Characters you think are really bad

[Khao]

Dr. Mario. **** the Tornado, Mario just works a lot better. I use that thing more often when it's a dair anyway.

Luigi's air speed just kinda ruins him for me, I'd probably use him all the freaking time if he could actually move on mid air.

Same for Ganondorf, though with him's movement in general, not just aerial. He feels really powerful now, but I just can't deal with playing as someone that can barely move around the stage.

That's it for me, everyone else feels pretty damn effective, I mean sure, there's some characters here and there where I'm just "I have no ****ing idea what I'm doing oh my god" but that's a completely different matter.

 

[Kevandre]

This is possibly just me/not knowing how to play the characters but...

Playing as is akin to suffering a most unfortunate torture.

Also, I feel like was nerfed pretty bad. Or just changed, I guess. I was alright with him in Brawl but didn't do so well with the new up smash and not being able to jump off the bike.

 

[wingo]

. I notice a pattern.

 

[Qbopper]

I think that 3 days is nowhere near enough time to start calling characters terrible...

 

[WinterShorts]

<---------- this waste of space.

Nahhh, <- this guy was a waste of space. His generation should've outdated already.

Ganondorf's a little batter. His moves seem more powerful and that warlock punch has god-forsaken superguard!

 

[Raijinken]

Obviously all of my mains suck.

But nah, seriously, the majority of the cast feels really good. The ones I haven't seen used effectively are:
And that's counting pro and my personal experience (no G&W Pikachu combos for 17s games do not count as effective use of G&W, I meant 1v1).

 

[Malcolmnex]

Do you prefer the air too?

references? lol

ontopic id say and

 

[Terotrous]

Of all the characters I've played so far (which is not all of them), Zelda is the only one who felt noticeably bad. Perhaps I've been spoiled by PM Zelda, but she just generally seems floaty and weak now. Some of her normals definitely lost power, which is stupid, and the fact that Din's Fire still goes into freefall is just idiotic.

 

[MugenLord]

I haven't really played everyone to the fullest yet, but what about the custom moves? Could they help these bad characters in someway and besides I am seeing a mix bag of opinions in what characters that people think are bad. I just think its still a little to early too decide who is really bad yet. Lets host some more tournaments within the board itself to gather some more data. This is just my two cents.

 

[TheAnvil]

Never liked him
^
I like him better, but I still HATE his specials
Still slow and bad moveset

NOTE: Haven't unlocked any custom moves for any of these guys

Ganondorf is easily the best character on the game.

And this is coming from someone who thought he was terrible in Brawl. He's been vastly improved.

 

[evoxpisces]

Saying a character is bad and just flat out not liking a character are two different things. I can't tell you which characters are objectively bad but I can tell you which ones I really don't like and probably never will.

Ganondorf
Captain Falcon
Fox
Falco
Peach
ROB

 

[Starbound]

Ike and Mega Man are the two characters that I think are in the running for last place.

Default Palutena is certainly bad too, but her custom moves open up a lot of largely unexplored options.

 

[Fenrir VII]

Y'all need to stop sleeping on Mega Man.

 

[praline]

No character is bad. There's just characters I can't play as.

 

[Toon link is 2cute!]

Why does everyone hate Ness? he is way better now

For me the worst character would probably be Falco, he was needed (stupid autocorrect!) incredibly, and he isn't even that strong still. Ganondorf is better, but isn't good still.
Also why do people think toon link is not very good now? If he was already good in brawl, and got buffed pretty well, Why would he be not good?

 

[Terotrous]

No character is bad. There's just characters I can't play as.

We're already starting the "tiers don't exist" thing for Smash 4?

 

[gmBottles]

I was so hype to main but she ended up being pretty awful. Playing her just feels weird, I could never seem to get KOs.

 

[Kevandre]

We're already starting the "tiers don't exist" thing for Smash 4?

Oh they definitely don't, but I don't think that's the point. Every character is great in the right hands, seemingly especially in this game.

 

[Hartenberg]

Why does everyone hate Ness? he is way better now

For me the worst character would probably be Falco, he was needed (stupid autocorrect!) incredibly, and he isn't even that strong still. Ganondorf is better, but isn't good still.
Also why do people think toon link is not very good now? If he was already good in brawl, and got buffed pretty well, Why would he be not good?

I didn't think Toon Link was all that great, then I played one online who absolutely destroyed me, and it changed my whole perception of the character.

 

[praline]

We're already starting the "tiers don't exist" thing for Smash 4?

Hey it's not my fault tiers are the stupidest thing ever.

 

[PizzaGuy]

I was so hype to main but she ended up being pretty awful. Playing her just feels weird, I could never seem to get KOs.

Agreed. She's a bit slow and some of her attacks (Forward A, for example) leave her way too vulnerable.

 

[Terotrous]

Hey it's not my fault tiers are the stupidest thing ever.

They clearly exist though. There are certain objective elements of a character's moveset that contribute to an overall quality that exists outside of anyone using that character.

For example, Marth's sword got shorter inbetween Brawl and Smash 4. This change is undeniably for the worse, there's no situation where having less range is desirable since the sword itself is not a hurtbox. Similarly, he also gained additional frames of recovery on some of his attacks, which is also a purely negative adjustment. The mere fact that we can compare these statistics shows that tiers exist (if we had Brawl Marth and Smash 4 Marth in the game, Brawl Marth would be on a higher tier than Smash 4 Marth since his parameters are superior).

