A Plumber's Tools - The Mario Moveset Discussion! #8: Bair.

[A2ZOMG]

You can mindgame people a little bit with F-tilt...the same way you can with Jab cause of the IASA frames.

If they get spotdodge happy, F-tilt is low lag enough to keep your options open so you can do other stuff as they come out of their dodge. F-tilting from behind someone's shield is a cool frame trap sometimes.

It's faster than most other F-tilts by a frame (well....unfortunately, not Snake or MK's), which is nice.

And in general people aren't usually expecting it, since it has more range than Mario's other ground moves, and is really fast. Angling it can surprise people in the air occasionally.

Otherwise...it's really situational due to not being exceptionally good at much, and the Jab and F-smash usually can do what the F-tilt can do but better. You should not forget this move though. It can be essential to contend with some characters out of shield due to its balance of range and speed. For example, against G&W. Your Jab usually lacks a tiny bit of range necessary to punish him out of shield. Your F-smash is a tad to slow to punish him on some stuff. The F-tilt can punish him in several of those situations where neither the Jab or F-smash reach him easily.

 

[vato_break]

a2zomg.... the new ??????

 

[:mad:]

Wow, man. Thanks for the helpful post, this needs to be on the wall.

 

[???????]

I am too busy to be of any assistance at this moment.

*I apologize for my absence*

 

[:mad:]

It's alright, I do find it a little depressing how inactive this place is, though.

 

[DtJ XeroXen]

Ftilt, Ftilt.

What I would say, one of the little moves I love to dive into.

Ftilt is honestly, one of my favorite moves to use on the ground, or if I feel the need to use an out-of-air move. I've found SH aerials to be nice in conjunction with a buffered Ftilt, since your opponent really doesn't see it coming. (This only really works at low percents, but it's a good damage racker.) In fact, most opponents won't have time to react, because if they're still in the air after the attack (and you aim the Ftilt upwards) they'll usually be hit, OR they'll airdodge, presenting a good opprotunity for a Pivoted Fsmash or a U/Dsmash, whichever fits into what you want to do, and depending on how far they are away from you.

It's really good to mix up your game with Ftilt too, especially if you space your bairs, and they attempt to shield grab you (and miss), you could simply use a Ftilt instead of an Fsmash, and you haven't weakened your staple kill move!

Plus, most opponents never see it coming, unless you abuse it. So... don't abuse it, then you get punished.

<3 Ftilt (It actually helped me with a ****LOAD of combos today)

 

[:mad:]

Ftilt, Ftilt.

What I would say, one of the little moves I love to dive into.

Ftilt is honestly, one of my favorite moves to use on the ground, or if I feel the need to use an out-of-air move. I've found SH aerials to be nice in conjunction with a buffered Ftilt, since your opponent really doesn't see it coming. (This only really works at low percents, but it's a good damage racker.) In fact, most opponents won't have time to react, because if they're still in the air after the attack (and you aim the Ftilt upwards) they'll usually be hit, OR they'll airdodge, presenting a good opprotunity for a Pivoted Fsmash or a U/Dsmash, whichever fits into what you want to do, and depending on how far they are away from you.

It's really good to mix up your game with Ftilt too, especially if you space your bairs, and they attempt to shield grab you (and miss), you could simply use a Ftilt instead of an Fsmash, and you haven't weakened your staple kill move!

Plus, most opponents never see it coming, unless you abuse it. So... don't abuse it, then you get punished.

<3 Ftilt (It actually helped me with a ****LOAD of combos today)

Very helpful post, glad someone's in favor of ftilt.
I'm just happy more Mario mains are showing up and helping keep this place alive.

I'll add this to the OP.

 

[Matt07]

Hmm I use ftilt as a 'gtfo' move. It has a little more range then Jab, and the knockback is okay. I know I basically repeated what others have said, but I don't really use ftilt that much , I'm more in the air then anything.

 

[:mad:]

Yeah, it's really not a great move. We do have dsmash, which is faster. Still, I only use it to refresh kill moves.

