Did you know you can shine-->JCgrab

[ynnek123]

so yea you can hit them with the shine and then JC grab xD not any use but it looks really nice

 

[Milos]

fail

10

Fails

+1 post count

 

[KirbyKaze]

this is an awesome tech

it's crazy good

it's also very old

 

[Da Shuffla]

That's what I do when I shuffle into shields. Nair>shine>JC grab.

 

[Havokbringer]

It's a very underused AT but for a good reason.

 

[ynnek123]

I don't mean against a shield, hitting them and immediately cancelling so you slide far enough to still get the grab

 

[Toobz]

Yeah I don't find Shine to JC grab to be generally useful. How about Shine to Usmash? I've done it 2-3 times on computer falcon, but thats it. I've never been able to do it against a human. Is it possible and is it very useful? I've never seen shine to usmash in a youtube video before, so I'm not sure its possible.

 

[Da Shuffla]

Oh, please do NOT try the reflectograb (that's the name I heard) on a human. Much safer doing waveshine to grab or Usmash on people. Too risky, besides, you could do it too early and get grabbed, not wise. Not worth it.

 

[ynnek123]

Oh, please do NOT try the reflectograb (that's the name I heard) on a human. Much safer doing waveshine to grab or Usmash on people. Too risky, besides, you could do it too early and get grabbed, not wise. Not worth it.

thats what I said...........-__________-'

 

[Da Shuffla]

Sorry, I forgot you said it was useless in your first post.

 

[Shai Hulud]

It's useful. If you do it out of a run it works on pretty much every character if you're fast enough. It's also considerably easier than shine to usmash.

 

[4 Aces]

Besides tacking on 4% more damage, is there a benefit to running shine smash/grab as opposed to just running smash/grab?

 

[RaynEX]

Yes. Its shiny.


Seriously though, ask yourself that question again. The answer you'll come up with will be:

****, I've just thrown myself into this monstrously terrible position wherein I might screw up a free grab or usmash because they smash d.i. the shine or i screw up technically.

Its not worth the trouble.

 

[4 Aces]

Yeah, I figured as much. Just wanted to make sure I'm not missing something.

 

[SpaceFalcon]

Then you keep doing it until you don't screw up anymore!

Shining between moves is very effective, thats why shine-bair is such a strong 2 hit combo because most likely they won't get the chance to smasH DI the b-air properly an if they do, then just don't shin in the first place, it's the same idea with shine>u-smsh/shine>nair..tc

 

[RaynEX]

Wow Space...your logic is awesome.

You're saying that he should practice shinebair, because it is a "strong combo"?

I don't know about you, but betting a FREE move with Fox is stupid. Almost every move he has leads to something else. Fox has the ultimate punish/gimp game. Throwing a JC shine between moves does nothing but add a big gaping window for error. In a tournament, that one ****ed up shineusmash could mean the difference between winning and losing.

If its friendlies then w/e, but being so careless with punishes and openings is dumb. Fox has to learn to jump on every opportunity he gets and **** the living **** out of his opponent. This **** just turns you into a thoughtless techy fox. Flashiness won't get you anywhere.

 

[SpaceFalcon]

We obviously need to play SSBM together

And edit: Thats not what I meant in my post. I'm not one of the shine>bair fascination stereotypes. I just said tricking your opponent into DI'ing the wrong move is like you ust said.

could mean the difference between winning and losing.

Thats why I said shining between moves is so effective.. but thats just me you guys can play fox in whatever manner you like.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

^^true, sometimes i do shinebair when I shinespike someone so they get hit by the bair if they SDI'd the shine. if they didn't they still got shined so it's win/win.
Shine out of a dash can be a pretty good/safe approach, b/c if you miss you can WD back ASAP so you'll have very little vulnerable time. PC chris does it all the time
But if you're approaching this way and you're not 100% sure you're gonna hit, there is no way you can react fast enough to jc grab since you need to jc grab so early. But you can react fast enough to waveshine->grab, though.

 

[Shai Hulud]

Shine bair is ********.

 

[TheManaLord]

shine bair *****

only good mid stage and not for edgeguarding unless they high percent tho

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

Yhea off course it's only useful if they're at high enough percent for the bair to kill them or atleast put them in a worse position then the shine would've, i didn't mind writing it cuz i figured it was obvious lol

 

[Shred_kid]

I use shine bair to kill, and that's about it.

 

[Shai Hulud]

shine bair *****

only good mid stage and not for edgeguarding unless they high percent tho

Shine bair only connects if your opponent DIs incorrectly. It's ********.

 

[RaynEX]

lol I've tried saying that for weeks and nobody cares.

But sometimes if you hit underneath them with the shine the bair will hit. If they are d.i.ing away for whatever reason shine is all you'll get.

 

[ArcNatural]

lol I've tried saying that for weeks and nobody cares.

