A Request to All Tournament-Level Meta Knight Users Regarding Infinate Cape...

[Tyberg29]

Wait, what is this tech, how do you do it?!? Sorry for noobyness.

 

[Dojo]

Lolz go here.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=182532

 

[Eternak]

Sooo

Let's do it for 2.5 seconds.
Appear safely.
Do it for another 2.5 seconds.
Appear safely.
Another 2.5 seconds.
Appear safely.
Repeat?

Thats called stallin not a movement approach or pullaway movement. everyone here is just hella scared of stallin the stallin its already banned. this tech must be used for movement approach not for stallin. if they repeat more than once thats stalling and its DQable so stop thinking in the stallin state and mind a good metagame with it.

 

[Dojo]

A movement approach?
Ok say they do it 3 times. But "they're looking for an opening for their movement approach."

Is that stalling?
**** like this is arguable.... THAT'S the problem.

 

[Eternak]

if they repeat more than once thats stalling and its DQable so stop thinking in the stallin state and mind a good metagame with it.

A movement approach?
Ok say they do it 3 times. But "they're looking for an opening for their movement approach."

Is that stalling?
**** like this is arguable.... THAT'S the problem.

I think you didnt read at all i guess. but anyways do whatever this board wants since they always do what "They" thinks its better for the "Community".

Ban it and thats all problem solved and no more arguing.

 

[IceDX]

As I said Before Has Any AT ever been Banned In SSB????

 

[Dojo]

Um, no. Stop with that "You didn't even read my post" If I wouldn't of read it, and comprehended it, I wouldn't of replied....

Now on topic, all you stated that has a matter in your argument is

if they repeat more than once thats stalling and its DQable.

At what time would it be repeating then?

Say they do it once, appear, throw a dsmash out there, disappear again. Is that repeating?
Say they do it, appear on the other side of the stage, run around for a couple of seconds til the opponent gets close, and DC to the other side again. 10 seconds is off the clock. Is that repeating?

When to consider it stalling is what is stumping everyone. A cunning player can easily use this to pass some time without getting DQ'ed for it.

Yes, I know we shouldn't be thinking of it as a stalling move but the fact that people do whatever it takes to win, will abuse this move. It could be an amazing approach but it wont be used as that.

It's gonna be gayed down to where I'm almost positive it will be banned. Which is lame because I do think it could be very helpful, but as you said yourself, it's not like it's up to us. It's what they think...

 

[Eternak]

thats why i just finished saying to ban it but im not gonna argue anymore ill let SBR to decide whichever they like.

 

[Yuna]

how do i predict it? as easy as setting rules for time limit during invisibility. 3 secs or your DQed.
he wont be able to stall at all so he just got at least 3 secs to do whatever and your opponent would be ready for that. but either way here at the very end the people who think are in command of tournament game like games would ban it for sure. anyway ill enjoy with or without it.

Edit: I tested it the traveling time and on and constant basis he has 2 secs to reach from side to side of FD, that means 3 secs time can be applied, since you can control it to move F,B etc so it is viable to allow it as that and players would be already ready to counter or do whatever in those 3 secs motion of the movement. and also lets MK players can either approach or get away from projectiles.

Did you know that your shield breaks if you hold it in for that long? No, seriously, you have to predict when during those 3 secs he's gonna attack, otherwise, you're just wasting shield. It's a losing guessing game.

As to your next post, we try to avoid biased and arbitrary judgment calls whenever possible. We're not gonna stick TOs in front of each Meta-Knight match to have them judge whether the Meta is using the move as a genuine tactic or using it to stall!

As I said Before Has Any AT ever been Banned In SSB????

No, but that's no reason to not ban it.

 

[adumbrodeus]

how do i predict it? as easy as setting rules for time limit during invisibility. 3 secs or your DQed.
he wont be able to stall at all so he just got at least 3 secs to do whatever and your opponent would be ready for that. but either way here at the very end the people who think are in command of tournament game like games would ban it for sure. anyway ill enjoy with or without it.

Edit: I tested it the traveling time and on and constant basis he has 2 secs to reach from side to side of FD, that means 3 secs time can be applied, since you can control it to move F,B etc so it is viable to allow it as that and players would be already ready to counter or do whatever in those 3 secs motion of the movement. and also lets MK players can either approach or get away from projectiles.

Policing is gonna be impossible for stalling, it'll require stopwatches at the tournies.

That said... were it policeable, that would pretty much deal with the "godly" approach issue reguardless.

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

How can you move in this infinite if your control stick has to be held down and your up smash has to be spammed?!?

 

[adumbrodeus]

How can you move in this infinite if your control stick has to be held down and your up smash has to be spammed?!?

Tilt the control stick, it has to be down and up respectively, but you can tilt both diagonally. This allows you to move, the greater the tilt, the more you move.

 

[ph00tbag]

Tilt the control stick, it has to be down and up respectively, but you can tilt both diagonally. This allows you to move, the greater the tilt, the more you move.

You can also move up as much as you ever could with a Cape. I've managed to reach Battlefield's top platform, although I didn't use the attack, which seems to change the physics of the move.

