Best Buy Demo Discussion - What do you think of Zelda in Smash 4?

[Krynxe]

This thread is to discuss your thoughts on Zelda from the playable demo at Best Buy. Please visit the other characters boards to discuss different characters.

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With the playable demos on Wednesday, June 11 and Saturday, June 14, smashers who couldn't attend e3 will have the chance to experience Super Smash Brothers for the Wii U hands on for the first time.


- For information, Click here.
- To find a location near you, Click here.

 

[MzNetta]

Played at the nintendo world store a bit today. These are a few first hand impressions.

1. >B Din's Fire has a somewhat shorter range. The blast radius feels about the same as brawl at full range.
2. the charge of vB Is very easy to be smacked out of which results in no phantom being spawned. If you don't charge it at all though, it has a very short range. This will take some getting used to.
3. It seems that ^B Farore's Wind keeps whatever momentum you have during the animation. For example if using ^B immediately after a jump, the animation will happen (zelda spinning, wind magic etc) but you will continue moving upward during it as if you were still just jumping. This makes Zelda's recovery much more effective assuming it isnt a bug.
4. All 3 Smash attacks seem to be in tact. Nothing noticeably different from brawl here yet.

 

[GameAngel64]

I went to the Best Buy in Schaumburg, IL today, but I was not about to wait in a four hour line for a 2 minute match. I did stand in the unofficial spectator area for a bit though. In all that time I only saw one (not very good) Zelda player. On the contrary, most matches consisted of at least one or two Little Macs and his stage was also the most popular pick. I did film the one Zelda match with my cell phone, so the quality is not very good, and I am also short, so not a lot of the screen is visible (never mind the players also blocking my view). In any case, here is my contribution (please switch it to 720p for usable quality):

http://youtu.be/MqEiVrdZvm0

 

[Toadallstar2]

http://youtu.be/MqEiVrdZvm0

Thanks so much, appreciated! What is up with that recovery though at 1:40? She fell fast. Nice b-air at the end.

 

[BJN39]

http://www.twitch.tv/nintendo/b/537496148 < Time: 06:26:00-ish

It's over. I'm through. Just... No.

You'll know when you see it.

 

[GameAngel64]

I cannot view what you are talking about with that link.

 

[BruiserKhang]

I went to the Best Buy in Schaumburg, IL today, but I was not about to wait in a four hour line for a 2 minute match. I did stand in the unofficial spectator area for a bit though. In all that time I only saw one (not very good) Zelda player. On the contrary, most matches consisted of at least one or two Little Macs and his stage was also the most popular pick. I did film the one Zelda match with my cell phone, so the quality is not very good, and I am also short, so not a lot of the screen is visible (never mind the players also blocking my view). In any case, here is my contribution (please switch it to 720p for usable quality):

http://youtu.be/MqEiVrdZvm0

Yooo dawg, that's me play Zelda! ^_^ Enjoy my derp playing?

Thanks so much, appreciated! What is up with that recovery though at 1:40? She fell fast. Nice b-air at the end.

I did not know how to Pro Controller. A lot of time I pressed X or Y instead of A or B... that's why I had that SD. I was trying some edge shenanigans, but it didn't work out so well. lol~

In any case, see how high Pikachu flew up after the dthrow at only 1%? I wonder if a bair follow up is possible. There's still free fall after aerial Din's Fire. No green Zelda. T_T (hopefully they'll add in the color later)

 

[Alacion]

No question, Zelda will be low tier once again. Ocarina of Time palette is gone.

My take: http://smashboards.com/threads/zgd-...banned-accounts.206557/page-456#post-16884755

 

[|ven|]

I actually don't mind zelda being a low tier

 

[SpLSlick]

No question, Zelda will be low tier once again. Ocarina of Time palette is gone.

My take: http://smashboards.com/threads/zgd-...banned-accounts.206557/page-456#post-16884755

That makes me =[ to hear...Hopefully things change since they delayed the release date

 

[Toadallstar2]

I did not know how to Pro Controller. A lot of time I pressed X or Y instead of A or B... that's why I had that SD. I was trying some edge shenanigans, but it didn't work out so well. lol~

In any case, see how high Pikachu flew up after the dthrow at only 1%? I wonder if a bair follow up is possible. There's still free fall after aerial Din's Fire. No green Zelda. T_T (hopefully they'll add in the color later)

Ohhh yeah, a different controller would really screw things up.
I wonder if sent flying, we could defend with Phantom if someone tries to aerial us.

