Will another PM surface? The possibility of a PM 2.0

[Senario]

Probably not, it takes time to make the mod and the Wii U probably will patch it out.

That said, I never really play project M. It is a nice way to appeal to melee players but I just play melee instead. Project M plays similarly but has a completely different feel.

Any updated version of smash bros with competitive aspects needs to be it's own thing and not a copy of melee. Melee was good, but trying to copy the best game in the series will likely be met with failure. Having Smash 4 be it's own thing that is just as competitive though...that could work. Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3 replaced MvC2 despite 2 being the best. And that is because it was competitive enough for players to hop over. I can go play melee whenever, but a new Smash Bros game is a chance that happens once every few years.

 

[JV5Chris]

This topic is not really something I care to speculate on, but I would hope to see continued growth and support for modders/indie developers on Smashboards.

Community driven game dev efforts should always be encouraged. The eventual quality of Smash 4 is not some condition on that matter. If you're trying to dissuade developers for whatever personal reason, I would take a cue from them and find something more productive to do with your time.

 

[CroonerMike]

I really hope they do not do another PM like mod. That would ruin the game for me. Just leave the game be as it is.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

This topic is not really something I care to speculate on, but I would hope to see continued growth and support for modders/indie developers on Smashboards.

Community driven game dev efforts should always be encouraged. The eventual quality of Smash 4 is not some condition on on that matter. If you're trying to dissuade developers for whatever personal reason, I would take a cue from them and find something more productive to do with your time.

If there one thing people can accomplish its dissuading people. The term productive can mean many things.
Building a mod based off of someone else game for free is far from productive in a business stand point.
But since the PM people do it for free is no different than the people here throwing out there free opinions.
(im not really against what your saying its more that i feel your reasoning's flawed.)

 

[JV5Chris]

Working on a game/mod can bring lots of value to your personal development and potentially others enjoyment. Anyone looking to discourage people from attempting it would be better off occupying themselves with other things. That's all I'm saying.

If someone is driven enough to make it happen, they certainly won't be persuaded like this to drop everything. There are plenty of other motivating factors that go into starting or joining these types of projects.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

Working on a game/mod can bring lots of value to your personal development and potentially others enjoyment. Anyone looking to discourage people from attempting it would be better off occupying themselves with other things. That's all I'm saying.

If someone is driven enough to make it happen, they certainly won't be persuaded like this to drop everything. There are plenty of other motivating factors that go into starting or joining these types of projects.

Agreeed

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

An ever prettier version of Melee? Yes please.

 

[TimeSmash]

Cutting in to say, that thoughts on whether this will happen or not aside, we are evenly split at around 54% for both parties who want this and who don't. Leave it to the community haha.

I also want to state whether or not this happens, modding really does take some serious effort and by doing it you're learning a whole new set of skills that could potentially lead to bigger things. Support da hackerz

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I really hope they do not do another PM like mod. That would ruin the game for me.

How?

 

[Katy Parry]

How?

Imo it makes me not appreciate Brawl anymore. I was ecstatic when it came out. But others complained because of changes made, because they wanted another melee, and Brawl then became less popular. Brawl is a fun time with friends, that's what it should be. Project M is a huge complaint about the game.

 

[QuickRat]

Imo it makes me not appreciate Brawl anymore. I was ecstatic when it came out. But others complained because of changes made, because they wanted another melee, and Brawl then became less popular. Brawl is a fun time with friends, that's what it should be. Project M is a huge complaint about the game.

That's not what happened. Most of people didn't want a Melee 2, they just wanted a good improvement. And Brawl's mechanics (tripping, unbalanced characters, non-competitive stages...) are not a "good improvement". I know there are some people that is only talking about Melee and Melee and Melee, but that's not the sensation of the most part of the competitive scene. What I saw in 2008 is a disapointment because they wanted Brawl to correct some problems from Melee and make a different game but good. They didn't. That's why Project B won't ever exist.

And believe me, if Brawl hadn't tripping, had this FD-mode, be faster with its physics and a better roster (in terms of balance), Project M would not exist. Why would it? The truth is Melee was a very good game (in my opinion, not as perfect as some people claim) but Brawl produced some disapointment.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

That's not what happened. Most of people didn't want a Melee 2, they just wanted a good improvement. And Brawl's mechanics (tripping, unbalanced characters, non-competitive stages...) are not a "good improvement". I know there are some people that is only talking about Melee and Melee and Melee, but that's not the sensation of the most part of the competitive scene. What I saw in 2008 is a disapointment because they wanted Brawl to correct some problems from Melee and make a different game but good. They didn't. That's why Project B won't ever exist.