 

[Dory]

Ftilt is best when your back is to the opponent. I honestly use it a lot more than people are sounding like they do/dont? lol. I dont like using dsmash a lot in that situation cause it attacks first front of you and its weaker when it hit with the second part (behind you). Ftilt for quickness and cmon roundhouse kick to the face? lol

 

[:mad:]

Ftilt is best when your back is to the opponent. I honestly use it a lot more than people are sounding like they do/dont? lol. I dont like using dsmash a lot in that situation cause it attacks first front of you and its weaker when it hit with the second part (behind you). Ftilt for quickness and cmon roundhouse kick to the face? lol

Was that a serious response, lol?
Not sure if I should add it.

 

[Dory]

Was that a serious response, lol?
Not sure if I should add it.

Im not looking for that to be added if you dont want to. Im just giving my 2 cents on "ftilt".

 

[Matador]

I use this for low% combos, usually from Bair. It's a pretty average attack. Decent range, damage, and speed (in comparison to the rest of Mario's attacks, of course), basically used whenever you want your Dsmash and Fsmash fresh or Fsmash wouldn't be fast enough. Doesn't really have the knockback for gimp setups till KO percentages, so not much use there. The priority is also pretty much nonexistent, though it works wonders vs SideB/DownB spamming Sonics; it knocks them right out of the spin.

I haven't really found a purpose for angling it, but I hear that angled down shield pokes and trips at low %. No real followups, just a great poker and damage racker. It's generally just a 2nd-best option to everything.

Commonly used after: SHFF Bair, SHNair, punisher on shield when grab wont reach, hitting an opponent on the ledge.

 

[:mad:]

I use this for low% combos, usually from Bair. It's a pretty average attack. Decent range, damage, and speed (in comparison to the rest of Mario's attacks, of course), basically used whenever you want your Dsmash and Fsmash fresh or Fsmash wouldn't be fast enough. Doesn't really have the knockback for gimp setups till KO percentages, so not much use there. The priority is also pretty much nonexistent, though it works wonders vs SideB/DownB spamming Sonics; it knocks them right out of the spin.

I haven't really found a purpose for angling it, but I hear that angled down shield pokes and trips at low %. No real followups, just a great poker and damage racker. It's generally just a 2nd-best option to everything.

Commonly used after: SHFF Bair, SHNair, punisher on shield when grab wont reach, hitting an opponent on the ledge.

Excellent post, Matador. This opens up a few more options.

Oh, and that reminds me. Are you really busy nowadays? It's been fairly dead here day to day, not a lot of posting gets done.

 

[Matador]

Excellent post, Matador. This opens up a few more options.

Oh, and that reminds me. Are you really busy nowadays? It's been fairly dead here day to day, not a lot of posting gets done.

Yeah, actually. Started school awhile ago...then kinda got put out because of payment issues

I should be around here a little more now, but only at night. I'm busy during the day.

I think the inactivity is just a brawl thing. With SF4, TvC, and soon SC2... all of these other better competitive games out (better meaning not revolving around camping), people, myself included, have put Brawl in the backseat. The only reason I even play anymore is to represent Mario, and see what I can do in tourneys. I really haven't done all I can to this point, and I'd hate to waste the time I've put into this game.

Edit: Alot of people have dropped Mario too. Many for Luigi.

 

[:mad:]

Yeah, actually. Started school awhile ago...then kinda got put out because of payment issues

I should be around here a little more now, but only at night. I'm busy during the day.

I think the inactivity is just a brawl thing. With SF4, TvC, and soon SC2... all of these other better competitive games out (better meaning not revolving around camping), people, myself included, have put Brawl in the backseat. The only reason I even play anymore is to represent Mario, and see what I can do in tourneys. I really haven't done all I can to this point, and I'd hate to waste the time I've put into this game.

Edit: Alot of people have dropped Mario too. Many for Luigi.

