Smash 3DS 3DS Japanese Release Build Demo Event Day II (Keep questions for AMA after event) [TY Zipzo's Wife]

[mario123007]

HYPE OVERLOADED

 

[Swedish_Otaku]

It's funny how nobody listens to the mods in here...

 

[ThePlacidPlatypus]

Yeah, I guess there's only so much you can do with differentiating Alph from Olimar - they're bound to have a similar, if not exact same, move set, so might as well have them within the same slot as alt costumes. Dark Pit would have really worked as one for Pit also but oh well, I guess he's easier to make into his own character by changing the weapons or whatever... Dr. Mario and Lucina I'm fine with though. Still I find there to be some inconsistencies. If Lucas ends up being an alt costume for Ness (which would be pretty unheard of haha), then I really wouldn't understand the logic.

I don't really see what you're getting at. Clones by definition have the same moveset. It's their stats that differentiate them. I really don't see any reason as to why Alph couldn't have been made a clone with some stat differences, but Lucina and Dark Pit can.

 

[Shariq]

When will Zipzo's AMA and livestream start?

 

[Spikeez]

JUST.
EPIC.

 

[Nu~]

Once again, the miis are demonstrated in away that makes them look top tier. Im telling u guys, miis are gonna be the underdogs. Top tier. Just watch

 

[mario123007]

I don't really see what you're getting at. Clones by definition have the same moveset. It's their stats that differentiate them. I really don't see any reason as to why Alph couldn't have been made a clone with some stat differences, but Lucina and Dark Pit can.

I think it makes sense.

 

[Staarih]

I don't really see what you're getting at. Clones by definition have the same moveset. It's their stats that differentiate them. I really don't see any reason as to why Alph couldn't have been made a clone with some stat differences, but Lucina and Dark Pit can.

Haha yeah, I don't really know what I'm getting at either. It does bother me a bit as to why Alph wasn't made into his own character while the others were, and I'm eager to hear why Sakurai chose to do this. But someone pointed out earlier the idea of Dr. Mario representing Melee Mario, Lucina representing Roy and Dark Pit representing Brawl Pit, which to me sounds... sort of logical? In this case, it would be as if Sakurai is trying to keep/bring back old, familiar aspects of the games we've missed before, yet still introducing something new. Depends on how the clones work in the end, of course. Though we'd still not have unique movesets of the likes of Mewtwo, Wolf and Snake I guess, unless they're in the game (or are to be at some point). Nahh, we'll see, I think I'm overthinking the decision of the clones haha!

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

On another note: That faker on Twitter? He was saying Sonic was nerfed, like "a combination of Brawl Sonic and Melee Kirby". Except that he then went on to list Sonic's Up Smash KOing at 130% (a major buff) and Sonic being able to UThrow > UAir > Up Special > UAir and KO at 100% (another major buff). I mean really, how do you fail that badly? (Oh, by the way, 130% seems to be a very respectable kill percentage in Smash 4, what with the distant blast lines and all.)

 

[Niala]

Guys he answered this question months ago when Lucina was revealed:

"However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!"

Clearly, Dr. Mario, Lucina, and Dark Pit all work in slightly different ways than the originals, and Alph does not.

 

[mario123007]

Haha yeah, I don't really know what I'm getting at either. It does bother me a bit as to why Alph wasn't made into his own character while the others were, and I'm eager to hear why Sakurai chose to do this. But someone pointed out earlier the idea of Dr. Mario representing Melee Mario, Lucina representing Roy and Dark Pit representing Brawl Pit, which to me sounds... sort of logical? In this case, it would be as if Sakurai is trying to keep/bring back old, familiar aspects of the games we've missed before, yet still introducing something new. Depends on how the clones work in the end, of course. Though we'd still not have unique movesets of the likes of Mewtwo, Wolf and Snake I guess, unless they're in the game (or are to be at some point). Nahh, we'll see, I think I'm overthinking the decision of the clones haha!

Yeah, but to some of the fans who want this game have of the best rosters ever. Clones are still a thing to argue.

 

[Frostwraith]

Haha yeah, I don't really know what I'm getting at either. It does bother me a bit as to why Alph wasn't made into his own character while the others were, and I'm eager to hear why Sakurai chose to do this. But someone pointed out earlier the idea of Dr. Mario representing Melee Mario, Lucina representing Roy and Dark Pit representing Brawl Pit, which to me sounds... sort of logical? In this case, it would be as if Sakurai is trying to keep/bring back old, familiar aspects of the games we've missed before, yet still introducing something new. Depends on how the clones work in the end, of course. Though we'd still not have unique movesets of the likes of Mewtwo, Wolf and Snake I guess, unless they're in the game (or are to be at some point). Nahh, we'll see, I think I'm overthinking the decision of the clones haha!

It's simple, actually.

