Character Discussion Thread

[Morbi]

It was definitely awful in Brawl, but in SSB4 it seems to have been improved somewhat. Now it can move around the stage without sitting in one spot.



I agree. The only thing that could possibly make discussion of the leak stop, if only for a little while, is the confirmation of a newcomer that wasn't leaked by Gematsu.

I disagree. That would only incite more discussion pertaining to the Gematsu leak (Rosalina clause), the only way to stop discussion of the leak (or at the very least its validity) would be to deconfirm one of the characters from the leak or confirm another a different newcomer to Fire Emblem, Rhythm Heaven, or Xenoblade.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I disagree. That would only incite more discussion pertaining to the Gematsu leak (Rosalina clause), the only way to stop discussion of the leak (or at the very least its validity) would be to deconfirm one of the characters from the leak or confirm another a different newcomer to Fire Emblem, Rhythm Heaven, or Xenoblade.

But then there's those people who will bring up the argument of how he could have gotten Chrom and Lucina mixed up, or Marshall and Chorus Kids.
We won't truly know if the leak is invalid in anyway until the release of the game.
That's the way I see it at least.

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

Clearly, Gematsu discussions can't end unless we force them to. There isn't really a way to reason around it. Why can't we just avoid it altogether? I don't even understand what talking about it gets us.

 

[N3ON]

I'll take an underwhelmed reaction caused by the leak over a reaction of extreme outrage and indignation which would unquestionably happen if we weren't aware there was a very real possibility of only getting three more newcomers, none of whom are Ridley, K. Rool, Takamaru, Dixie, Isaac, Mewtwo, etc. Not to mention the Chrom and Chorus Men reveals would be a lot more volatile if we didn't have the info we already do.

 

[Morbi]

I'll take an underwhelmed reaction caused by the leak over a reaction of extreme outrage and indignation which would unquestionably happen if we weren't aware there was a very real possibility of only getting three more newcomers, none of whom are Ridley, K. Rool, Takamaru, Dixie, Isaac, Mewtwo, etc. Not to mention the Chrom and Chorus Men reveals would be a lot more volatile if we didn't have the info we already do.

I would honestly assert that the possibility of only three more newcomers only is not necessarily a very real possibility. It is difficult to believe that Rosalina would be the only character that was planned slightly before E3 2013 and prior to the April Direct (about a 10 month period of time). That is not feasible from my perspective.

 

[N3ON]

I would honestly assert that the possibility of only three more newcomers only is not necessarily a very real possibility. It is difficult to believe that Rosalina would be the only character that was planned slightly before E3 2013 and prior to the April Direct (about a 10 month period of time). That is not feasible from my perspective.

Rosalina not being among the first batch of leaked characters doesn't indicate anything about when she became planned for the game or for reveal - other than it wasn't to be at E3 2013.

The intention of the first leak was never to leak all characters that were to be revealed prior to the second.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Rosalina not being among the first batch of leaked characters doesn't indicate anything about when she became planned for the game or for reveal - other than it wasn't to be at E3 2013.

The intention of the first leak was never to leak all characters that were to be revealed prior to the second.

There's also the point that Sakurai stated the character roster was decided back in 2012.
Which would mean Sal's leakers info is either very limited or severely outdated.

 

[Morbi]

Rosalina not being among the first batch of leaked characters doesn't indicate anything about when she became planned for the game or for reveal - other than it wasn't to be at E3 2013.

The intention of the first leak was never to leak all characters that were to be revealed prior to the second.

I never insinuated that that was the intent of the leak. In fact, that is the point that I conveyed. I am just stating that months of development time does not just yield one character that happens to be the only exception. Even from June to December, there were no other characters accounted for. Technically, we do not even know when he got his information prior to the Direct. However, we do know that he had no additional information regarding the roster prior to E3 2014. Therefore it is more likely that he knows less than it is that he knows more.

