All newcomers were leaked along Little Mac, Pac Man and the Miis

[8-peacock-8]

I'll never believe the leak. But i wont mind having the Miis. I actually kind of want to play as myself in a game filled with characters that were part of my childhood. It would be awesome.

It's like mardi gra only a lot more violent.

 

[Big-Cat]

wut?... Miis can do anything they want (or Nintendo want), and the face (it's the major problem between you?) is something very very irrelevant for what the avatars can do. Miis would be great to be a rep of some sports variety titles, Find Mii, Nintendoland (and their Assist would be Monita!)... etc etc... you guys are limited, .. R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch ended pretty well.

and Pac... just play all his games (a large library) you don't need to think to hard to imagine his moveset... like Rosalina, I guess =P.

and sincerely, besides Little Mac and Miis (and maybe Mega Man, but was still a surprise), the others aren't "easy to guess". well, at least, no one that I know see Villager and Wii Fit Trainer coming.

Care to give me a coherent playstyle for the Mii? Same for Pacman. Telling me to look at the games suggests you don't have anything concrete in mind.

Anyway, chances are that Mii would cover the ground already explored by Game and Watch in terms of aesthetics. At least Villager has those items in his series to begin with.

I also haven't seen much from Pacman fans that shows he would bring anything new to the table.

 

[CyberWolfBia]

yeah, I want to play as my Mii too. will be nice for casual matches. =)

Care to give me a coherent playstyle for the Mii? Same for Pacman. Telling me to look at the games suggests you don't have anything concrete in mind.

Anyway, chances are that Mii would cover the ground already explored by Game and Watch in terms of aesthetics. At least Villager has those items in his series to begin with.

I also haven't seen much from Pacman fans that shows he would bring anything new to the table.

go to the Pac-Man's support thread,.. and of course you know that Pac-Man isn't just a Arcade cabinet, isn't it?.. all those platforms games with a lot of variety of abilites aren't for nothing. =P..

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I liked the post above me until it said bring back Snake. Hopefully with the desire to add a more cartoonish feel (altering the ray gun and homerun bat) I won't have to see Pikachu get an RPG shot at him.

I wouldn't mind Pacman as much as Mii. That Pilot Wings stage is starting to scare me.

I'm also not against the inclusion of more than one third party character per company. But I wouldn't want to see any unique fighters get cut for it.

What's wrong with adding Snake? Doesn't make it any less cartoony or whatever. Have you ever even played Metal Gear Solid? The games are ridiculous. Not to mention he was one of the most well designed characters in Smash.

This game has Plumbers, Anthropomorphic Animal Pilots with laser guns, Magical Princesses, Magical Animals, ****** Boxers, Race Car Driving bounty hunters,Intergalactic space warriors, medieval swordsman who manipulate time, Giant Dragon Turtles, Angel Swordsman, Psychic Children, Pink Sphere-Like creatures and 2 Dimensional beings. If you can make all of this look "cartoony" then you can make Snake work.

 

[Big-Cat]

I've seen it and I saw nothing that seemed like something only Pacman can do.

Though I think something can be done by turning his pellet eating paths into an 8-way air dash like in Marvel vs. Capcom.

 

[LazerRage]

I liked the post above me until it said bring back Snake. Hopefully with the desire to add a more cartoonish feel (altering the ray gun and homerun bat) I won't have to see Pikachu get an RPG shot at him.

I wouldn't mind Pacman as much as Mii. That Pilot Wings stage is starting to scare me.

I'm also not against the inclusion of more than one third party character per company. But I wouldn't want to see any unique fighters get cut for it.

Yeah, I wouldn't mind getting Tails playable. I do think its doubtful for Smash 4 (Assist Trophy??), but maybe somewhere down the line if Sonic ends up becoming an established Smash Bros franchise/ Nintendo-adopted character, maybe one day? He could be a pretty unique character with his two tails and being a mechanic whiz (that's a thing, right?).

