Character Discussion Thread

[Schnee117]

Besides the winner of the poll that will be closed in October, do you think there will be any more DLC, or will that poll winner be the last character to join?

I'd like the Inklings from Splatoon to join the fight for three reasons:
-Splatoon has been the most popular new game from Nintendo in years. It's having more popularity that Pikmin or Xenoblade when they appeared.
-Almost all battlers are from 90s and last new franquice in Smash is Xenoblade, from 2006-08 (I don't remember). Having a new franquice from 2015 would be awesome.
-There is a lack of gunners in roster.

Xenoblade was a 2010-2012 release depending on where you live. (2010 - Japan, 2011 - Europe, 2012 - NA)
My doubt for Inklings comes from them getting a DLC trophy and Mii Gunner costumes which Sakurai has said represents the game.
Pretty sure there's more to the Inklings than shooting Ink everywhere anyways. And I say that not wanting to touch Splatoon.

 

[memoryman3]

Rosalina. She was the first character worked on, not to mention how Takamaru was considered, yet not on the lis

Rosalina was the very first character to be worked on???? Source?

 

[Geno Boost]

New article from me:
https://sourcegaming.wordpress.com/2015/06/19/why-every-veteran-could-return-as-dlc/

But can we have Back? As his own character without pokemons but with his own moveset kinda like ? I have an Idea for his moveset and I know it's crazy but it can work

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Rosalina was the very first character to be worked on???? Source?

In the game's files, Rosalina was the first newcomer with any files, like Wario in Brawl

 

[WeirdChillFever]

There is a limited amount of resources, why bother making unpopular characters DLC? Especially after Sakurai says DLC is about making fans happy? "Because I can predict Sakurai"No one can, it's bad business, do you want nother Federation Force-like controversy? "WE WANT TO PLAY AS THESE CHARACTERS" "These characters were heavily requested and are the top score in the Ballot. However, I decided to make Kaepora Gaepora playable because I thought lolrandom character."

I think it's the reason he makes the DLC instead of quitting.
Because you can't say "Duh moneeeeey", he says "I do this because it makes the fans happy"

Let me say this:

"If Sakurai's way of making the fans happy was to include only fan favorites, we would've had a completely different roster from the start"

Do you seriously think he HASN'T tried to make the fans happy in the previous games and that these oddballs we're result of Sakurai hating the fans?
And that now that DLC hits he suddenly wants his fans to be happy and is going to include popular characters? ("But only after the ballot in October")

Sakurai has made these games and its rosters to make the fans happy all the time, he just doesn't do it by making the roster a Popular Pick Paradise.

We are going to get oddballs. Trust me.
While it is crazy to assume the Ballot won't be used to measure popularity, to say he'll just copy paste the top 5 to the game is also silly.

And LOL at the people who put this up/analyse DLC to conclude that Sakurai's only gonna conclude popular character, while they're saying that YL supporters "cling to this article" and forget that 3/4 DLC characters are veterans, with Wolf being regarded as lock.

In the game's files, Rosalina was the first newcomer with any files, like Wario in Brawl

Don't say that. The Rosalina fans will get even more entitled as if that was possible.

 

[Schnee117]

A DLC character has more hoops to jump through than one on the initial roster.
DLC is sold separately from the main game and in the end Sakurai works for Nintendo so he's got to pick characters that will make money. The popular characters and iconic third party characters are the best at achieving this.

With the initial roster they're sold alongside the rest of the game, stages, other characters, single player modes, trophies, music etc. Oddball choices are more acceptable here as a result.

Who'd make more money as a DLC character?
King K Rool, one of the most popular newcomer choices for the game, or Pichu, a clone remembered for being absolutely awful in Melee with little support for Smash 4?

But we haven't had an oddball choice for DLC yet. We've had 3 popular cut veterans and a gaming icon. So until we get an oddball DLC character it's just hypothetical at this point that a popular character/gaming icon is more likely than an oddball in terms of DLC.

 

[FalKoopa]

I don't think we need to apply the same rules for the on-disc roster and DLC.