 

[N3ON]

Well then what you were insinuating makes little sense. No characters were planned slightly before E3 2013 (except maybe Greninja) - they had all been decided much earlier than that. Development time and planning time are not the same thing, plans for Rosalina happened earlier than development of Rosalina, and development of Rosalina probably started a while before E3 2013. Development time for characters we haven't even seen yet probably started in 2012. I get that you're trying to convey Rosalina development couldn't have taken up that amount of time, and I agree, but that's not quite how development would've worked anyway.

What a roundabout way of saying he might not have the most up-to-date information and therefore might get more than three more newcomers.

Plus, he did have additional information regarding the roster prior to E3 2014, it just wasn't as concrete and wasn't regarding newcomers.

 

[Baskerville]

Why do people still consider Mewtwo a newcomer?

 

[N3ON]

Why do people still consider Mewtwo a newcomer?

I only listed him with the others because I was too lazy to make a distinction, hehe. Embarrass

 

[Morbi]

Well then what you were insinuating makes little sense. No characters were planned slightly before E3 2013 (except maybe Greninja) - they had all been decided much earlier than that. Development time and planning time are not the same thing, plans for Rosalina happened earlier than development of Rosalina, and development of Rosalina probably started a while before E3 2013. Development time for characters we haven't even seen yet probably started in 2012. I get that you're trying to convey Rosalina development couldn't have taken up that amount of time, and I agree, but that's not quite how development would've worked anyway.

What a roundabout way of saying he might not have the most up-to-date information and therefore might get more than three more newcomers.

Plus, he did have additional information regarding the roster prior to E3 2014, it just wasn't as concrete and wasn't regarding newcomers.

I did not insinuate that either, I believe you may have made an erroneous presumption. After rereading the post, I can see where the confusion comes from (I was alluding to "planning" under the blanket term "development time"). To clarify, I do not believe Rosalina was the only other character planned within the months between E3 2013 and the April Direct.

There's also the point that Sakurai stated the character roster was decided back in 2012.
Which would mean Sal's leakers info is either very limited or severely outdated.

This is precisely why I came to that conclusion. If the roster was already finalized in 2012, Rosalina was either planned at a later date or the leaker has limited knowledge. Either way, it is quite clear that there is a discrepancy and there is an overt possibility that there were more characters planned during that time period (10 months presuming his Lucas "news" is relevant).

 

[Oblivion129]

Rosalina was probably meant to be in the second batch of newcomers but she was revealed so early.

There's still the possibility that the leaker doesn't know all the newcomers, and/or only knows the ones meant to be promoted, if you want to be optimistic about it.

 

[N3ON]

This is all under the assumption that the leaker would've leaked Rosalina had he known about her (assuming he didn't), yet like I said, the intent was never explicitly to leak all characters between June and April. It was to leak characters planned for the E3 reveal. Just because Rosalina wasn't leaked in the first batch doesn't mean there are still unleaked newcomers remaining, all it means is that... we didn't get her in the first batch. Even if we had got her in the first batch, those who support the idea of more unleaked newcomers would still be doing so under the reasoning of the leak not being all-encompassing or entirely definitive (which is still true even had Rosalina been a part of it).

So the mentality of more unleaked newcomers still being present really doesn't hinge on Rosalina at all... it hinges on the fact that the leak has never claimed to include the entirety of the newcomer selection. Especially since the original leak only was dealing with supposed E3 reveals, not reveals half a year later.

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

I argue that Gematsu is saying a lot more than it lets on. Sure, it may only specifically name a fair amount of newcomers on the surface, but deeper down, there's more to it. The reason I think this is because of the mention of the Ness and Lucas dilemma. Why mention that specifically, and not anything about PT's pokemon or Snake? I believe the leaker did have information on them and Rosalina, but Nintendo and/or circumstances surrounding the characters simply beat them to it. Think about it.

