Blue of Enemy Controller Hosts: The Blue Battle Cup weeklies

[Voidious]

omg read my posts

100% completely random unpredictable events can decide a match.

There's no pattern and no warning when it comes to the different forms of the stage.

I read your posts, but more importantly, I've played on that stage dozens or hundreds of times. I don't get killed by the stage, and apparently neither do 3/4 of SBR voters. Maybe you should practice on the SBR stage list stages?

There's no pattern or warning? If there is no transformation present, watch out for one coming. It could be any of them, but only a few pose a threat. If there is a transformation present, it will complete before another one comes, so don't worry about it stopping abruptly and going into another dangerous one.

 

[Inui]

The SBR is dumb. They released a terrible ruleset and an EXTREMELY inaccurate tier list. I don't trust them at all.

There's no pattern or warning? If there is no transformation present, watch out for one coming. It could be any of them, but only a few pose a threat. If there is a transformation present, it will complete before another one comes, so don't worry about it stopping abruptly and going into another dangerous one.

No pattern and no warning. You can't just say "watch out for the random" and think that's fine, because that would mean you should be ready to get attacked by the stage at any point...but you can't do anything about it anyways.

-You're in the air fighting someone. Spikes randomly appear and kill you at 80%, deciding the match. You had no way of avoiding it because you were in the middle of doing a move.
-You're recovering on the right. The face appears and gimps you.
-You're recovering on the left. The huge line appears and gimps you.
-One of the wall portions appears and Dedede gets an infinite on you.
-You jump up in the air and a missle randomly appears and kills you.
-You're in the air and the fireballs appear and knock you silly, putting you in a bad situation.

The only thing you can do something about is the Dedede infinite by running away...but not if you're grabbed already when the stage transforms. Everything else is completely random and you can't do anything about it. Anyone that thinks this stage is fair is an idiot.

 

[Voidious]

Well, it took a lot of back and forth, but you did finally make some good points to back up your stubborn insistence (not request) that it be banned. But I have to go from my own experience before someone else's theorycraft, and I am pretty sure I've died more from Halberd's (predictable!) hazards than I have from those on PictoChat.

Everything else is completely random and you can't do anything about it.

I don't think you understand what "completely random" really means...

Anyone that thinks this stage is fair is an idiot.

Nobody's claiming it's "fair". Counterpicks aren't supposed to be fair. If we take your statements at face value, it sounds like a very good counterpick for Dedede, heavy characters, and ground fighters.

So let's imagine a scenario. You win game 1, they CP PictoChat. If you win, obviously you're OK with that. If you lose, it was pure luck (according to you), so are you really worried about losing game 3, against someone you beat on a neutral, and now you can counterpick character and stage?

Anyway, sorry to drag this on. I've said my piece, it's up to Blue.

 

[Inui]

I'd rather win off of skill.

People that counterpick Pictochat are hoping to win off of LUCK. I know because I've been there against players like dmbrandon and teh_spamerer back before I could beat them. You just hope for something ******** to happen to the other person instead of you.

Counterpicks aren't supposed to be game-breaking and luckbased to the extreme that Pictochat is.

 

[BlackWaltzX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcojcb7ZMxc

 

[teh_spamerer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcojcb7ZMxc

^this is all that needs to be said about Pictochat.

 

[Inui]

Pictochat for b7.

 

[Jigglymaster]

^this is all that needs to be said about Pictochat.

That match was definatly done on purpouse.

1. Who would record a 2 stock match on Picochat
2. I'm pretty sure those 2 players did that exact same movement untill they got that one drawling.
3. The rockets barely kill the opponent and that wario had it timed so well that he would die off the right and the drawling would exactly appear in the right spot.

PicoChat isn't a neutral, but defintatly is a counterpick. Look at the other random stages.

Defino's Random Routes
Halberds Attacking Bomb, blaster, and arm cannon
Lylat's Stage Tilting
Yoshi's Island Ghost Helpers
Frigrates Stage flipping, fast appearing and dissapearing sides killing any miss techs, plus no right ledge
Pokestads1&2 stage switching

I'd say the reason you want Picochat banned is because it is like a second FD and you don't know much about the stage so your scared. You can bann pico at your own tournaments but don't force others to bann it for you.