Of course, real tier comparisons are more complex than this, but that's the basic argument behind why "tiers don't exist" is nonsense.

 

[gmBottles]

Hey it's not my fault tiers are the stupidest thing ever.

Seems ridiculous to claim that tiers don't matter when we see primarily high tiers competing in Melee. While I don't think that will apply nearly as much in Smash 4, there are clearly characters that are just better than others, and there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[Luigi#1]

It depends on people personally. I was actually very good with and when I tried this game, and these characters seem to be showing up alot here. Also, I've seen some great with , and I can't do **** with him.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Probably and , they really don't fit my style of play.

 

[shogungari]

just
too much nerf in marth u_u

If it's any consolation, level 9 Marth is a counter *****. I had to kite him with projectiles because he countered every attack I used and knew when I was going in for a grab.


Personally, I'm not liking Pale Tuna. Maybe it's because she's not my playstyle, but her moves just don't seem to have much impact. Her up smash only hits one side of her so if you face the wrong way you're wide open. Her custom moves can't be used without equipment turned on so even if you just want to have a different set up you have to risk having your opponent putting on their own OP equipment if you do random. And despite Greninja's cool moveset he doesn't seem to have much killing power. I had to get Yoshi to over 150% just to KO him with an up smash!

 

[smashbroskilla]

Everyone who thinks Dr. Mario in this thread is terrible should add me and play me tonight

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Mii sword fighter. He feels clunky projectiles are kinda ass from what I can tell. Like he is a bootleg Link where you can throw in a counter or reflect in exchange you are bad at everything else link does.

 

[dguy6789]

Oh they definitely don't, but I don't think that's the point. Every character is great in the right hands, seemingly especially in this game.

Smash novices are so adorable. We get posts like this every time a new game comes out.

 

[gmBottles]

Everyone who thinks Dr. Mario in this thread is terrible should add me and play me tonight

I really don't think the Doc is that bad. Maybe not as good as in Melee, but he's really fun.

 

[CitizenSNIPS]

They clearly exist though. There are certain objective elements of a character's moveset that contribute to an overall quality that exists outside of anyone using that character.

For example, Marth's sword got shorter inbetween Brawl and Smash 4. This change is undeniably for the worse, there's no situation where having less range is desirable since the sword itself is not a hurtbox. Similarly, he also gained additional frames of recovery on some of his attacks, which is also a purely negative adjustment. The mere fact that we can compare these statistics shows that tiers exist (if we had Brawl Marth and Smash 4 Marth in the game, Brawl Marth would be on a higher tier than Smash 4 Marth since his parameters are superior).

Of course, real tier comparisons are more complex than this, but that's the basic argument behind why "tiers don't exist" is nonsense.

I don't see why people oppose tier lists so much. If you see the same 10 or so characters dominating tournament placings and online then there's an obvious reason for it. It doesn't mean that mid tier characters CAN'T win, it just means they have less tools to win.

 

[THE_MAAFIA]

Wtf are you all talking about? Mega man is amazing, stay back and shoot a forward b, if they shield like an idiot, grab them and throw em up, then up-air, back air is murder, down air is a good option to clear below you, down smash gets people who roll, up smash catches almost every aerial, up tilt KILLS

 

[Now Disappear]

Nahhh, <- this guy was a waste of space. His generation should've outdated already.

Ganondorf's a little batter. His moves seem more powerful and that warlock punch has god-forsaken superguard!

I'm sorry to say, but with my experience with the character,He's nowhere near a waste of space.He's stupidly overpowered above 50% if you know how to use him properly, on top of that he has amazing recovery.I've been in 100+ For Glory matches with Lucario and I have a 87% win rate.

 

[Sambiti]

 

[Deathcarter]

I've been unimpressed with . I haven't used him but every time I faced a Falco in For Glory I handily beat him.

As an player, I actually think he's decent overall but campers and Greninja (who for some reason Ike's jab doesn't work against) give me absolute hell. Low tier but thankfully nowhere near Melee Kirby/Brawl Ganondorf bad.

 

[SmashBro99]

No one seems bad.

 

[Kevandre]

Smash novices are so adorable. We get posts like this every time a new game comes out.

Oh that's cute condescension. Very becoming of someone who considers themselves higher than novice. Get off your high horse.

 

[dguy6789]

Oh that's cute condescension. Very becoming of someone who considers themselves higher than novice. Get off your high horse.

My apologies. I am clearly mistaken. Now I must be off to tell Formula 1 drivers that a Volkswagen bug is just as fast with the right driver.

 

[dmcAxle]

by a long shot on her default specials. They're just not very useful from what I've tested. Also her normals aren't very strong in combination with that.

 

[Kevandre]

My apologies. I am clearly mistaken. Now I must be off to tell Formula 1 drivers that a Volkswagen bug is just as fast with the right driver.

Or it's looking at how it's used. If you're looking straight at top speed then sure. Bug loses. In a longevity contest, Bug wins without a contest at all. Don't be single minded dude.