Social Zelda Social - Still the queen of Smash...and maybe queen of low tier for a decade, too. Shall we make it two?

[~The Koopa King~]

man i can't remember the last time i even fought a zelda player online or used her myself(honestly i kinda gave up when she ended up seeming too difficult for me to comprehend winning with)

why is zelda so hard to bump into?

 

[EODM07]

How's it going prisoners of Gay Baby Jail?

So I made two people ragequit on me in Ultimate. One person did it twice in fact, or maybe three times.

One was using all three Miis and I beat all of them, he then went Dark Pit and was also using Side B when I was in shield, then he gave up when I was comboing him with Palutena and he gave up against my Wolf when I did a zero-to-death on him?, all I had to say was this: "Are you scared?"

Also, for some Duel Links nonsense, but then again who even cares about that game now other then myself here? :V

But Jack Atlas is now available to get, sadly just like everyone except Tetsu Trudge, his Ace Monster: Red Dragon Archfiend is locked behind a skill, so I'm guessing it'll be a UR from a Main BOX or Mini BOX; since that's one of two Synchro Dragons we don't have yet from BOXes. Black Rose Dragon and Red Dragon Archfiend.

I am curious if we'll get the Assault Mode versions of them yet. But on the plus side, Jack has a good skill in Beatdown.

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~

 

[~The Koopa King~]

it feels like I'm gonna vomit my guts out from stress every time i even play one match with zelda....even if i win a match i feel like complete garbage afterwards

none of the other characters i play present such a stressful scenario

 

[StoicPhantom]

It seems it didn't take as long to make it back up to where I was before in GSP, as I thought it would. It doesn't start slowing to a crawl until around 3.2 and then even going undefeated, still only had it going up a few thousand. I of course ran into a couple of laggy matches as per usual and tanked any gains, since reaching 3.2. It seems I'm going to be stuck here for a while, given I basically need to go undefeated for a few days in row to surpass this. The lag lottery will not permit that.

I also tried out Mii Brawler today and while I'm not very good with that character archetype, I still did way better than I should've and can confirm, it's pretty good. We can add a near Smash 4 Mario Up-Tilt to the list. Might stick with it more and see if I can optimize it's movelist even further.

I also got a patch notification for 2.0 next week. Not sure if I should be excited or worried. Hopefully they will be a little more detailed about what it actually changes than the previous ones. Guess I'll have to start saving replays.

man i can't remember the last time i even fought a zelda player online or used her myself(honestly i kinda gave up when she ended up seeming too difficult for me to comprehend winning with)

why is zelda so hard to bump into?

I think we are at the really high end or the really low end of GSP with not much middle ground.

it feels like I'm gonna vomit my guts out from stress every time i even play one match with zelda....even if i win a match i feel like complete garbage afterwards

none of the other characters i play present such a stressful scenario

Just be patient and read some of the more active threads here. They contain a lot of tips and tricks to make things easier.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

I can get behind this as I had the same feeling for a while. Still they are at least far more competent to land than in Brawl and especially Smash 4. However I think her Melee Kicks would be far more beneficial as they are more spacing/approach tools than a hard read punish option, also the ability to do two LK out of a SH needs to come back, it would be highly intuitive for a game like Ultimate. I mean we're have way there (less ending lag and slightly bigger sweetspot) but we may as well go all the way.

https://youtu.be/ZEb1W0KmwM4?t=9

 

[Eddie The Pacifist]

Finally, an anime I can get behind.

 

[Cenizas]

View attachment 188477Finally, an anime I can get behind.

@GingerGaymer

 

[Rickster]

man i can't remember the last time i even fought a zelda player online or used her myself(honestly i kinda gave up when she ended up seeming too difficult for me to comprehend winning with)

why is zelda so hard to bump into?

