Dealing With Discouraged "Casual" Friends

[Theftz22]

Most of the time there really isn't anything to do. There's a reason why we (and the broader fgc) are a small community (relative to the most hobbies in life). Most people simply aren't cut out for what we do mentally. Nothing you can do would make them enjoy competitive SSBM.

 

[-ACE-]

tell them to sdi

Pretty much this. Teach them how to get out of your combos as you go. Make a quick comment jokingly here and there when they make a mistake... your goal should be to teach them without getting them pissed off. Your goal should be to teach them so that you will learn along with them. If they are the type of people that can't take positive criticism, just be as tactful as can be. You could say "man, the only reason I was about to hit you there is because you DI'd toward me!! try to point the stick away from me!" or whatever. I dealt with this a lot when I was starting to get competitive. You need those guys. Human practice is better than cpu practice any day. And usually guys that don't take the game so seriously are pretty cool aside from the in-game temper tantrums. Lots of people are mad when they lose because they don't realize how deep the game is yet and don't see WHY they lost. If you help explain their mistakes they will get better, like the game more, want to play more, and you will get better competition/better practice. You should try to make them so good that they beat you. Because like you already know, playing people better than you is how you get better. Just make sure you don't drop too much info on them at once, they are more likely to have a "Aww **** this game" attitude if you do that. Make them better without discouraging them.

 

[Somaiah]

^ I agree. Definitely take it slow, and give them bits and pieces to "munch on," so to speak. I've helped one of my bros (who literally picked up Smash the second I met him) get to become the king of scrubs and **** all things noob, just by teaching him DI, shines spikes, edgeguarding tactics, smart attack options, and general match-up knowledge over the course of like four months. Naturally he would figure out crouch cancelling, recovery mix-ups, and his own style by just playing with me. He's kinda peaked because he lost much of his initial interest in improving, but like it's been said before, they can only improve if they want to. Motivation like helpful tips scattered over time can get them to learn slowly, and trust me if they want to stop getting ***** by the small things, they'll see change.

 

[Smasher89]

It´s all about their spirit, if they want to play they will, if they dont they wont. Make sure you dont limit yourself by listening to their scrubcomplain and start doing stupid stuff like not techchasing.

 

[Shore Top]

I 've been playing melee competitively for about 10 years and I recently tried getting my boyfriend to take it up. I can tell he really likes to play, but he also gets really frustrated with the game. He is still with it, but I've had to adjust the way I play and interact with him when we play. I compliment him alot. Even if it seems like a really easy feat, the encouragement means a lot to a beginner. I also let him win often, and I don't try to constantly destroy him. He is stubborn though, and he does not want me to try to teach him advanced tactics, yet. I'm am letting him develop that passion for smash on his own, and when he is ready, he will invest the time for advanced skills. It is a slow process, and smash has quite a high learning curve.

 

[Ziodyne]

Thank you for saying that.

Encouragement helps people. Also, cool thing about chilling with casuals is sometimes they just do the craziest **** because not even they will know what the **** is going on.

 

[Luco]

This applies to me in Brawl, which really isn't too big a difference. My brother loves to play but he's more or less dropped his main because of me (double Lucas, I PSI magnet kill him all the time) and can't take as much smash in general as he used to. I know he tries and I know he enjoys it with me for a while but I also know he would like the win occasionally. I love teaming with him and wanna keep seeing him going, so my tact is this:

1. Compliment him on the things he's doing well and gently let him know of the things he could do in that situation.
2. Tactfully bring up the subject of tournaments and all of that if I want him to go (this is harder and more subtle than it seems: It's not that he doesn't want to go, it's that he never believes he's going to have a good time, then we proceed to have an amazing day and he gets excited about smash again until the effect wears off)
3. Try to make the game as fun as possible. For instance, making jokes and doing laughing at random things.
4. Explain things as I go. This is one of the most helpful things i can ever do for my brother as once he gets in to something, we can discuss it for hours. Usually these discussions start with me elaborating on some MU in the game as we play, then we begin talking about it, sometimes look up videos, discuss what was going on in those videos, discuss possible strategies, queue 3-hour long discussion.
5. Overall suggest smash as a game to play every so often. My brother usually resets any 'annoyed' timer he has over a period of sleep. That is to say, he's refreshed and ready to 'turn over a new leaf' the next day. I suggest it and he's often pretty eager, as long as I don't suggest it too often.

