Worthy of Bottom Tier?

[Chip.]

Pichu sucks >_>

 

[Deleted member]

In no way I disagree Pichu is crap. I'm merely arguing for either top of the bottom tier, or bottom of the low tier. ><

Explain what you mean by "really laggy". If somehow this is outside of the Dash attack, Down-B, and Forward-B, then it's probably lag common to other characters quite seriously which can be punished likewise across the world of Smash. Unless somehow my eyes deceive me, his aerial attacks overall start up faster than those of other characters, and can be L-canceled like any other (except for 3 of G&W's). The way I see it, his most important attacks are pretty reasonable in terms of lag. None of his other A-button attacks have any more lag that's going to kill you, except for the Dash attack really. High movement speed is a key factor in reducing any such lag that might exist, which is particularly important for Captain Falcon. I don't get your point with lag at all. If you somehow don't agree that Kirby and Mewtwo have waaaaaay worse lag problems than Pichu, I'm going to need an explanation here.

Range and weight are pretty much agreed upon. Strength? Dude, that's Mario's problem. Mario has only like one kill move out of many moves with average to below average knockback. Nobody has less strength than Mario, and this certainly applies to Pichu, who has significantly more killing options than him. Pichu's Smash attacks especially have great knockback, and his aerials are more or less average in knockback. Strength is not an argument I believe should be used as "OMG PICHU IS TEH WORST"



Movement speed is a big factor in being fast. Captain Falcon has a lot of moves that can be considered laggy, but he reduces noticeable lag tremendously by linking it in with mindgames that take advantage of his great movement speed. What is your point again?

Again, it's all about me believing him to be top of the bottom tier, or bottom of the low tier (basically, 3rd worst, as opposed to 2nd or 1st worst character in the game, I mean your point is he's the worst character eh?). I find no better source to learn otherwise than a top Pichu player. I'll appreciate any time you put to the reply. =P

A top pichu player isnt here right now, and neither are any other pichu players, so ill respond, though u dont have to agree. Ok for laggy, i wouldnt say pichu has much lag. He is probably average in that area, maybe a little better than most, but with l cancels, the difference is pretty miniscule w/ aeriels. Now for ground attacks, he has laggy fsmash and dsmash IMO. So thats lag.
Strength...lol, his strength is pathetic. Kill move... fsmash works sometimes, but it is hard to hit with it and it can be DId out of. Dsmash can work, but usmash has pathetic range, and can usually only hit in a combo or as an edgeguard. K movement speed. He is pretty fast, but he looks much faster than he is IMO due to his small size, so it looks like he is gooing faster. His speed is pretty good IMO.

Ok so summery. IMO pichu is the second worst character, to mewtwo, because, though the point can be argued, Mewtwo really has some disadvantages. Like combining Bowser with jiggly, in a bad way. Pichu is let down mainly by his lack of range, weight, and kill moves. Lets compare Pichu to ness, since u want pichu to be higher than him. I dont think it needs explaination that ness is much better. NEss has combos, strength, DJC, and aeriel maneuverability. Pichu has speed and...


I cant think of anything else, i hope this helps u guys, but take my wisdom lightly, as i am not the most knowledgable smasher.

 

[Chained Up]

+

LOL

what a joke

Young Link and Link are leagues better than Bowser and Gaw.
no arguments? kthx

Leagues? I might agree with the Bowser part but G&W Young Link and Link leagues better? Hell no. Maybe a bit better but not even a slightly decent amount. I might be bias but still, there is no way in hell Young Link or Link is "leagues" better. Period

Pichu sucks >_>

Best post in this thread ever.

 

[Chip.]

+ Leagues? I might agree with the Bowser part but G&W Young Link and Link leagues better? Hell no. Maybe a bit better but not even a slightly decent amount. I might be bias but still, there is no way in hell Young Link or Link is "leagues" better. Period

Gaw is a horrible charachter >_>
young Link and Link are bad charachters, NOT horrendous and basically unplayable charachter like Bowser and Gaw.
Not like this is going to be an arguement or anything but at least both Links have workable sheilds, can actually dish out some-what "effective" combos, and can ACTUALLY L-cancel their arials -_-
That's what I mean by "leagues" better; charachters like Link and young Link are bad but aren't garbage crap like bottom tier.

Best post in this thread ever.

thx =) 10 char

 

[BentoBox]

You people care wayyy too much about tiers, imo.

 

[Chip.]