I feel like Zelda has a very...different playstyle compared to the rest of the cast that turns a lot of people off. Unlike most characters, you aren't gonna be spamming SH aerials. She plays a more grounded spacing game, but without the speed of Little Mac. Her aerials are very precise and must be used carefully, unlike someone like Sheik, Ike, etc. She also pushes the B button waaaay more than most other characters which is also a little weird

She's more popular than past games but still uncommon. The Phantom rework made her much more intuitive to use so that helps some. But I think her slight rise in popularity is mostly due to her cutesy makeover

 

[Ffamran]

I am completely and utterly baffled at what Square Enix decided to do with Kingdom Hearts III. So, it's been leaked right? It also doesn't have a simultaneous worldwide release, right? Well, to prevent all things being spoiled, they decided to hold the epilogue and secret movie until the game's released and patch them in after the game's out. Unfortunately, it's almost like a case-by-case basis or rather, because it was released in Japan first, on today, the epilogue ended up being patched in. Why the **** would you do this?

It's already stupid that a massive game like this wasn't given a simultaneous worldwide release. For some games, not having simultaneous worldwide releases are fine or a given like if a game's only being made for Germany for some reason. For other games, especially big, internationally popular titles like Kingdom Hearts, then it makes absolutely no sense for it not be to released on the same day for everyone. In this day and age, it's to be expected that people will upload videos of stuff regardless of whatever intent they have and can easily import the stupid game if they really, really want to play it that badly. I get that some things were out of their control like people stealing copies of the game or retailers breaking the street date and that leaks are leaks. Still, why? Just why. It'd suck for Japanese fans to have to wait until January 29 for the epilogue to be patched in which is not that long compared to some games having +3 month release date gaps between regions like Final Fantasy XIII and Lightning Returns, but it could have prevented the problem of the whole game being known through leaks and because the game was released earlier in a different region. The worst part is that Final Fantasy XV had a simultaneous worldwide release and yet for some dumbass reason, Kingdom Hearts III didn't.

Goddamn this game had such a cluster**** of a launch. I can't wait to see Kingdom Hearts III's secret movie on the front page of YouTube...

Speaking of patches, who's ready for the inevitable patch for our unexpected potted plant? Placebos will be everywhere as a bonus.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Got 7th out of 50 at our weekly. This is definitely progress, and I'm pretty sure I could've definitely make it farther...I'm not exaggerating that I thought I could make GFs, with a lot of gut.

S StoicPhantom

https://challonge.com/es/xorwyby3/standings

 

[Lil Puddin]

What is sounds like when my random ratchet Fairs/Bairs/Dairs keep hitting things:

For those curious which song Critikal meant to sing, it's the epic opera/diva song from The Fifth Element.

man i can't remember the last time i even fought a zelda player online or used her myself(honestly i kinda gave up when she ended up seeming too difficult for me to comprehend winning with)

She's the unicorn of Smash. If you play her correctly, you should be the most relaxed player in all of Smash. She's less about constantly acting and flying while throwing in 100-control-and-hand-breaking-inputs per second. She wants to stay on the ground as much as possible and then react from there.

Master her specials and the rest kinda just happens. Smash to kill. Dtilt/Jab/Uair to swat. Try to stay on the ground a lot.

Neutral B (Naryu's Love)
1) The reach is fairly short, basically the range of standard jabs (except it hits both sides).
2) Intangibility starts at frame 4 (fast!) and lasts until after the 1st hit.
3) It reflects stuff and protects her so it can be used for intangibility cheese or reflecting oooor pressure relieving.
4) Downside = if you miss they can ez punish you, if you hit them, you screw up their momentum ez. She kinda forces people to play at her speed.

Side B (Din's Fire/Flare)
1) Is as strong as it is bad to use, so yay/boo!
2) Do not spam this. Like. Ever. It's the easiest special move of hers to punish and there's very little reward for spamming it.
3) DO use it to harass those who are far away and stuck in the air, preferably off stage or up high. Zelda prefers to stay on/near the ground if she can.
4) Can be used in tandem with Phantom Knight walls if your opponent isn't heavy on the approaches or speed.