 

[teh_spamerer]

That match was definatly done on purpouse.

1. Who would record a 2 stock match on Picochat
2. I'm pretty sure those 2 players did that exact same movement untill they got that one drawling.
3. The rockets barely kill the opponent and that wario had it timed so well that he would die off the right and the drawling would exactly appear in the right spot.

Stop trying to make it look like propaganda. They would have done a ONE stock match if they were trying to stage that event happening.

Also, my personal experience on the stage
I uptilted dmbrandon at ~30% into the ground spikes and he died making it a 2v1 against his team mate.
I hit Ryoko off the left side of the stage, he was under the stage and went to recover then the line came up and he died at 20%.
Atomsk was recovering with Diddy on the left side of the stage and the line came up, forcing him to recover into it and then get fsmashed by me, costing him the match when we were both at last stock high %.

 

[Inui]

Jigglymaster, you're dumb. Nobody cares about totally predictable and avoidable stuff on Halberd.

Frigate should also be banned, but it's not as gay as Pictochat.

Stop crying about people banning FD on you. That's the only reason you want Pictochat allowed.

 

[Jigglymaster]

Jigglymaster, you're dumb. Nobody cares about totally predictable and avoidable stuff on Halberd.

Frigate should also be banned, but it's not as gay as Pictochat.

Stop crying about people banning FD on you. That's the only reason you want Pictochat allowed.

Clearly on the SBR rules list picochat is allowed. You shouldn't be crying about picochat not being banned.

 

[Inui]

The SBR is wrong.

 

[Pierce7d]

Pictochat has random hazards and influences on the match, which are not preceded by an alarm, therefore should be banned.

Please, if there is any flaw or untruth in my statement point it out.

Also, Jigglymaster isn't dumb. He's just wrong about Pictochat.

Frigate's really not that bad. It's more the combination of one side without an edge then the flipping shinanigans. Anyone can use that, just practice the stage. You can't practice Pictochat and simply know and avoid the hazards. It's no better than Wario Ware. Actually, at least Wario Ware you can do stuff to stop your opponent's from getting broken rewards, AND you are warned. Everyone has a fair chance on WW (still banned though. Dumb stuff can happen) being warned of everything well in advance.

My main problem with WW is that when the stage transforms, unlike in Castle Siege, the floor doesn't rise from below, and you can get gimped fairly at random. I've Dolphin Slashed at a disappearing ledge before on WW.

But anyway, Pictochat is bad.

Lastly, I don't think Spam is scared of fighting anyone in this region. Think about it: Why would a really well known, well regarded, good player, be so unhappy to fight on a stage? It's not like MK gets ***** on PC, so it probably has to do with his distaste for the randomness of the stage. Just sayin.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

BTW

I didn't know Delfino had random routes. Always seemed the same to me. I'll test that later.

Halberd's hazards are HIGHLY telegraphed. The bomb takes for ever to come, the laser stays in one spot, and the arm moves around like it's having a **** seizure.

Lylat's stage tilting is why sometimes we consider it a counterpick. That particular aspect is pretty gay. I'm not even sure if it's random though.

Ghost helpers are pretty random, and can affect the match, but rarely do they ever significantly affect the match, and they only appear in two places, and can easily be accounted for. They produce 0 hitboxes, or stage hurtboxes, and do not affect the vast majority of the stage.

Frigates flipping is hugely telegraphed.

IMO, both Poke Stadiums should be banned. Perhaps 1 should be counter-pick, but definitely have Poke Stadium 2 BANNED. And even with that, these are telegraphed.

Pictochat hazards are super random.

 

[Luck-NYC/NJ]

delfino doesnt have random routes >_>

it goes beach, then pool side, then walk off ledge with the building on the other side, then the one with the groute and the walk off ledge on the right.