Anyways I would also like to chime in and say, the guy clearly states in his post that they are his "unlikely predictions" meaning he didn't know anything, and has so far just made a super lucky guess. Someone somewhere was bound to come up with a winning combo. Plus, when we think about it, they are all actually smart choices. People seem to think guessing Wii Fit Trainer means something, but if you think about the direction Nintendo has been heading in, its not a huge surprise. Its one of the only new Nintendo franchises, really. That, and, well... the Mii-centered games....*sigh*

Which brings me to my next point. Mii is going to happen. Nobody wants it, but its going to happen. Might as well accept our pathetic fates now. My guess is for the Neutral Special (B) to change depending on the color of the Mii's shirt. Realistically, it probably won't even be that cool.

Pac-Man gets a pass for being a VIP gaming icon (despite being a lame zombie-version of itself nowadays).

 

[TheGoldMan]

Still waiting for Mewtwo.

 

[HammerHappy]

What's wrong with adding Snake? Doesn't make it any less cartoony or whatever. Have you ever even played Metal Gear Solid? The games are ridiculous. Not to mention he was one of the most well designed characters in Smash.

This game has Plumbers, Anthropomorphic Animal Pilots with laser guns, Magical Princesses, Magical Animals, ****** Boxers, Race Car Driving bounty hunters,Intergalactic space warriors, medieval swordsman who manipulate time, Giant Dragon Turtles, Angel Swordsman, Psychic Children, Pink Sphere-Like creatures and 2 Dimensional beings. If you can make all of this look "cartoony" then you can make Snake work.

I'm sorry but snapping someones neck and planting land mines is hardly in the realm of "cartoony".
He uses weapons straight out of reality, and he stuck out like a sore thumb in Brawl.

Also, how is he one of the most well designed characters? He's one of the WORST designed characters, second to Metaknight. His entire game play is a huge camp fest with amazing range options yet powerful close combat options. He's part of the reason why in addition to its host of other balance issues, Brawls meta game itself is snooze fest projectile spam.
He encourages inaction, massive area denial, and punishes players who stay away from him and get close to him.
Awful design.

Also, you argue against your own point.

How are things like magic Princesses, pink spheres, a 2-D man and talking animals not easily "cartoonish"?

"Good job, you made a fictional animal cartoonish. Now do this modern warfare soldier in camo fatigues toting enough explosives to break into Fort Knox."

They throw fireballs with little sound effects and ride stars into people. They do not call in an attack helicopter and shoot people with a grenade launcher.
The style of science fiction in Metal Gear does not equate to the light hearted style of Smash Bros.

Sammus and the Space animals get past this with laser beams and weapons that are not pulled from real life. Snake does not do this at all.

He's incredibly out of place and poorly designed. I hope he isn't coming back and I strongly doubt that he's coming back.

 

[CoryCory]

Pac-Man would make a fun assist trophy but a full character? I don't know. I just can't envision it being anything less than him having all of his special moves being the same variation of eating dots and going forward. With the final smash turning everyone into blue ghosts.

Same with the Mii. It'd feel like a create-a-character in a wrestling game but I can see this happening just for the sake of it's relation to Nintendo's current ethos.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I'm sorry but snapping someones neck and planting land mines is hardly in the realm of "cartoony".
He uses weapons straight out of reality, and he stuck out like a sore thumb in Brawl.

Also, how is he one of the most well designed characters? He's one of the WORST designed characters, second to Metaknight. His entire game play is a huge camp fest with amazing range options yet powerful close combat options. He's part of the reason why in addition to its host of other balance issues, Brawls meta game itself is snooze fest projectile spam.
He encourages inaction, massive area denial, and punishes players who stay away from him and get close to him.
Awful design.

Also, you argue against your own point.

How are things like magic Princesses, pink spheres, a 2-D man and talking animals not easily "cartoonish"?

"Good job, you made a fictional animal cartoonish. Now do this modern warfare soldier in camo fatigues toting enough explosives to break into Fort Knox."

They throw fireballs with little sound effects and ride stars into people. They do not call in an attack helicopter and shoot people with a grenade launcher.
The style of science fiction in Metal Gear does not equate to the light hearted style of Smash Bros.

Sammus and the Space animals get past this with laser beams and weapons that are not pulled from real life. Snake does not do this at all.

He's incredibly out of place and poorly designed. I hope he isn't coming back and I strongly doubt that he's coming back.