Pit, Marth, Olimar and Mario originally were going to have alts to become Dark Pit, Lucina, Alph and Dr. Mario. Of these four characters, three of them ended up getting their own slots because the dev team had extra time and made some tweaks to them.

Sakurai's philosophy is that each different character regarding gameplay must have a slot, Dark Pit, Lucina and Dr. Mario got promoted as separate characters. Alph got no changes and plays identically to Olimar, so he shares the same slot and battle records with him.

In this logic, each slot is actually a gameplay style.

Alts or separate slots, Dr. Mario, Lucina, Dark Pit and Alph were planned to appear as playable characters.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

I will be streaming a live AMA in 20 minutes at 10:30AM EST time zone with RelaxAlax!

www.twitch.tv/zipzo62

 

[Niala]

I will be streaming a live AMA in 20 minutes at 10:30AM EST time zone with RelaxAlax!

And where will this be?

Thank you~

 

[ThePlayer77]

On another note: That faker on Twitter? He was saying Sonic was nerfed, like "a combination of Brawl Sonic and Melee Kirby". Except that he then went on to list Sonic's Up Smash KOing at 130% (a major buff) and Sonic being able to UThrow > UAir > Up Special > UAir and KO at 100% (another major buff). I mean really, how do you fail that badly? (Oh, by the way, 130% seems to be a very respectable kill percentage in Smash 4, what with the distant blast lines and all.)

Twitter player seems to hate Sonic with a passion.
Seems to have a ton of bias.

 

[Luis1234554321]

What is the color of robin's hair in his alt?

 

[Jonn]

Why is it so difficult for people to understand why Alph isn't his own character?

Alph represents the player in the Pikmin series, as does Olimar. Smash consists of characters derived from different games and expects to draw fans from those series. Given that Pikmin characters don't have unique attributes when played as, it wouldn't make sense to give them unique moves.

 

[ThePlacidPlatypus]

Haha yeah, I don't really know what I'm getting at either. It does bother me a bit as to why Alph wasn't made into his own character while the others were, and I'm eager to hear why Sakurai chose to do this. But someone pointed out earlier the idea of Dr. Mario representing Melee Mario, Lucina representing Roy and Dark Pit representing Brawl Pit, which to me sounds... sort of logical? In this case, it would be as if Sakurai is trying to keep/bring back old, familiar aspects of the games we've missed before, yet still introducing something new. Depends on how the clones work in the end, of course. Though we'd still not have unique movesets of the likes of Mewtwo, Wolf and Snake I guess, unless they're in the game (or are to be at some point). Nahh, we'll see, I think I'm overthinking the decision of the clones haha!

The thing is that Lucina isn't playing the role of Roy. She just seems to have a balanced sword, which isn't even something Roy had. It doesn't seem like she has any of the power/weight/speed changes that Roy did nor the flames. I also doubt that Dark Pit will end up adopting Brawl Pit's moveset, but that's yet to be seen.

It's simple, actually.

Pit, Marth, Olimar and Mario originally were going to have alts to become Dark Pit, Lucina, Alph and Dr. Mario. Of these four characters, three of them ended up getting their own slots because the dev team had extra time and made some tweaks to them.

Sakurai's philosophy is that each different character regarding gameplay must have a slot, Dark Pit, Lucina and Dr. Mario got promoted as separate characters. Alph got no changes and plays identically to Olimar, so he shares the same slot and battle records with him.

In this logic, each slot is actually a gameplay style.

Alts or separate slots, Dr. Mario, Lucina, Dark Pit and Alph were planned to appear as playable characters.

The question is, why didn't they give Alph some minor changes like they did for the others?

 

[Shariq]

Twitter player seems to hate Sonic with a passion.
Seems to have a ton of bias.

Yeah, I was reading some of his stuff and he seems to be saying the opposite of what most people are saying about Sonic.

 

[icecreamlights]

Ignore Me

 

[Staarih]

Clearly, Dr. Mario, Lucina, and Dark Pit all work in slightly different ways than the originals, and Alph does not.

Haha yeah, that is clearly the case, some people (myself included) just wonder as to why Alph didn't get any minor changes when all the others did, especially since he seems to now be the only actual alternate character (besides the Koopalings I guess if they end up being true). Though I guess Sakurai is the only one who can answer it. I don't mind the clones, I'm just interested in the decision process of them.

 

[Raijinken]

The thing is that Lucina isn't playing the role of Roy. She just seems to have a balanced sword, which isn't even something Roy had. It doesn't seem like she has any of the power/weight/speed changes that Roy did nor the flames. I also doubt that Dark Pit will end up adopting Brawl Pit's moveset, but that's yet to be seen.



The question is, why didn't they give Alph some minor changes like they did for the others?

Development time, lack of iconic value.

