De-Synched D-Smash

[Cook]

So I was messing around with a level 9 Marth and I think a de-synched d-smash happened. I was falling toward the stage, Marth was on the ground, I fell to the ground, whistled, d-smashed, and for some reason the pikmin on the right side d-smashed while it was still up in the air. I can't upload the video, but I saved it the replay, so I could send it to someone who can upload it (I'm looking at you, Hilt). It was especially weird because I don't think he hit the pikmin or anything, so I don't know what the deal was. Wish I could slow it down...

 

[DtJ Hilt]

^.^ yay ^.^

i've added your brawl/wii codes, and mine should be near my name. Send the replays whenever you can

i'm definitely interested in this ;D

 

[Maniclysane]

Maybe the whistle has to do with the desynch, seeing that it switches up the Pikmin and their positioning.

 

[IllidR]

Wait so 1. How far in the air above you was the Pikmin?
And 2. So while the Pikmin was in air it moved horizontally as if it were a down-smash?

 

[Llumys]

I'm really interested in seeing this.

 

[KillerSOS]

Interesting! I wanna see this

 

[shanus]

I've only desync'd the downsmash after the pikmin has been hit. But its still pretty awesome as you can desync the hit pikmin in the downsmash directly into an upsmash :D

 

[Cook]

^.^ yay ^.^

i've added your brawl/wii codes, and mine should be near my name. Send the replays whenever you can

i'm definitely interested in this ;D

Are you sure your Wii FC is right? It says it is incorrect when I enter it...

 

[DtJ Hilt]

>.> fixed it, it should work now

 

[Cook]

Ok, you're registered on my Wii, it still says "Awaiting Registration" for Brawl, though. Maybe it works faster if you're online?

 

[DtJ Hilt]

mine says i've registered you :D

we should be good

 

[Cook]

It says I'm registered on Brawl? Huh. Mine still says "Awaiting Registration" and you're not available when I try to send a replay.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

now it's working

._.

 

[Cook]

There we go. It's right around two minutes in, after Marth up-throws me.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Alright, you whistled three times in the video. The first time, you had a red, so a Red Pikmin came up first. Second time you had a yellow, so yellow came up. However, the third time, the whistle right before your DeSync'd DSmash, you didnt have any blues or whites, but two purples. The two purples came up, however one obviously wasnt in the right place yet, but still went for the attack. Perhaps

Later on tonight I'll use my capture card to re-record it so i can slow it down to see it easier. I should have it on youtube later on tonight.

(nice find btw :D)

edit: looking at it now, i think marth actually DOES hit the purple pikmin with a NAir. I'm not sure if this is what caused it or not, but i'll probably end up doing some more tests later tonight.

 

[Cook]

Alright, you whistled three times in the video. The first time, you had a red, so a Red Pikmin came up first. Second time you had a yellow, so yellow came up. However, the third time, the whistle right before your DeSync'd DSmash, you didnt have any blues or whites, but two purples. The two purples came up, however one obviously wasnt in the right place yet, but still went for the attack. Perhaps

Later on tonight I'll use my capture card to re-record it so i can slow it down to see it easier. I should have it on youtube later on tonight.

(nice find btw :D)

edit: looking at it now, i think marth actually DOES hit the purple pikmin with a NAir. I'm not sure if this is what caused it or not, but i'll probably end up doing some more tests later tonight.

Yeah, after watching it a few more times I did notice that the n-air hit the pikmin, but the pikmin was already in the air when he hit it, so it still doesn't make much sense that it would carry out the attack when it wasn't in position.

 

[Excellence]

I think Whistle forces your Pikmin to conform with an attack that it normally couldn't do, reguardless of standards. I've actually managed to perform TWO Up-Smashes consecutively multiple times because of this. I have the tendency to drop on my opponents using Whistle and a lot of times they hit my Pikmin but they go on with their attacks regardless. We really should experiment more with Whistle. I tried to replicate it a while back, but I gave up when it stopped working.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Alright:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYWHGzSgRS0&feature=channel_page

again, thank you Asc!
this is awesome :D

I'm tying to determine, for sure, whether or not the DeSync was caused because of the whistle, marth hitting the pikmin, or both.

Here's what I think: A pikmin in the falling animation CANNOT be used as the attacking pikmin. I'm sure we've all WAC'd someone's attack, and try to retaliate with our own, only to whiff a smash without any pikmin. However, this pikmin was NOT in the falling animation, but in the animation of getting hit by marth's sword. I think pikmin are still registered as being the one to be used for the attack, no matter where they are if they are under olimar's controlled (If it's following him in any way). If the pikmin is standing, or walking, it will be used for the attack. If it's still in the air, from being rearranged, and olimar's on the ground, they wont. However, for some reason, a pikmin in the animation of getting attacked confuses this law, and the game thinks that the pikmin is ready for olimar to use because it's NOT in the falling (or returning) animation.

I remember from a long time ago seeing these videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pSQAN7mXts (the DeSync happens around 1:00)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzMQ8DFKqCU (the DeSync happens around 1:45)

These are generally the same scenarios, but with a returning pikmin instead of a falling one.

...What would you guys say to me starting a DeSync thread? I'd really like to get this thing organized and have a central thread for people to send their DeSync videos instead making new threads for them. Also I'd like to start researching the 'Ghost Pikmin' phenomenon as well. Even if this doesnt make olimar "Broken" or shoots him up through the tier list, it may at least give us a couple of tricks ;D

 

[IllidR]

Thanks for posting the video Hilt. Wow, that was amazing.

 

[Sudai]

Hilt, I'd love an organized thread to discuss all this in.

As for this specific desynch:

If you look closely, the pikmen in the air does its DSmash animation during the hitlag of Marth's NAir and then as soon as the hitlag would normally be over, it goes back to its normal falling animation, or so it seems. That might be the key to this one.

 

[Llumys]

Right. If it was really like the other rockets we've seen, it would've gone through it's whole animation.

But, since the down smash animation is on the ground, that could be the reason it doesn't do anything after its hitframes.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Hilt, I'd love an organized thread to discuss all this in.

As for this specific desynch:

If you look closely, the pikmen in the air does its DSmash animation during the hitlag of Marth's NAir and then as soon as the hitlag would normally be over, it goes back to its normal falling animation, or so it seems. That might be the key to this one.

yeah, i noticed that too. The FSmash travels through the air until the game registers that the pikmin is back on the ground. Then the pikmin gets up and walks back to olimar. DSmash however, the pikmin gets up as soon as the animation of the attack is over. Then it walks back. However when the animation is over in this, it cant, because it's not on the ground, which confuses the game. So it goes through the only possible animation it can go through. What I think is interesting is that there's no animation of the pikmin's body moving back to itself facing upwards. It just... automatically does it. One frame it's in the DSmash animation, the next it's facing upwards. The animation wasnt even programmed.

 

[Llumys]

Exactly. It's basically the same idea as normal desynching, it's just the animation is messed up. :|