Lol. Are you making the game? All these things about the games direction are just your opinions. And even if that was the case, how do you know he doesn't fit ? You already admitted that you never played a Metal Gear game. lol

All I got from that is that you don't like him, so he shouldn't return.

MK and Snake aren't why Brawl's meta game is the way it is, it's the engine. Brawl is a defensive game that doesn't reward approaching and has tripping among many other issues, but I'm not gonna debate.

You sound like your mad because you aren't good against MK or Snake. That's your problem. I mean Ocean (A ROB main) beat M2K's Meta Knight, and Mike Neko (Marth) destroys MK. Don't be a hater, it's not a good look.

Also, MK was one of the best designed characters in smash so far. You have no clue what you're talking about, bro.

 

[Kamiko]

The style of science fiction in Metal Gear does not equate to the light hearted style of Smash Bros.

Sammus and the Space animals get past this with laser beams and weapons that are not pulled from real life. Snake does not do this at all.

He's incredibly out of place and poorly designed. I hope he isn't coming back and I strongly doubt that he's coming back.

I believe the point being made was that Metal Gear doesn't take itself too serously. It's full of fourth wall breaking nonsense, even if it happens to have some real world weapons. But do you know what else it happens to have? Mind readers, giant robots, and cybernetic ninjas. It's not very far behind Metroid in terms of cartoonishness.

 

[HammerHappy]

Lol. Are you making the game? All these things about the games direction are just your opinions. And even if that was the case, how do you know he doesn't fit ? You already admitted that you never played a Metal Gear game. lol

All I got from that is that you don't like him, so he shouldn't return.

MK and Snake aren't why Brawl's meta game is the way it is, it's the engine. Brawl is a defensive game that doesn't reward approaching and has tripping among many other issues, but I'm not gonna debate.

You sound like your mad because you aren't good against MK or Snake. That's your problem. I mean Ocean (A ROB main) beat M2K's Meta Knight, and Mike Neko (Marth) destroys MK. Don't be a hater, it's not a good look.

No, I'm not designing the game but the guy who is outright stated that the appearance of the ray gun was altered to look less like an actual weapon. You think a guy that tosses pineapple grenades and fires mortars is going to fit in?
You're delusional, and anyone with critical thought can compare him to the rest of the fighters and see that he doesn't fit in.

Competitive Brawl is a bad joke of imbalances and nonsensical design. Snake isn't the reason it's like that, but he very clearly flourishes in it.
He's one of the heaviest characters despite not having the typical large model. He has high damage projectiles and high damage close range. His recovery is one of the best in the game. None of that is about OP or UP, it's just observable bad design.

Brawl is well documented to be awful in this regard. No one takes it seriously competitively. Hypothetically, if I even played Brawl online (lol), how could I be mad about losing in a game so imbalanced? Again, you argue against yourself by pointing out the game has lots of issues and then trying to suggest I would be mad for losing in it.

Also, I point out the boring projectile spam meta and you bring up R.O.B. as some sort of counterpoint. Are you even reading what you type?

All I got from your posts is that you have absolutely no logic to defend against my points and resorted to using pointless ad hominems such as:

1) Trying to turn empirical evidence into personal opinion
2) Saying I'm "mad cause bad" in a game that I don't play because I "lose" against Snake and a character internationally banned from tournaments.
3) Saying that because I don't play Metal Gear I hate Snake and that if I did play Metal Gear he would magically become appropriate for Smash

Just stop. Your bias is disgustingly obvious and you have had two chances to show that you have something to offer in discussion. You've displayed that you don't.

 

[HammerHappy]

I believe the point being made was that Metal Gear doesn't take itself too serously. It's full of fourth wall breaking nonsense, even if it happens to have some real world weapons. But do you know what else it happens to have? Mind readers, giant robots, and cybernetic ninjas. It's not very far behind Metroid in terms of cartoonishness.

But that isn't cartoonish. Many aspects of Metroid are not cartoonish but Sammus makes the cut via being more rooted in pure fiction.

I know the damn plot to Metal Gear. I've watched a lot of game play. Again, the aspects of MGs realism isn't what the discussion is about, it's about if it fits into SSB4.