Or maybe I'm just Pikmin ignorant (quite likely), but my reaction to Alph is probably like many people's to Robin and Lucina. A flat "Who's that?" Except instead of following it up with "Oh, looks cool", I'd follow it up with "Oh, another character who just chucks pikmin."

 

[Frostwraith]

Yeah, but to some of the fans who want this game have of the best rosters ever. Clones are still a thing to argue.

Alts or not, Lucina, Dark Pit and Dr. Mario were meant to appear in playable roles.

Instead of having Lucina, Dark Pit and Dr. Mario playing identically as Marth, Pit and Mario, you have clones that add their own twists to already existing characters.

The question is, why didn't they give Alph some minor changes like they did for the others?

No one knows, but if I had to guess:

Dr. Mario - Melee veteran. Fills a certain niche to have a character more similar to pre-Brawl Mario, having the Tornado as the down special. Could also have his quirks from Melee regarding attack attributes.
Dark Pit - Popular character in Japan. Has potential to use a few different weapons from Kid Icarus: Uprising. His portrait actually suggests so.
Lucina - Popular character in Japan. Removing the tipper mechanic might result in interesting strategies.

I guess Alph could have his own twists too, but I'd say it was a matter of priority and the three characters above having more going to them regarding popularity and gameplay potential.

You could say the clones are a in-development version of this: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AscendedExtra

 

[Raijinken]

By the way Zip's stream is live.

 

[MrPanic]

Some characters got cut or cancelled during development. This caused some open spots on the planned roster. Nobody likes a css with room for more so they decided to fill it up with other characters. Because of time restrictions they needed to add more simple ways to develop characters, hence the choice of adding clones. They decided to add characters that already had alternate costumes for even more ease implementing them. Lucina, Docter and Pittoo got chosen as clones either by luck, to make the css look better or because they saw an interesting way to change up a character.

Here you go guys, a reasonable explanation. I can't believe some of you guys actually buy in to that 'this char got a spot because properties are different' excuse Sakurai came up with.

 

[Jesus castro]

>Expecting some Bowser news
>Zipzo says he didnt play with Bowser and Wii fit trainer.
>Immediate close stream

 

[SmashBro99]

By the way Zip's stream is live.

where?

nvm missed that post somehow

 

[wildvine47]

>Expecting some Bowser news
>Zipzo says he didnt play with Bowser and Wii fit trainer.
>Immediate close stream

Please leave 4chan

 

[HotelWaffle]

Is zip playing the game or is he watching trailers

 

[Baskerville]

Just trailers

 

[SmashGuides]

This mod's got style, so listen up dudes,
His pay can shrink in size, to suit his mood.
He's fat and lazy when he needs to be.
He can ban through the air if you disagree!
If you choose him, you'll choice will be flawed
With a hot pocket and doritos, he's one cheap mod!

UH

DK, DONKEY KO- oh wait.

 

[TheOthin]

So if Alph is in as a costume, why not others like Roy?

 

[Zaku]

So if Alph is in as a costume, why not others like Roy?

Because Roy's model is not the same as Marth's.

 

[Spikeez]

So if Alph is in as a costume, why not others like Roy?

Because Roy has slightly differences, such as fire effects in some of his attacks, Alph is technically the same as Olimar (Sorry if I said wrong).

 

[Moldy Clay]

Because Roy's model is not the same as Marth's.

I didn't know Iggy had the same model as Bowser Jr.

 

[Zaku]

I didn't know Iggy had the same model as Bowser Jr.

What I meant was that there is a notable size difference that would mess up hitboxes. Your Iggy-Bowser jr. example is not the same because despite the slight size differences between the koopa kids, the hitboxes would not be altered because they are all flying in the Koopa clown thing.

Roy is much shorter than Marth,so they would either have to make him taller, which would just look weird, or have them have different models, which falls under the "change that requires a different character" category.

 

[TheOthin]

Also, now that I think about it, there's ALREADY a Roy alt character costume.

Think the audience will chant "ROY'S OUR BOY!" for Roy Koopa?

 

[FallofBrawl]

I didn't know Iggy had the same model as Bowser Jr.

Umm I'm quite sure that the Koopa Kar is only possible to get hit, Bowser Jr. himself doesn't. And it's just easier to implement on resizing koopalings to all fit Bowser Jr. Size than to resize Marth and give him fire properties in his sword. Roy is way different than Marth but all the Koopalings have the same fighting style, their Koopa Klown Kar.
Woops Zaku went trough this already

 

[SpaceJell0]

Guys couldn't Alph have gotten Rock Pikmin to replace Purple Pikmin and have that be a cause for him to take his own slot? That's a way better reason than: "lol no tipper"

 

[Zaku]

Guys couldn't Alph have gotten Rock Pikmin to replace Purple Pikmin and have that be a cause for him to take his own slot? That's a way better reason than: "lol no tipper"

I don't see how that's better. All you are doing there is changing the look of one Pikmin.