically playing an On-rails shooter trying to get the most points while not trying to die.

New Transformation and vehicles means new ways to play.
With the Chicken Walker, and the Helicopter.. thing with the robot guy, this game may not be all on-rail, and you'll have some control to explore a little, as well as changing things up.

Remember that mission where you have to save Pepper in the tower from robot attackers? You could choose to take them all from the air or go into the Chicken Walker form and do it. And even that one boss that was shown. You got some options, you can either take down it's parts and go inside of it to take out the core. or you can shoot some things and win, however this would result in the bad guy escaping in a rocket he had in the center of it. If there's different ways to do things, I can see myself playing this a lot.

What do I also want?
I won't guarantee anything but.

Completing Story Mode - Unlock Star Wolf sub-story (Give us more to play!)

Completing 100% - Unlock new Characters to use in missions (like from SF2, or even playing as Falco, Peppy, Slippy, or Krystal? although this game is a bit away before Adventures happens)

Challenge Mode - Play the game again but with a new difficulty!

Online Multiplayer - How cool would it be to have FFA or team dogfights? Just let's not do that facecam thing SF64 3D did..

Amiibo Support - Amiibo themed Vehicles maybe?

I know Nintendo wants to milk SF 64 until its bone dry, just for the profits alone.

I honestly (and I don't care about the hate I might get) want something similar to that of Adventures. Apply the Zelda dynamic of on-foot missions and employ air missions from Assault. Or create a SF game that takes place between the events that occurred in Adventures and Assault. Have the voice actors from Assault reprise their respective roles. Maybe something where Krystal is still trying to get a hold on the ropes of being part of the Star Fox team.

And have Rare develop it, hell knows they do laps around Platinum and Namco imo when it comes to game development. I can't emphasize on that enough.

I was really hoping for cutscenes or some type of furthered communication between characters than just radio transmissions, and play as Fox on foot rather than in a chicken robot.

I fell in love with SF starting with Adventures, and I'd love to see a game like that again.

 

[radio silent]

I fell in love with SF starting with Adventures, and I'd love to see a game like that again.

Lemme tell you about this series called The Legend of Zelda.

 

[Foxus]

Lemme tell you about this series called The Legend of Zelda.

I know about the Zelda games, despite (gasps) never playing one.