Dark Samus Approaching: Extreme caution recommended.

[BaganSmashBros]

Dark Samus update. Improved animations, better graphics on the Phazon orbs and tentacles/tendrils, and a shiny new Dark Samus model. Nanobuds contribution has been a huge boon to Project Phazon.

Looks nice, but those phazon tentacles/tendrils look pretty bad. I guess its to make sure game won't lag with 4 DS-s using it on Bowser's Castle or something, but still. Something like this would look better:

If not model itself, then at least textures. Compared to lights on Dark Samus' exoskeleton, those tentacles are darker and just not as saturated.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Looks nice, but those phazon tentacles/tendrils look pretty bad. I guess its to make sure game won't lag with 4 DS-s using it on Bowser's Castle or something, but still. Something like this would look better:
View attachment 74602
If not model itself, then at least textures. Compared to lights on Dark Samus' exoskeleton, those tentacles are darker and just not as saturated.

If you have that model then it would be in your best interest to send it here for Dark Samus to look as good as possible!

And the tentacles don't look bad during gameplay, especially with the various particle effects used. Let's not forget this is Brawl from 2008, graphics are not going to be HD.

And everytime you comment on an update of mine you always say it looks bad. Try to be a little nicer in the future, you should know how much time goes into creating a character especially with your work on Ridley.

So if something looks bad, use it as an opportunity to offer some assistance, whether it be coding, animating or graphics importing rather than giving unconstructive criticism. Sending that tentacle would be a great start....

 

[HypnotizeOverdrive]

I could comment on Bagan's attitude on this stuff, but I feel like I'd be beating a dead horse.

Instead, I'll say that DS looks way more amazing than when I originally saw her, and Nano's touch has definitely helped bring out the best of the mod visually. My excitement for her certainly hasn't diminished. I can't wait to see how she plays in-game.

Keep up the good work, DSL. c:

 

[BaganSmashBros]

If you have that model then it would be in your best interest to send it here for Dark Samus to look as good as possible!

And the tentacles don't look bad during gameplay, especially with the various particle effects used. Let's not forget this is Brawl from 2008, graphics are not going to be HD.

And everytime you comment on an update of mine you always say it looks bad. Try to be a little nicer in the future, you should know how much time goes into creating a character especially with your work on Ridley.

So if something looks bad, use it as an opportunity to offer some assistance, whether it be coding, animating or graphics importing rather than giving unconstructive criticism. Sending that tentacle would be a great start....

Why do you think i shoved this model then? Model has 18 bones, glows and isn't too complex to work in the game (as far as i know). Already sent it.
And i'll try to offer assistance in the future if possible.

 

[PseudoTypical]

I honestly think Bagan was just being a little candid for most people's tastes, but that he had good intentions. It seems best to at least offer him the benefit of doubt, especially when he's offering something for the project.

That said, I really like the suggested tentacle effect and think it'll fix the only visual blemish I think the problem still has (aside from the Echoes model needing an update, that is).

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Why do you think i shoved this model then? Model has 18 bones, glows and isn't too complex to work in the game (as far as i know). Already sent it.
And i'll try to offer assistance in the future if possible.

Thanks for sending the model. You're right, it looks great and I can replicate this attack more closely.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions for sure. And you weren't even that rude... so thanks for contributing. Looking forward to more assistance from you Bagan.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

I honestly think Bagan was just being a little candid for most people's tastes, but that he had good intentions. It seems best to at least offer him the benefit of doubt, especially when he's offering something for the project.

That said, I really like the suggested tentacle effect and think it'll fix the only visual blemish I think the problem still has (aside from the Echoes model needing an update, that is).

Yes, the Echoes model needs a huge update. The current upload on the Vault is pretty hideous visually.

 

[drogoth232]

Textures look bad because they weren't the ones I sent, plus they are using different UVs. Of course it's going to look bad.

I don't even remember the original polycount of the tentacles I sent, but they were pretty low. No idea how the smash4 tentacles stand up to it, though.

 

[PseudoTypical]

Textures look bad because they weren't the ones I sent, plus they are using different UVs. Of course it's going to look bad.

I'm not familiar with your part on the textures of this project: are you referring to the Echoes model, or to the tentacles here? If it's for the Echoes model, that makes things a ton easier...