 

[Teczer0]

Clearly on the SBR rules list picochat is allowed. You shouldn't be crying about picochat not being banned.

Starter
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Starter/Counter
Castle Siege
Delfino
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokémon Stadium 1

Counter
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Pipes)

Counter/Banned
Green Greens
Mario Circuit
Onett
Port Town Aero Dive
Skyworld

You mean.... this one....???

Wanna explain why Distant planet is legal and not on the consider to ban list?

 

[Jigglymaster]

Starter
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Starter/Counter
Castle Siege
Delfino
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokémon Stadium 1

Counter
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Pipes)

Counter/Banned
Green Greens
Mario Circuit
Onett
Port Town Aero Dive
Skyworld

You mean.... this one....???

Wanna explain why Distant planet is legal and not on the consider to ban list?

I didn't know those other ones were on. But if thats SBRs rules, then there the rules.

delfino doesnt have random routes >_>

it goes beach, then pool side, then walk off ledge with the building on the other side, then the one with the groute and the walk off ledge on the right.

They are random routes. There are 3 routes it takes each containing 3 landing spots. Haven't you noticed that if you played more than once you would appear on a different landing spot.

To prove it watch these 2 videos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4l_-cr-Z10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4ZqIXJlAhI

They have different starting points where they land
First one lands on the beach, the second video lands on the front of DP first.

I play on Delfino Plaza enough to know this >_>

 

[Teczer0]

So if the SBR rules were that you had to play with a wii mote you would?

These rules are MADE UP. These stage selections MADE UP. They were what some group of people MADE UP.

Why wouldn't you fit the rules for local community?

If the ENTIRE community says pictochat is bad AND provides valid reasons for it you should blindly follow the "rules"?

Thats stupid.

Btw SBR also said that the stage selection they created was a RECOMMENDED stage selection.

You know what that means? Its not THE stage selection you HAVE to abide by.

SBR didn't tell everyone you have to follow this stage selection or meteors will fall on your head.

 

[Jigglymaster]

Inui says picochat is bad. I don't and there are other people who agree with me. This isn't either of our tournaments so you can't force the tournament host to bann picochat.

I BELIVE that picochat is CP because of its stats of how low chances are.

15/27 in a match at most

10/27 hazardous

ONLY FOR 13 SECONDS.

Just because Inui had a bad experaince with the stage dosn't mean we have to go and bann it. The chances are so rare its not even funny. I don't choose that stage because of those random effect, i choose it because its FLAT. FLAT= NEUTRAL

 

[Teczer0]

When did I say anything about trying to force anything?

In the end yea I guess Blue decides that.

But if it makes sense and the points are valid I would hope that Blue decides to Ban/un-ban whatever stages were being discussed.

And not just blindly use dumb *** "rules" that exist only in the Wizard of Oz.

 

[Jigglymaster]

When did I say anything about trying to force anything?

In the end yea I guess Blue decides that.

But if it makes sense and the points are valid I would hope that Blue decides to Ban/un-ban whatever stages were being discussed.

And not just blindly use dumb *** "rules" that exist only in the Wizard of Oz.

Inui was forcing the ban. I wasn't talking about you. Truthfully when there were rules i'm not the kind to break them and I just follow them w/o complaining or whinning about them. That SBR list however must be old or something because i don't see those in regualr tournies.

 

[Pierce7d]

The chances are so rare its not even funny. I don't choose that stage because of those random effect, i choose it because its FLAT. FLAT= NEUTRAL

The chances of SOMETHING bad happening, or opportunities for easy wall combos to arise are not rare.

Also, by this logic, Bridge of Eldin = Neutral. MM my Falco on Bridge of Eldin

 

[Keitaro]

Starter
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Starter/Counter
Castle Siege
Delfino
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokémon Stadium 1

Counter
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Pipes)

Counter/Banned
Green Greens
Mario Circuit
Onett
Port Town Aero Dive
Skyworld

You mean.... this one....???

Wanna explain why Distant planet is legal and not on the consider to ban list?

The SBR rulelist is a joke. I really don't know why those people supposively control the stage list when no one really follows them.

