A King's Quest For Respect: The Bowser Matchup Thread

[Miquel0123]

Can you comment on these vids?
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=10789777&postcount=651

yes, this pikachu only knows how to use chaingab. Finish.

edit: This pikachu don't knows how to use chaingrab.

 

[Flayl]

What isn't he doing that he could abuse more?

 

[Miquel0123]

chaingrab is up to 100% damage.



I will upload a set me pikachu vs marc bowser, and question it

Grewardz:
such a bad pikachu

 

[KillerJawz]

Flayl you're being trolled by europeans. Just let it slide until he can give a more detailed explanation on this match up.

 

[Miquel0123]

Flayl you're being trolled by europeans. Just let it slide until he can give a more detailed explanation on this match up.

europeans> this matchup

chaingrab= http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=he3l5X9wZf8

 

[KillerJawz]

I would believe you if I saw some videos. Also, after seeing this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSy7hZ3Xj4I

I really do want to see videos, rather then these statements with no visual evidence OR explanations to back them up.

 

[Miquel0123]

I would believe you if I saw some videos. Also, after seeing this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSy7hZ3Xj4I

I really do want to see videos, rather then these statements with no visual evidence OR explanation to back them up.

:3 i'ts my pool battle with kasper but i'm playing too bad XD

I uploaded this for memories of that tourney XD

PD: I was nervous and tired XD

PD: I will upload more replays :3

This **** is better but, anyone can **** me, i'm not too good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0XdgGmdaQQ

 

[Flayl]

chaingrab is up to 100% damage.



I will upload a set me pikachu vs marc bowser, and question it

Marcbri's Bowser? This will be fun to watch XD

KJ in case you forgot every party involved in this conversation is european

Miquel is also one of the best if not the best Pikachu in europe. I'll survive the ego if it means we can get useful info on the matchup.

 

[Miquel0123]

Marcbri's Bowser? This will be fun to watch XD

KJ in case you forgot every party involved in this conversation is european

Miquel is also one of the best if not the best Pikachu in europe. I'll survive the ego if it means we can get useful info on the matchup.

who is the best pika of europe????

Moko? Bking? -___-

explain it

PD: pika have walk chaingrab like ddd, but 0 to 40 and now dthrow buffer, you don't know it? XDDD

I'm saying 90-100% i don't have all information but, bowser vs pika spacing = (n) all bowser atacks are punishable with ftilt but bowser's fitlt can punish the most of all pikachu attacks.

Lol my english is too bad XD

you understand me? XD

If bowser wins a pika can be:

Pika is too bad

The bowser player knowns at the perfection his rival

mmm

nothing more

 

[KillerJawz]

KJ in case you forgot every party involved in this conversation is european

Oh I assure you, I havn't forgotten that, I just wanted my location to be concealed as of this moment. THANKS FOR THE BLOWN COVER MISEUR FLAYL ;___;.

who is the best pika of europe????

Moko? Bking? -___-

explain it

I don't doubt you're the best Pikachu in Europe, it's your Bowser knowledge I'm a tad concerned about.

 

[Flayl]

I thought the buffered Dthrow didn't work on Bowser.

KJ I doubt his english is good enough to draw that conclusion. He thought I was saying he wasn't the best Pikachu.

 

[Miquel0123]

i thought the buffered dthrow didn't work on bowser.

kj i doubt his english is good enough to draw that conclusion. He thought i was saying he wasn't the best pikachu.

xddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd

sure, i was confused. i only have 0 to 55% to nair and can combo dthrow to nair buffer up to 90%

i don't have chaingrab 0 to 100 XD

 

[Flayl]

This is the second of Pika's two most frequently used throws. Dthrow can start combos at low percentages, sending the opponent more or less directly above you (and slightly to the side depending on their DI), which allows you to utilt or uair them.

Dthrow is also imperative to Pika's grab game because it can chaingrab a large number of the cast. There are two types of CGs you can do with dthrow: buffered and unbuffered. For more information on buffering and the difference between these two types of CGing, see GRBG.