No question, Zelda will be low tier once again. Ocarina of Time palette is gone.

Thanks for linking us! Dins upsets me, I actually found it useful in some situations in Brawl so to see it this pathetic isn't good. Now, I hope that there's quite a few characters who suck even more to give us low tier instead of bottom, haha.

 

[BruiserKhang]

Ohhh yeah, a different controller would really screw things up.
I wonder if sent flying, we could defend with Phantom if someone tries to aerial us.

yeah, yeah, it was the controller, I swear

Phantom might be an interesting move to use to help your recovery. It stays in place and lingers when used in the air, so it might cover some interesting space. (I had no idea you could charge it, though. That sounds pretty useful)

 

[GameAngel64]

Yooo dawg, that's me play Zelda! ^_^ Enjoy my derp playing?



I did not know how to Pro Controller. A lot of time I pressed X or Y instead of A or B... that's why I had that SD. I was trying some edge shenanigans, but it didn't work out so well. lol~

In any case, see how high Pikachu flew up after the dthrow at only 1%? I wonder if a bair follow up is possible. There's still free fall after aerial Din's Fire. No green Zelda. T_T (hopefully they'll add in the color later)

Haha, nice. Good on you for enduring that line and getting the chance to play; I just couldn't bring myself to do it. I could also definitely understand the pro controllers being gimp-inducing, since all you need to do is accidentally attack when you meant to jump or something like that, and then it's all over. I assumed that's why you SDed.

It looked like the Phantom did not have a lot of utility, unfortunately, or at least not in a free-for-all match. What did you think?

 

[Toadallstar2]

yeah, yeah, it was the controller, I swear

Phantom might be an interesting move to use to help your recovery. It stays in place and lingers when used in the air, so it might cover some interesting space. (I had no idea you could charge it, though. That sounds pretty useful)

Oh, I wasn't sarcastic lol. Sorry for the confusion. I legit only play with the GC controller so it would screw me up too.
Yeah, charging seems best. Do you stay in one place while it charges and then you release or is it you can charge it and use it later? It seems if you stay in one place, they would anticipate it anyway and it wouldn't be effective. Or worse, they could reflect it and hit Zelda...

 

[BruiserKhang]

Haha, nice. Good on you for enduring that line and getting the chance to play; I just couldn't bring myself to do it. I could also definitely understand the pro controllers being gimp-inducing, since all you need to do is accidentally attack when you meant to jump or something like that, and then it's all over. I assumed that's why you SDed.

It looked like the Phantom did not have a lot of utility, unfortunately, or at least not in a free-for-all match. What did you think?

Yeah, the line was unbelievably long, I feel ya on that one. We were some of the first people there and still had to wait a good hour and a half after the event started before playing. Gosh though, I thought I heard someone getting excited over a Zelda pick behind me. That was probably you, huh? :D It's sweet to know there will be another Zelda player in the area when the game rolls around~

Hmmm, the Phantom... It barely travels anywhere without any charge. Maybe it has some creative uses for escape and controlling space while you recover. Just some theory, it's hard to say.

Oh, I wasn't sarcastic lol. Sorry for the confusion. I legit only play with the GC controller so it would screw me up too.
Yeah, charging seems best. Do you stay in one place while it charges and then you release or is it you can charge it and use it later? It seems if you stay in one place, they would anticipate it anyway and it wouldn't be effective. Or worse, they could reflect it and hit Zelda...

Ahaha, I knew you weren't, I was just being silly~

I honestly had no idea you could charge the thing until I read this thread, so I never got to actually charge it. I don't believe you can store the charge, though. You stay in one place while it charges and then you release.

 

[Aninymouse]

Guys, I'm no Zelda expert, and no one has said a word about this yet, but Zelda's UAir looks to have changed for the better, somehow. It looks to me like the hitbox is way bigger, and the knockback on it is quite strong. I saw it drive people downwards... Sourspot? But man. Me and this other guy couldn't figure out what these giant explosions were, and it dawned on us both at the same time that Zelda's UAir looks way more impressive, now. Definitely not as fast, but seems more powerful.