Up B (Farore's Wind)
1) Most versatile and furthest reaching teleport in the game.
2) The 2nd hit is tremendously powerful, allowing you to punish from afar and get KOs as early as 60%.
3) If used on the ground, the 1st hit combos into the 2nd hit regardless of a foe's %, unless they DI properly.
4) The 1st hit is relatively fast and she is intangible/invisible for the middle portion of the move.
5) The 2nd hit can come out instead of snapping to ledges when teleporting back to the stage, allowing for safer teleports to the ledge (hold UP shortly to pick the path, then quickly push DOWN so she teleports past the ledge; do this from below the stage so you can guage the distance better).

Down B (Phantom Knight)
1) DO spam this. It's her safest and spammiest special that can force opponents into making mistakes (which is what she's all about really).
2) It has multiple stages and very little delay, meaning the very act of charging it can be a bait move.
3) It can help break shields or trap opponents if they stay on the ground to block the hit.
4) The last 2 stages have 2 very different swipes with the large sword, overhead then down for 80% charge OR forward and upwards for 100% charge. Full charge takes 1.5 seconds.
5) When she is allowed to move, the Knight just sits there. She can make the Knight jump forward early if she hits Down B again. If she doesn't hit any buttons, it'll jet forward after a couple of seconds.
6) Since the range is fixed and she can force a delay, it is very hard for Zelda to get hit by her own Knight without Villager/Isabelle shenanigans. Just another reason why it's safe to spam.

why is zelda so hard to bump into?

People generally want easy to use characters, characters with good cheese, or characters who have safe spammy options.

So that's why she ain't all over the place despite being a magic kawaii waifu now.

Which is a blessing in disguise for a few reasons.

How's it going prisoners of Gay Baby Jail?

idk if I want to understand this reference.

View attachment 188477Finally, an anime I can get behind.

Communism is 100% OK if the guy who's trying to make it happen is a hot guy. It's the law to let hot guys do things like that.

 

[Deleted member]

I feel like Zelda has a very...different playstyle compared to the rest of the cast that turns a lot of people off. Unlike most characters, you aren't gonna be spamming SH aerials. She plays a more grounded spacing game, but without the speed of Little Mac. Her aerials are very precise and must be used carefully, unlike someone like Sheik, Ike, etc. She also pushes the B button waaaay more than most other characters which is also a little weird

She's more popular than past games but still uncommon. The Phantom rework made her much more intuitive to use so that helps some. But I think her slight rise in popularity is mostly due to her cutesy makeover

Phantom is what makes her fun to play imo. It rounds out her kit a lot more, giving her a very strong pressure option with tons of mindgames, and turning her into more of a strong set-ups/mindgames character with insane Edgeguard, as opposed to what she was: broken.

That said, I'd say she still needs some slight buffs. Nair needs better hitstun and hitboxes. USmash needs better hitboxes, it's a useless move. And she needs less recovery frames on Farore so she can act out of it faster. As it is, it's far too risky to use midstage unless your opponent is braindead, making it very situational. If not that, then please please PLEASE add more leniency on the Edge Cancel. It's far too strict, and I can't even begin to count the number of SDs I've had for just being a pixel off on the positioning for Edge Cancelling Farore. Seriously, if she slides off the ledge from Farore, she should be allowed to act out of it. Period. Especially when you consider that characters like Fox (one of the best in the game) have been buffed to be allowed to act out of Side B, giving him not only insane recovery, but also a solid error correct.

 

[EODM07]

idk if I want to understand this reference.

Spoiler: Indepth explanation

A Gay Baby Jail is when you in a situation where you are softlocked in the game with no way of escaping, mostly in Mario 64 ROM Hacks. Where if you get stuck in say a box, but you can't BLJ out of or even get a Star. Hench the term coined by one of SimpleFlips' viewers, Gay Baby Jail. The only way out would be by resetting.

Spoiler: Meme explanation

Press A to be gay today.

Anyway, what's happening slick moment fans?

I managed to get a really sweet zero-to-death against a Wolf on T&C as Palutena, all thanks to the T&C platforms too.