- PT's removal is unmentioned because it's pretty well implied and covered in the April 8th Smash Direct that he's gone along with his two 'mons.
- Snake's removal is unmentioned because it's fairly clear by Kojima's and Sakurai's words that Snake simply isn't in(and the state of Nintendo and Konami's relationship is... Poor).
- Lucas's removal wasn't hinted at or clear by any circumstance, so the leaker saw fit to disseminate information relating to his(very likely) cut from Smash.

Rosalina similarly goes unmentioned because there she was already confirmed. Why include her on a list of newcomers? You'll notice that none of the other predictions that were confirmed were on Part 2 either. Why not just expand the list rather than type out a brand new one? Because I believe this list is only mentioning things that are significant changes to the game that are not immediately clear due to other information. This is why the leak doesn't mention Mewtwo, Ridley, or any of the Big Three, because the status quo(they're not playable) is being maintained in those regards.

 

[AEMehr]

Only character that's really worth the "rage" is Chrom mostly because he's pretty bland in concept and he's just the flavor of the month that saved Fire Emblem.

I'm very interested in seeing Shulk and I've always thought a Rhythm Heaven character would have been a good fit, the only problem was who to add. Although, it's not fair to really judge any of these three until we see them in action. Pac-Man and the Miis were in extremely similar cases. Many people, and even me to an extent, were hesitant to seeing these two being playable due to the possibilities of their inclusion (Miis being online / Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures design) but the actual execution of these two have been better than most of us expected it to be (from what I can tell anyways, especially with Pac-Man).

I think we shouldn't be salty about these characters until we actually see them in the game. imeanistillthinkrobinwouldhavebeenthesuperiorchoicebutmeh

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

Whatever, we know the leak is incomplete because Ridley is playable.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I'm just pointing out how the cute mons aren't under represented.

Except they kind of are. At the moment I don't think we need another bipedal Pokémon who looks glaringly into the camera.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

But then there's those people who will bring up the argument of how he could have gotten Chrom and Lucina mixed up, or Marshall and Chorus Kids.
We won't truly know if the leak is invalid in anyway until the release of the game.
That's the way I see it at least.

LOL, that's just ridiculous and a clear case of denial. Don't bother with anyone who would use that terrible argument.

I'll take an underwhelmed reaction caused by the leak over a reaction of extreme outrage and indignation which would unquestionably happen if we weren't aware there was a very real possibility of only getting three more newcomers, none of whom are Ridley, K. Rool, Takamaru, Dixie, Isaac, Mewtwo, etc. Not to mention the Chrom and Chorus Men reveals would be a lot more volatile if we didn't have the info we already do.

Doubt it. Considering how popular the WFT became, I don't expect a ROB situation to happen with the Chorus Men. Rather, I expect there to be a legion of people declaring them an obvious, unique and desirable choice and for the importance of representing Rhythm Heaven to be heavily argued. You know, just like the way the WFT was declared an obvious, unique and desirable choice whose inclusion helps to represent an important game after her reveal wowed.

Or like the way Rosalina was widely declared an obvious, unique and desirable choice whose inclusion helps to represent an important part of Mario history after her reveal wowed people.

Or like the way Greninja was declared an obvious, unique and desirable choice whose inclusion was"necessary" to represent the newest Generation as people will argue that a newcomer Pokemon character was "needed"-all after his reveal wowed people.

 

[AncientTobacco]

Is this thread the Official Gematsu Discussion Thread now?

 

[Cobalsh]

Except they kind of are. At the moment I don't think we need another bipedal Pokémon who looks glaringly into the camera.

You've had a lot of intelligent posts. This isn't one of them. We don't "need a cutesy Pokemon", we're getting Jigglypuff already. Two cutesy characters is enough for a fighting game, I think.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

You've had a lot of intelligent posts. This isn't one of them. We don't "need a cutesy Pokemon", we're getting Jigglypuff already. Two cutesy characters is enough for a fighting game, I think.

I know, I was arguing that Jigglypuff shouldn't get cut in favor of Mewtwo. I agree we don't need anymore after Jiggs, but only having Pikachu fill that niché would be very shallow.