 

[Katy Parry]

Hey guys, here's my experience at Best Buy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs-ObbYeN_w

We had a really good camera to record with. I used to work at best

It might just be the hype, but Zelda felt amazing.

I'll most likely analyze the video shortly. But around 1:33 I hit Mario with Din's Fire's CORE, and it almost killed him at 80%, and I also combo Pikachu with two bairs in a row. It felt pretty amazing. The visual effects and sounds are just perfect.

The only thing I don't like was it seems like after landing on the ground with Farore's, you seem to have almost 2 seconds of landing lag, before you can move again. This might be to compensate for how fast the teleport is now, but I'm not sure.

 

[HRR2b23]

Oh, I wasn't sarcastic lol. Sorry for the confusion. I legit only play with the GC controller so it would screw me up too.
Yeah, charging seems best. Do you stay in one place while it charges and then you release or is it you can charge it and use it later? It seems if you stay in one place, they would anticipate it anyway and it wouldn't be effective. Or worse, they could reflect it and hit Zelda...

Yeah, the line was unbelievably long, I feel ya on that one. We were some of the first people there and still had to wait a good hour and a half after the event started before playing. Gosh though, I thought I heard someone getting excited over a Zelda pick behind me. That was probably you, huh? :D It's sweet to know there will be another Zelda player in the area when the game rolls around~

Hmmm, the Phantom... It barely travels anywhere without any charge. Maybe it has some creative uses for escape and controlling space while you recover. Just some theory, it's hard to say.




Ahaha, I knew you weren't, I was just being silly~

I honestly had no idea you could charge the thing until I read this thread, so I never got to actually charge it. I don't believe you can store the charge, though. You stay in one place while it charges and then you release.

You guys were both at the Schaumburg BB? Guess what? There will be a THIRD Zelda player in your area! I personally tried Sheik, and boy was she bad. Zelda however looks to be much improved from Brawl, so I'll be giving my PM main my full attention now

 

[Alacion]

Despite how good or bad you think Din's Fire is, it doesn't stop the fact that a single aerial move will completely nullify Din's.

 

[Toadallstar2]

Hey guys, here's my experience at Best Buy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs-ObbYeN_w

Awesome, thanks for sharing. You did really good... Nice landing all those LKs! And camping with Dins lol. Phantom doesn't go far despite charging... Maybe if its charged to the max it might.

Nayru's looks good, and knocks considerably. The ending lag seems minimal as well, can you clarify?
You tried to up-air Mario right, as he KOd you? Does it take longer for uair to activate?

Zelda's spotdoge looks amazing lol, a great pose.

 

[Squii The Fish]

Hey guys, here's my experience at Best Buy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs-ObbYeN_w

We had a really good camera to record with. I used to work at best

It might just be the hype, but Zelda felt amazing.

I'll most likely analyze the video shortly. But around 1:33 I hit Mario with Din's Fire's CORE, and it almost killed him at 80%, and I also combo Pikachu with two bairs in a row. It felt pretty amazing. The visual effects and sounds are just perfect.

The only thing I don't like was it seems like after landing on the ground with Farore's, you seem to have almost 2 seconds of landing lag, before you can move again. This might be to compensate for how fast the teleport is now, but I'm not sure.

Nice footage bro!

that said I was really hoping DinAir wouldn't burn all your jumps. Welp.

 

[|ven|]

Hey guys, here's my experience at Best Buy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs-ObbYeN_w

We had a really good camera to record with. I used to work at best

It might just be the hype, but Zelda felt amazing.

I'll most likely analyze the video shortly. But around 1:33 I hit Mario with Din's Fire's CORE, and it almost killed him at 80%, and I also combo Pikachu with two bairs in a row. It felt pretty amazing. The visual effects and sounds are just perfect.

The only thing I don't like was it seems like after landing on the ground with Farore's, you seem to have almost 2 seconds of landing lag, before you can move again. This might be to compensate for how fast the teleport is now, but I'm not sure.