Buffered Dthrow CG Combos (Original Testing by Michael Hey, K Prime, The Truth!, RPK, & ESAM)
Diddy Kong: 0%-21% + regrab (fthrow > dthrow > grab)
Donkey Kong: 7%-26% + regrab (dthrow x2 > grab)
Falco: 0%-100% + regrab (fthrow x2 > dthrow x13 > grab)
Fox: 0%~100% + regrab (dthrow x14+ > grab)
Ike: 0%-62% + regrab (dthrow x9 > grab)
King Dedede: 0%-77% + regrab (fthrow x2 > pummel > dthrow x3 > pummel > dthrow x4 > grab)
Link: 0%-41% + regrab (dthrow x5 > grab)
Lucas: 5%-33% + regrab (dthrow x3 > grab)
Meta Knight: 0%-52% + regrab (dthrow x7 > grab)
Sheik: 0%-105% + regrab (fthrow x2 > dthrow x14 > grab)
Snake (ver. 1): 0%-83% + regrab (fthrow x2 > pummel > dthrow x3 > pummel > dthrow x5 > grab)
Snake (ver. 2): 10%-90% + regrab (fthrow > pummel > dthrow x10 > grab)
Snake (ver. 3): 0%-90% + regrab (fthrow to ledge > dthrow to 90% or below (must begin dthrow by 30%))
Squirtle: 3%-22% + regrab (dthrow x2 > grab)
Wolf (ver. 1): 0%-115% + regrab (dthrow x3 > pummel > dthrow x14 > grab)
Wolf (ver. 2): 0%-115% + regrab (dthrow x3 > fthrow > dthrowx13 > grab)

*Note: Not all of these CGs start with dthrow; however, they all center around buffering dthrow at some point.

Unbuffered Dthrow CG (Original Testing by Ruuku)
Captain Falcon: 0%-80%
Fox: 0%-70%
Sheik: 0%-60%
Wolf: 0%-30%

*Note: Sheik and Captain Falcon can DI towards you and footstool out of the unbuffered CG on the first throw, so this is not a true chaingrab on them. However, many opponents don't know this, so it's worth trying if you can get the grab. Otherwise, use the fthrow or buffered dthrow CG.

I'll do frame-by-frame testing tomorrow night.

 

[Miquel0123]

I'll do frame-by-frame testing tomorrow night.

take note of this combo

at 10% to wario.

2 dthrows buffer, 1 fthrow and usmash.

Pikachu not have chain to wario at 0% but yes at 10% XD

add this on these list

 

[Flayl]

take note of this combo

at 10% to wario.

2 dthrows buffer, 1 fthrow and usmash.

Pikachu not have chain to wario at 0% but yes at 10% XD

add this on these list

I'm only testing the Bowser one, ask somebody in the Pikachu boards to do Wario.

 

[KillerJawz]

KJ I doubt his english is good enough to draw that conclusion. He thought I was saying he wasn't the best Pikachu.

Ah okay, understood.

Once you get your findings back, we can compare them to Hoe4u's games with Ixis to determine what else could have been done in certain situations.

 

[Miquel0123]

I'm only testing the Bowser one, ask somebody in the Pikachu boards to do Wario.

i will upload pika vs bowser but this is more than 60:40 really

 

[KillerJawz]

Any idea when we can expect these videos?

Also are they tournament sets/friendlies/MMs?

 

[Flayl]

If it's marcbri's Bowser it's friendlies (he doesn't even use Bowser in low tier tournaments)

 

[Miquel0123]

If it's marcbri's Bowser it's friendlies (he doesn't even use Bowser in low tier tournaments)

just look XDDD

 

[Zigsta]

Pikachu's not a bad MU for Bowser for the same reason Peach isn't: Both can rack up damage quickly, but they have obvious KO moves, and Bowser lives forever.

Just don't be dumb and klaw hop into nair or upsmash. If Thunder hits, don't use an aerial afterwards, or you'll get KO'd off the top. And just know fsmash's range. If Pikachu goes for a falling fair, expect a KO move.

 

[Miquel0123]

Pikachu's not a bad MU for Bowser for the same reason Peach isn't: Both can rack up damage quickly, but they have obvious KO moves, and Bowser lives forever.

Just don't be dumb and klaw hop into nair or upsmash. If Thunder hits, don't use an aerial afterwards, or you'll get KO'd off the top. And just know fsmash's range. If Pikachu goes for a falling fair, expect a KO move.

Ok.

MM.

 

[Dumbfire]

Zigast gettin' those MM's like a man.

 

[Flayl]

Come October 30th I'm giving money away I'm playing a bunch of money matches, most of which with characters I never see.

I'm fighting a Captain Falcon, a Ganondorf, an Ike, a Marth, a Ness, an Olimar and a R.O.B.

I'm gonna train the only real way I can: watching vidoes and fiddling with stuff in training mode. Expect me to post here if I find anything interesting.