The answer is no.

"The Ray Gun in Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS/Wii U has been redesigned completely. It has a more futuristic design and like the Ray from Brawl, it doesn't have a sight . Also, instead of a trigger it has a button and in front of the muzzle, it has the Smash symbol that appears backward because it acts like a stamp. As Sakurai said in his Miiverse post, they are trying to differentiate between the Ray Gun from an actual gun."

They took the trigger off a laser blaster. Keep telling me how Snake fits.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

No, I'm not designing the game but the guy who is outright stated that the appearance of the ray gun was altered to look less like an actual weapon. You think a guy that tosses pineapple grenades and fires mortars is going to fit in?
You're delusional, and anyone with critical thought can compare him to the rest of the fighters and see that he doesn't fit in.

Competitive Brawl is a bad joke of imbalances and nonsensical design. Snake isn't the reason it's like that, but he very clearly flourishes in it.
He's one of the heaviest characters despite not having the typical large model. He has high damage projectiles and high damage close range. His recovery is one of the best in the game. None of that is about OP or UP, it's just observable bad design.

Brawl is well documented to be awful in this regard. No one takes it seriously competitively. Hypothetically, if I even played Brawl online (lol), how could I be mad about losing in a game so imbalanced? Again, you argue against yourself by pointing out the game has lots of issues and then trying to suggest I would be mad for losing in it.

Also, I point out the boring projectile spam meta and you bring up R.O.B. Are you even reading what you type?

All I got from your posts is that you have absolutely no logic to defend against my points and resorted to using pointless ad hominems such as:

1) Trying to turn empirical evidence into opinion
2) Saying I'm "mad cause bad" in a game that I don't play because I "lose" against Snake and a character internationally banned from tournaments.
3) Saying that because I don't play Metal Gear I hate Snake and that if I did play Metal Gear he would magically become appropriate for Smash

Just stop. Your bias is disgustingly obvious and you have had two chances to show that you have something to offer in discussion.

Lol

You act like you can't read but I know you can. You sound like a wanna-be professor. Instead of analyzing what I'm saying try addressing what I'm saying.

You said you didn't play Metal Gear right? Therefor, your opinion isn't as valued as someone who has

I never said you hated Metal Gear, you're putting words in my mouth bro lol

That Match up comment was just my assumption, but everyone I see complain about usually just suck at the match up. Even if both characters are strong they can't be beat; not with that mentality, though.

I brought up ROB because to tell you they are beatable. Like I said, I'm not gonna debate about Brawl 's meta game.

Because I disagree with your opinions doesn't make me bias.

Lol 2 chances? This isn't Who wants to be a millionaire, the weakest link, Deal or no Deal, I can say what I want, and I really don't have to prove anything to you.

 

[Kamiko]

But that isn't cartoonish. Many aspects of Metroid are not cartoonish but Sammus makes the cut via being more rooted in pure fiction.

I know the damn plot to Metal Gear. I've watched a lot of game play. Again, the aspects of MGs realism isn't what the discussion is about, it's about if it fits into SSB4.

The answer is no.

"The Ray Gun in Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS/Wii U has been redesigned completely. It has a more futuristic design and like the Ray from Brawl, it doesn't have a sight . Also, instead of a trigger it has a button and in front of the muzzle, it has the Smash symbol that appears backward because it acts like a stamp. As Sakurai said in his Miiverse post, they are trying to differentiate between the Ray Gun from an actual gun."

They took the trigger off a laser blaster. Keep telling me how Snake fits.

Samus is far from the most cartoony aspect of Metroid. You seem to be of the opinion that real-world weapons don't belong anywhere near Smash. Except we already have swords, so. . . I don't really see where this is coming from.

 

[Substitution]

Samus is far from the most cartoony aspect of Metroid. You seem to be of the opinion that real-world weapons don't belong anywhere near Smash. Except we already have swords, so. . . I don't really see where this is coming from.

Most of them aren't that realistic though...

 

[HammerHappy]

Lol

You act like you can't read but I know you can. You sound like a wanna-be professor. Instead of analyzing what I'm saying try addressing what I'm saying.

