Character Discussion Thread

[Morbi]

Don't misunderstand me, i don't want to see him cut, i love him. I simply think that it is plausible.

I don't believe that it is plausible. That is like saying that he was going to cut Fox because Fox was top in Melee. The characters merits come far before what they contribute to the competitive scene.

 

[MargnetMan23]

I'm guessing he's talking about attack priority. Like for example, Pit's Upperdash Arm being prioritized over Pikachu's Thunder Jolt, or Little Mac's punches being prioritized over Bowser's side attack or Samus' forward aerial.

I know that, I just don't really have much of a firm grasp about how that mechanic works (one of the many things I will have to learn more about if I'm interested in getting better at Smash 4)

but do you know what we need? A rock type priority move =D (ugh, giving buffs to rock type at least in an offensive/stealth rock manner will always be a double edged sword, for every overpowered pokemon that needs to be taken down a few pegs there's a butterfree DX)

 

[wafflini]

Factor Halberd's return into that and you have a character with virtually no chance of being cut.

Ill admit, Halberd is a good piece of evidence against my statement, but i stick by it.

I don't believe that it is plausible. That is like saying that he was going to cut Fox because Fox was top in Melee. The characters merits come far before what they contribute to the competitive scene.

True, but, correct me if i am wrong, Fox was never considered so OP that he should be banned, was he?

 

[Will]

Again, Meta Knight may have been overpowered in Brawl, but he is an important and popular Nintendo character. He's worth the time and effort of nerfing. Also, referring to Brawl's priority list, he was the most prioritized newcomer next to Wario. Cutting him is unlikely since he is likely a high priority character again. Also important to mention...
View attachment 14382
An image Sakurai drew during very early development of Smash 4.
I would think all of the characters included were being worked on at the time, or at the very least planned to be in the game. A character like Meta Knight has no way of being cut from the get go, and being high priority I doubt time constraints would hurt him at all. Factor Halberd's return into that and you have a character with virtually no chance of being cut.

But with the picture with all of the thought playable characters.....

OHMYGOD SANDBAG CONFIRMED PLAYABLE.

RANK UP THE HYPES.

FOR THIS DAY TO BE CALLED BAG DAY.

 

[False Sense]

So, are we talking about Meta Knight?

He's pretty much in, I think. He's important to the Kirby series, he's one of the more popular Smash characters, the Halberd stage is returning, he's in that concept art, and any issues he had with being overpowered can easily be fixed up, especially considering how much they're balancing out the rest of the cast.

 

[Pacack]

Hm, of all mechanics of Smash Bros, priority is one of the ones that I'm the least familiar with...

I'm talking about Meta Knight's transcendent priority.

"Transcendent priority (also known as transcending priority) describes the set of rules that apply to transcendent attack hitboxes, as distinct from normal attack hitboxes. In Smash Brothers games, particular attacks and hitboxes are assigned transcendent priority by the game designers; the property is not inherent of any attack type or character. However, it should be noted that all of Meta Knight's standard attacks, except dash attack, are transcendent. Transcendent hitboxes ignore the rules of normal priority: they cannot collide with, clash with, cancel out, or be cancelled out by other hitboxes."

Since his attacks come out at least as fast as the majority of other characters' attacks, this is a terrible combination.

 

[Morbi]

Ill admit, Halberd is a good piece of evidence against my statement, but i stick by it.



True, but, correct me if i am wrong, Fox was never considered so OP that he should be banned, was he?

Of course not, Meta Knight was undoubtedly broken as opposed to Fox, who was just top. But I don't see the difference; it is the same situation, you believe that it is feasible to remove a character based on how they perform in the competitive scene. Fox would probably be exempt as he is the main character of his franchise. But the competitive scene is roughly 5% (being very generous) of the community. Sakurai is not going to consider omitting one of the most prominent Nintendo characters because he was considered to be banned by a very small portion of that 5%.

 

[Louie G.]

But with the picture with all of the thought playable characters.....

OHMYGOD SANDBAG CONFIRMED PLAYABLE.

RANK UP THE HYPES.

FOR THIS DAY TO BE CALLED BAG DAY.

Playable characters and items, smart***.

Also @ wafflini , I don't think you are factoring in how important Meta Knight is to his respective franchise. Mewtwo can be used as a rebuttal, but he was low priority in Brawl, and as a result was cut due to time constraints, he was not planned to be cut. Meta Knight is pretty much guaranteed a high priority slot, being one of Sakurai's favorite characters and being from a series that he created. I really can't see an important character like Meta Knight being cut.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Meta Knight felt so great in Brawl, it'd be a shame if he was nerfed with lag or shortened duration of attack. Maybe removing that transcendent priority for some of his attacks would do the trick?

