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Character Discussion Thread

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WeirdChillFever

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One crazy idea I had for Captain Toad was that his Smashes would summon platforms to make up for his poor jump height.
Imagining Up Smash creating a propellor platform that hurts opponents and where Captain Toad can climb on.

His Specials would be trampolines to jump on, minecart rollercoasters to ride on and a plant and pluck spot as weapon ammo.
And a Pickaxe to destroy it all if an opponent uses it.

Basically Captain Toad's mobility would be trash, but he has specials and smashes to make a path for him.
Like a puzzle.
 

Ura

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3 more weeks ppl. It's getting closer and closer by the second.
 

Diddy Kong

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Don't think that's what he meant, but I do agree. Honestly, I think that's why DK didn't get a new character for the most part. Gimmiks are cool, but they shouldn't be prioritized (says the Robin fan :p).
Yeah compared to all the newcomers in Smash 4, K.Rool and Dixie Kong are rather "gimmick-proof".

Take :4megaman: for example: all projectiles even A attacks and Smashes.
:4shulk:: Stat boosts are the main gimmick, even though the Monado is gimmicky enough.
:4villager:: Does all kinds of random **** on a battlefield
:4robinm:: Tomes and Levin Sword have durability (even ****tier than in FE)
:4mii:: Custom gimmicks plus gets three different ****ing movesets
:4bowserjr:: Fighting in a mech is quite a gimmick, but Jr. is cool enough to tollerate this
:4duckhunt:: Breaking the 4th wall gimmick...
:4littlemac:: His gimmick is already the KO Punch, but aside from that his statistical spread can be considered a gimmick as well, same with :4mewtwo:
:rosalina:: Luma is a gimmick, an awesomely cool one which gives Smash it's first puppeteer character, but still gimmicky in a sense.
:4wiifit:: Her being "unexpected" is already a gimmick, otherwise a character that's pretty boring, despite the gimmicks given to her
:4pacman:: Yay 2D sprites? Arcade references? I always get so painfully reminded by this character's presence why I wanted him out in the first place. Same with Villager and Mii.
 

Burruni

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There's nothing to gain from arguing about how gimmicky characters are because people will twist things to fit into the argument they want.

PLEASE can we move onto an actually mildly productive subject?
 

Kenith

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Also, I like all of those "gimmicks" and a lot of those characters would be horribly uninteresting without them.
But for characters like King K. Rool, Dixie Kong, etc. yes, I agree that they don't need a gimmicky moveset, just a fun one.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Yeah compared to all the newcomers in Smash 4, K.Rool and Dixie Kong are rather "gimmick-proof".

Take :4megaman: for example: all projectiles even A attacks and Smashes.
:4shulk:: Stat boosts are the main gimmick, even though the Monado is gimmicky enough.
:4villager:: Does all kinds of random **** on a battlefield
:4robinm:: Tomes and Levin Sword have durability (even ****tier than in FE)
:4mii:: Custom gimmicks plus gets three different ****ing movesets
:4bowserjr:: Fighting in a mech is quite a gimmick, but Jr. is cool enough to tollerate this
:4duckhunt:: Breaking the 4th wall gimmick...
:4littlemac:: His gimmick is already the KO Punch, but aside from that his statistical spread can be considered a gimmick as well, same with :4mewtwo:
:rosalina:: Luma is a gimmick, an awesomely cool one which gives Smash it's first puppeteer character, but still gimmicky in a sense.
:4wiifit:: Her being "unexpected" is already a gimmick, otherwise a character that's pretty boring, despite the gimmicks given to her
:4pacman:: Yay 2D sprites? Arcade references? I always get so painfully reminded by this character's presence why I wanted him out in the first place. Same with Villager and Mii.
Mega Man isn't entirely projectile, but mostly
Shulk's Monado is gimmicky because of the stats, how else would it be?
Villager does Animal Crossing things for the most part
Weapons don't come back in FE
Ultimate customization for a character meant to be you
'Bowser Jr' and 'cool' sounds wrong when put together
Smash Attacks and 2 specials are the only example
Statistic spread is a gimmick now?
Only one without complaints
By that logic K.Rool being a popular request is a gimmick
A tribute to Namco's other games being the reason you didn't want him?
 

Arcadenik

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There's nothing to gain from arguing about how gimmicky characters are because people will twist things to fit into the argument they want.