Also, interesting to note here that my brother is far older than I am. He got used to the fact that i beat him most of the time ages ago, we love each other so there's nothing like what was explained before in this thread, I will admit.

I dunno whether it will help or not but that's what I do.

 

[Jabejazz]

If you have to deal with "casual" friends, treat them as such. They won't/can't compete with you. Still play for fun with them, just don't expect to polish your skills. I mean, there's nothing YOU can do about it.

 

[Cactuar]

The biggest motivator to continue doing something is to legitimately make progress, as the feeling of reward encourages further play, for the intent of making further progress. It is when we stagnate in progression that we lose motivation. This is, imo, the reason behind why players who are uncontested at the top lose motivation to continue playing.

You want your friends to keep playing, teach them everything you know. Study and explain what their options are in every scenario. Autopilot doesn't just prevent you from honing your skills, but also discourages the people you play with if they are unable to figure out what their options are. The biggest issue we have as a community is that our desire to improve is not matched by our ability to do so. Improvement happens when you understand the scenarios you are put in, and you understand what options are available. Your ability to execute the options will come as you repeatedly attempt to use them. Effective tech-skill, regardless of how flashy it is, follows need. Learning tech skill before having need to do so gives you information overload, giving you a bunch of options that you don't understand how to use.

 

[KirbyKaze]

It's almost as if you're inferring that adding more multishines isn't the solution.

 

[Cactuar]

Moar bettar alwayz.

 

[Avalancer]

tell them to go fist themselves

****ing magnificent

I had the same problem as you, although people were motivated to play better when they played smash with me. I just play the entire roster and play bad on purpose to give them more chances.

 

[rjgbadger]

kids in my friend group are starting to open up to more competitive ideas. After we hosted our first tournament(it was like 50 ppl deep) at the university, many of my friends have started to actually think in the mindset of improvement, and began to watch a ton of videos as well. I just need them to get to reading on smashboards, as I apparently don't know 'everything'

 

[KirbyKaze]

Moar bettar alwayz.

You'd better believe it.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Melee is a competitive game and getting beat is really never fun if that's all there is to it
Losing might be fun for those that can beat 90% of the scene anyway, but losing constantly, over and over, is discouraging for most people. It may motivate some but not most, hell where would we be without the players and combo videos motivating people? Most gamers get discouraged when they lose and do not have the motivation to learn the game, because it takes so much time and effort. I don't play Melee because I enjoy getting ***** by players better than me, I hate it. I hate losing and I enjoy winning. I play Melee because I enjoy the moments when all the hard work I've put into this game pays off. Mind you, that doesn't happen when I get 4-stocked or combo'd to death over and over, that happens when I beat someone or pull off a good combo. You should be empathetic with your friends and kindly encourage them to learn the competitive aspects of the game. I think it would be good since your friends are on the same skill level if they all started learning together.

 

[Jockmaster]

This kinda happened with me and two of my good friends.

When we got to college we started playing Melee a lot, I learned how to do ATs because i ****ing wanted to idk. Then I just bodied the hell out of them simply by spamming tech skill for like forever, even to the point where they would actively avoid playing against me because of the certainty of their defeat. I tried teaching them things, but the most competitive of the two was super stubborn and **** and thought that if he just spammed Falco fsmash enough he could beat me.

Then they quit for like forever and I started playing with other competitive-minded people and went to a few tournaments and stuff. Lo and behold they got that Melee itch again and are doing pretty good in learning how to play.

Basically you just have to give them some time to understand the "getting better" mindset. They have to understand that they will lose to someone who is better at the game than they are. They will learn to accept a loss and not take it as a LOSS (if that makes any sense). Once your crew understands that losing a game of smash bros is a learning experience, friendlies become a lot more fun and you can get a lot better through them.

