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Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

Y2Kay

Y2Kay

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Furret said:
not shocked about that, but who voted for pika clone?
Click to expand...
nobody

Pikachu Libre is kinda cool, but I think it's dome for a game to have clones with such a small roster. Shadow Mewtwo get's a pass obviously.

Have you seen his burst attack? It's so over the top, it's glorious.

:150:
 
FullMoon

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Okay I have a somewhat decent grasp on Pokkén now, Lucario is fun to play, not that I have played anyone else yet.

If any of you gorls want to play with me, I'll be up for it. At least in this game it probably won't lag horribly lol
 
BJN39

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Patch 1.1.0:
- [wip, adding]

What does it mean?: Jab got a damage increase, going from 6% damage, to 8% damage. (2% increase) This means that combos starting with Jab will do 2% more damage. An increase in damage also increases the hit-stun caused by a move, so the hit-stun from the final hit would be very slightly increased.

the KB stat changes increase the initial KB of the final hit, and reduce the KB scaling with damage. More base KB can increase the hit-stun of a move, so the base KB increase should yield a very slight hit-stun increase. The growth reduction offsets the increase in damage, as increasing the damage increases the KB growth in its own way.

The numerous changes to size, bone, angle, weighted-KB, and x/y/z-position appear confusing, but yield an important result. First, all two of the three hit-boxes on her Jab used to be connected directly to her arm. Now, these hit-boxes are not, and instead float in place. The x/y/z-position changes make it so that these hitboxes float in almost the same place as where they were attached to her arm, only slightly lower. The sizes of these two inner hit-boxes were increased on all hits.

The result is that now, these hit-boxes are large and low enough to reliably connect with any standing opponent, when originally, these hit-boxes easily whiffed on many short characters, regardless of whether they were crouching or not. The alterations to the weighted (set) KB and the angles are extremely important in making the move connect correctly, instead of dropping opponents. The inward-upward angles bring opponents in until the last hit.

Because the angles are upward, they actually improve the move's ability for consistent followups. Sakurai angles work oddly in that, on grounded opponents, they can send at straight horizontal angles, but on airborne opponents, they send at 45 degree angles. Originally, grounded targets weren't lifted off the ground by the predominant Sakurai angle hit-boxes, and slid farther away. The 45 degree angle is far more conducive to followups for Zelda's Jab, and the new upward-inward angles raise opponents off the ground, and are more predominant. So at any non-point-blank range, (Due to the innermost hit-box still being a Sakurai angle) the move received improved combo-ability.

Patch 1.1.5:
- loop hitboxes damage 2.5 -> 3.0
final hitboxes:
- damage 3.0 -> 5.0
- bkb 35 -> 40
- kbg 130 -> 95

What does it mean?: Jab went from doing 8% damage to doing 11% damage. (3% increase) This is a decent damage increase. As a result combos starting with Jab will do 3% more damage. An increase in damage causes an increase in hit-stun, so the final hit should induce slightly more hit-stun. In addition, the damage on the final hit was increased enough to yield one more frame of shield stun, so the move is 1 frame safer on shield, going from -5/+2 (OoS/shield drop responses) to -4/+3 on block.

The changes to the final hit's base KB and KB growth give it slightly higher initial KB, and cause the KB to scale slower with increasing damage. More base KB can increase the amount of hit-stun, so the increase should give the final hit a tiny bit more hit-stun. The decrease in KB growth was likely to counterbalance the damage increase, as increased damage also increases KB growth in its own way.

A little taste of something you'll soon be able to find in the fairy fountain data thread ~ Patch and "What does it mean?" spoilers for every move.

Because honestly raw changelists for smash can be confusing af for the common player/user. People may not realize everything entailed by one change.

Which is why raw damage increases can be very versatile buffs, because they can affect hit-stun/block advantage/KO percents aside from the obvious and simple "more damage when you land it."
 
Last edited:
Kofu

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BJN39 said:
Patch 1.1.0:
- [wip, adding]

What does it mean?: Jab got a damage increase, going from 6% damage, to 8% damage. (2% increase) This means that combos starting with Jab will do 2% more damage. An increase in damage also increases the hit-stun caused by a move, so the hit-stun from the final hit would be very slightly increased.

the KB stat changes increase the initial KB of the final hit, and reduce the KB scaling with damage. More base KB can increase the hit-stun of a move, so the base KB increase should yield a very slight hit-stun increase. The growth reduction offsets the increase in damage, as increasing the damage increases the KB growth in its own way.

The numerous changes to size, bone, angle, weighted-KB, and x/y/z-position appear confusing, but yield an important result. First, all two of the three hit-boxes on her Jab used to be connected directly to her arm. Now, these hit-boxes are not, and instead float in place. The x/y/z-position changes make it so that these hitboxes float in almost the same place as where they were attached to her arm, only slightly lower. The sizes of these two inner hit-boxes were increased on all hits.

The result is that now, these hit-boxes are large and low enough to reliably connect with any standing opponent, when originally, these hit-boxes easily whiffed on many short characters, regardless of whether they were crouching or not. The alterations to the weighted (set) KB and the angles are extremely important in making the move connect correctly, instead of dropping opponents. The inward-upward angles bring opponents in until the last hit.