PLEASE can we move onto an actually mildly productive subject?
Yeah... people say Meowth isn't interesting enough to be in Smash... like why does Meowth have to be gimmicky or novel? He's a cat who fights by scratching and throwing coins. That's unique enough considering there are no feline fighters in Smash.
 

Burruni

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Yeah... people say Meowth isn't interesting enough to be in Smash... like why does Meowth have to be gimmicky or novel? He's a cat who fights by scratching and throwing coins. That's unique enough considering there are no feline fighters in Smash.
Meowth as a normal pokemon within the games lacks much beyond what already exists as a pokeball summon.

And using a niche to justify a character is never a good grounds for one =/
Not enough feline fighters? Let's add cat mario!
 

Scoliosis Jones

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There is SO much more than goes into a character being "unique" then just their appearance. Plus they need to, for the most part, have some sort of fan demand and inherently valid reasons that they should be in over other characters.

You could have X reasons that this or that character is unique, but what type of moveset a character has is probably more important. This IS a game after all.

For example, if I claimed I was unique because I have an awesome beard and bent spine, sure. But if I don't DO something unique as opposed to the rest of the group, then what do I add?
 

Arcadenik

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Meowth as a normal pokemon within the games lacks much beyond what already exists as a pokeball summon.

And using a niche to justify a character is never a good grounds for one =/
Not enough feline fighters? Let's add cat mario!
Do you really want another Mario? No, then go with Meowth.

You should take a look in the Meowth support thread in the predefined roles group.

What is Meowth lacking in the games? Really... what does Meowth as a species lack?
We do have feline fighters.
These are Mii Fighters. They are not really feline fighters. I mean, we do have Inkling costumes for the Mii Fighters... that means we don't need the real Inklings in Smash, right?
 

Geno Boost

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i made this for smash bros fans

i think Nester is very likley deconfirmed because the ballout rule says "video game character" but... :4rob: isnt a video game character he is just a toy but nester is a comic character but he had a video game just like him

note: i am just putting newcomers not cut vetrans because they were a part of super smash before
 

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Cutie Gwen

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i made this for smash bros fans

i think Nester is very likley deconfirmed because the ballout rule says "video game character" but... :4rob: isnt a video game character he is just a toy but nester is a comic character but he had a video game just like him

note: i am just putting newcomers not cut vetrans
*Donkey Kong Junior
Who the **** asked for him?
 

Burruni

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Do you really want another Mario? No, then go with Meowth.

You should take a look in the Meowth support thread in the predefined roles group.

What is Meowth lacking in the games? Really... what does Meowth as a species lack?

These are Mii Fighters. They are not really feline fighters. I mean, we do have Inkling costumes for the Mii Fighters... that means we don't need the real Inklings in Smash, right?
No.
But people still want Inklings because they're an innovative character who are the face of a New IP that is getting a MASSIVE pull in both mangas and game not because of a gunner or aquatic species fighter niche.

What Meowth as a species lack is any real type of highlight in the games. The biggest role I can remember one having was being one of a couple dozen possible main species in the Mystery Dungeon games and one of the enemies in the easier difficulties of Pokemon Dash.

:4jigglypuff: got in due to anime popularity and ease of programming off of assets from :4kirby:. :pichumelee: got in due to being related to and being an easy clone of :pikachumelee:.

:4pikachu::4charizard::4mewtwo::4lucario::squirtle::ivysaur: have far more significant roles in the games and it is that which opened the door for them in Smash. :4greninja: as a starter was chosen due to being at the forefront of official art and having a very interesting design that Sakurai liked to create a Ninja character.
 
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WeirdChillFever

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Uniqueness has become such a empty term for me, since every character can be made to fullify an archetype or made unique with enough mind-twisting.

I could say Pidgey would be perfect, since we don't have a bird-fighter using bird-moves.
It'd be a very cool archetype with unique moves and ditto playstyle.

Loops, dives, pecks, talon grabs and various wind-moves could make for a great bird/acrobat moveset.

Same with Nabbit (shameless plug is extremely shameless).
He could encompass the Thief/Rogue-class seen in many RPGs.

This archetype relies on quick hits and evasion to get their goal, along with a lot of stealing.
Nabbit would be able to quickly get to the opponent time and time again, stealing the walls of projectiles that are on his way before kidnapping the opponent for a positional advantage.

He could even trick opponents with a fake treasure chest, slam around his bag or even steal stocks and items!

This archetype appears in a lot of RPGs, including big names as Fire Emblem!
Gangrell and to an extent Anna could be repped by Nabbit!