 

[Pacack]

I feel like pointing out that Pikachu was as broken if not more broken in SSB64 than Meta Knight was in Brawl.

Meta Knight felt so great in Brawl, it'd be a shame if he was nerfed with lag or shortened duration of attack. Maybe removing that transcendent priority for some of his attacks would do the trick?

That would help, for sure. But, seeing how he can kill at like 70% for most characters, he should have his moves nerfed in power a bit too.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Just a tiny bit though. I'd still like him to be a bit OP. Just a little, tiny bit less though. A little goes a long way?

 

[Louie G.]

I don't think Meta Knight will be OP again, just good.
Maybe A Tier, but I feel that he'll get outranked by the likes of Rosalina, Mac, and/or Greninja.

We don't know exactly how good they are yet, but from the looks of it there are many potential strategies and combos that I am very eager to try out.

 

[Pacack]

Just a tiny bit though. I'd still like him to be a bit OP. Just a little, tiny bit less though. A little goes a long way?

How about a Flaco-esque nerf? He went from first/second to seventh in the transition to Brawl. He's good, but by no means as good as he was.

I don't think Meta Knight will be OP again, just good.
Maybe A Tier, but I feel that he'll get outranked by the likes of Rosalina, Mac, and/or Greninja.

We don't know exactly how good they are yet, but from the looks of it there are many potential strategies and combos that I am very eager to try out.

I wouldn't count on Little Mac or Greninja being that good. Little Mac will be juggle-bait for characters like Marth and probably Sheik. His recovery is garbage, meaning he'd have a terrible time getting back on stage once he's hit off. Greninja we just haven't seen enough of to know yet.

Rosalina, however, will probably be at least B tier.

 

[wafflini]

That would help, for sure. But, seeing how he can kill at like 70% for most characters, he should have his moves nerfed in power a bit too.

70%? ****. Lol, im trying to learn him and i have no luck with killing, lol.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Again, Meta Knight may have been overpowered in Brawl, but he is an important and popular Nintendo character. He's worth the time and effort of nerfing. Also, referring to Brawl's priority list, he was the most prioritized newcomer next to Wario. Cutting him is unlikely since he is likely a high priority character again. Also important to mention...
View attachment 14382
An image Sakurai drew during very early development of Smash 4.
I would think all of the characters included were being worked on at the time, or at the very least planned to be in the game. A character like Meta Knight has no way of being cut from the get go, and being high priority I doubt time constraints would hurt him at all. Factor Halberd's return into that and you have a character with virtually no chance of being cut.

Correction: if I recall correctly, that image was drawn by someone on the Dev team besides Sakurai, and then Sakurai tweeted it.

 

[Morbi]

How about a Flaco-esque nerf? He went from first/second to seventh in the transition to Brawl. He's good, but by no means as good as he was.

How about a Jigglypuff-esque nerf? She went from fifth to thirty-sixth in the transition to Brawl. She's good, but by no means as good as she was.

 

[Louie G.]

Correction: if I recall correctly, that image was drawn by someone on the Dev team besides Sakurai, and then Sakurai tweeted it.

Oh, really? Sorry for the confusion then.

If anything this helps MK even more, though. Obviously someone on the Dev team would have the characters that they are programming on their mind, rather than Sakurai's cluttered mind of many character suggestions and Kirby/Kid Icarus.

Although Kirby and Pit are up front so I could see Sakurai drawing this.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

And that's why I never really played as Falco! Or Jigglypuff, or Peach in Brawl. Nerfs suck, generally. Eh, I guess maybe his Mach Tornado and Drill Rush could be shortened a teensy bit.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

How about a Flaco-esque nerf? He went from first/second to seventh in the transition to Brawl. He's good, but by no means as good as he was.

Who's Flaco?

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

My flaco, don't touch my flaco.

 

[Morbi]

Who's Flaco?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=flaco

And that's why I never really played as Falco! Or Jigglypuff, or Peach in Brawl. Nerfs suck, generally. Eh, I guess maybe his Mach Tornado and Drill Rush could be shortened a teensy bit.

You never played as Falco, Jigglypuff or Peach because you knew that they would be nerfed?

 

[Pacack]

70%? ****. Lol, im trying to learn him and i have no luck with killing, lol.

Okay, maybe not 70%, but it's close. His best killing moves are his Shuttle Loop, Down Smash, and Side Smash (if memory serves).

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

No because they were nerfed! Not because I predicted anything, haha. I guss I shouldn't have said "never played." "Rarely played" would have been the better choice of words.

 

[Pacack]

No because they were nerfed! Not because I predicted anything, haha.

I hate to tell you this...


But you are in a very small minority.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

I am the silent majority brah! Ya don't see what you don't see unless you see it!