So here's how it went: Falling Back Air to then space myself and SH Nair to combo into a 2nd SH Nair. FH Fair onto the moving platform and then FSmash which killed Wolf at around 40%. It was amazing, thankfully I saved it and will upload it when I get the chance, maybe even see if I can get it onto a montage series.

Also, I've given another F2P Card Game a try, being Shadowverse. I'll see if I can stay F2P in that game and get Crystals from other means in Single Player or Practice Mode.

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~

 

[StoicPhantom]

Got 7th out of 50 at our weekly. This is definitely progress, and I'm pretty sure I could've definitely make it farther...I'm not exaggerating that I thought I could make GFs, with a lot of gut.

You were definitely close enough. Only a few games away, is pretty good. Out of curiosity, which characters did you lose to? And did you beat that Sheik player?

 

[Deleted member 189823]

You were definitely close enough. Only a few games away, is pretty good. Out of curiosity, which characters did you lose to? And did you beat that Sheik player?

Got sent to Losers early, WR2. Lost to a Ridley player, but I was honestly in a lead until I decided to somehow kill myself twice in the last game.

Got eliminated by a Toon Link. Idon't the matchup in itself was problematic, I just think this guy has a tendency to literally sit in shield with a bomb forever since Smash 4. He's not a bad player, but I definitely played really bad when I NEVER grabbed him and kept trying to approach from above with Nair. Next time, dude has to see you can't get away with that stuff like you did back then...

And no, this Sheik player didn't go.

 

[Ffamran]

BJN39 , according to Lavani , the hit angle for the loop hits of Falco's Nair was changed from the 367 autolink angle in 1.0.8 Smash 4 to the 366 one in Ultimate. It also has issues connecting like Ultimate Zelda's Nair. Other than the differences between how they move, I wonder if might be because of the knockback. Smash 4 Zelda's Nair had 75 set knockback for its loop hits while Falco's had 22 in 1.0.8 Smash 4; it was lower in launch Smash 4 at 15 and in Brawl at 10. In other words, the opponent is in hit stun longer for the loop hits of Zelda's compared to Falco's. No idea what the knockback on Falco's Nair is in Ultimate.

 

[EODM07]

How's it going Smash content fans?

So I had one zero-to-death happen with Palutena. And it got me hype.

Here you go guys, there was also a ragequit I managed to get as well.

I'm very proud of the Palutena clip, I sent it to Beefy Smash Doods to see if I can get it into one of their montages they're brining back.

Oh, and Pyrocynical has done a video on Smash Ultimate as well. So that's cool too.

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Image results <3

 

[Lil Puddin]

Good job sis.

Also wow, Inkling made 1st, that's 100% surprising especially since Inkling is such a bad character.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Good job sis.

Also wow, Inkling made 1st, that's 100% surprising especially since Inkling is such a bad character.

Too bad I didn't play him ),: (:<

 

[Biggamer10^Neo]

https://discord.gg/5Fpfg2u join this server if you use a waifu! Special emotes and roles

 

[Aussie1024]

Great job @Oz! I'm happy to hear about how well you performed, even if the result wasn't what you desired. I know you'll only use this experience for the better going forward.

 

[Dcas]

I also managed to get to 13 in a major here in my country with only zelda. Ive been maining her and ridley so far.

I can certainly say zelda is a good character (and excelent vs zoners) she only needs a couple of tweaks to be a great character:

-More running speed (most important): atm zelda is the 8th slowest character in the game. Right now i think that making her as fast as wolf /link/snake tier it would make wonders since we could punish way easier with the excelent kit zelda got.

-FTILT: the move is good atm but its very lagy. The hitbox wont connect smaller characters, if you angle it it loses even more of its hitbox. We either need more range so we can space it or reduced landing lag so we can throw it more often.

-Nayrus Love: right now is a great tool but to make it super viable we need it to have a bigger hitbox or make it so that it starts 3-6 frames sooner so it could be the go to OoS.

-Nair hitbox: right now the earlier part of the nair is in front of zelda, to make it a great tool for landing it should have either a bigger hitbox in front of zelda or less lag.