You said you didn't play Metal Gear right? Therefor, your opinion isn't as valued as someone who has

I never said you hated Metal Gear, you're putting words in my mouth bro lol

That Match up comment was just my assumption, but everyone I see complain about usually just suck at the match up. Even if both characters are strong they can't be beat; not with that mentality, though.

I brought up ROB because to tell you they are beatable. Like I said, I'm not gonna debate about Brawl 's meta game.

Because I disagree with your opinions doesn't make me bias.

Lol 2 chances? This isn't Who wants to be a millionaire, the weakest link, Deal or no Deal, I can say what I want, and I really don't have to prove anything to you.

I've already addressed what you're saying.
"An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad hominem, is a general category of fallacies in which a claim or argument is rejected on the basis of some irrelevant fact about the author of or the person presenting the claim or argument."

Also, no where do I state that you said I hated Metal Gear. I stated that you said I hate Snake, where you do several times where you claim I don't like him and that I'm a hater.

Regardless, whether or not a person has or has not played a Metal Gear game has nothing to do with a discussion about his place aesthetically and thematically in Smash Bros. It adds no value to your opinion and does not detract from mine.

You know what else has nothing to do with the discussion? Snake being beatable in Brawl.
Poor design has nothing to do with a characters strength. A poorly designed character can also be a terrible pick, i.e Pichu.

And to finally end it all off, for the third time you argue against yourself in self-depreciating hypocrisy.

Yes, you can say whatever you want. So can I.
And if you have nothing to prove to me, why did you initiate this discussion? You realize that the whole point of a discussion is to prove a point?

Your bias isn't from disagreeing with me or liking MG, just like I don't have a bias from disagreeing with you and being indifferent to MG. You're biased because you've staunchly defended something while providing no legitimate points whatsoever. You've only attacked me and talked about things that have absolutely nothing to do with the discussion.

So please, just stop.

 

[Louie G.]

Why are we arguing about Snake here?
Is it another Pac-Man vs Snake argument?
Just have them both.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I will say that Snake talk should be moved elsewhere.

 

[HammerHappy]

Samus is far from the most cartoony aspect of Metroid. You seem to be of the opinion that real-world weapons don't belong anywhere near Smash. Except we already have swords, so. . . I don't really see where this is coming from.

Ladies and gentlemen, a legitimate point.
Yes, things like swords and arrows are real world weapons. But consider the aesthetic and theme of the game.

Can you honestly say that Link wielding a sword is in the same gear as someone wielding an assault rifle or an RPG?
That's where I'm coming from. Swords are a very common theme of Nintendo. Legend of Zelda, Fire Emblem, etc. Even very cartoonish characters such as Kirby and Metaknight wield swords such as final cutter and galaxia.

And again, I'm not saying that Sammus is very cartoony, I'm saying that she's very clearly rooted in fiction which makes the translation into Smash Bros simple. She shoots beams of energy. The bombs she drops look nothing like anything from the real world. The closest thing is the missile, but she shoots it out of her arm canon.
I would say that the weapon itself is of more importance than the projectile.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Why are we arguing about Snake here?
Is it another Pac-Man vs Snake argument?
Just have them both.

I'm not trying to argue really.

@ HammerHappy

Whatever man, I'm not gonna argue with you man. I would understand if I was saying something false, but for the most part in not , that and I really don't feel like arguing with the Webster dictionary.

Read what you are typing. You're saying that Snake shouldn't return, he doesn't fit , yet, he is already in smash bros. Think about that.

 

[HammerHappy]

I will say that Snake talk should be moved elsewhere.

I can respect that because I had no intention of discussing Snake.

So here's something on topic: I really don't feel like Mii should be included. Beyond the fact that I can't think of any abilities he would have (though they did pull off Wii Fit Trainer) couldn't it be abused?

I'm not sure if they fixed this with the Wii U, but I don't want to look at someones disgustingly ugly or even inappropriate Mii.

 

[Pacack]

I can respect that because I had no intention of discussing Snake.

So here's something on topic: I really don't feel like Mii should be included. Beyond the fact that I can't think of any abilities he would have (though they did pull off Wii Fit Trainer) couldn't it be abused?