 

[Schmeckle]

I share a similar misfortune.
Of my group of training partners:
-One has quit, saying that "the way you(meaning me) play is not that way I want to play to enjoy the game"
-One has migrated to Project: M after he realized that winning against me is much more feasible in that game (due to it's more balanced/gimmicky cast and my lack of matchup experience in it)
-One has stopped playing his main because he hates losing to me with him
-One has stopped playing and moved to SSFIV:AE (and I picked up the game and now beat him in that too)
-And the last, my brother, who used to be the best (by far) when we were kids, will play with me on occasion, only to rage about how "if he practiced the game he would beat me" and about how "it's funny how you(meaning me) think you're good because you can beat me" and says stuff like "imagine if I practiced, I'd be unstoppable" and "I'd still outplace you at a tournament" and similar bulls**t. Then he usually insults me and calls me a loser for playing this game and calls competitive gaming an illegitimate hobby and says that "If you go to a professional tournament, that's a really poor life choice", and then it's off to bed for him.

And so I have nobody to practice against who is of any challenge to me. I'm pursuing playing with some friends from tournaments in the near future, though. Gotta get something going or I'm going to have Melee withdrawals.
Good luck! I like to think that this is a good representation of how some of my friends (and especially my brother) act when playing me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPPvqgnYBiY

lol

 

[ALAX]

I share a similar misfortune.
Of my group of training partners:
-One has quit, saying that "the way you(meaning me) play is not that way I want to play to enjoy the game"
-One has migrated to Project: M after he realized that winning against me is much more feasible in that game (due to it's more balanced/gimmicky cast and my lack of matchup experience in it)
-One has stopped playing his main because he hates losing to me with him
-One has stopped playing and moved to SSFIV:AE (and I picked up the game and now beat him in that too)
-And the last, my brother, who used to be the best (by far) when we were kids, will play with me on occasion, only to rage about how "if he practiced the game he would beat me" and about how "it's funny how you(meaning me) think you're good because you can beat me" and says stuff like "imagine if I practiced, I'd be unstoppable" and "I'd still outplace you at a tournament" and similar bulls**t. Then he usually insults me and calls me a loser for playing this game and calls competitive gaming an illegitimate hobby and says that "If you go to a professional tournament, that's a really poor life choice", and then it's off to bed for him.

And so I have nobody to practice against who is of any challenge to me. I'm pursuing playing with some friends from tournaments in the near future, though. Gotta get something going or I'm going to have Melee withdrawals.
Good luck! I like to think that this is a good representation of how some of my friends (and especially my brother) act when playing me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPPvqgnYBiY

So everyone who viewed this thread should, here on out, call JKJ a dirty trickster. I happen to be the so called "One who stopped playing and moved to SSFIV:AE". Just letting you guys know that this statement is as false as they come because:
-I am better than JKJ at SSFIV:AE. I've been clearly winning more matches than him.
-I didn't stop playing because I was too stubborn to play against him when he was beating me: I stopped playing because I obviously didn't find the game fun, even when I played against people I could beat, and he knows this.
-Tickle my ballsack.
-FACTS.
-And the last, tickle my ballsack.

And so I sit here flabbergasted as my good friend is secretly ****ing me in the ass on smashboards. I like to think that this is a good representation of how my good friend (Jay AKA JKJ) is ****ing me in the ass.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTgJ8uapM5Y

 

[KrIsP!]

Anonymously ****ing you in the ass. Wouldn't know or care if you hadn't posted. also he didn't say you were stubborn or raging, just said you play sf now (and that he beat you in it). You took it really hard though, so salty about your sf skill, you must obviously now MM each other. It's the rules.

 

[Somaiah]

So everyone who viewed this thread should, here on out, call JKJ a dirty trickster. I happen to be the so called "One who stopped playing and moved to SSFIV:AE". Just letting you guys know that this statement is as false as they come because:
-I am better than JKJ at SSFIV:AE. I've been clearly winning more matches than him.
-I didn't stop playing because I was too stubborn to play against him when he was beating me: I stopped playing because I obviously didn't find the game fun, even when I played against people I could beat, and he knows this.
-Tickle my ballsack.
-FACTS.
-And the last, tickle my ballsack.

And so I sit here flabbergasted as my good friend is secretly ****ing me in the *** on smashboards. I like to think that this is a good representation of how my good friend (Jay AKA JKJ) is ****ing me in the ***.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTgJ8uapM5Y

This is a god tier first post. Getting hyped for a rebuttal.