Adding oddballs to the on-disc roster is fine because Sakurai can get away with it, and we don't have a choice to not accept them. Not so for DLC. DLC characters are forced to stand on their own merits, so if you don't like a character nobody is going to force you get it. That makes popularity inherently a more important factor.

The first question a DLC character faces is "Is this character going to sell?" which boils down to popularity and marketability. Sakurai has some control over the latter and can use it to improve sales, but the former is outside his control.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

A DLC character has more hoops to jump through than one on the initial roster.
DLC is sold separately from the main game and in the end Sakurai works for Nintendo so he's got to pick characters that will make money. The popular characters and iconic third party characters are the best at achieving this.

With the initial roster they're sold alongside the rest of the game, stages, other characters, single player modes, trophies, music etc. Oddball choices are more acceptable here as a result.

Who'd make more money as a DLC character?
King K Rool, one of the most popular newcomer choices for the game, or Pichu HADES WAS HERE., a clone remembered for being absolutely awful in Melee with little support for Smash 4?

But we haven't had an oddball choice for DLC yet. We've had 3 popular cut veterans and a gaming icon. So until we get an oddball DLC character it's just hypothetical at this point that a popular character is more likely than an oddball in terms of DLC.

Yes, popular character are more likely, but less popular character have a chance too.
(That, and comparing K. Rool and Pichu wasn't even fair for the main game)

I stand by the notion oddball/not top 20 poll topping characters can get in TOO, not instead of K. Rool. That's a bigger strawman than K. Rool's gut.

 

[Schnee117]

Yes, popular characters are more likely, but less popular characters have a chance too.
(That, and comparing K. Rool and Pichu wasn't even fair for the main game)

I stand by the notion oddball/not top 20 poll topping characters can get in TOO, not instead of K. Rool. That's a bigger strawman than K. Rool's gut.

I'm not saying less popular characters don't have a chance. I'm saying they have low chances because of their low popularity.

K Rool, Isaac, Dixie etc. have a better chance as DLC due to their popularity than the likes of Viridi, Hades and Wonder Red who would be better fit on an initial roster due to a lack of a sizeable fanbase to get them in as DLC.

Wolf is the only popular cut veteran left with little to hold him back (Not a third party going through issues like Snake or a character that wouldn't work due to weak hardware like IC). Pichu, Squirtle, Ivysaur and Young Link don't have that popularity to the point it wouldn't be worth the man hours to bring them back.

But again we haven't had an oddball choice for DLC yet so it's all hypothetical at this stage. Maybe Wonder Red gets in as DLC and sells much better than expected. Maybe he gets in as DLC and doesn't sell well at all.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I'm not saying less popular characters don't have a chance. I'm saying they have low chances because of their low popularity.

K Rool, Isaac, Dixie etc. have a better chance as DLC due to their popularity than the likes of Viridi, Hades and Wonder Red who would be better fit on an initial roster due to a lack of a sizeable fanbase to get them in as DLC.

Wolf is the only popular cut veteran left with little to hold him back (Not a third party going through issues like Snake or a character that wouldn't work due to weak hardware like IC). Pichu, Squirtle, Ivysaur and Young Link don't have that popularity to the point it wouldn't be worth the man hours to bring them back.

But again we haven't had an oddball choice for DLC yet so it's all hypothetical at this stage. Maybe Wonder Red gets in as DLC and sells much better than expected. Maybe he gets in as DLC and doesn't sell well at all.

Viridi, Hades and Wonder Red all have problems outside of popularity.

 

[Schnee117]

Viridi, Hades and Wonder Red all have problems outside of popularity.

Viridi's only issue is being a background character in Reset Bomb Forest.
Hades has no issues.
There isn't a problem with Red as far as I can tell.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Viridi's only issue is being a background character in Reset Bomb Forest.
Hades has no issues.
There isn't a problem with Red as far as I can tell.

Viridi's issue is being a one-off tritagonist from a small series. (Not Mother small, just not that big)
Hades' issue is being the secondary villain from a small series (Same as above)
Wonder Red's game bombed.

 

[Schnee117]

Viridi's issue is being a one-off tritagonist from a small series. (Not Mother small, just not that big)
Hades' issue is being the secondary villain from a small series (Same as above)
Wonder Red's game bombed.