Looks like the costumes stayed the same D:

 

[UnownLegend]

I played as Zelda too! my very inexperienced take is that Zelda was changed to be a better all around character than she ever was. Basically, first impression left me feeling like a lot of her power moves were weakened. They didn't seem to hit as hard. Granted I never managed to sweet spot her back or forward airs, or any move actually, but her smashes definitely seemed to have less impact than before. And while dins fire doesn't feel as uber strong as brawl, it seems to have the same radius do I think it's still decent.

I didn't get a chance to really play with her down b much, but it seems like a move you want to use when you can't afford to be vulnerable from din's fire.

Over all though, she felt really solid. it seems like she can take a hit better and she feels quicker to me.

I think Sakurai originally intended for Zelda to mainly be used as a finisher for shiek, who lacked really good finishers, but was really good all around. Basically I think he really thought people would use them as a combo and that's why Zelda has always been low tier.

Now that she is her own character I think Sakurai has rebalanced her accordingly. Making her better overall, but toning down her raw power.

But I'm just a scrub who's never played a single tourney ever, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I did win the match though so I represented for y'all over here in Utah

 

[Ultinarok]

Hey now, its not all bad. From watching alone it seems as though Zelda is much faster and falls much, much quicker.

Let's not forget her biggest flaw that decimated her in both Melee and Brawl: being tall, light, floaty and slow. She's still tall of course, but she's not as slow or floaty, although she still appears a bit light. Nonetheless, that alone is a big improvement for her meta, even with punishable Din's, SDI smashes and questionable Phantom Knight use. And who knows? Maybe her smashes have hitboxes that prevent SDI and Zelda simply sourspotted in the footage of Pikachu escaping side smash. It may have trapping frames in its center that can't be escaped and the player simply didn't land it. Zelda has always been about all-or-nothing risk and reward attacks built on timing, so I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[Katy Parry]

I played as Zelda too! my very inexperienced take is that Zelda was changed to be a better all around character than she ever was. Basically, first impression left me feeling like a lot of her power moves were weakened. They didn't seem to hit as hard. Granted I never managed to sweet spot her back or forward airs, or any move actually, but her smashes definitely seemed to have less impact than before. And while dins fire doesn't feel as uber strong as brawl, it seems to have the same radius do I think it's still decent.

I didn't get a chance to really play with her down b much, but it seems like a move you want to use when you can't afford to be vulnerable from din's fire.

Over all though, she felt really solid. it seems like she can take a hit better and she feels quicker to me.

I think Sakurai originally intended for Zelda to mainly be used as a finisher for shiek, who lacked really good finishers, but was really good all around. Basically I think he really thought people would use them as a combo and that's why Zelda has always been low tier.

Now that she is her own character I think Sakurai has rebalanced her accordingly. Making her better overall, but toning down her raw power.

But I'm just a scrub who's never played a single tourney ever, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I did win the match though so I represented for y'all over here in Utah

I feel the opposite. I almost killed Mario with Din's at 70%, as well as my ftilt almost killed as well. Her kicks have incredible knockback. And her smashes, especially fsmash, seemed inescapable and strong. I feel Zelda is stronger than ever.

I'll answer any other questions asked tomorrow.

 

[UnownLegend]

fair enough. its really hard to get a good impression from one game, but your video did show some good hits.

i never got any sweet spots in my game, so that is likely a large problem with my assessment.

either way, she definitely feels good. like, maybe not PM good, but close

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

From what I see it's pretty good... Except a lot of people don't really play well, and don't try the Phantom that much

 

[Katy Parry]

From what I see it's pretty good... Except a lot of people don't really play well, and don't try the Phantom that much

I tried Phantom out, and I really didn't see it an opportunity (with in my 4 minutes of playing the game lol) to use it well. In fact, I don't think I hit anyone with it once. I also fully charged it in the video. It's confirmed that after the phantom is released, it cannot be cast again until it disappears (makes sense, but just did it to confirm)

From what I saw, it does not put Zelda into helpless.

Awesome, thanks for sharing. You did really good... Nice landing all those LKs! And camping with Dins lol. Phantom doesn't go far despite charging... Maybe if its charged to the max it might.

Nayru's looks good, and knocks considerably. The ending lag seems minimal as well, can you clarify?
You tried to up-air Mario right, as he KOd you? Does it take longer for uair to activate?

Zelda's spotdoge looks amazing lol, a great pose.