Have Pirate Ship on and Dave will **** more than you can count.

Have Jungle Japes and KEITARO WINS!! FLAWLESS VICTORY!!

 

[Jigglymaster]

The chances of SOMETHING bad happening, or opportunities for easy wall combos to arise are not rare.

Also, by this logic, Bridge of Eldin = Neutral. MM my Falco on Bridge of Eldin

Bridge of Elden has Walk off ledges, Picochat doesn't.

 

[Gamingwolrd]

This Saturday for anyone that says they didn't see the date. 10/11

 

[Keitaro]

@ Blue: You should post the date in the title.

 

[BlackWaltzX]

Plaster the time around also.

 

[Inui]

I'd rather play on Bridge of Eldin than Pictochat because I can pick one of many characters that isn't CGed and still play a match without a LOT of luck influencing it.

 

[Gamingwolrd]

10/11 at 12 pm

 

[Jigglymaster]

Me and Vex are coming to this and were teaming so yeah.

@inui, if pico isn't banned at the tournament I don't want to hear any complaining >_<

 

[bschung]

The price of coming to this increased by a couple of dollars. The stage list lost rainbow cruise, brinstar, and castle siege... and gained pictochat.

... each of these things are

 

[Inui]

@inui, if pico isn't banned at the tournament I don't want to hear any complaining >_<

If you pick it on me and win the set because the stage destroys me......

But considering I beat NL, I'm not that worried about your Diddy anymore. >_>;


BLUE, YOUR STAGE LIST IS TERRIBLE. You turned off multiple fair stages and then added a random luck-based stage. FIX IT.

 

[Pierce7d]

It's entirely possible I might not make it to this. We'll see.

 

[BlackWaltzX]

It's entirely possible I might not make it to this. We'll see.

Saturdays are easy to go to.
Make your time or die.

 

[Pierce7d]

Uh, question? What is the pot percentages being taken out for if there's a venue fee?

And Waltz, it was a money issue, but I seem to be alright.

 

[-Blue-]

wow guys i did fix it. and crews and doubles are $5 per person. sheesh lol. i took out picto what more do you want. stop complaining like lil babies. im trying my best to make it to where you all can enjoy lol not jus......INUI.

 

[Orion*]

100% random events you have 0 control over and 0 ability to predict can decide matches instead of skill..

johns lylat tilted Randomly and i missed the ledge.

johns delfino changed and i got gayed in the transformation.

johns frigate decides to flip when im recovering and i died

johns halberd

johns norfair

johns castle siege change

johns i tripped

This game is full of completely random events. If LYLAT can be nuetral then Pictochat can be CP. stop getting frustrated because you got gayed there and lost once every now and then. Ive lost matches to the spikes in tourny and i still thinks its better than some CPs. Pictochat isnt that bad.

 

[teh_spamerer]

johns lylat tilted Randomly and i missed the ledge.

You still always have the option to recover onto a platform or on the stage instead of going for the ledge.

johns delfino changed and i got gayed in the transformation.

The only way you can get gayed is if your opponent does something to screw you over. THIS will never happen on Delfino: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcojcb7ZMxc

johns frigate decides to flip when im recovering and i died

Frigate should be banned.

johns halberd

Halberd should be banned.

johns norfair

Norfair IS banned.

johns castle siege change

If you can't camp for 3 seconds....you deserve to die.

johns i tripped

No tripping should become standard.

 

[_Yes!_]

Johns Kashif ***** me

 

[Pierce7d]

So Brian was over today, and we messed around on Pictochat. At 71 percent on his last stock (he was Kirby by choice, I was C. Falcon by random) he's edge-guarding me, the missile appears and he's RIGHT in the middle of it, no chance of dodging, and he dies off the right side of the stage (we were on the right)

Bad stage is bad.

 

[fkacyan]

No tripping should become standard.

If the coding for the game includes MOVES tripping people under the same variable, then you're ruining quite a few chains by removing it.

No more dtilt to grabs would make me a sad panda.