Not that you'd ever have any good reason to use this to get to the top platform.

 

[OmegaXF]

Many of those techs were banned for stalling purposes only. I don't see why we can't do the same for this.

It's not even that useful to be honest. Try to apply it to a real match urself and you will find that you just get ***** out of it 75% of the time.

The reason people are talking about banning it is because people are using it in a real match.

 

[adumbrodeus]

You can also move up as much as you ever could with a Cape. I've managed to reach Battlefield's top platform, although I didn't use the attack, which seems to change the physics of the move.

Not that you'd ever have any good reason to use this to get to the top platform.

Yeah, that's a point I made earlier actually, the only place you're safe from the hitbox is at the top platform of battlefield or above. Just Barely.

Gives mk plenty of time to get out of the move using the non-striking variation and punish you for being above him.

 

[OverLade]

I played a stalling MK....but he didn't use this tactic. I saw a few people using it at FAST, but nobody tried stalling with it, so it was all good.

 

[Frames]

I played a stalling MK....but he didn't use this tactic. I saw a few people using it at FAST, but nobody tried stalling with it, so it was all good.

exactly.

i hosted fast and i told people not to use it to stall, but that they could use it anyway and people were fine about it, no problems

and it wasn't like it was some scrub tourney, some of the best players traveled for this event

 

[the-real-dan0]

if you can't tell where on the screen an invisible mk is you must be blind it's so obvious. It's easy as hell to counter

situation: you're on battlefield fighting MK, he uses IDC what do you do?

answer 1) watch how the camera moves and be prepared to jump/shield/spot dodge if the camera closes in on you

answer 2) get up onto a platform and wait for MK to reappear. MK cannot jump while using IDC

 

[Kayzee]

I'll use this as a legitimate approach. I'll probably start off a match with it. I might also follow up with it after knocking my opponent across the stage with a dsmash or something similar. I'm not going to rely on this tech. I'm not going to stall, and I'm not going to be one of the guys that causes this tech to get banned.

 

[UnSaxon51]

After playing around with it for a while, I've come to following decision.

It doesn't have to be banned, but it probably should be (and almost definitely will be).

Even after practicing for a few hours, I still can't do this reliably. I don't know I just can't tap fast enough, but at best I'll go for 2 seconds or less. My longest is 6 so far, and I accidentally died off the edge. Regardless, my fingers get tired really quickly, which affects the rest of my performance.

Under normal circumstances, I can't see anyone able to keep this up for any extended amount of time. It puts a serious strain on the fingers and requires a lot of concentration. However, as Yuna stated earlier in the thread. If it's possible to be abused, someone will invariably learn to do so.

It's a cool (but difficult) technique and fun to bust out in friendly matches. But in the hands of a practiced player, the potential is simply too broken to be allowed on the tournament scene.

 

[ALB247]

It's funny. The fastest way this is going to be banned is by everyone bringing it up in discussion.

If everyone were to just let it be, it'd last alot longer. You guys are killing your chances by bringing it up in such a ridiculous discussion.

Perhaps you could all stop worrying on whether it will be banned or not and work on other aspects of your strategies instead?

 

[ph00tbag]

answer 1) watch how the camera moves and be prepared to jump/shield/spot dodge if the camera closes in on you

MK waits for the lag after your spotdodge or what have you and attacks, or he just drops out and grabs you out of the dodge. Maybe he even does a dtilt or somesuch.

answer 2) get up onto a platform and wait for MK to reappear. MK cannot jump while using IDC

First of all, I've already said that MK can get some decent height out of the Cape, and thus can get some good height out of the IDC. Second of all, he doesn't need to. If you're on a platform and he's below you, then the move has already done what it needs to do.

 

[adumbrodeus]

answer 1) watch how the camera moves and be prepared to jump/shield/spot dodge if the camera closes in on you

Mk's solution: Stay in IDC hovering within the range of the attack out of cape (preferably right on top of the opposing character). If you try spotdodging, MK attacks during the lag frames. If you try to jump, MK gets nice height on the tech, he can chase and attack. Shield buys you a little while but it doesn't last forever.

MK has multiple opportunities to attack with this every second. You have a couple of seconds of shield (which MK will not attack into), and beyond that, MK picks a random instant to attack, you pick a random instant to spotdodge/rolldodge/airdodge, and you better pray the two match up.

If you're too late, the attack proceeds as planned, if you're too early MK has an easy punish.

answer 2) get up onto a platform and wait for MK to reappear. MK cannot jump while using IDC

So, you exchanged a completely impossible to defend position for one that is considerably less dangerous... but still completely weighed in MK's advantage.

Believe me, if all this tech did was force you to the height of Battlefield's top ledge (which you require because the attack reaches anything lower), then it would still be completely broken. It's a horrible defensive position against MK because of his Godlike airgame.


That's not a counter, that's what the tech is ultimately trying to accomplish, forcing you to take a ledge or get above MK, because while you're still better off doing it then staying on stage, it's an almost insurmountable advantage to be forced to deal with MK from either the ledge or above. Enough to make him hard-counter the entire cast.