I'm not sure if they fixed this with the Wii U, but I don't want to look at someones disgustingly ugly or even inappropriate Mii.

Been mentioned before, but I'd let people use whatever Miis they want to locally, while limiting it to default Miis (Iwata, Sakurai, Miyamoto, Reggie, and the like would be interesting. If not, then just generic ones like you see when you log onto Miiverse and whatnot.) when you're playing online to prevent inappropriate Miis (Hiitler and more vulgar things).

 

[HammerHappy]

Been mentioned before, but I'd let people use whatever Miis they want to locally, while limiting it to default Miis (Iwata, Sakurai, Miyamoto, Reggie, and the like would be interesting. If not, then just generic ones like you see when you log onto Miiverse and whatnot.) when you're playing online to prevent inappropriate Miis (Hiitler and more vulgar things).

I've just never understood Nintendo's infatuation with them.

They don't even really look like human beings, just creepy caricatures. With the Xbox Avatars they actually resemble people so when they're included as PCs you can get the novelty of seeing a guy that looks like you play in the game. I don't get that with Miis, and even if I did I wouldn't say it warrants them to be in Smash.

Also, if Namcos involvement nets them a character, does anyone have other ideas besides Pacman? I'm not a fan of 3-D Pacman and can't think of anything else from Namco.

 

[Kamiko]

I really don't feel like Mii should be included.

They don't even really look like human beings, just creepy caricatures. With the Xbox Avatars they actually resemble people so when they're included as PCs you can get the novelty of seeing a guy that looks like you play in the game. I don't get that with Miis, and even if I did I wouldn't say it warrants them to be in Smash.

I thought you said cartoonyness/lack of realism is what made something fit into smash. Wouldn't that make Miis and Pacman perfect additions? I'm beginning to think we don't have the same definition of "cartoon".

 

[Arcadenik]

I also haven't seen much from Pacman fans that shows he would bring anything new to the table.

I think Pac-Man is probably gonna have a moveset that is mostly inspired by arcade games.

Pac-Man is known for eating dots and ghosts... so maybe Pac-Man could eat projectiles as long as he held down the B button to do the "waka waka"... and while you are holding down the B button, you could make Pac-Man move around like how you play the arcade game with the control stick... and Pac-Man could move in all four directions (up, down, left, right) while you are holding down the B button. Pac-Man could bite opponents but it is not the same as Wario's bite move... because Wario's bite only chews the opponent... but Pac-Man's bite could simply knock opponents away. This could work as a recovery move too since you could simply hold down the B button and then push the control stick in any four directions so Pac-Man could "waka waka" back to the stage in right angles.... but you can go "waka waka" for five seconds.

For the Side+B move, he could go "waka waka" like Sonic's spinning move in the direction you pushed the control stick (left or right)... the four blue ghosts appear in front of Pac-Man... and they will let you know how far you can go... so Pac-Man will automatically stop moving when he eats the last ghost... well, that or when he bites the opponent... when Pac-Man eats a ghost, his bite gets stronger and stronger as a homage to the score system in the original arcade where you get 200, 400, 800, and 1600 points... so if Pac-Man eats the fourth ghost, Pac-Man will one-bite KO the opponent if the opponent is in the way...and like in Pac-Mania where Pac-Man could actually jump over ghosts... Pac-Man could automatically jump over projectiles and continue on his way to the last ghost or to bite the opponent.... so it is different from Sonic's Side+B move where projectiles can hit Sonic. Also, the ghosts can hurt opponents if they touch each other.

For the Up+B move, this is the true recovery move, of course... based off the Pac-Dot Chain in Pac-Man World games... you press Up+B and a random fruit appears above Pac-Man... you move the control stick to trace Pac-Man's flight... but it is all right angles... no diagonals... and the fruit leaves a line of yellow dots behind... Pac-Man goes "waka waka" as he eats the dots... Pac-Man can "waka waka" for ten seconds unlike the inferior neutral B recovery. Pac-Man will stop moving when he eats the fruit.