Well that sucks.
I actually put Ness second after Mario, so it does no good to post here if it's dead. You really contribute to this place. A lot. D:

Well, if anything, pleaseeee don't give up on Brawl. I'm on the brink of going back to Melee if I can't use Mario. I used to be big on Halo, but really did quit just so I could represent Mario, Ness, Jigglypuff and Kirby.

I don't see why, though. Why not both?

 

[A2ZOMG]

I can't represent Mario anywhere except the AllisBrawl ladder 99% of the time. =(

I get really happy though when people leave me nice comments about my Mario. Even though comments like those can be found on almost any player LOL.

 

[Matador]

Well that sucks.
I actually put Ness second after Mario, so it does no good to post here if it's dead. You really contribute to this place. A lot. D:

Thanks

Well, if anything, pleaseeee don't give up on Brawl. I'm on the brink of going back to Melee if I can't use Mario. I used to be big on Halo, but really did quit just so I could represent Mario, Ness, Jigglypuff and Kirby.

I don't see why, though. Why not both?

Brawl really pales in comparison to these new games coming out. If Brawl's competitive scene weren't bigger than Melee's, I'd be playing that myself. This game just wasn't cut out to be competitive.

This game greatly rewards camping, is terribly unbalanced, and is victim to the most ridiculously "cheap" (for lack of a better word) strategies I've ever even heard of short of steroids. I just don't feel like playing a game that's constantly slapping me in the face with things like tripping, RCO lag, and grab release infinites. It stops being fun after some time.

Fortunately, Brawl doesn't require much practice, so I can still play this and SF4...but probably not for too much longer. I'll probably be about finished after Genesis.

 

[:mad:]

I can't represent Mario anywhere except the AllisBrawl ladder 99% of the time. =(

I get really happy though when people leave me nice comments about my Mario.

Well that sucks too.
Rep him well, at least. I manage to place in the top 5 these monthlies with only like, 36 people or something. Only Mario and Ness. (Lol)

And Matador, I see what you mean by that. I was honestly considering myself, but I really don't think I can part with the smash series. I can handle all of the other games and still play Brawl/Melee because I'm beyond devoted.

I can't say I'm not a little upset that people are starting to quit, but I really can't blame them, considering how bad this game is. Oh well. I'll eventually be the only Mario main some day, lol. You guys will be missed.

 

[vato_break]

ftilt isnt a good move,if all else fails use a reverse fair to catch them offgaurd

 

[Judge Judy]

I can't say I'm not a little upset that people are starting to quit, but I really can't blame them, considering how bad this game is. Oh well. I'll eventually be the only Mario main some day, lol. You guys will be missed.

I think someday ??????? will be the only Mario main left; he seems to always and never be around, if that makes any sense.

 

[:mad:]

ftilt isnt a good move,if all else fails use a reverse fair to catch them offgaurd

Pretty much a concise way of putting it, but it does have a few uses.
Particularly refreshing your other moves, lol.


And nah, Judge. It'll probably be me because I'm just that devoted. I still have fun playing as Mario, so I'll never quit.

Unless my current situation gets worse, and I'm forced to only play Falcos, Roberts, and Snakes. Then I go back to Melee.

 

[vato_break]

i think i would use a dtilt rather than ftilt its a betetr mindgame
mario=mindgame
trust me

 

[:mad:]

Dtilt? What? Mario has a down tilt? I never noticed.

 

[Matador]

I'd never use Dtilt offline. It's just too slow.

 

[DtJ XeroXen]

Er... I'm not quitting Brawl anytime soon, so I'll probably be here for a looooooong time.

 

[Kanzaki]

I like Mario's ftilt :[

 

[:mad:]

That cool.
I don't. It's really not that good.


And XeroXen, keep in mind. I'm on moreoften than any of you, lol. I'm one of the most active members on SWF, lol.

 

[Kanzaki]

That cool.
I don't. It's really not that good.


And XeroXen, keep in mind. I'm on moreoften than any of you, lol. I'm one of the most active members on SWF, lol.