Yes, the Echoes model needs a huge update. The current upload on the Vault is pretty hideous visually.

Spoiler

This is the preferred design of the two for me as well, so I'd be really excited to see this thing brought up to PM standards. I hope it gets done.

 

[Cahalan]

Yes, the Echoes model needs a huge update. The current upload on the Vault is pretty hideous visually.

Definitely needs shaders. More than likely if the Echoes Model gets similar Shaders the the Corruption model has, then this really needs a huge texture boost... But for now I can live with only having the Corruption model being used.

 

[drogoth232]

I'm not familiar with your part on the textures of this project: are you referring to the Echoes model, or to the tentacles here? If it's for the Echoes model, that makes things a ton easier...

Tentacles. I don't blame DSL for applying one of DS's textures on it, considering he doesn't know how to UV map. But having an inaccurate map doesn't do the model any justice.

 

[PseudoTypical]

Definitely needs shaders. More than likely if the Echoes Model gets similar Shaders the the Corruption model has, then this really needs a huge texture boost... But for now I can live with only having the Corruption model being used.

I'm not at all experienced in editing models to any degree, but I'm inclined to think those textures are pretty small. I'm pretty sure those are straight from the 2004 game.

Tentacles. I don't blame DSL for applying one of DS's textures on it, considering he doesn't know how to UV map. But having an inaccurate map doesn't do the model any justice.

Oh, okay; I definitely agree. So long as one of the tentacle models works, I guess.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Tentacles. I don't blame DSL for applying one of DS's textures on it, considering he doesn't know how to UV map. But having an inaccurate map doesn't do the model any justice.

Did you have a tentacle model properly mapped? To be honest, it looks fine in action and with an animation. The low resolution stills make it look worse than it actually is.

But still it's a huge upgrade from this VERY early Dark Samus iteration:

Haaa. Those are really bad. But they were good placeholders.

 

[drogoth232]

Did you have a tentacle model properly mapped? To be honest, it looks fine in action and with an animation. The low resolution stills make it look worse than it actually is.

It's mapped to use the texture it came with. When you replaced the texture with your own, it still has the position of the old map saved. That's why the texture seems to repeat itself.

But still it's a huge upgrade from this VERY early Dark Samus iteration:

Haaa. Those are really bad. But they were good placeholders.

Ivysaur pls

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

I could comment on Bagan's attitude on this stuff, but I feel like I'd be beating a dead horse.

Instead, I'll say that DS looks way more amazing than when I originally saw her, and Nano's touch has definitely helped bring out the best of the mod visually. My excitement for her certainly hasn't diminished. I can't wait to see how she plays in-game.

Keep up the good work, DSL. c:

Thanks!

 

[Nanobuds]

Send me the tentacles. I got an idea.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Send me the tentacles. I got an idea.

Drogoth's or Bagan's?

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Textures look bad because they weren't the ones I sent, plus they are using different UVs. Of course it's going to look bad.

I don't even remember the original polycount of the tentacles I sent, but they were pretty low. No idea how the smash4 tentacles stand up to it, though.

IIRC you never sent textures with the model or else I would have used them. All I remember is a plain white tentacle model.

 

[PseudoTypical]

Drogoth's or Bagan's?

For expediency's sake, I'd just send him both, maybe explaining what you did with a readme.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

For expediency's sake, I'd just send him both, maybe explaining what you did with a readme.

Already done. Let's see what magic he can work on them.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

This is snippet of a behind the scenes conversation about possibly implementing a clone mechanic onto Dark Samus:

Man, there is always some complication! But thanks for the info. I really want to implement a clone mechanic in the moveset but I don't know if it's worth it to make people go thru hoops just to use her. Plus, i myself don't want to fiddle around with many complicated file constraints and implications.

Another idea I had was using a Generate Item event to spawn a modded Pokemon or AT. There is an Ike PSA that has him summon Deoxys. It's a neat idea and involves editing the Common3.pac file. It would make people have to edit that file but all they would have to do is replace the standard one with a modded one with the Dark Samus clone.

I don't even know if it's possible to replace a Dark Samus model and moveset onto a Pokemon/Assist trophy but its an idea worth investigating. Of course it would not function like having a true clone fighting by your side, but if it were balanced and had varied attacks (think along the lines of the Saki assist trophy), it might be a cool thing to include. I would also look into having the move have a cool down mechanic of sorts since it would be broken if she could summon an AT all the time.