 

[ALAX]

Anonymously ****ing you in the ***. Wouldn't know or care if you hadn't posted. also he didn't say you were stubborn or raging, just said you play sf now (and that he beat you in it). You took it really hard though, so salty about your sf skill, you must obviously now MM each other. It's the rules.

Guess you didn't realize from the ridiculous "Tickle my ballsack comments" that it's a complete joke. And btw, he's implying I was too butthurt to keep playing when I lost because I'm at a casual level at that game. It's called reading the subtext.

 

[Schmeckle]

Guess you didn't realize from the ridiculous "Tickle my ballsack comments" that it's a complete joke. And btw, he's implying I was too butthurt to keep playing when I lost because I'm at a casual level at that game. It's called reading the subtext.

-Facts

 

[KrIsP!]

-Facts

Evidence.zip

 

[Somaiah]

gityerfaxstrait.edu

 

[bearsfan092]

My thread... it's been hijacked.

Please continue. I'm enjoying this.

 

[Lawn Chair]

When I first started to play I was a ok player and my 2 friends **** me alot, and I used to leave the house crying over it. ( pretty dramatic kid. I know ) But I always came back the next day now playing again I have improved greatly. Let your friends know they will not get good over night and their is a great amount of advice in here, get your friends to read this thread. Also tell them straight up I will not sandbag for you, come to tornys. look at guides, if you don't want to play we don't have to play I can play with others. Find out if they really want a competitive melee play style

 

[JKJ]

So everyone who viewed this thread should, here on out, call JKJ a dirty trickster. I happen to be the so called "One who stopped playing and moved to SSFIV:AE". Just letting you guys know that this statement is as false as they come because:
-I am better than JKJ at SSFIV:AE. I've been clearly winning more matches than him.
-I didn't stop playing because I was too stubborn to play against him when he was beating me: I stopped playing because I obviously didn't find the game fun, even when I played against people I could beat, and he knows this.
-Tickle my ballsack.
-FACTS.
-And the last, tickle my ballsack.

And so I sit here flabbergasted as my good friend is secretly ****ing me in the *** on smashboards. I like to think that this is a good representation of how my good friend (Jay AKA JKJ) is ****ing me in the ***.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTgJ8uapM5Y

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one gamer to dissolve the shadows of lies and deception which have been disseminated amongst those in the public forum of Smashboards, a decent respect to the forum as a whole requires that he should declare the truth, wholly, completely, and without reservation.

- I wholeheartedly believe that ALAX migrated to SSFIV:AE because he was discouraged in Melee. He had played SSFIV:AE for some time before attempting to pick up Melee after he watched Javi play at Apex 2012 and became interested in the game. However, ALAX does not own a cube, or Melee, so techskill training was not an option for him. He constantly would become filled with an excess of Sodium Chloride after his losses, and has said, to my face, multiple times, that he did not want to play Melee because he "didn't enjoy getting bodied all the time". I never claimed that he quit for any other reason than discouragement. When he did win, he seemed to me to be quite elated and enjoying himself quite thoroughly. It was only when he lost to a player he did not believe should beat him, due to his lack of technical consistency, or when he lost to me multiple games in a row, that he seemed to stop enjoying himself. If that is not discouragement, then, friends, I implore you, what is?

-He is not better than me at SSFIV:AE. I do not believe, however, that my statement implied my complete and utter domination of him in any way. I refuse to apologize for saying that I beat you (note my ambiguity: I did not say I always beat you, or even that I often beat you, only that I do beat you). We went extremely even the last time we played; the time before that, we played 30+ matches, and the win ratio was something along the lines of 87% wins for me to 13% wins for him. Getting absolutely rocked, then going even, does not, in any way, under any circumstances, make you better than me, ALAX. You have been misinformed.

-I would like to respectfully decline your offer; I do not wish to tickle your ballsack at this time. I would, however, like to submit a counter offer:
Would you be interested in ingesting my fecal matter? In layman's terms, I am telling you to eat my sh*t, ALAX.

-TRUTH.

-And, in closing, ingest my fecal matter.