I charged Phantom fully. There's a charge sound and little flash indication to let you know when its fully charged. It doesn't go out too far. I'm not judging the move yet, but it doesn't seem too useful, at least as of yet. I'm sure in 1v1s itll be much better, and possibly stop dash attacks. Plus, there will most likely either be 3 iterations of her down special. Either she'll have different moves like Palutena, or she'll have 3 different charge speeds/attacks.

(Is anyone else praying one of the moves will be Transform? )

Nayru's still seemed like a good "get off me" option in my option. The ending lag was minimal as well, yes.

Din's Fire range has been knocked considerably, and it doesn't arch as much as you could in Brawl. It's almost back to how Melee's Din's was in terms of control, but its a little faster and a lot stronger, with a much larger radius. If anyone noticed, It does put Zelda into helpless (ugh) and it is IMMENSELY strong. In the video around 1:33, I almost killed Mario will it around 68% (it put him at 80% after the hit).

Farore's Wind is QUICK, but the ending lag leaves you seriously vulnerable for about a full 80 frames.

I do love Zelda's spotdodges

As for the up air, can you refer to the specific time in the video? Up air does come out pretty quickly, as usual.

If you guys have other questions let me know!

 

[BruiserKhang]

You guys were both at the Schaumburg BB? Guess what? There will be a THIRD Zelda player in your area! I personally tried Sheik, and boy was she bad. Zelda however looks to be much improved from Brawl, so I'll be giving my PM main my full attention now

Awww yeah, that's great to hear! Chicago-area Zelda players unite~ :3
Was Sheik actually selectable in the demo? I had no idea.

Hey now, its not all bad. From watching alone it seems as though Zelda is much faster and falls much, much quicker.

Can confirm. Dedede would be proud. :')

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Thanks for all of this Ethan!

It seems good so far, and I can understand the nerf in Din's Fire range (and control). Although easily dodgeable, it was easy to use them at great distance, making it somewhat strong for edgeguard, espcially against/for begginners. It was also a bit OP to get the Smash Ball (this doesn't stopped my friend who complain about this to use Lucas Up B, but I digress).

So I can afford a Din's nerf if the rest is buffed. Faster falling speed, especially. From what I saw, it's really good!

Plus, there will most likely either be 3 iterations of her down special. Either she'll have different moves like Palutena, or she'll have 3 different charge speeds/attacks.

It's confirmed that, except for the Miis and Palutena, every characters will get variations of their moves. I'm expecting a fully defensive phantom, able to take several hits for you.



Oh, also, does Zelda's Back and Front Aerial are easier to land than in Brawl?

 

[HRR2b23]

Awww yeah, that's great to hear! Chicago-area Zelda players unite~ :3
Was Sheik actually selectable in the demo? I had no idea.



Can confirm. Dedede would be proud. :')

Sheik was selectable in the 3DS version, but not in the Wii U version

 

[AlanHaTe]

After watching a couple videos, I'm pretty sad that SideB still let's her in free fall animation, that's an instant no for me... She'll still be bad ._.

 

[staindgrey]

I'm a fairly recent switch to Zelda, so I don't know her intimately, but in my one Wii U match and 3DS Smash Run using her, I really couldn't find any particularly groundbreaking changes from her Brawl variation. As already stated, her upB seems to carry jumping momentum now, her downB is difficult to hit, she seems a little heavier annnnnd... that's about it. I only landed one heel in the entire Wii U match, but I'm not sure if that's due to the sweetspot being smaller or me not being able to adjust to her new weight right away. (Three minutes is not a whole lot of time.)

And yes, OoT outfit was sadly excluded.

Overall, I worry that they didn't change much about her at all, and her new move will have very limited potential. Still having free fall after sideB hurts, too. I can never seem to use that move in an advantageous way.

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Well, from what I saw, we have a blonde Zelda with a purple dress?

That's... quite Weird. And hair looked weird, too. But I do have to admit that TP Zelda, in SSB4, is really pinkish.

But I'm also sure that there's missing colors in the demo. There were no Dark Link for example.

 

[staindgrey]

Yeah, I assume that costumes are lowest priority, but I don't actually know that much about the order in which these things are done during the development process. I would find it odd, though, if they made all of these color choices for the demo just to be replaced later down the line.