[Join Date: Dec, 2008]

[Today's Date: Mar, 2009]

3 months old at most... and your post count is almost doubled mine... </inb4postwh0re>

 

[Noodlehead]

im sure everyone knows this but since no one mentioned it yet i will. mario has a ftilt lock but its pretty much useless because mario has the jab lock and the tilt lock only works until about 30%.

 

[:mad:]

I just know the right places to post. ;D
I have little to do nowadays, so if I'm not at work or running, I'm usually on here.

Yeah, but that's only good when playing against a wall, which there aren't many, besides Corneria's. But still, useful information nonetheless.

 

[DtJ XeroXen]

And XeroXen, keep in mind. I'm on moreoften than any of you, lol. I'm one of the most active members on SWF, lol.

That may be true, but my computer exploded back in December, and I get on Smash Boards twice daily for about an average of an hour or so(combining both sessions), I just don't post much, as it's pretty hard on my Wii.

Anyway, regardless of the fact tha you're around more, I'll still be around!

Quite honestly, if I had a computer... I'd probably be over 400 posts, since I really didn't start posting until about a month ago. (I just have had the account since August)

Anyway, Ftilt discussion is pretty bland, I think we're finished with it, really. We should really move on to Utilt tommorrow, instead of Thursday, unless anybody else disagrees?

Edit: Just look at these spelling errors, I don't feel like fixing them because my Wii takes like, a minute to get to those locations... I'm just lucky I have a USB Keyboard.

 

[:mad:]

That may be true, but my computer exploded back in December, and I get on Smash Boards twice daily for about an average of an hour or so(combining both sessions), I just don't post much, as it's pretty hard on my Wii.

Anyway, regardless of the fact tha you're around more, I'll still be around!

Quite honestly, if I had a computer... I'd probably be over 400 posts, since I really didn't start posting until about a month ago. (I just have had the account since August)

Anyway, Ftilt discussion is pretty bland, I think we're finished with it, really. We should really move on to Utilt tommorrow, instead of Thursday, unless anybody else disagrees?

And to be perfectly honest, I'd have over 2,300 posts if they counted User Blogs/Meet and Greet, lol. I'm at least glad I won't be the only one.

Yeah, I was using today as a day to post final thoughts, and tomorrow, utilt will begin. It'll last awhile, because there's plenty to say about it.

 

[hippiedude92]

My dtilt to a Fsmash kill is too epix. I need a vid up there lol.

 

[Judge Judy]

Utilt has good vertical range, juggles at low percents, and true combos into Up B. The only con with Utilt is its very low horizontal range.

 

[Matt07]

U-tilt is a good OOS option as well, although everytime I go to use usmash out of shield, I utilt instead >.>.

 

[DtJ XeroXen]

Utilt... USE IT!

It can lead to Uair chains, Up B, and y'know, anything else you feel like doing. Utilt is your friend, and it's pretty fast too.

And, since it seems we're skipping Dtilt entirely, I'll post my little tidbit.

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, DON'T USE DTILT!

(^Belongs on the OP)

I'll post a longer explanation of Utilt tommorrow, I have to go for now.

 

[:mad:]

Judge wins the award for best concise explanations.
Some of this stuff is a little small to add, but I'll go ahead and do that.

Fft, we aren't even doing dtilt. We'll finish that last.

 

[vato_break]

i lie to uptilt>jab lock too good ^_-

 

[A2ZOMG]

Mario's best damage dealer at low percents. It's an easy 25% on many characters (or even like 40% on fastfallers) by itself if you get it off at low percents (beware, at 0%, if your opponent is smart, they will shield the 2nd U-tilt, so instead of U-tilting there, do a D-throw to be safe).

U-tilt juggles set up perfectly into U-air juggles, and you can get off about 50% if you connect with a U-tilt juggle and two U-airs. The thing that is so great about U-tilt juggles is that even if you don't commit to just U-tilts, Mario is almost always able to mix up with something faster than his opponent can do other attacks.

U-tilt hits through BF platforms. U-tilt is good setup for jablocks on Luigi's Mansion. This move is the reason why characters need to be cautious of Mario at low percents, because one U-tilt at the right moment can carry them to 60% quickly.