 

[Cassius.]

Zigsta, you MM ***** you.

Also, Flayl you shouldn't lose any of those matches except Olimar.

Make sure you're on your A game bby.

 

[Zigsta]

Ok.

MM.

Come to the US, and you've got yourself a deal.

 

[Dumbfire]

Come October 30th I'm giving money away I'm playing a bunch of money matches, most of which with characters I never see.

I'm fighting a Captain Falcon, a Ganondorf, an Ike, a Marth, a Ness, an Olimar and a R.O.B.

I'm gonna train the only real way I can: watching vidoes and fiddling with stuff in training mode. Expect me to post here if I find anything interesting.

Who is the Ganondorf?

 

[Flayl]

Foturan

10Ganondorfs

 

[Dumbfire]

Isnt it Foturan? I remember him ^^
He is pretty good, and he gave me some awesome music.
Tell him to get more active on Ganny boards ;p

 

[Flayl]

Pikachu's buffered DThrow chaingrab doesn't work on Bowser, he can jump out. I can upload a vid if anybody wants.

I'm going to test DThrow -> NAir

DThrow -> SH NAir works at 80% if Dthrow is completely stale (not a very realistic scenario). It doesn't work if it's completely fresh (more realistic but certainly not impossible for Pikachu to overcome)

A completely fresh DThrow -> NAir on Bowser stops working between 60% and 70%. I'm not going to do any more work, it's the Pikachu boards' job now.

 

[King Funk]

Come October 30th I'm giving money away I'm playing a bunch of money matches, most of which with characters I never see.

I'm fighting a Captain Falcon, a Ganondorf, an Ike, a Marth, a Ness, an Olimar and a R.O.B.

I'm gonna train the only real way I can: watching vidoes and fiddling with stuff in training mode. Expect me to post here if I find anything interesting.

Lionman, Foturan, Rydle, Borja, Marcbri's Ness, Greward and Robo_Luigi?

 

[Greward]

lol miquel's english is completely awesome

the pikachu of the vid completely sucked, but the bowser did play good

Miquel is a chaingrab lover so if u ask him something hell just say this:
pikach can chaingrab? yes->easy no->imposible matchup
but anyways pikachu outplays bowser.

for ROB i think hes playing NaZe, KF.

 

[Miquel0123]

i'm uploading a MM bo5 =D

 

[Flayl]

So let me see if I understand this. You did a Bo5 against a pro Falco player that plays Ness & Ike in low tiers.

Game 1 ends with Miquel winning JV 2 stock
Game 2 ends with Marcbri winning at 89%
Game 3 ends with Miquel winning 2 stock high %
Game 4 ends with Marcbri winning at 109%
Game 5 ends with Miquel winning what would be JV 2 stock

I don't know about you, but if this isn't evidence the matchup isn't that bad I don't know what is.

 

[Greward]

all of miquel's wins were 2 stock

also marcbri usually destroys miquel with most of the cast xD

 

[Flayl]

all of miquel's wins were 2 stock

No, two of them were (one of which would have been 1 stock but he got lucky)

also marcbri usually destroys miquel with most of the cast xD

that's not very helpful in establishing miquel's credibility as best european Pikachu...

edit: Let me be perfectly clear - when a character has 70:30 over another, he should lose AT MOST 1 match in a best of 5. 70:30 means there should be a technique that shuts down the other character's approach unless the player reads the other player better, or a combo that leaves the disadvantaged character in a bad position, etc.

70:30 is Marth VS Mario stuff.

 

[Marcbri]

Any match that involves me or greward against mikel should not be taken seriously xD.

although I'm pretty sure he's the best pika in eu, we just know him too much and a match-up shouldn't be judged by a match between us.

I dunno about Bowser vs pika, 6-4 seems abut fine to me, I could see Bowser's aerial mobility helps him a lot to avoid gimps, thunders and stuff, so it's not that bad if pika chaingrabs him out of the stage.
btw Mr.R lost to a mario so it has to be 6-4 xD

 

[Flayl]

Pikachu boards seems to be in agreement this is 40:60. However, I'm still interested in finding out what stages should be striked/banned and what their best options against firebreath are.

 

[Dumbfire]

Now that were talking about Pika's, I could get a set vs Pikaforlife in sometime, if he at least go's to the next tournament xD I dunno if he's any good tho.

 

[Greward]

miquel sucks, im the best pika in eu