Secondary villain is more often used for a henchman villain serving under the Main Villain. Hades was the main villain if anything as he used Medusa whilst operating behind the scenes.

The reasons provided are why they're considered oddball choices you know.

 

[Wintropy]

Viridi is one of the protagonists in Uprising, and her appearance bleeds into Smash 4, thereby strongly hinting that she'll return in a future game.

Hades is the big bad of Uprising, and while he could well be a one-off antagonist, his quirky mannerisms and charming personality mean he has a relatively large fanbase.

Sakurai is good friends with Hideki Kamiya and included a lot of Wonderful 101 trophies in the game, so he's at least aware of the character and their fanbase.

The only issues these characters have is that they have, at best, a cult following. I'd be quicker to cite their indistinct future as the real damning factor for their chance at promotion.

EDIT: The only issues they have in terms of getting voted in, I mean. The fact that they may not have another game anytime soon is more of an issue to me.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

As for the other 2 preplanned characters

They better not datamined them out of hiding and i might ask nintendo to hunt down these guys so they can't do the ballot winner(s) character(s)

 

[Bowserlick]

I wonder if Chorus Kids will end up as DLC even if they are oddballs.

Sakurai could have been working on them for the game release, but could not make the deadline. Rather than scrapping the time and resources already put into the unfinished product, he could simply continue his work and reap the rewards by packaging them as DLC.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Viridi and Wonder Red in the same post.
am I dead?

Wonder Red's problem is having a future and not being a top ballot contender. if there was a W102 (which there probably wont be after the terrible sales and Platinum working on like 3 projects) he would probably be in a decent spot. nut until then he is in limbo. He does have the moveset potential of being a random charcter for smash 5 I guess.

Viridi is the least popular of 3 contenders who has never been seen fighting (although we know she can) and potentially being a stage hazard (probably). Not to mention all the other KI content. Viridi really only has moveset potential going for her. thats about it.

 

[Pakky]

Hades is too big... *snicker, snicker

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Even though I'm a slowpoke, I've rewatched that Mario & Sonic trailer to see Sticks the Badger playing archery. And now you know desperate Sega is at pushing that spinoff.

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

Even though I'm a slowpoke, I've rewatched that Mario & Sonic trailer to see Sticks the Badger playing archery. And now you know desperate Sega is at pushing that spinoff.

At least they add new characters, as they didn't add any to the London and Sochi games.

I still can't believe that Sega screwed up every game it has made exclusively for Nintendo during the 2010s.

 

[volbound1700]

I think Sakurai also looks into whether a character has a fun move set/unique moves and not necessarily always on popularity. That is why we get characters such as Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, etc.

 

[Deleted member]

I still can't believe that Sega screwed up every game it has made exclusively for Nintendo during the 2010s.

Sonic Colors was a Nintendo exclusive released in 2010, and that game was generally praised. Aside from that, yeeaaah.

 

[Coricus]

Hades is too big... *snicker, snicker

The funniest part is when his fans proceed to claim that Ridley is too big but THEIR giant purple villain 50 times Ridley's height is perfectly fine because "proportions".

And then you remember all the "Ridley as a stage" jokes. . .

I dunno. I get a pretty big kick out of it.

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

Sonic Colors was a Nintendo exclusive released in 2010, and that game was generally praised. Aside from that, yeeaaah.

Oh, I forgot that Colors was a Nintendo exclusive. I hope that they don't screw up Long-leg Sonic & Knuckles on steroids: Part II (also known as Sonic Boom: Fire and Ice).

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I always lol when I see somebody complain about Sakurai. "He hates the fans!" or "He doesn't want to make the fans happy!"

It's all about entitlement. Sakurai supplied us with an incredibly fun lineup of characters. He brought back Mewtwo, the #1 most wanted character. We have the greatest video gaming lineup in the history of Smash, probably the history of gaming as well. You have Mario, Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Ryu...along with many of Nintendo's all star cast.

But then you have people who aren't content with that. "He didn't add X character! Sakurai hates the fans!". Honestly, he SHOULD hate the fans. No matter what he does, people complain about it. Mainly just because it isn't what THEY wanted. Do you think he'd be happy when people on the internet think they'd do a better job than him at his own job?

