Data COMPLETE: Marth Hitboxes and Frame Data

[hectohertz]

@ Kadano found an aerial interrupt with marth.
gives +3 gaint.

FF for 3 frames
jump for 19 frames
then dair

i posted this in the wrong thread, but its sort of marth frame data i guess?

 

[Guzzler Guzzler]

What does that mean

 

[Kadano]

@ Kadano found an aerial interrupt with marth.
gives +3 gaint.

FF for 3 frames
jump for 19 frames
then dair

Nice find. I’ve added it to the table. Don’t think it’ll be too useful considering how ledgedash yields 4 gaint and is both easier and more variable, though.

 

[hectohertz]

Nice find. I’ve added it to the table. Don’t think it’ll be too useful considering how ledgedash yields 4 gaint and is both easier and more variable, though.

agreed. although i still have hope that there's a faster AI (something involving holding away / not FFing on the first frame). also did you add the pikachu one?

 

[Mr. Bean]

Where can i find the ledge attack frame data?

 

[Crawfish]

Where can i find the ledge attack frame data?

your eyes

 

[Mr. Bean]

Oh look there it is... right there in my eyes

 

[townes]

When you say roll back is the second longest roll, are you referring to the distance covered or the frames spent rolling? I don't feel like finding that ancient convoluted M2K frame data thing. Thanks!

 

[LeadRod]

Hey does anyone know where the best area to hit with is when trying to get a down air spike? Like in a Ken combo? I understand tipping is usually best for most attacks but does that apply here?

 

[DJ _ICE]

about the Dair, the bottom hitbox (the tipper and spike) out prioritizes the other hitboxes, meaning as long as you hit that, even if all the others hitboxes connect, it will always be a tipper. I think its the only Marth move that does that

 

[Kadano]

No, up special and up aerial do that as well.

 

[tonic]

Nice find. I’ve added it to the table. Don’t think it’ll be too useful considering how ledgedash yields 4 gaint and is both easier and more variable, though.

Kadano, how is this optimal ledgedash achieved/what are the inputs? And are you aware of marth players incorporating it at all in their play already?

 

[Kadano]

Kadano, how is this optimal ledgedash achieved/what are the inputs? And are you aware of marth players incorporating it at all in their play already?

It’s pretty straight-forward. Drop, jump forward, waveland. Sure, but it’s one of the worst ledgedashes, so it’s nowhere near as useful as Fox’ or Dr. Mario’s ledgedash.

 

[tonic]

So to get the 4 frames of invincibility, would I need to be frame perfect? As in, drop on frame on frame 8, DJ on frame 9, and ledgedash purely horizontally ASAP? Do you know if the angle of the ledgedash differ on different stages? Also regarding the direction of the double jump, it seems that jumping forward and jumping straight up don't make the input for the perfect waveland any faster.

 

[Kadano]

So to get the 4 frames of invincibility, would I need to be frame perfect? As in, drop on frame on frame 8, DJ on frame 9, and ledgedash purely horizontally ASAP? Do you know if the angle of the ledgedash differ on different stages? Also regarding the direction of the double jump, it seems that jumping forward and jumping straight up don't make the input for the perfect waveland any faster.

Marth can’t do horizontal airdodge ledgedashes like Ganondorf. You need to hold at least slightly (197° / 343°) downward. The earliest frame you can input your airdodge on is JumpAerialF 13.

You do need to hold forward at some point. Because Marth’s JAF is so slow, you have lots of time to generate the forward momentum, though.

For every frame you delay, you lose 1 frame galint. So yes, for 4 galint, you need to be frame perfect.

 

[-=Untamed-Beast=-]

Is there any hope for this thread being updated with getup attacks, ledge attacks, etc.? Just curious, as basically anyone can obtain the data now with ease..

 

[Mr Postman]

How many frames does the shield breaker last if you just tap b?

 

[XenoPrince]

i think the reverse dolphin slash is the same as the forward, because i think you have to input the turn around within the first 6 frames anyways, so most of the time you're character will start to turn around before the hitbox emerges.

 

[Willyawesome]

Wavedashes and wavelands

 

[XenoPrince]

Just looking to confirm a theory. Since Marth's dash grab has that lunge animation that makes the grab come out at the 10th frame, would dashing and then doing a JC grab not only make the grab come out 3 frames faster, but would it still have almost the same/the same range going forward? Not concerned about losing the grab range of the dash grab that is behind Marth, only in front.

 

[Kadano]

Just looking to confirm a theory. Since Marth's dash grab has that lunge animation that makes the grab come out at the 10th frame, would dashing and then doing a JC grab not only make the grab come out 3 frames faster, but would it still have almost the same/the same range going forward? Not concerned about losing the grab range of the dash grab that is behind Marth, only in front.

Yeah, in terms of closing up to an opponent as quickly as possible, dash grab is no worse than JC grab. It’s sometimes useful when chaingrabbing spacies that DI away from a platform; JC shine might make you slide off during kneebend, this can’t happen with dash grab.

 

[Zad]

I always wondered what Marth's counter hitbox looked like.

 

[EvilGandhi224]

Those tipper hitboxes are insane.

 

[UDIE]

This is all good information to know.
Especially since i main Marth. I thought I would combine them all into one gif for my own personal use.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

No, up special and up aerial do that as well.

What flag indicates this at all? I assume its in Master Hand tool.

 

[Kadano]

What flag indicates this at all? I assume its in Master Hand tool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOlQv-9S1zE&t=6m13s

 

[Rlagkrud]

for an aerial shield breaker, if you just tap B, does it come out on frame 5?
theory crafting on if intercepting a firefox with a shield breaker is a better option than fair, since it sends them out with better KG and is only 1 frame slower than fair (if it does come out on 5).

and on the side, it looks like marths bair body hitbox is actually same strength as its tipper?