Because the angles are upward, they actually improve the move's ability for consistent followups. Sakurai angles work oddly in that, on grounded opponents, they can send at straight horizontal angles, but on airborne opponents, they send at 45 degree angles. Originally, grounded targets weren't lifted off the ground by the predominant Sakurai angle hit-boxes, and slid farther away. The 45 degree angle is far more conducive to followups for Zelda's Jab, and the new upward-inward angles raise opponents off the ground, and are more predominant. So at any non-point-blank range, (Due to the innermost hit-box still being a Sakurai angle) the move received improved combo-ability.

Patch 1.1.5:
- loop hitboxes damage 2.5 -> 3.0
final hitboxes:
- damage 3.0 -> 5.0
- bkb 35 -> 40
- kbg 130 -> 95

What does it mean?: Jab went from doing 8% damage to doing 11% damage. (3% increase) This is a decent damage increase. As a result combos starting with Jab will do 3% more damage. An increase in damage causes an increase in hit-stun, so the final hit should induce slightly more hit-stun. In addition, the damage on the final hit was increased enough to yield one more frame of shield stun, so the move is 1 frame safer on shield, going from -5/+2 (OoS/shield drop responses) to -4/+3 on block.

The changes to the final hit's base KB and KB growth give it slightly higher initial KB, and cause the KB to scale slower with increasing damage. More base KB can increase the amount of hit-stun, so the increase should give the final hit a tiny bit more hit-stun. The decrease in KB growth was likely to counterbalance the damage increase, as increased damage also increases KB growth in its own way.

A little taste of something you'll soon be able to find in the fairy fountain data thread ~ Patch and "What does it mean?" spoilers for every move.

Because honestly raw changelists for smash can be confusing af for the common player/user. People may not realize everything entailed by one change.

Which is why raw damage increases can be very versatile buffs, because they can affect hit-stun/block advantage/KO percents aside from the obvious and simple "more damage when you land it."
Click to expand...
Wait, Zelda's jab only did 6% at release?

Sometimes I wonder if they were thinking when they programmed some of the release characters. Game & Watch's only disfunctional moves on release were DTilt (rectified by giving it more knockback) and UTilt (which is still bad). FAir is arguable given that it's often punishable on hit until mid/mid-high percents but it does become good after a point.
 
BJN39

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Kofu said:
Wait, Zelda's jab only did 6% at release?
Click to expand...
It did 6% since Melee.

That said I was thinking the upgrade to 8% was pretty alright. Brining it up again was just hilarious.

You can literally Jab > Grab Fthrow for 23%.

I think Sheik's Fthrow to quadruple FAir does that much...? :secretkpop:
 
Last edited:
Kofu

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BJN39 said:
It did 6% since Melee.

That said I was thinking the upgrade to 8% was pretty alright. Brining it up again was just hilarious.

You can literally Jab > Grab Fthrow for 23%.

I think Sheik's Fthrow to quadruple FAir does that much...? :secretkpop:
Click to expand...
That's odd that it did 6% for so long but at least it made sense unlike completely destroying Marth's damage output.

Speaking of Sheik's FAir, it did more damage than Shulk's at release. That's pretty screwed up. Shulk's hard to balance because of the Monado but even Buster can't save a 5% (IIRC) base move.
 
BJN39

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Talking about pre-patch thing is fun,


Like remember how half of Rosalina's moveset used to have bigger hitboxes and NAir/Usmash were kill moves? :^)
 
Kofu

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BJN39 said:
Talking about pre-patch thing is fun,


Like remember how half of Rosalina's moveset used to have bigger hitboxes and NAir/Usmash were kill moves? :^)
Click to expand...
It'd be interesting though a little time-consuming to compare each patch change for all characters.

I didn't remember NAir being a kill move but the hitbox used to be much larger (or something, it was totally restructured that first patch). FThrow and BThrow used to kill for her though.
 
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Rickster

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Remember when Phantom only took 6 seconds to respawn instead of 9? :secretkpop:

Seriously though the patches have been a blessing for this game as a whole. And to think Sakurai said during pre-release that there would be no balance changes.
 
wedl!!

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idk what i miss about prepatch stuff other than like... release diddy or peach's weird turnip cancel stuff

probably bc i was always having a main crisis before all this sweet dlc came out

(im so sleepy but i want to watch cartoons, what do i do)
 
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Kofu

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Lavani said:
Mewtwo's moveset on G&W crashed my 3DS :drsad:
Click to expand...
I cackled when I read this tbh. Maybe try Little Mac on Game & Watch then.

I'm assuming Mewtwo has a bone ID for his tail and not many other characters have that so I'm assuming that's why it crashed. Try it on Charizard if you want (though IDK what the wings would do).

Basically Game & Watch looks really creepy with any kind of fluid movement. Assuming he's programmed the same as in past games, he actually has a 3D model that's just compressed like other characters' are on Flat Zone.
 
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|ven|

|ven|

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Grimes_ said:
YASSSS!!

Charlotte is also super amazing <3

83% crits bby
Click to expand...
I tried to make charlotte cute so I changed her to hero and she lost her crit rate. And I dislike my new file because many of my main units are ranged base and kinda weak x.x
 
|ven|

|ven|

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Rickster said:
I'm playing Nohr but I'm only on Chapter 11.
I don't think I've given my castle a proper name yet either lol.
Click to expand...
That's fine :p if you need to borrow one of my units let me know and I can make my castle easily beatable.
 
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