But sometimes if you hit underneath them with the shine the bair will hit. If they are d.i.ing away for whatever reason shine is all you'll get.

False.

10Falses.

 

[RaynEX]

False.

10Falses.

your false is false.

 

[ArcNatural]

Lovage has already explained this.

The only type of DI (at least against fast-fallers) that can get you out of shine -> bair is DI away and down(except of course smash DI). Being that he does it the most in competitive play, I'm going to take his word over yours.

Not that I don't agree that it's a majorly flashy move and there are usually better combo connectors and options. Just that DI away doesn't work for all characters.

Edit: Correction DI down and away gets you out 100% not just makes it harder.

 

[Da Shuffla]

I think you could possibly catch someone off guard with shine>bair. Not everyone thinks "DI down and away" in the precious few frames between the two attacks. Only in friendlies, though.

 

[RaynEX]

Lovage has already explained this.

The only type of DI (at least against fast-fallers) that can get you out of shine -> bair is DI away and down(except of course smash DI). Being that he does it the most in competitive play, I'm going to take his word over yours.

Not that I don't agree that it's a majorly flashy move and there are usually better combo connectors and options. Just that DI away doesn't work for all characters.

Edit: Correction DI down and away gets you out 100% not just makes it harder.

I don't know why someone would even try that in tournament. Potentially throwing away a free bair or uair. If lovage spams this, and someone predicts the shine->bair and d.i.s correctly, getting the grab was a waste because there was no sufficient follow-up.

It COULD be used for d.i. manipulation, but a really silly kind. you uthrow or something, then shine but DON'T hit them, then bair. They might d.i. the bair down+away expecting the shine to hit. I've done this before.

I'd still rather hit with a straight bair, even if they do survival d.i. it correctly. But yea, as you said its a flashy, novelty Fox move.

 

[KirbyKaze]

clearly the chance of an extra 4% is worth the chance of missing the bair/uair/edgeguard.

raynex doesn't know what he's talking about

 

[ArcNatural]

clearly the chance of an extra 4% is worth the chance of missing the bair/uair/edgeguard.

raynex doesn't know what he's talking about

I've actually mid % fox ditto have done Upthrow grounded shine shffl bair to regrab. I have no clue what sort of horrible DI was involved to make that happen, but my friend shut of the gamecube and walked out of my house.


(That's right I still use mah Gamecubez +rep).

Theoretically they would never want to DI the shine regardless. Because if you DI away and down and they bair instead. That's pretty much the worse possible DI you could do in that situation, especially near an edge. DIing up to survive both the shine -> bair and just bair seems much more likely.

I have no clue why this is being discussed in a shine JC grab thread. But it's pretty cool.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

I think you could possibly catch someone off guard with shine>bair. Not everyone thinks "DI down and away" in the precious few frames between the two attacks. Only in friendlies, though.

You have to input DI before or at the same time as you're being hit
so you have to expect it to be able to DI out

in fact, you could use shine-bair to mindgame people into di:ing down and away, and then use just the bair instead, and they'll have **** di and die

wow i just discovered a real good use for shinebair
**** i'm good

Spoiler

except that people usually won't DI down and away in those situations, cuz they're afraid of having **** DI and dying because of it. which is why shinebair usually works (if you space it right and do it fast enough)

EDIT: raynex beat me to it, gay
AND arcnatural
piece of crap

 

[Cactuar]

I don't understand why this thread is still active.

 

[ynnek123]

I've actually mid % fox ditto have done Upthrow grounded shine shffl bair to regrab. I have no clue what sort of horrible DI was involved to make that happen, but my friend shut of the gamecube and walked out of my house.


(That's right I still use mah Gamecubez +rep).

Theoretically they would never want to DI the shine regardless. Because if you DI away and down and they bair instead. That's pretty much the worse possible DI you could do in that situation, especially near an edge. DIing up to survive both the shine -> bair and just bair seems much more likely.

I have no clue why this is being discussed in a shine JC grab thread. But it's pretty cool.

I think it's pretty cool and cactuar posted in my thread that makes me epic

I don't understand why this thread is still active.

 

[ArcNatural]

You have to input DI before or at the same time as you're being hit
so you have to expect it to be able to DI out

in fact, you could use shine-bair to mindgame people into di:ing down and away, and then use just the bair instead, and they'll have **** di and die

wow i just discovered a real good use for shinebair
**** i'm good

Spoiler

except that people usually won't DI down and away in those situations, cuz they're afraid of having **** DI and dying because of it. which is why shinebair usually works (if you space it right and do it fast enough)

EDIT: raynex beat me to it, gay

Didn't I beat you to it?

 

[RaynEX]

nah I mentioned it back on post #29. I win teh internetz.

 

[FastFox]

HEY DID YOU KNOW YOU CAN PRESS EITHER x OR y TO JUMP