 

[MargnetMan23]

Well, I wouldn't mind a Jigglypuff-esque nerf for Meta Knight, because barely seeing Meta Knight at all in Smash 4 tournaments would be hilariously awesome :3

 

[Phaazoid]

I like to think of myself as a fairly small minority. I don't see many other super kings around.

But honestly, if meta knight got cut, I'd be flabbergasted. I highly doubt meta knight won't be returning.

 

[MargnetMan23]

Personally, I couldn't give less of a **** about Meta Knight returning but I don't wish ill will on those that do...

Also I fully acknowledge the fact that he has approximately a 0.00000000000000000001% chance of getting cut.

 

[Spinosaurus]

But honestly, if meta knight got cut, I'd be flabbergasted. I highly doubt meta knight won't be returning.

With all that ridiculous sword swinging he's bound to get himself cut.

i tried

 

[Morbi]

I like to think of myself as a fairly small minority. I don't see many other super kings around.

But honestly, if meta knight got cut, I'd be flabbergasted. I highly doubt meta knight won't be returning.

I would also be flabbergasted. More than flabbergasted, I would be perturbed!

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

I think that maybe Sakurai's delaying the reveal of characters that are/are expected to get changes. Like many people want to see Wario changed, Meta Knight nerfed, Falco and Wolf decloned even more, etc. Or he's just going to troll and be like Nope! No nerfs for Meta Knight, suck it complainers!

 

[Pacack]

I would also be flabbergasted. More than flabbergasted, I would be perturbed!

Flabbergasted sounds worse than perturbed to me. How about stupefied?

 

[MargnetMan23]

I would also be flabbergasted. More than flabbergasted, I would be perturbed!

Perturbed, now that's an interesting new word for me. Looking up it's definition, I'm not sure it fits that well in this context.

I think that maybe Sakurai's delaying the reveal of characters that are/are expected to get changes. Like many people want to see Wario changed, Meta Knight nerfed, Fox and Falco decloned even more, etc. Or he's just going to troll and be like Nope! No nerfs for Meta Knight, suck it complainers!

(and maybe Wolf being differentiated more as well :3 Oh wait, he's almost guaranteed to stay a secret character if he's still in)

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Flabbergastation sounds at least more exciting than perturbation...

 

[Morbi]

I think that maybe Sakurai's delaying the reveal of characters that are/are expected to get changes. Like many people want to see Wario changed, Meta Knight nerfed, Fox and Falco decloned even more, etc. Or he's just going to troll and be like Nope! No nerfs for Meta Knight, suck it complainers!

It would be nice to see what alterations Ganondorf will endure. I suppose the same could apply to Falco, I might even main him once again if he changes for the better.

 

[wafflini]

And that's why I never really played as Falco! Or Jigglypuff, or Peach in Brawl. Nerfs suck, generally. Eh, I guess maybe his Mach Tornado and Drill Rush could be shortened a teensy bit.

I could get behind shortening them

I think that maybe Sakurai's delaying the reveal of characters that are/are expected to get changes. Like many people want to see Wario changed, Meta Knight nerfed, Falco and Wolf decloned even more, etc. Or he's just going to troll and be like Nope! No nerfs for Meta Knight, suck it complainers!

That would be hilarious

 

[Spinosaurus]

I think that maybe Sakurai's delaying the reveal of characters that are/are expected to get changes. Like many people want to see Wario changed, Meta Knight nerfed, Falco and Wolf decloned even more, etc. Or he's just going to troll and be like Nope! No nerfs for Meta Knight, suck it complainers!

I feel like I'm the only one who DOESN'T want Falco decloned. The small differences he had from Fox made me prefer him that much more in Melee.

He's still my favorite spacey in Brawl, but I like Melee Falco's versatility way more than Brawl Falco's reliance on keepaway. He went from one of my mains to "might occasionally use".

 

[MargnetMan23]

Secretly, every other character has been buffed to high hell so Meta Knight's only like mid-tier now xD

 

[Morbi]

Perturbed, now that's an interesting new word for me. Looking up it's definition, I'm not sure it fits that well in this context.


(and maybe Wolf being differentiated more as well :3 Oh wait, he's almost guaranteed to stay a secret character if he's still in)

My opinion on Meta Knight's alleged omission doesn't fit well in the context of Meta Knight's omission? Wat?

 

[Pacack]

I feel like I'm the only one who DOESN'T want Falco decloned. The small differences he had from Fox made me prefer him that much more in Melee.

He's still my favorite spacey in Brawl, but I like Melee Falco's versatility way more than Brawl Falco's reliance on keepaway. He went from one of my mains to "might occasionally use".

[Words of agreement from every competitive Melee player sound in the distance]