And to be honest the only one she REALLY needs is the running speed and if she gets even those minors adjustments i can see her being solid high tier.

 

[Gay Ginger]

I of course ran into a couple of laggy matches as per usual and tanked any gains, since reaching 3.2. It seems I'm going to be stuck here for a while, given I basically need to go undefeated for a few days in row to surpass this. The lag lottery will not permit that.

Gorl, I feel you.

I'm at 3.5, and it's the same. I win almost all of my matches and my GSP barely moves up. Then I come across one laggy player and it can legit plummet, and it takes quite a bit of time to get it back up. Today and yesterday I plummeted and managed to get it back up to where I was when I began before calling it quits, but I'm not making many gains.

On other news, the REmake of Resident Evil 2 is now out! I don't have a system to play it, but the guy I've recently started going on dates with (we've been on 3 so far) just downloaded it so we can play it together! I'm excited. Any other RE fans here?

-FTILT: the move is good atm

Gorl, no it's not.

 

[Buddhahobo]

They added Videl to DBZ Fighters, and she summons The Great Saiyaman to help her fight. She's not in her superhero outfit, but anything that can help erase the travesty that was DBZS Videl from my mind is amazing.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

I'm very proud of the Palutena clip, I sent it to Beefy Smash Doods to see if I can get it into one of their montages they're brining back.

I'm pretty interested. I have a few clips lying around. Do they have like a link, or something?

 

[EODM07]

I'm pretty interested. I have a few clips lying around. Do they have like a link, or something?

I have no idea who this Dcas guy is, they must be quite chill.

Also, since you asked, here's the video where they ask for Replays.

Anyway, what's going on DBFZ fans?

So the 2nd Season got unveiled, and while I was watching Top 8. Chris Sabat turned up while Sean Schmmel and Yipes were announcing the next match, and Chris just yelled in Vegeta's voice to Sean:

"HOW DARE YOU TURN UP TO THIS RIDICULOUS TOURNAMENT, WITHOUT INVITING ME!"

I haven't watched DBFZ in a few months, but it was kind of nice to watch it again. And speaking of ArcSys titles, we got a new trailer for BBTAG for anyone interested like myself, evmaxy54 and SBphiloz4 .

The trailer revealed that the game will be getting an Arcade release in Japan, so that's good along with several updates and fixes; at the end of the trailer, that were a voice that people heard and they believe it's Naoto Kurogane from Blazblue: Central Fiction.

And here were two changes people found in BBTAG AE's previews that ArcSys provided at an event:

- The HUD for the game is changed slightly around the timer, instead of being a black-ish blue, it's now a white fading to purple.
- One of Ragna's assists got changed as well, he lost one of his assists for his 6D from BBCS.

Spoiler: Ragna's 6D

Spoiler: BBTAG AE preview

Other then these, I'll be trying to work on more of my University stuff and see what I can write up for my Tutor Marked Assessment. Which is an Ethics Matrix with the following listed:

Value Dimensions | Values & Virtues | Actions | Consequences
Individual | | | Intended: Unintended:
Social
Economic
Ecological

I just gotta write up some stuff and note what each of these sections will contain. This will also added up to my word count too.

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~

 

[Eddie The Pacifist]

In relation to the Europe=Antarctica drama recently (Which is some of the funniest smash drama I’ve ever seen), someone drew every Smash character as a Penguin.
Link.

 

[StoicPhantom]

Got sent to Losers early, WR2. Lost to a Ridley player, but I was honestly in a lead until I decided to somehow kill myself twice in the last game.

Got eliminated by a Toon Link. Idon't the matchup in itself was problematic, I just think this guy has a tendency to literally sit in shield with a bomb forever since Smash 4. He's not a bad player, but I definitely played really bad when I NEVER grabbed him and kept trying to approach from above with Nair. Next time, dude has to see you can't get away with that stuff like you did back then...

And no, this Sheik player didn't go.