Well, you aren't the only fan out there. There are plenty of people who don't care for K.Rool out there. Sure, a large portion wants him. But there are different opinions everywhere. Luckily, Nintendo has the Ballot...another sign they care about the fans (or at least want us to think that).

If we all considered what we already have before yelling for more, then maybe we wouldn't get all hive minded and blame the guy who brought us the ****ing game in the first place.

 

[memoryman3]

In the game's files, Rosalina was the first newcomer with any files, like Wario in Brawl

Wow...

 

[Pakky]

The funniest part is when his fans proceed to claim that Ridley is too big but THEIR giant purple villain 50 times Ridley's height is perfectly fine because "proportions".

And then you remember all the "Ridley as a stage" jokes. . .

I dunno. I get a pretty big kick out of it.

I see what you did there,lol. But yeah, I love him and Medusa but the truth is this whole "keeping true to the character" statement applies to them too.

 

[Deleted member]

In the game's files, Rosalina was the first newcomer with any files, like Wario in Brawl

Actually, that'd be Lucina.

And we know for a fact she wasn't her own character until later in development.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If you think about it, it makes sense we have only gotten popular characters so far. Mewtwo was the most popular cut veteran, so they added him as DLC to test the waters of the idea of ssb4 DLC. Problem is, many people got him for free, so to see how well a character can sell, they gave us two more popular characters, and a gaming icon nobody knew they wanted. Now that they aren't stumbling around in the dark about how well DLC will sell, it is very possible we could get some not-so-popular characters. But really, the non-popular characters we have gotten have usually been a character we didn't know we wanted.
Super Smash Bros. only had popular characters because we only had twelve.
Super Smash Bros. Melee gave us and. Three out of six of these characters are now beloved by fans, and Mr. Game & Watch has become a regular in the Super Smash Bros. series.
Super Smash Bros. Brawl gave us and. Lucas has become a fan favorite, and R.O.B. has quite the fanbase now.
Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds/Wii U gave us and for DLC, . Many people have accepted the Wii Fit Trainer, and Duck Hunt, and Ryu got a pretty good reception despite people saying he would be generic. (I was one of them)

As far as cut veterans go we have:
The fan favorite as of now.
The almost finished and very popular characters that have a very similar character to use as a base so they can fix them.
The popular 3rd party character owned by a dying company. If the demand is high enough, I'm pretty sure Nintendo would at least try to get Konami's permission. And considering the state Konami is in, I don't think they would refuse.
and The not-so-popular unique characters that were cut from the main game because of time limitations as well as the fact that they weren't the most popular characters in the world.
The character that sits in the background, and puts Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard in one character slot. This is the only veteran I don't see returning mostly because he wasn't technically playable. If he does return, he would just act like the Random button, except he would only choose Squirtle, Ivysaur, or Charizard. And maybe it would allow you to switch Pokémon upon death, but definitely not as a Down Special.
The clone to Link and the semi-clone to Toon Link. Contrary to what people believe, having Young Link and Toon Link in the same game wouldn't be Toon Link, and Toon Link again, the two play much differently. Decloning Young Link would actually take him further from Toon Link, and then we could have a Triforce of Links; The power , the spacer , and the combos.
The most hated character in the game sadly. He is known as the clone with the poorly made gimmick. Ironically he has the potential to be one of the most unique veterans. In order to balance him, he would need some new moves to improve his range, and get rid of some of his electric attacks. He would need a new Neutral Special, and then some powerful electric attacks to make him high risk/reward. With all the needed adjustments, he would probably be his own character by the time they were done balancing him out.

As far as sales go, everyone will sell well because it's Super Smash Bros., and completionists alone will give Nintendo a profit. Weather or not they will sell as much as Roy, or Lucas, probably half the characters previously mentioned will sell as well or close to it. Will we get an unpopular character? We kind of already have (Ryu was popular, but not really wanted in Smash), but as far as getting a character like Ivysaur, only time will tell. But it's not impossible.