Competitive play is based around tiers >_>

 

[Chained Up]

Gaw is a horrible charachter >_>
young Link and Link are bad charachters, NOT horrendous and basically unplayable charachter like Bowser and Gaw.
Not like this is going to be an arguement or anything but at least both Links have workable sheilds, can actually dish out some-what "effective" combos, and can ACTUALLY L-cancel their arials -_-
That's what I mean by "leagues" better; charachters like Link and young Link are bad but aren't garbage crap like bottom tier.
Game and Watch doesn't need to L-Cancel his nair, his fair is able to be l-canceled, his dair can be l-cancelled, his u-air isn't used for squat, leaving just his bair; so yeah not that big of a deal. Heh, for the combos one you got me there. But Game and Watch has incredible finishers all of which are disjointed hit boxes, so yeah. Shield: yeah it does suck pretty bad but his wavedashing can remedy this a bit. As for Bowser, I wouldn't know how he plays but his aerials are all abled to be L-canceled, he has a pretty good edgeguard, living till high percentages with proper DI also sounds pretty good, and having nice as hell ko potential is probably good enough for some people. Having a 4 frame start up move that ko's at somewher near 110% with beautiful priority is definitely cool. Just to know have you played either G&W or Bowser? Cause I've played as Link before and know about his moves and crap.

 

[Deleted member]

People shut up! Link, YL, Bowser, G&W, Yoshi, they are all crap characters, accept that, and play who u want. Seriously, argue somewhere else. But pichu sux more than all of them

 

[Chip.]

Game and Watch doesn't need to L-Cancel his nair, his fair is able to be l-canceled, his dair can be l-cancelled, his u-air isn't used for squat, leaving just his bair; so yeah not that big of a deal. Heh, for the combos one you got me there. But Game and Watch has incredible finishers all of which are disjointed hit boxes, so yeah. Shield: yeah it does suck pretty bad but his wavedashing can remedy this a bit. As for Bowser, I wouldn't know how he plays but his aerials are all abled to be L-canceled, he has a pretty good edgeguard, living till high percentages with proper DI also sounds pretty good, and having nice as hell ko potential is probably good enough for some people. Having a 4 frame start up move that ko's at somewher near 110% with beautiful priority is definitely cool. Just to know have you played either G&W or Bowser? Cause I've played as Link before and know about his moves and crap.

Again this isn't to be an arguement; which means we shouldn't discuss why so-and-so isn't that much better than so-and-so because of this-and that moves. The fact is that Bottom tier means BOTTOM tier; A.K.A complete garbage charachters. Young Link and Link are not that good of charachters either and are bad which is WHY they are low tier but HIGHER than bottom tier. That is what I meant by my statement of "leagues better". I'm sorry if you took offense to my comment, but that's just how I see it IMHO.

I don't need to play Gaw and Bowser to know that they are crap, all you do is just examine the tier list. I've played with Gimpyfish's Bowser and albeit a penomonal Bowser, Bowser is still a horrible charachter based off the tier list. The Tier list basically states what charachters do best in the overall Smash Comunnity and is based off of Tournament performance + Charachter matchups = The Charachter's overall potential in the Smash Community (a.k.a The Charachter's Metagame).

 

[Deleted member]

Again this isn't to be an arguement; which means we shouldn't discuss why so-and-so isn't that much better than so-and-so because of this-and that moves. The fact is that Bottom tier means BOTTOM tier; A.K.A complete garbage charachters. Young Link and Link are not that good of charachters either and are bad which is WHY they are low tier but HIGHER than bottom tier. That is what I meant by my statement of "leagues better". I'm sorry if you took offense to my comment, but that's just how I see it IMHO.

I don't need to play Gaw and Bowser to know that they are crap, all you do is just examine the tier list. I've played with Gimpyfish's Bowser and albeit a penomonal Bowser, Bowser is still a horrible charachter based off the tier list. The Tier list basically states what charachters do best in the overall Smash Comunnity and is based off of Tournament performance + Charachter matchups = The Charachter's overall potential in the Smash Community (a.k.a The Charachter's Metagame).

I dont think u should always completely agree with the tier list. U can, but u dont have to. I meant was, argue about it somewhere else.

 

[Chip.]

You should completely agree with the tier list.


Pichu sucks and Fox is good.


That's all I'm going to say.

 

[BentoBox]

Competitive play is based around tiers >_>

No, tiers are based around competitive play. Tiers don't force you to choose a certain character. Who gives a crap if Pichu is top or low tier, if you enjoy playing the character, that's all that counts. Ppl should stop acting and thinking like tools. Everyone would be playing Fox if tiers mattered that much.

 

[BentoBox]

sry 2x post.

 

[Chip.]

No, tiers are based around competitive play.

It goes both ways. Tiers are based on competitive play yes but competitive play can be based around tiers too. Why do you think there are so many n00bs on the Fox boards? It is because they saw the Tier list and are like "0 h jgeez, iF i pick teh Fox then i'Ll be goodz, rite?" >_>

Tiers don't force you to choose a certain character. Who gives a crap if Pichu is top or low tier, if you enjoy playing the character, that's all that counts.