In all honesty, I find it odd that they don't use pallet swaps in the same way Injustice did, by giving us fan-favorite and recognizable costume differences rather than simple color changes. And for some costumes, they even replaced the voice work, like John Stewart's Green Lantern or the CW's Arrow. Imagine if we could get Wolf/Falco/James/Krystal/anyone else usable as Fox, or any of the Earthbound kids usable as Ness (assuming he's in).

But anyway, that's off topic. I just wish we could play as many different iterations of Zelda. TP, SS, OoT and even her new Hyrule Warriors look would all be fantastic.

 

[|ven|]

It really makes me wonder why they stick to the twilight princess costume. I wonder if they have something in mind.

 

[Toadallstar2]

Thanks everyone for your reviews and discussion, I'm loving it.

It's confirmed that, except for the Miis and Palutena, every characters will get variations of their moves. I'm expecting a fully defensive phantom, able to take several hits for you.
Oh, also, does Zelda's Back and Front Aerial are easier to land than in Brawl?

Did I miss something with the above statement, in which variations are available in moves? I thought only Mii's were customizable?

The fair and bair do seem a little easier to activate and even sour-spotted, the distance seems larger as Zelda won't get aerial punished right after. Of course, I'm taking this from the few videos we got so I'm not sure.

Heavier is good! I seen her get whacked and survive a lot more, but that could also be due to the larger area of off-screen.
Yeah, colors now I assume are basic. They just needed 4 of each for the demo. I think they'll be improved and added later on.

 

[staindgrey]

Did I miss something with the above statement, in which variations are available in moves? I thought only Mii's were customizable?

Every character has customizable moves. The examples given were Mario's fireball and Link's boomerang-- Mario can fire a much larger and slower fireball, and Link can get his old Melee boomerang back. Essentially, every character will have slight variation choices to their standard moveset that you can choose, then take with you in those little Amiibo things. (Why they it can't just be attached to your Nintendo Network ID, I have no idea.)

No idea how this will be used in competitive play, if at all. But they weren't available to toy with in the Best Buy demo.

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Did I miss something with the above statement, in which variations are available in moves? I thought only Mii's were customizable?

There's an example about Mario in this video (and other things, it's the round table where Pac-Man was shown)

Or the screen about Mario's moves.

So now, I hope for OoT's Din's Fire and Nayru's Love. This could be REALLY intersting. And a protective armor, too. I wonder if we'll see other phantoms from Spirit tracks.

The fair and bair do seem a little easier to activate and even sour-spotted, the distance seems larger as Zelda won't get aerial punished right after. Of course, I'm taking this from the few videos we got so I'm not sure.

That's what I think too,and that's a good news, I think.

The changes seems weird at first (especially Din's Fire) but I think we are going in the good direction.

 

[Oz37]

Floridian Zelda mainer here, and I played Zelda at the SmashFest yesterday as well. Now, I'm not a competitive player whatsoever, and my controller scheme is the Wii-mote/Nunchuk combo. I really like having all my movement on the left hand and my attacks on my right (standards with thumb, specials with trigger finger). I've been using that control scheme exclusively since Brawl's first day of release.

I say all of this because I utterly failed using the Pro Controller. I used Zelda in my first round, and I was thoroughly demolished. However, I still got a decent feel for how she's gonna play.

- Din's Fire, as most know by now, has a nerfed range, but if you can sweetspot it, it's devastating. The area-effect, though, doesn't do much at all. Very give-and-take.
- Farore's Wind is much improved, with increased range, speed, and control. It's also easier to damage with it, but it shines as an escape to higher ground.
- Nayru's Love has definitely been buffed. It has great knockback and decent damage, and pretty good surrounding range.
- Phantom Knight doesn't have much use in a FFA match, it seems. We played on the Coliseum, and there was just no real use for the big buy here. However, when he does land a hit, he adds to the confusion and gives great escape options.

Overall, she felt pretty good to handle. Her standards are all pretty hard hitting, so I'm excited to get some practice in with her and see what she's really capable of. I'm thinking that, in a FFA, sticking with standards and using Nayru to get out of crowds is a solid approach, using Din to camp/finish from afar and Farore to escape.