The thing is, the archetype doesn't make the character.
 

Ura

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It's a shame that Cat Mario was blacklisted by Nintendo.

That's really mean to the people that wanted Cat Mario in the game. :c
 

Arcadenik

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This is my work-in-progress moveset for Meowth.

Neutral Attack (Fury Swipes)

Meowth scratches right and left like in the gif.

Neutral Combo (A+A+A) (Fury Swipes)

When you keep tapping the A button, Meowth will leap and suspend in midair to scratch the opponent multiple times like in the gif.

Dash Attack (Slash)

Meowth zooms past the opponent and slashes them.

Side Smash (Pay Day from the Pokemon games)

More coins scatter when the original coin hits the opponent and these coins can hurt nearby opponents who didn't get hit by the original coin. Meowth, that's right! Collateral damage!

Neutral Aerial (Pay Day from Smash 64)

A homage to the original Smash 64 game. The coins fly in all directions and they hit enemies. It seemed like an ideal move for a neutral aerial move.

Forward Aerial (Double Scratch from the Pokemon trading cards)

Meowth scratches the enemy two times... it sounds simple and bland on paper but look at how flashy it really is in that nifty gif! :awesome:

Back Aerial (Iron Tail)

It is like :4lucas: meteor smash move. God, I love that move in Brawl.

Up Aerial (Iron Tail)

It is like :4yoshi: Up Aerial where Meowth hits the opponent with his tail. Do you want to see Meowth doing that to Pikachu in Smash?! :awesome:

Down Aerial (Fury Swipes)

Meowth scratches around so fast it can hit opponents multiple times... kinda like :4mario: Down Aerial (Mario Tornado).

Neutral Special - PAY DAY (Pay Day from Brawl and SSB4)

Another homage to Meowth's Smash history! Just hold down the button and Meowth will keep on throwing coins till he runs out of coins... it functions like :4bowser: and :4charizard: fire breathing moves.

Side Special - THIEF

The description of the move Thief states, "The user attacks and steals the target's held item simultaneously. It can't steal if the user holds an item."

So, like you see in that gif, Meowth pounces in one direction like :4diddy: Side+B move. When Meowth lands on the opponent, he steals their held item and then jumps off them. If the items are turned off, well, Meowth can just meteor smash them straight down anyway.

One of the custom moves could be Snatch where Meowth doesn't steal generic items but he steals character unique items and effects of healing and stat-changing moves. Meowth can steal the effects of :4wiifit: deep breathing, :4shulk: Monado Arts... Meowth can also pick up :4diddy: bananas, :4villager: pocketed items, :4peach: vegetables, :4link: bombs, :4rob: gyros, and even :4olimar: Pikmin.

Up Special - FURY SWIPES

It controls like :4fox: Up+B move where Meowth pauses midair for a moment before he launches in the direction you choose... and he will scratch enemies multiple times on his path. Meowth is very agile and acrobatic so I think this move would have a good distance.

I imagine Meowth's animation for this move and certain scratch-based moves (Neutral Combo, Down Aerial) would be based on the gif below.



Down Special - FEINT ATTACK

Just to be clear, Feint Attack used to be called Faint Attack. Anyway, when Meowth does this move, he leaves behind several afterimages like in the gif above... you know, like how :4fox: leaves behind afterimages in his Side+B move.


Meowth does a flip jump like :4miibrawl: does in the gif above but with afterimages trailing behind... and instead of kicking, he pounces like Cat Mario does in the gif below.


One of the custom moves could be Dig Claws where Meowth buries the opponent when he pounces on them... kinda like :4zss: Down+B move. Dig Claws is from one of the Pokemon trading cards. Oh, and Meowth can learn Dig in the games, too!
 

Cutie Gwen

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they have nothing to do with smash why are you mention them?
You said DKJunior was requested in Japan. Does he even have a trophy in the franchise? Probably, but the point is, you said he has some fans and that's why you put him on that chart. Need I remind you that Rundas is a pretty popular choice around? Except that unlike DKJunior, I've seen multiple videos of 'Top 10 characters for Smash' having Rundas.
 