Yeah, multiple SDs tend to lose games lol. Haven't run into many TLs myself, mostly it's just the other Links. The rest in that picture you posted though, is pretty much all I ever run into.

Gorl, I feel you.

I'm at 3.5, and it's the same. I win almost all of my matches and my GSP barely moves up. Then I come across one laggy player and it can legit plummet, and it takes quite a bit of time to get it back up. Today and yesterday I plummeted and managed to get it back up to where I was when I began before calling it quits, but I'm not making many gains.

Indeed, it feels like Zelda's GSP is borked. Most of the other characters I've played so far, I have near or even above Zelda, despite doing worse, simply because they don't drop as hard and gain more per win. I played Marth earlier, after not touching him for a while and went from 1.8 to over 3.0 fairly quickly. I started losing more then, but it takes like 3-4 losses with other characters, to equal one of Zelda's and you can quickly make that back in one or two matches.

I got really lucky yesterday and didn't run into one laggy match and ended up breaking into the high 3.3 finally. Today was the usual fare though and spent my time making it back after falling.

Interestingly enough, I started fighting the 2.5 and quickly ended up facing the 3.1, even though my Marth was still around 1.8. I think there is another system besides GSP that determines match making. I notice this when I body people with Zelda, quit for the day and then start off with a different character the next. It seems I start off facing GSPs much higher than mine, with other characters. Even though my Ganon was around 3.1, I was fighting 3.3-3.4, so I'm assuming win ratio with other characters, plays a factor as well. It's just a shame that it doesn't seem to apply to Zelda, where I have an over 90% percent win ratio, and still get paired with those of a lower or equal GSP, despite destroying the few higher ones I get paired with.

 

[Lil Puddin]

So y'all gorls talking about GSP going down drastically, what do you mean? When I lose I still stay around 3.5m.

I wish it was easier to find Battle Arenas or create one that attracts people. Elite is just a cess pool of the same boring heauxes who either take things too seriously. Earlier I played vs a Sonic that went all tryhard on my (basically his B button was breaking). I was like "Gorl, ur already Sonic, y u tryin so hard lmao."

HUNTY U IS FITIN ZELDA
HUNTY NO CALM DOWN
JUST WALK UP 2 HER & HIT A UNTIL HER SHIELD BREAKS OR U HIT HER LMAO
WHAT R U DOIN W/ UR LIFE RIGHT NOW
IM CALLIN 911 4 CONTROLLER ABUSE

Anyway, yeah, Elite is super boring but also super easy to get into. It was a very bad idea on their part since the moment you're in Elite you gotta throw to leave to get some variety/fun fights. They should just keep GSP as a MU type of thing, but remove Elite QP and let us play vs the same people but with different characters.

In relation to the Europe=Antarctica drama recently (Which is some of the funniest smash drama I’ve ever seen), someone drew every Smash character as a Penguin.
Link.

https://imgur.com/a/TveGv2M for the full thing.

It's true art. It also doubles as a penguin mood board. I'm Mega Man Penguin atm.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Also, since you asked, here's the video where they ask for Replays.

thanks my guy

Now if only I could actually decide my Top 5 favourite Zelda replays. Any volunteer judges?

 

[McKnightlíght]

thanks my guy

Now if only I could actually decide my Top 5 favourite Zelda replays. Any volunteer judges?

I'm not doing anything so I could take a look.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

I'm not doing anything so I could take a look.

Thanks.

Prime candidates (Top 4):

Spoiler

 

[Cress!]

I was in an arena today and the host played Ike and DK. I won a game against him (as Wii Fit ofc) and I think after that he got salty or something because how dare someone beat him with this joke character. Anytime someone else joined the arena, he immediately kicked them out so that he could just 1v1 me until he won. I think by the 4th or 5th game he finally won (I was getting kinda bored and I let him live over 200% on one of his stocks but I also wanted to see how long this would go on for), and right after he won he kicked me out. Troo poetry.

 

[McKnightlíght]

Thanks.