That is all.

 

[JKJ]

lol

-Facts

You know which one you are.
Maybe play your main against me sometime. Get over my complaining that I did once in our entire Melee career; the same complaining that I have profusely apologized for, often, and told you to disregard.
And maybe you should stop complaining about my playstyle, and my main; I don't enjoy your double standard.
TRUTH

 

[Somaiah]

Melee: Building friendships since '01.

 

[EPsilon933]

I was thinking of writing something nice and encouraging like saying accomplishing personal challenges is more valuable than winning. I think I arrived here too late

 

[JKJ]

All right everyone, just know that it's all in fun. We don't actually hate eachother.

 

[Jayk]

With my group, we used to have 9 people who would play regularly (and were getting competitive)
... but then me and 3 others got way better than the others and they all quit

Trying to get them back into it is hard...

 

[ALAX]

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one gamer to dissolve the shadows of lies and deception which have been disseminated amongst those in the public forum of Smashboards, a decent respect to the forum as a whole requires that he should declare the truth, wholly, completely, and without reservation.

- I wholeheartedly believe that ALAX migrated to SSFIV:AE because he was discouraged in Melee. He had played SSFIV:AE for some time before attempting to pick up Melee after he watched Javi play at Apex 2012 and became interested in the game. However, ALAX does not own a cube, or Melee, so techskill training was not an option for him. He constantly would become filled with an excess of Sodium Chloride after his losses, and has said, to my face, multiple times, that he did not want to play Melee because he "didn't enjoy getting bodied all the time". I never claimed that he quit for any other reason than discouragement. When he did win, he seemed to me to be quite elated and enjoying himself quite thoroughly. It was only when he lost to a player he did not believe should beat him, due to his lack of technical consistency, or when he lost to me multiple games in a row, that he seemed to stop enjoying himself. If that is not discouragement, then, friends, I implore you, what is?

-He is not better than me at SSFIV:AE. I do not believe, however, that my statement implied my complete and utter domination of him in any way. I refuse to apologize for saying that I beat you (note my ambiguity: I did not say I always beat you, or even that I often beat you, only that I do beat you). We went extremely even the last time we played; the time before that, we played 30+ matches, and the win ratio was something along the lines of 87% wins for me to 13% wins for him. Getting absolutely rocked, then going even, does not, in any way, under any circumstances, make you better than me, ALAX. You have been misinformed.

-I would like to respectfully decline your offer; I do not wish to tickle your ballsack at this time. I would, however, like to submit a counter offer:
Would you be interested in ingesting my fecal matter? In layman's terms, I am telling you to eat my sh*t, ALAX.

-TRUTH.

-And, in closing, ingest my fecal matter.


That is all.

Let me first begin by saying that I love JKJ with all my heart, though I still believe him to be a dirty trickster; here is why:

-I wholeheartedly know that I migrated to SSFIV:AE because I did not enjoy melee at that level, or at any level for that matter, because the style of the game simply did not interest me in any way. Though I may have been discouraged because of a couple of losses, (like all humans do when they lose at anything competitive, especially to someone at a much higher level) I undoubtedly took the constructive criticism appropriately, and found happiness out of games where I progressed but still lost (i.e. getting two stocked rather than four stocked, or getting a couple of well-timed shine spikes). So let me say clearly that I stopped playing melee because I did not enjoy the game, not because I was discouraged, though I respect its competitiveness as I play video games only for competitive play, and I recognize the skill and time required to be successful.

-He is not better than me at SSFIV:AE. I do believe, however, that your statement implied your complete and utter domination of me. "And I picked up the game and now beat him in that too". When you say "too" you're obviously implying that you beat me in SSFIV:AE just as you beat me in melee. This is a complete lie, therefore contributing to your dirty trickery. Let me tell you that the last time we played it was not "extremely even", as I was ahead by at least three to four matches. And "the time before that" was at least a month and a half ago. For you to speak of "the time before that" is to completely ignore any practicing or studying (watching pro videos) I may have done to improve during this large time. Further, I judge only by the present, not the past. Do MMA fighters lose their championship belt to a fighter they previously beat and say "Well I won last time so... I'm still a champion."? Ask the great Anthony Cami. He'll tell you absolutely not.