You should choose a charachter based on tiers, but also one that fits your playing style. You see many Top-Professionals playing with charachters ranging from the Ice Climbers to Fox, because that particular player plays BEST when using that charachter.

Yeah, if you're playing JUST to enjoy playing that charachter, that isn't "all that counts". Sure you can live under a rock and say "Yeah, who cares if I can't win a match with Pichu. . . *snif* at.. at least I enjoyed playing him.. *snif* though *bawls*"

Try and play to win is what I'm saying. Choosing charachters higher on the tier list (a.k.a. better charachters) is a good way of doing that.

If ppl have fun with whatever charachter, then be my guest, I don't really care.

Ppl should stop acting and thinking like tools. Everyone would be playing Fox if tiers mattered that much.

many, MANY good players play Fox, which is another reason why he is the best charachter in the game. Tiers do matter a bit, there is no other way around it.

 

[Deleted member]

This is not the tier thread. Take it somewhere else! This is the pichu worthy of bottom tier thread. *applies for mod*

 

[Chip.]

Sorry, but it is Pichu related - the stuff about tiers - just a little bit.

Bento -Box , take it to a pM with me, I'm empty so you can shoot if you want. . .

 

[BentoBox]

It goes both ways. Tiers are based on competitive play yes but competitive play can be based around tiers too. Why do you think there are so many n00bs on the Fox boards? It is because they saw the Tier list and are like "0 h jgeez, iF i pick teh Fox then i'Ll be goodz, rite?" >_>

And I find said noobs to be ignorant.

You should choose a charachter based on tiers, but also one that fits your playing style. You see many Top-Professionals playing with charachters ranging from the Ice Climbers to Fox, because that particular player plays BEST when using that charachter.

Yeah, if you're playing JUST to enjoy playing that charachter, that isn't "all that counts". Sure you can live under a rock and say "Yeah, who cares if I can't win a match with Pichu. . . *snif* at.. at least I enjoyed playing him.. *snif* though *bawls*"

There are people playing low tiers while still being competitive, Gimpy and Taj are coming to mind. I respect them much more than any other person in need to be spoonfed.

Try and play to win is what I'm saying. Choosing charachters higher on the tier list (a.k.a. better charachters) is a good way of doing that.

If ppl have fun with whatever charachter, then be my guest, I don't really care.

Making a thread discussing Pichu's position is pointless. If you've had your share of fun playing with Pichu only to realise a few months later that ZohEmGee, he's low tier!, I don't really see what it is that should keep you from improving your game. Basically, I frown upon every thread discussing a character's placement in the tier list, as if making it jump up a couple of spots would make him more worthy of being played. CJ didn't have the tier list telling him to play DK, he used to be a lot lower and now he's gained a few spots mainly because of him. Same goes for Chu and the Ice Climbers. If everyone acted as tools, the ICs and DK would still be way down, and that's what I find regretable. Tier lists should not dictate who you should play. If there were more Tajs, M2 could gain a few spots. But nobody bothers, why? Because of the noobs you refered to. "top tier ish leh waiz 2 go!"

many, MANY good players play Fox, which is another reason why he is the best charachter in the game. Tiers do matter a bit, there is no other way around it.

Many people were attracted to Fox simply because he's top tier, and because statiscally speaking, he's the best character in the game. There could be half the amount of fox players out there and he'd still be up there because of the way he was designed. Fox was broken when the game came out.

All in all, if you don't think Pichu is worthy of bottom tier, start working his way up through hard work and training instead of whining pointlessly. Theorycrafting doesn't lead anywhere.

 

[MinunQ]

I'm sure Pichu doesn't suck as much as everyone assumes. He's not a bad character, he just has many...disadvantages. In fact, I'm glad that Sakurai added Pichu to the roster, giving us a challenging character to master.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm sure Pichu doesn't suck as much as everyone assumes. He's not a bad character, he just has many...disadvantages. In fact, I'm glad that Sakurai added Pichu to the roster, giving us a challenging character to master.

Just no! Pichu does suck (not really arguable), best pichus in the world say he should be in a crap tier of his own, and he isnt that tough to play. Tough to win w/ for sure. Anyways, bento, u do know chip mains YL right? He just tells people if u want bettr chances of winning, play high tier character.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

I'm sure Pichu doesn't suck as much as everyone assumes. He's not a bad character, he just has many...disadvantages. In fact, I'm glad that Sakurai added Pichu to the roster, giving us a challenging character to master.

Pichu does suck as much as everyone assumes. That doesn't stop people from maining him, or RI from maining low tiers in general..

 

[Taj278]

K, I'm sorry I left this open so long, lol. I'll just close it cuz Pichu is bottom tier, and there's nothing that will change that.