Prime candidates (Top 4):

Spoiler

4, 5, 1, 2. imo

 

[Rickster]

I'm so conflicted on using arenas or quickplay. They both seem terrible in their own special ways lol

 

[Codebox]

man i can't remember the last time i even fought a zelda player online or used her myself(honestly i kinda gave up when she ended up seeming too difficult for me to comprehend winning with)

why is zelda so hard to bump into?

Other's have replied so I thought I'd add my two cents. Zelda's playstyle is far different that any character in Ultimate, she requires a style in which the player must slow down normally to gain the advantage in battle, which turns a lot of people away from her playstyle. Why use moves that require high punish rewards when you can spam aeriels for free? That being said I feel Zelda can be used in this game without feeling like a feeble ceramic. She's a lot like Mac in that she plays a lot heavily on the ground for spacing, but has situational aeriels (U-Air is probably the best it's ever been though, the same could apply to D-Air as well) There's also more reliance on B attacks (perferrably any special that's not Dins) than any other character.

Personally what I think would exemplify Zelda's utility and make her more popular (or at the very least more usable friendly) would be

-4 extra invincibility frames on Nayru's along with reduced ending lag (being shielded while the last hitbox is out) It's the best iteration of the move, but still needs more tweeks to work consistently as both OoS and up close.

-Since Zelda is currently the 8th slowest character getting her anywhere out of bottom 10 run speed would be a godsend. We're so close guys, yet still so far. All she needs is 11th fastest or more to make her tools more effective (I'd say at around 11-16, maybe 17, as I don't imagine Zelda is a speed god) she just needs to be fast enough for what she needs to do

-Fix her Nair, right now it has questionable uses and people fall out of the hits. I'm honestly debating if it's as bad as Melee Nair.. (The less I have to think about Zelda's Melee kit outside of LK's and D-Smash the better) #notmynair

-U-Smash when has this ever been good outside of a niche anti air punish? The only contender it has is its Brawl counterpart, tbh I appreciate the increased radius compared to previous iterations, but it needs to hit more above and she should always suck in opponents standing next to or crouching under her, those two changes would make it an effective punish move.

-Farore's Wind: Tbh the move is almost near perfected imo, all it needs is the PM shield/dodge cancel treatment and this move is set, just decrease the endlag. Ultimate in general did a good job at nearly perfecting her specials (maybe not Dins), they just need that extra shove to be perfect.

-Removing F-Tilt down angle whiffs and decreasing endlag altogether.

-Bring back Smash 4 D-tilt

Inescapable Jab.. Nuff said.

I know I just spent a lot about what she needs, but to end here, I think Zelda here is easily more adaptable than any other game in the series thus far, but she's still lacking as far as needing enough tools to catch the bigger appeal and her toolkit requires more slower pace and percision. At the very least it's less detrimental than previous installments. But I wouldn't call her terrible, Idk I have mixed feelings, but see more potential with her. I think her design more than anything just aided her userbase more than moveset utility. Not sure if other's would agree.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

*****, Zelda is perfect.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I have arrived to complain about legendary Azura in Aether Raids because I'm hard stuck in tier 19.

 

[Lil Puddin]

Other's have replied so I thought I'd add my two cents. Zelda's playstyle is far different that any character in Ultimate, she requires a style in which the player must slow down normally to gain the advantage in battle, which turns a lot of people away from her playstyle. Why use moves that require high punish rewards when you can spam aeriels for free? That being said I feel Zelda can be used in this game without feeling like a feeble ceramic. She's a lot like Mac in that she plays a lot heavily on the ground for spacing, but has situational aeriels (U-Air is probably the best it's ever been though, the same could apply to D-Air as well) There's also more reliance on B attacks (perferrably any special that's not Dins) than any other character.

Personally what I think would exemplify Zelda's utility and make her more popular (or at the very least more usable friendly) would be

-4 extra invincibility frames on Nayru's along with reduced ending lag (being shielded while the last hitbox is out) It's the best iteration of the move, but still needs more tweeks to work consistently as both OoS and up close.