-I would like to respectfully ask you to let me up off my hands and knees JKJ, because you're still ****ing me in the ass, only this time with a spiked bat.

-FACTS

-And in closing, tickle my ballsack.


That is all.

 

[choknater]

reading this is weird lol

 

[Schmeckle]

You know which one you are.
Maybe play your main against me sometime. Get over my complaining that I did once in our entire Melee career; the same complaining that I have profusely apologized for, often, and told you to disregard.
And maybe you should stop complaining about my playstyle, and my main; I don't enjoy your double standard.
TRUTH

Tickle my nuts, you wrote I quit because I hate losing to you. That's false. I quit it for a while because every time I'd beat you, you would complain and It would demoralize me. Yes, I shouldn't quit because of your opinion but you shouldn't haggle someone over a character when you beat it all the time. Learn to lose sometimes, we are playing friendlies <3. P.s tickle my nuts. c:

 

[Schmeckle]

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one gamer to dissolve the shadows of lies and deception which have been disseminated amongst those in the public forum of Smashboards, a decent respect to the forum as a whole requires that he should declare the truth, wholly, completely, and without reservation.

- I wholeheartedly believe that ALAX migrated to SSFIV:AE because he was discouraged in Melee. He had played SSFIV:AE for some time before attempting to pick up Melee after he watched Javi play at Apex 2012 and became interested in the game. However, ALAX does not own a cube, or Melee, so techskill training was not an option for him. He constantly would become filled with an excess of Sodium Chloride after his losses, and has said, to my face, multiple times, that he did not want to play Melee because he "didn't enjoy getting bodied all the time". I never claimed that he quit for any other reason than discouragement. When he did win, he seemed to me to be quite elated and enjoying himself quite thoroughly. It was only when he lost to a player he did not believe should beat him, due to his lack of technical consistency, or when he lost to me multiple games in a row, that he seemed to stop enjoying himself. If that is not discouragement, then, friends, I implore you, what is?

-He is not better than me at SSFIV:AE. I do not believe, however, that my statement implied my complete and utter domination of him in any way. I refuse to apologize for saying that I beat you (note my ambiguity: I did not say I always beat you, or even that I often beat you, only that I do beat you). We went extremely even the last time we played; the time before that, we played 30+ matches, and the win ratio was something along the lines of 87% wins for me to 13% wins for him. Getting absolutely rocked, then going even, does not, in any way, under any circumstances, make you better than me, ALAX. You have been misinformed.

-I would like to respectfully decline your offer; I do not wish to tickle your ballsack at this time. I would, however, like to submit a counter offer:
Would you be interested in ingesting my fecal matter? In layman's terms, I am telling you to eat my sh*t, ALAX.

-TRUTH.

-And, in closing, ingest my fecal matter.


That is all.

"He constantly would become filled with an excess of Sodium Chloride after his losses" lolololololololol facts

 

[JKJ]

Tickle my nuts, you wrote I quit because I hate losing to you. That's false. I quit it for a while because every time I'd beat you, you would complain and It would demoralize me. Yes, I shouldn't quit because of your opinion but you shouldn't haggle someone over a character when you beat it all the time. Learn to lose sometimes, we are playing friendlies <3. P.s tickle my nuts. c:

You stopped playing your main because after I got gimped by Sheik on that one specific night, I called her fair dumb and said it takes no skill. That's all I said, and I said it a few times, out of frustration. I know how to lose gracefully, I do it often at tournaments. I just don't like losing because I missed a DI and got hit by a fair at like 40% for a kill. Not that it's cheap, but I know I can get out of it, I just messed up. That's what frustrates me. There wasn't a time when "I would complain" as if it was commonplace. I said it a few times on one night where I was messing up quite a lot, and apologized the next day, and pretty much every time I saw you after that. It wasn't a phase, it was one night that I was an a**hole.

 

[Grunt]

Sheik is unfair, though.

 

[EPsilon933]

Sheik is unfair, though.

No she's not. The opponent can pick Sheik too. Equal access to the same brokenness

 

[Ziodyne]

Please no one make a joke about Sheik's fair.

I've seen more than enough of that for a lifetime.