Geno Boost

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You said DKJunior was requested in Japan. Does he even have a trophy in the franchise? Probably, but the point is, you said he has some fans and that's why you put him on that chart. Need I remind you that Rundas is a pretty popular choice around? Except that unlike DKJunior, I've seen multiple videos of 'Top 10 characters for Smash' having Rundas.
we can get a joke character cant we? just like :4rob::4wiifit::4drmario::4duckhunt: , DK jr. did make something special in nintendo history in the past he made people learn math
 
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Arcadenik

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You said DKJunior was requested in Japan. Does he even have a trophy in the franchise? Probably, but the point is, you said he has some fans and that's why you put him on that chart. Need I remind you that Rundas is a pretty popular choice around? Except that unlike DKJunior, I've seen multiple videos of 'Top 10 characters for Smash' having Rundas.


And popularity isn't everything... :4duckhunt: and :4wiifit: weren't on top 10 lists. :052:
 
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Cutie Gwen

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we can get a joke character cant we? just like :4rob::4wiifit::4drmario::4duckhunt: , DK jr. did make something special in nintendo history
Here's the thing about DLC: As it isn't required to play the game, you have to make it as appealing to fans as possible. What would you want, a highly fan requested character as DLC, or a character added as a joke as DLC? You can get away with joke characters in the full game itself as they are already in the game, but as DLC? If ROB was DLC I guarantee he'd have failed. If that guy on Nintendo's old cards was DLC, only about 5 people or something would buy it when compared to, say, Krystal
And popularity isn't everything... and weren't on top 10 lists.
They however, were in the game's initial roster instead of DLC. Geno Boost's picture with DKJunior had the ballot thing, ergo, DLC
 
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Arcadenik

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I'm not trying to get Meowth in via DLC.... I'm advocating for Meowth's inclusion in the SSB5 initial roster.
 

Geno Boost

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Here's the thing about DLC: As it isn't required to play the game, you have to make it as appealing to fans as possible. What would you want, a highly fan requested character as DLC, or a character added as a joke as DLC? You can get away with joke characters in the full game itself as they are already in the game, but as DLC? If ROB was DLC I guarantee he'd have failed. If that guy on Nintendo's old cards was DLC, only about 5 people or something would buy it when compared to, say, Krystal
thats true i know he is very unlucky if he is a paid DLC instead of a free fighter but smash 5 can be a thing right?
 
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Cutie Gwen

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thats true i know he is very unlucky if he is a paid DLC instead of a free fighter but smash 5 can be a thing right?
First of all, grammar needs a bit of work, second, you posted this
For the ballot. Not Smash 5. This whole discussion started because you added DKJunior in this ballot image along with Nester and popular choices
 

Kenith

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Here's the thing about DLC: As it isn't required to play the game, you have to make it as appealing to fans as possible. What would you want, a highly fan requested character as DLC, or a character added as a joke as DLC? You can get away with joke characters in the full game itself as they are already in the game, but as DLC? If ROB was DLC I guarantee he'd have failed. If that guy on Nintendo's old cards was DLC, only about 5 people or something would buy it when compared to, say, Krystal
Well, it's Smash Bros. character DLC, so it'd probably sell regardless of who it is.
Unless they're a clone because people hate clones for some reason.
Also, I don't think R.O.B. in particular would have been a failure. Especially because Mewtwo would probably be DLC too.
 

Geno Boost

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First of all, grammar needs a bit of work, second, you posted this

For the ballot. Not Smash 5. This whole discussion started because you added DKJunior in this ballot image along with Nester and popular choices
english is not my main language

that doesnt mean DK jr. and nester are impossible they are just very unlucky, nintendo sometimes picks crazy characters for DLC just like they did put cat peach and raccon mario as DLC for mario kart 8
 
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Cutie Gwen

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Well, it's Smash Bros. character DLC, so it'd probably sell regardless of who it is.
Unless they're a clone because people hate clones for some reason.
Also, I don't think R.O.B. in particular would have been a failure. Especially because Mewtwo would probably be DLC too.
Er, ROB would have failed in comparison to Mewtwo, especially as ROB was hated when revealed. And about your 'it'd probably sell regardless' statement, keyword probably. Square Enix could probably give Nintendo the rights to Geno, Microsoft would probably let Banjo Threeie exist
english is not my main language

that doesnt mean DK jr. and nester are impossible they are just very unlucky, nintendo sometimes picks crazy characters for DLC just they did put cat peach and raccon mario as DLC for mario kart 8
Mario Kart characters are literally just models, animations and weight, it costs less to make MK8 DLC compared to smash as you need to balance it, correct hitboxes and other things. Not to mention the only Mario Kart request I've seen is to bring Waluigi back
 
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