For the Down+B move, this is from Pac-Man World games where Pac-Man bounces... it is like your typical ground pound moves like Yoshi's and Bowser's... except Pac-Man bounces back up to the air after he hits the ground... and you can press Down+B again to make Pac-Man bounce... each bounce will go higher and higher... when Pac-Man connects with the opponent from above, it is a Meteor Smash. Hell, Pac-Man could probably bounce off airborne opponents who are trying to recover and land on the stage.

The Final Smash needs no explanation.

 

[HammerHappy]

I thought you said cartoonyness/lack of realism is what made something fit into smash. Wouldn't that make Miis and Pacman perfect additions? I'm beginning to think we don't have the same definition of "cartoon".

I said that Smash has a specific theme and aesthetic that is very cartoonish and with the changing of ray gun we can expect it to be slightly more cartoonish.

I don't like Mii because theres the chance they can be abused to hurt the aesthetic of the game (not by not being cartoonish, but by being customized to be terrible), and they simply look disturbing to me.
Characters like Wii Fit and Villager pull off human minimalism very well. I don't think Miss do.
The part of my post you quoted is something that goes past Smash. I don't understand what they add to Nintendo games by being in them. Their purpose as player representation between players is fine, I don't think he fulfills player representation in the game.

I guess there's something amusing as kicking Marios ass as a Regi like humanoid, but again I'm not feeling that it gives him precedent over more appropriate additions.

I don't like Pacman because I'm straight up not a fan of him.

I'll ask again, can anyone come up with another Namco character that would work?

 

[Arcadenik]

I'll ask again, can anyone come up with another Namco character that would work?

Ms. Pac-Man

 

[Pacack]

I said that Smash has a specific theme and aesthetic that is very cartoonish and with the changing of ray gun we can expect it to be slightly more cartoonish.

I don't like Mii because theres the chance they can be abused to hurt the aesthetic of the game (not by not being cartoonish, but by being customized to be terrible), and they simply look disturbing to me.
Characters like Wii Fit and Villager pull off human minimalism very well. I don't think Miss do.
The part of my post you quoted is something that goes past Smash. I don't understand what they add to Nintendo games by being in them. Their purpose as player representation between players is fine, I don't think he fulfills player representation in the game.

I guess there's something amusing as kicking Marios *** as a Regi like humanoid, but again I'm not feeling that it gives him precedent over more appropriate additions.

I don't like Pacman because I'm straight up not a fan of him.

I'll ask again, can anyone come up with another Namco character that would work?

The most popular non-Pac-Man Bandai-Namco characters are Lloyd and Klonoa. However, the odds of them getting in over the company mascot are ridiculously low.

 

[salaboB]

What's wrong with adding Snake? Doesn't make it any less cartoony or whatever. Have you ever even played Metal Gear Solid? The games are ridiculous. Not to mention he was one of the most well designed characters in Smash.

This game has Plumbers, Anthropomorphic Animal Pilots with laser guns, Magical Princesses, Magical Animals, ****** Boxers, Race Car Driving bounty hunters,Intergalactic space warriors, medieval swordsman who manipulate time, Giant Dragon Turtles, Angel Swordsman, Psychic Children, Pink Sphere-Like creatures and 2 Dimensional beings. If you can make all of this look "cartoony" then you can make Snake work.

Well, maybe you *can* make Snake fit. But Nintendo sure didn't manage to in Brawl.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well, maybe you *can* make Snake fit. But Nintendo sure didn't manage to in Brawl.

You're arguing opinion. There is no real right or wrong answer here.

I personally Snake fit just fine.

Regardless on whether he "fit" Sakurai saw no problems with him. And neither did most Smash fans.


But again, move the Snake talk elsewhere.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Well, maybe you *can* make Snake fit. But Nintendo sure didn't manage to in Brawl.

He's in the game, how much more can he fit? Lol

 

[salaboB]

He's in the game, how much more can he fit? Lol

That ignores the entire context of the post I was responding to.

If all it takes is being added to the game, anything could fit.

 

[IsmaR]

I know something that couldn't fit, but that is neither here nor there.

As Swamp said drop it.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I know something that couldn't fit, but that is neither here nor there.

That Tetris piece you needed like 10 minutes ago?