Now that I'm thinking about it, that would probably be unbalanced as hell for Project M but would be awesome and true to Dark Samus' character.

 

[PseudoTypical]

Already done. Let's see what magic he can work on them.

Always excited to see something new from Nano, particularly when it pertains to this project.

Nanobuds , do you intend to also do the Echoes model? I know it's sorta pushing it to ask, particularly since it needs more work than the Corruption one did, but it seems best that both models are held to the same standard of quality.

This is snippet of a behind the scenes conversation about possibly implementing a clone mechanic onto Dark Samus:

I think that's an amazing idea, but it should only be for a split second. Think Marvel vs Capcom assists!

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Always excited to see something new from Nano, particularly when it pertains to this project.

Nanobuds , do you intend to also do the Echoes model? I know it's sorta pushing it to ask, particularly since it needs more work than the Corruption one did, but it seems best that both models are held to the same standard of quality.

Always excited to see something new from Nano, particularly when it pertains to this project.

Nanobuds , do you intend to also do the Echoes model? I know it's sorta pushing it to ask, particularly since it needs more work than the Corruption one did, but it seems best that both models are held to the same standard of quality.
I think that's an amazing idea, but it should only be for a split second. Think Marvel vs Capcom assists!

Oh yeah, MvC's assists length would be a good duration to mimic. In an ideal world though, the Dark Samus facsimile would be like a level 3 CPU, die after receiving about 20-30% damage, and be able to summoned at will, after Dark Samus/the player fulfilled a set criteria (i.e. full charge, cool down completed, receiving over X % of damage, etc.)

A Metroid Prime/Dark Samus/Smash fan and modder can dream...

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

I have a question to ask anyone who knows:

How do I get the Turn, TurnRun, TurnRunBrake and Throw B(Back) to flow smoothly into the Wait animation? For some reason there is a one frame freeze between the last frame of the turn animations and the Wait and it's incredibly annoying. Seems like it should be a simple fix though.

 

[drogoth232]

I have a question to ask anyone who knows:

How do I get the Turn, TurnRun, TurnRunBrake and Throw B(Back) to flow smoothly into the Wait animation? For some reason there is a one frame freeze between the last frame of the turn animations and the Wait and it's incredibly annoying. Seems like it should be a simple fix though.

Pics?

 

[Draco_The]

Gifs?

FTFY.

 

[drogoth232]

FTFY.

Thanks fam.

But yes, gifs or videos would be very helpful, otherwise idk what to suggest.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

FTFY.

Nope.

 

[Kamineigh]

Here's an idea for how to incorporate Dark Samus' cloning ability.

BronzeGreekGod gave OoT Ganondorf's ground dodges the ability to leave afterimages

Perhaps something similar could be done, where when Dark Samus dodges, a fake Dark Samus dodges in the opposite direction and disappears, allowing her to confuse opponents. Hell, that gif that was posted already looks like it could be a dodge.

So the only difference between her left dodge and right dodge would be which Dark Samus is the fake.


And on the topic of alternate colors, perhaps Dark Samus could have a costume resembling the other monster cloned from Samus, SA-X.

 

[PrinceGal3n]

Here's an idea for how to incorporate Dark Samus' cloning ability.

BronzeGreekGod gave OoT Ganondorf's ground dodges the ability to leave afterimages

Perhaps something similar could be done, where when Dark Samus dodges, a fake Dark Samus dodges in the opposite direction and disappears, allowing her to confuse opponents. Hell, that gif that was posted already looks like it could be a dodge.

So the only difference between her left dodge and right dodge would be which Dark Samus is the fake.


And on the topic of alternate colors, perhaps Dark Samus could have a costume resembling the other monster cloned from Samus, SA-X.

I never thought of it this way! This is actually a pretty fantastic way to incorporate her cloning ability!

 

[Xenozoa425]

The animation itself would be great for roll dodges and perhaps the double jump, but I don't think her cloning abilities are too important. The way I view Dark Samus as a playable character, she would be a hybrid of Samus, P:M Lucas, P:M Wolf, and P:M Mewtwo. Neutral B is a charge that powers up her other 3 special moves, Up B is like Wolf's with high knockback, Down B is a phazon shield and shine, Side B is the scattershot like Sheik's needles.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Here's an idea for how to incorporate Dark Samus' cloning ability.