 

[Jaedrik]

I'll take an underwhelmed reaction caused by the leak over a reaction of extreme outrage and indignation which would unquestionably happen if we weren't aware there was a very real possibility of only getting three more newcomers, none of whom are Ridley, K. Rool, Takamaru, Dixie, Isaac, Mewtwo, etc. Not to mention the Chrom and Chorus Men reveals would be a lot more volatile if we didn't have the info we already do.

Maybe... maybe NOA knew this would cause huge upset with the NA fans and decided to lead the information...!!!!!! !H!121201?!!/sdflaj;suixhe5kj

:O :O :O

 

[Louie G.]

Is this thread the Official Gematsu Discussion Thread now?

Every thread is the Official Gematsu Discussion Thread now.

 

[Xenorange]

Except they kind of are. At the moment I don't think we need another bipedal Pokémon who looks glaringly into the camera.

Which are you more likely to use on an actual Pokemon team? A fully evolved "bada**" Pokemon or an unevolved cute Pokemon. The fully evolved Pokemon would certainly get the job done more efficiently and it makes more since to put them in a fighting game. Plus lets be real here alot of the people playing Pokemon are younger males that like that kind of Mon.

 

[Reality_Ciak]

You've had a lot of intelligent posts. This isn't one of them. We don't "need a cutesy Pokemon", we're getting Jigglypuff already. Two cutesy characters is enough for a fighting game, I think.

Pikachu, Olimar/Pikmin, Kirby, Luma, Chorus Kids, Megaman (kinda), Toon Link, Diddy (sorta), Marth (lol), Ness and/or Lucas, Villager, Ice Climbers; this game has plenty of "cutesy" characters haha. Jigglypuff is a whole. 'nother. level. above them though. And then Pichu was top tier cutesy. A character that cries when it attacks and sleeps when it crouches? D'awh.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Some of this leak discussion makes me facepalm.

 

[AncientTobacco]

Every thread is the Official Gematsu Discussion Thread now.

And ain't that great!

Seriously though, I recall moderators stating just earlier this week that discussion of the Sal leak is not allowed in this thread. Yet now some are even participating? Sigh.

 

[josh bones]

Which are you more likely to use on an actual Pokemon team? A fully evolved "bada**" Pokemon or an unevolved cute Pokemon. The fully evolved Pokemon would certainly get the job done more efficiently and it makes more since to put them in a fighting game. Plus lets be real here alot of the people playing Pokemon are younger males that like that kind of Mon.

LC tho

 

[Twin Shot]

Kind of wish people didn't react they way they did to the leak.

Seems like any theory that comes up uses the leak to justify its credibility.
However, no one knows the exact credibility of the leak either.

There are arguments for the leak and against it.


BUT, anyways, Calling this now..

Big Boss will "replace" Snake.
This is why the reveal is taking so long.
Keifer will voice Boss and not Hayter.

Loyalty to the mission.

 

[Deleted member]

Every thread is the Official Gematsu Discussion Thread now.

Spoiler: Alternate Version Featuring modified Logo and :4wiifit:

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Which are you more likely to use on an actual Pokemon team? A fully evolved "bada**" Pokemon or an unevolved cute Pokemon. The fully evolved Pokemon would certainly get the job done more efficiently and it makes more since to put them in a fighting game. Plus lets be real here alot of the people playing Pokemon are younger males that like that kind of Mon.

I dunno, even back when I was a kid I prefered Jigglypuff over nearly every other Pokémon. There's a huge fanbase for cute Pokémon, otherwise I wouldn't even bother talking about representing them, the Eevee line isn't one of the most popular Pokémon lines because they're cool you know.

Plus, nobody uses Pikachu either because it's a low-evolved Pokémon that sucks, but that didn't stop it from becoming the series' mascot. Pokémon power has never really been such a deciding factor in popularity honestly, Charizard sucked balls until just recently and it's consistently been voted the fan-favorite since forever.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

All I'm going to say is that anybody who seriously thinks the leaker could confuse Chrom and Lucina... is in serious, SERIOUS denial.