 

[Yann J.Ridin]

Hello, what it s the first frame that Marth can grab the ledge in his UpB? Thy

 

[Piman34]

X1-12 or Kadano do you have a slowed down version of marth's back flip jump animation compared to forward jump animation? I'm wondering if there's a height difference

 

[Poopencio]

Part of the on-going Stratocaster's Hitbox Project
Credits:
Frame data: SuperDoodleMan
Image compiling: Stratocaster
Image Editing + Uploading: X1-12

All gifs are at 1/3 game speed, all aerials are while falling, and therefore the hitboxes stretch up. If you want to see a still image of any frame, post in this thread and I'll upload it for you.

Jab

Total: 27
Hit: 4-7
Window of the second slash: 3-27
Second slash starts: 20
IASA: 26

Jab 2

Total: 28
Hit: 5-9
IASA: 27

F-Tilt

Total: 35
Hit: 7-10

D-Tilt

Total: 49
Hit: 7-9
IASA: 20

U-Tilt

Total: 39
Hit: 6-12
IASA: 32

Dash Attack

Total: 49
Hit: 12-15
IASA: 40

F-Smash

Total: 49
Hit: 10-13
Charge frame: 3
IASA: 48

Up-Smash

Total: 54
Hit: 13-16
Charge frame: 7
IASA: 46

D-Smash

Total: 64
Hit: 5-7, 20-22
Charge frame: 3
IASA: 62

N-air

Total: 49
Hit: 6-7, 15-21
Auto cancel: <5 25>
Landlag: 15
Lcanceled: 7

Up-Air

Total: 45
Hit: 5-8
Auto cancel: <4 27>
Landlag: 15
Lcanceled: 7

B-air

Total: 39
Hit: 7-11
IASA: 35
Auto cancel: 32>
Landlag: 24
Lcanceled: 12

D-air

Total: 59
Hit: 6-9
Auto cancel: <5 48>
Landlag: 32
Lcanceled: 16

F-air

Total: 33
Hit: 4-7
IASA: 30
Auto cancel: 27>
Landlag: 15
Lcanceled: 7

Grab

Total: 30
Grab: 7-8

Dash Grab

Total: 40
Grab: 10-11

Counter

Total: 59
Counters: 5-29

--when it counters--
Total: 46
Hit: 14-20 (or 1 frame later for real
strong moves)
Invincible 1-16

Sword Dance (1, Side)

Total: 29
Hit: 6-8
Window for attack 2: 9-26

Sword Dance (2, Neutral/Side/Down)

Total: 40
Hit: 14-16
Window for attack 3: 17-33

Sword Dance (2, Up)

Total: 40
Hit: 12-15
Window for attack 3: 17-32

Sword Dance (3, Side/Neutral)

Total: 46
Hit: 11-14
Window for attack 4: 16-37

Sword Dance (3, Up)

Total: 46
Hit: 13-17
Window for attack 4: 18-38

Sword Dance (3, Down)

Total: 46
Hit: 15-18
Window for attack 4: 19-35

Sword Dance (4, Side/Neutral)

Total: 50
Hit: 23-26

Sword Dance (4, Up)

Total: 50
Hit: 20-25

Sword Dance (4, Down)

Total: 60
Hit: 13-15, 19-21, 25-27, 31-33,
37-38

Shield Breaker

Time to get to charging: 11 frames
Hit (from release of B): 5-10
Max charge time: 121 frames

Dolphin Slash

Total: 39
Hit: 5-10
Invulnerable: 5
Landfallspeciallag: 34

Air Dodge

Invulnerable 4-29 out of 49

Spot-Dodge

invulnerable 2-18 out of 27

Roll Forward

invulnerable 4-19 out of 35

Roll Back

invulnerable 4-23 out of 35
2nd longest roll (thx M2K)

Jump: airborne on frame 5

Air time: 59
Earliest FF: 31
FF air time: 45

SH air time: 38
Earliest FF: 20
SH FF air time: 26

2nd jump earliest FF: 26

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Alright thats all for now, tell me what other moves you would like to see (techs, techrolls, missed techs, get-up attacks, etc) as well as what is good and what should be better about this (gif speed, other stuff...)

all of gifs are free for anyone to use as well as the images (to be uploaded and posted here soon)

part of a series for every character hopefully - Stratocaster's Hitbox Project

I though his grab range was longer lol
Where did you get these?

 

[A_Reverie]

I though his grab range was longer lol
Where did you get these?

Marth's grab range is very long, it's just hard to tell from that capture alone. If you look at it frame by frame in game and move the camera around, you can see how long it is. One thing that is hard to notice without slower framerate is that the grab box is still there when Marth pulls his arm back toward his body, giving it a very large disjoint on the last few active frames. Also, given Marth's wide dash dance and ability to slide through wavedashes with his traction, the effective range of his grab becomes even more formidable.

 

[Slyben]

for the auto cancel nair is it any frame in between 5 and 25 or is after the 25th frame?

 

[1000g2g3g4g800999]

for the auto cancel nair is it any frame in between 5 and 25 or is after the 25th frame?

Two rules to remember that will answer these types of questions for you:
1. You don't autocancel while a hitbox is out.
2. You autocancel before and after hitboxes.

 

[reverie2]

Questions about marth's jab...

Total: 27
Hit: 4-7
Window of the second slash: 3-27
Second slash starts: 20
IASA: 26

The 2nd jab's hitbox comes out 20+4=24th frame right? iasa 26 means interruptible by non jab moves?

Is 3rd jab 20 frames after 2nd jab starts (same rule as 2nd jab following first jab)? Doesn't seem to show frame number for it.

EDIT: tested in 20xx and this seems to be correct... if i'm wrong let me know

 

[Saria_100]

Thx very much