 

[Wintropy]

I always lol when I see somebody complain about Sakurai. "He hates the fans!" or "He doesn't want to make the fans happy!"

It's all about entitlement. Sakurai supplied us with an incredibly fun lineup of characters. He brought back Mewtwo, the #1 most wanted character. We have the greatest video gaming lineup in the history of Smash, probably the history of gaming as well. You have Mario, Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Ryu...along with many of Nintendo's all star cast.

But then you have people who aren't content with that. "He didn't add X character! Sakurai hates the fans!". Honestly, he SHOULD hate the fans. No matter what he does, people complain about it. Mainly just because it isn't what THEY wanted. Do you think he'd be happy when people on the internet think they'd do a better job than him at his own job?

Well, you aren't the only fan out there. There are plenty of people who don't care for K.Rool out there. Sure, a large portion wants him. But there are different opinions everywhere. Luckily, Nintendo has the Ballot...another sign they care about the fans (or at least want us to think that).

If we all considered what we already have before yelling for more, then maybe we wouldn't get all hive minded and blame the guy who brought us the ****ing game in the first place.

To be fair, there is a difference between vitriol and criticism. While there are no doubt a lot of people who throw tantrums at Sakurai for debatably petty reasons, there's a lot of valid feedback that addresses areas where Sakurai could stand to improve.

Not disputing your statement, just pointing out that criticism shouldn't be enveloped under a blanket of immunity. Sakurai is a fine director and has made a great game, but it's far from perfect and we, the consumer, should address what we feel needs to be remedied.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

To be fair, there is a difference between vitriol and criticism. While there are no doubt a lot of people who throw tantrums at Sakurai for debatably petty reasons, there's a lot of valid feedback that addresses areas where Sakurai could stand to improve.

Not disputing your statement, just pointing out that criticism shouldn't be enveloped under a blanket of immunity. Sakurai is a fine director and has made a great game, but it's far from perfect and we, the consumer, should address what we feel needs to be remedied.

There's certainly a difference. I'm simply referring to the people who swear and complain that this guy has no idea what he's doing when he absolutely does.

 

[Wintropy]

There's certainly a difference. I'm simply referring to the people who swear and complain that this guy has no idea what's he doing, when he absolutely does.

Oh, of course, and again, not disputing your statement. Just pointing out in general that critique is healthy.

 

[Burruni]

Critique: "Wario having the only remaining parts of his moveset that were based on his actual protagonist games removed in Smash 4 and having ONE song is deplorable when they're what made him the #3 most requested in Melee."

Tantrum: "WHY IS DILLON JUST AN AT?! WTF SAKURAI 0/10 WORST GAME."

 

[FalKoopa]

Hades is too big... *snicker, snicker

And purple too.

I'll show myself out.

The popular 3rd party character owned by a dying company. If the demand is high enough, I'm pretty sure Nintendo would at least try to get Konami's permission. And considering the state Konami is in, I don't think they would refuse.

The rumour is that Konami is trying to drive MGS into the ground. Now that Kojima is leaving the company (or has he left already?), I can only see a messy legal dispute over the rights of the franchise. I don't have hope for him, not until the mess is over.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I feel like the only oddball choice that could really perform well (sales wise) in terms of dlc would be the Excitebiker.

Then again you can't really tell with oddball choices, that's why they're oddballs.

 

[StormC]

Besides the winner of the poll that will be closed in October, do you think there will be any more DLC, or will that poll winner be the last character to join?

There isn't necessarily going to be only one character, or a "winner."

Don't say that. The Rosalina fans will get even more entitled as if that was possible.

Excuse you?

 

[Pakky]

Okay, between these two unlikely characters who is more likely Chun Li or Nights?

 

[Deleted member]

Between Chun-Li and NiGHTS?
Chun-Li.

Even if she's another Capcom character and a secondary Street Fighter character, she's almost as big a name in fighting games and gaming in general as Ryu himself.

 

[Bowserlick]

MORTAL KOMBAT!!!!

Scorpion vs Ryu. Do it. Final Smash as a fatality.

 

[FalKoopa]

To continue the topic further, between Chun-Li and Phoenix Wright? And who do you actually want between them?