I'm all for not believing it if you don't want to, but don't start pretending like the information there isn't what we're getting.

 

[Xenorange]

I dunno, even back when I was a kid I prefered Jigglypuff over nearly every other Pokémon. There's a huge fanbase for cute Pokémon, otherwise I wouldn't even bother talking about representing them, the Eevee line isn't one of the most popular Pokémon lines because they're cool you know.

Plus, nobody uses Pikachu either because it's a low-evolved Pokémon that sucks, but that didn't stop it from becoming the series' mascot. Pokémon power has never really been such a deciding factor in popularity honestly, Charizard sucked balls until just recently and it's consistently been voted the fan-favorite since forever.

Charizard has never sucked balls, only competitively has he sucked balls. The vast majority of people don't even know what IVs and Evs are, so in their heads Charizard may have been the strongest ever, due to him being a starter and often the highest level on their teams. Pikachu, togepi, Evee and Fennekken are all Pokeballs now. Those are arguably the most popular cute Pokemon.

Edit: my bad not Pikachu XD, but he still reps the cuties as a playable.

 

[Sonic Poke]

Whatever, we know the leak is incomplete because Ridley is playable.

There's a possibility he's absent, but I think he is in. Too troll to be true.
Do not be adamant.

 

[Louie G.]

There's a possibility he's absent, but I think he is in. Too troll to be true.

Alright, I can understand expecting Ridley, but...

It kind of bothers me when people say that Sakurai is intentionally "trolling" or "teasing".
He clearly hinted at Ridley as a boss character. I doubt that the meant to give any other impression.

While it's possible that Ridley is playable, Sakurai isn't really trying to tease anyone.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

All I'm going to say is that anybody who seriously thinks the leaker could confuse Chrom and Lucina... is in serious, SERIOUS denial.

Chrom is about as likely as Shulk.

Unless we get a different RH character, the hypothetical confirmation of the Chorus Men along with all the others on the leak already revealed (including WFT, of all characters) would mean that Chrom and Shulk are both good as confirmed.

Funny thing is, when I first heard of the secodn part of the Gematsu leak, I considered Shulk, Palutena and Chrom all believable choices that made sense, whereas the Chorus Men were the only ones to make me go all

 

[False Sense]

Alright, I can understand expecting Ridley, but...

It kind of bothers me when people say that Sakurai is intentionally "trolling" or "teasing".
He clearly hinted at Ridley as a boss character. I doubt that the meant to give any other impression.

While it's possible that Ridley is playable, Sakurai isn't really trying to tease anyone.

Technically, even if Ridley is a boss, he's still being teased. Ridley has been hinted at ever since the Pyrosphere was revealed, and months later the only other bit of information we got about him was the suggestion that he was a boss, and a shadow of Ridley. Considering how long we've known about this, we have very little actual information regarding Ridley. One way or another, Ridley is being teased. Whether or not he's being teased because he's actually a playable character is up for debate.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Charizard has never sucked balls, only competitively has he sucked balls. The vast majority of people don't even know what IVs and Evs are, so in their heads Charizard may have been the strongest ever, due to him being a starter and often the highest level on their teams. Pikachu, togepi, Evee and Fennekken are all Pokeballs now. Those are arguably the most popular cute Pokemon.

Edit: my bad not Pikachu XD, but he still reps the cuties as a playable.

I'm sure we're not going to end up agreeing at any point, so I think we can just close this off and agree to disagree. Personally 1v4 isn't what I want from the Pokémon representation, but of course at the end of the day this is just trying to have excuses to include either Jigglypuff or Mewtwo, and I do understand why you would prefer one over the other.

 

[DraginHikari]

We regardless of whether the leak is true or not, we're sitting on another 70 days until the Japanese release when the truth will be revealed one way or another. Not really all that long at this point.