BronzeGreekGod gave OoT Ganondorf's ground dodges the ability to leave afterimages

Perhaps something similar could be done, where when Dark Samus dodges, a fake Dark Samus dodges in the opposite direction and disappears, allowing her to confuse opponents. Hell, that gif that was posted already looks like it could be a dodge.

So the only difference between her left dodge and right dodge would be which Dark Samus is the fake.


And on the topic of alternate colors, perhaps Dark Samus could have a costume resembling the other monster cloned from Samus, SA-X.

Cool idea for sure but totally not what I have in mind. In the final Corruption Dark Samus battle, she summons clones to fight for her so it would be a neat element to her moveset to be able to summon them to aid her.

Plus, the Escape (dodge/roll) animations are complete and unless there is a cartwheel animation floating around I'm not going to redo them.

 

[Kamineigh]

Hmm. What if it was an attack like Dedede's Waddle Dee Toss?

Dark Samus summons up a clone that walks around and has a couple of relatively weak attacks, and are relatively easy to KO. Can be used twice, which allows two clones to be on-screen. This allows Dark Samus to evade foes by hiding behind clones.


What are her Smash Attacks and throws at the moment? Perhaps clones could be integrated there.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Hmm. What if it was an attack like Dedede's Waddle Dee Toss?

Dark Samus summons up a clone that walks around and has a couple of relatively weak attacks, and are relatively easy to KO. Can be used twice, which allows two clones to be on-screen. This allows Dark Samus to evade foes by hiding behind clones.


What are her Smash Attacks and throws at the moment? Perhaps clones could be integrated there.

Using Dedede's Side B is a cool idea and is probably the best move from Brawl to utilize but unfortunately it's not as easy as just copy and pasting one characters special onto another. We are currently investigating using Ice Climber's Popo + Nana mechanic and also summoning Assist Trophies (edited to be Dark Samus of course).

 

[BaganSmashBros]

Using Dedede's Side B is a cool idea and is probably the best move from Brawl to utilize but unfortunately it's not as easy as just copy and pasting one characters special onto another. We are currently investigating using Ice Climber's Popo + Nana mechanic and also summoning Assist Trophies (edited to be Dark Samus of course).

But what would happen to the replaced summoned AT character? Will you be able to just randomly summon DS with normal assist trophy or what?

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

But what would happen to the replaced summoned AT character? Will you be able to just randomly summon DS with normal assist trophy or what?

No idea. Haven't even attempted this yet. Unfortunately the assist trophy would probably be totally cannibalized. And of course you wouldn't be able to summon a clone at will, there would have to be some criteria met before using the move, for example Project M's Ivysaur has to fully charge before using Solarbeam, Lucario has to have full aura before using his enhanced specials, Lucas has that special charge move to enhance his smashes so maybe Dark Samus would have to fully charge a special move (if she would have a clone move maybe it could be mapped to a taunt) so she could work like the aforementioned examples.

Just brainstorming though. Dark Samus needs help in animation polishing at this point before anything.

 

[Xenozoa425]

That's why I figured it's best to just polish what you have done instead of running around like a headless chicken trying to get a cloning gimmick to work.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

That's why I figured it's best to just polish what you have done instead of running around like a headless chicken trying to get a cloning gimmick to work.

If there was a dislike button I'd give you x10 for that.

Keep stupid remarks like that one to yourself, especially if you haven't contributed a damn thing to the project. Jesus.

 

[BaganSmashBros]

If there was a dislike button I'd give you x10 for that.

Keep stupid remarks like that one to yourself, especially if you haven't contributed a damn thing to the project. Jesus.

Well, he is kinda right (just poor choice of words). Its better to finish and polish the main thing first and then worry about cloning. Its not main part of DS anyway and will be harder to balance the whole thing with this in mind.

 

[Dark-Samus-Lives]

Well, he is kinda right (just poor choice of words). Its better to finish and polish the main thing first and then worry about cloning. Its not main part of DS anyway and will be harder to balance the whole thing with this in mind.

All I'm doing is brainstorming and posting my thoughts here. If you'd all rather have no updates at all so be it.

If you want your ideas to be taken with a grain of salt Xenozoa, perhaps learn how to mod and code and make Dark Samus yourself?