-Since Zelda is currently the 8th slowest character getting her anywhere out of bottom 10 run speed would be a godsend. We're so close guys, yet still so far. All she needs is 11th fastest or more to make her tools more effective (I'd say at around 11-16, maybe 17, as I don't imagine Zelda is a speed god) she just needs to be fast enough for what she needs to do

-Fix her Nair, right now it has questionable uses and people fall out of the hits. I'm honestly debating if it's as bad as Melee Nair.. (The less I have to think about Zelda's Melee kit outside of LK's and D-Smash the better) #notmynair

-U-Smash when has this ever been good outside of a niche anti air punish? The only contender it has is its Brawl counterpart, tbh I appreciate the increased radius compared to previous iterations, but it needs to hit more above and she should always suck in opponents standing next to or crouching under her, those two changes would make it an effective punish move.

-Farore's Wind: Tbh the move is almost near perfected imo, all it needs is the PM shield/dodge cancel treatment and this move is set, just decrease the endlag. Ultimate in general did a good job at nearly perfecting her specials (maybe not Dins), they just need that extra shove to be perfect.

-Removing F-Tilt down angle whiffs and decreasing endlag altogether.

-Bring back Smash 4 D-tilt

Inescapable Jab.. Nuff said.

I know I just spent a lot about what she needs, but to end here, I think Zelda here is easily more adaptable than any other game in the series thus far, but she's still lacking as far as needing enough tools to catch the bigger appeal and her toolkit requires more slower pace and percision. At the very least it's less detrimental than previous installments. But I wouldn't call her terrible, Idk I have mixed feelings, but see more potential with her. I think her design more than anything just aided her userbase more than moveset utility. Not sure if other's would agree.

For my changes...

Walk speed - 0.9
Run speed - 1.49

Sliiiiiiiiiiightly slower walk, faster run. Giving her easier control over her ground game and spacing. Since she is a ground character... For some reason.

Vacuum hits for Fsmash, Usmash, Naryu, Nair and make the multi-hits as big as the final hit. Once they're hit, they'll stay in until the final hit. Simplify the hitboxes to be in line with other moves (so none of this "airborne only" or "ground only" hitbox nonsense, which in turn makes Nair better). Usmash has invisible 3 tiny hitboxes under the main one, 1 below the Usmash hitbox and 2 right next to it allowing it to KINDA catch people on the sides if they are right up on her. Frame data stays the same otherwise.

Frame 8 standing grab, frame 10 dash grab, frame 9 pivot grab.

Lower landing lag of Fair to 21 frames, cut 2 frames of end frames in the air. Make Bair the same. Strengthen sourspot KB

Make Uair startup 2 frames faster.

Sm4sh Dtilt with more protection for the foot. Sm4sh Ftilt startup with more protection for the arm.

Make Utilt 35% swipe faster, but allow the magic sparkles to linger once they are placed. Basically making it like a grounded version of Peach's Uair. Make the tip hitbox +0.2 bigger too. Increase base KB so it doesn't combo easily into itself, making it a better anti-air move, but less KB growth. Being hit with the hand deals 3% damage and holds them in place with hitstun so they can get hit by the lingering part next.

All magic covered limbs for ground attacks are intangible. So her grab and jab have safe hands. Her Ftilt, Fsmash, Utilt, Usmash have safe hands and forearms. Her Dsmash/Dtilt only have safe feet. For aerials, only her Uair hands are safe and her Fair/Bair feet are safe.

Rework Din's Fire to have a 2nd way of using it. If she lets go within the 0.5 seconds of controlling Din, it flies horizontally from the position it's left at for another 2.5 seconds. It explodes only on impact and can be reflected back to Zelda (the same way her Phantom is, so no range reset) since she gave up controlling it. The KB is similar to her lvl1 charge sourspot and only deals around 5.5% damage fresh, so it's more for poking and baits.

I have arrived to complain about legendary Azura in Aether Raids because I'm hard stuck in tier 19.

HunTy, Aether Raids is a garbage mode. Just stay stuck in 19 and be thankful ranks carry over unlike Arena lmao.