 

[Kamiko]

I said that Smash has a specific theme and aesthetic that is very cartoonish and with the changing of ray gun we can expect it to be slightly more cartoonish.

I don't like Mii because theres the chance they can be abused to hurt the aesthetic of the game (not by not being cartoonish, but by being customized to be terrible), and they simply look disturbing to me.
Characters like Wii Fit and Villager pull off human minimalism very well. I don't think Miss do.
The part of my post you quoted is something that goes past Smash. I don't understand what they add to Nintendo games by being in them. Their purpose as player representation between players is fine, I don't think he fulfills player representation in the game.

I guess there's something amusing as kicking Marios *** as a Regi like humanoid, but again I'm not feeling that it gives him precedent over more appropriate additions.

I don't like Pacman because I'm straight up not a fan of him.

I'll ask again, can anyone come up with another Namco character that would work?

I don't have a problem with you not liking the characters, I don't really care for them much myself either. I was just pointing out that you DID contradict yourself there. First you said realism was bad for a Smash character, then used lack of realism as a reason to exclude a different character. It's important to be consistant when defending your viewpoint.

I'd be happy to continue discussing Snake in his own thread, by the way.

 

[HammerHappy]

I don't have a problem with you not liking the characters, I don't really care for them much myself either. I was just pointing out that you DID contradict yourself there. First you said realism was bad for a Smash character, then used lack of realism as a reason to exclude a different character. It's important to be consistant when defending your viewpoint.

I'd be happy to continue discussing Snake in his own thread, by the way.

Where did I say that I don't like Pacman because he lacks realism? I don't like Pacman because I know nothing about the character and his creepy puppet mouth. Admitting 100% personal opinion here.

And I didn't say I don't want Mii because he isn't realistic. I point out Wii Fit and Villager as great examples of simplistic humans.
I was trying to theorize why Nintendo loved them so much because they fail at doing what they're clearly being put in Nintendo games to do, which is player representation. If they can't do that, then what is their purpose in any game- not just Smash Bros.
There's no contradiction.

If anything, it shows that I'm unbiased towards Snake. I don't want him excluded because I just don't like him (Pacman), I'm excluding him because he doesn't fit thematically with the game.

And that isn't opinion, it's observable fact. Am I missing some other Smash Nintendo character that uses modern weaponry straight from reality?
I shouldn't have to call up Sesame Street and have a "One of these things is not like the other" session.

I don't see how people can even argue for his inclusion when we're talking about a game where a laser beam gun got turned into a giant stamp because the original was too realistic. And I don't understand the "He was already in Brawl so he fits" argument. Yes, that's why Snake and Smash Bros is something that's even being talked about. That's how people determined that he didn't fit.

And if you're trying to say that things in Brawl should transfer over to SSB4 simply because they were in Brawl, then this has been a lesson in futility for me.

Oh, and I'd like to point out that I was fine to let this lie.

 

[Kamiko]

Where did I say that I don't like Pacman because he lacks realism? I don't like Pacman because I know nothing about the character and his creepy puppet mouth. Admitting 100% personal opinion here.

I wasn't taking about Pacman, I just grouped him with Miis as "things that fit in Smash Bros." That confusion is partially my own fault though for bringing him up in the first place.

And I didn't say I don't want Mii because he isn't realistic.

They don't even really look like human beings, just creepy caricatures. With the Xbox Avatars they actually resemble people so when they're included as PCs you can get the novelty of seeing a guy that looks like you play in the game. I don't get that with Miis, and even if I did I wouldn't say it warrants them to be in Smash.

And if you're trying to say that things in Brawl should transfer over to SSB4 simply because they were in Brawl, then this has been a lesson in futility for me.

I'm the last person you'll ever catch making that argument. I completely agree that that's a stupid reason for anything.


The Snake talk I'll only respond to if you want to take it to the Snake thread. We can drop it if you want, but I DO have things to say about that if you're willing to listen.

 

[I_DON'T_KNOW_YOU!]

I'll never believe the leak.

Even if the remaining characters from said leak end up in the game?

 

[8-peacock-8]

Even if the remaining characters from said leak end up in the game?

Yeah.