And believe me, if Brawl hadn't tripping, had this FD-mode, be faster with its physics and a better roster (in terms of balance), Project M would not exist. Why would it? The truth is Melee was a very good game (in my opinion, not as perfect as some people claim) but Brawl produced some disapointment.

Lol alot of people wanted melee 2

 

[DaDavid]

I think for as much as we can make the argument that PM wouldn't have existed if Brawl had just been good enough in it's own right, it's hard to argue that Brawl not being enough like Melee isn't a very similar, nearly identical, statement. Think about the complaints levied against Brawl and the improvements PM made to fix them... It's all still a comparison to Melee.

However, I think Smash 4 is in a better place because people aren't really anticipating anything Melee-like this time around. In my opinion, people are much more open to the idea that this will be a better Brawl, but without returning to Melee mechanics in every way that I'm sure some people would prefer. Sakurai being so open about his vision for this game is certainly helpful, whereas Brawl was released under the assumption that it would be the evolution of Melee. For Brawl, Sakurai didn't reveal anything about his ultimate goal for the game until after launch when complaints were already being made.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

I think for as much as we can make the argument that PM wouldn't have existed if Brawl had just been good enough in it's own right, it's hard to argue that Brawl not being enough like Melee isn't a very similar, nearly identical, statement. Think about the complaints levied against Brawl and the improvements PM made to fix them... It's all still a comparison to Melee.

However, I think Smash 4 is in a better place because people aren't really anticipating anything Melee-like this time around. In my opinion, people are much more open to the idea that this will be a better Brawl, but without returning to Melee mechanics in every way that I'm sure some people would prefer. Sakurai being so open about his vision for this game is certainly helpful, whereas Brawl was released under the assumption that it would be the evolution of Melee. For Brawl, Sakurai didn't reveal anything about his ultimate goal for the game until after launch when complaints were already being made.

sorry what was his ultimate goal for brawl?

 

[DaDavid]

sorry what was his ultimate goal for brawl?

Well "ultimate goal" was probably not the best wording, but he has specifically said that with Brawl he wanted to make a game that was more accommodating to the "casual" gamer's that the Wii attracted.

 

[Dott]

I'm a fan of Project M, i play online constantly, but i really don't want to see a PM for Smash 4, i just want to play smash 4 the way it is.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

Well "ultimate goal" was probably not the best wording, but he has specifically said that with Brawl he wanted to make a game that was more accommodating to the "casual" gamer's that the Wii attracted.

I thought as much i just was not sure if we were on the same wave lenght

 

[Katy Parry]

I think all of us can agree we want the game perfect from the get go. It's looking to be that way.

 

[Muster]

P:M is going to separate itself from sm4sh in its own way if the clone engine really will bring us some good newcomers (They've confirmed they will not be making new characters from sm4sh's newcomer list as to not compete with the game).

I'd like to play sm4sh by itself and to play project M on the side. There better be a Brawl minus for sm4sh though, best mod evar.

In the unlikely event that sm4sh is a "bad" game, i will wait for an update to the game before of using a mod.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

P:M is going to separate itself from sm4sh in its own way if the clone engine really will bring us some good newcomers (They've confirmed they will not be making new characters from sm4sh's newcomer list as to not compete with the game).

I'd like to play sm4sh by itself and to play project M on the side. There better be a Brawl minus for sm4sh though, best mod evar.

In the unlikely event that sm4sh is a "bad" game, i will wait for an update to the game before of using a mod.

Yeah the only reason why people were curved balled by brawl is because the expectations of melee
but Will all the videos we seen and all the skeptics keeping eye out for flaws this game actually looking better is alot more accurate an assumption

 

[Jade_Rock55]

They would probably release balance patches and stuff in the first month hopefully,if the game is bad.

 

[JV5Chris]

Stating what should be obvious here, but the smash community would do a much better job at any sort of re-balancing down the road if the opportunity presented itself.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

Stating what should be obvious here, but the smash community would do a much better job at any sort of re-balancing down the road if the opportunity presented itself.

If your thought are based on PM you have to think about it.
they literally have 4 years of balancing.
patching can and should be fine in the long run.

 

[JV5Chris]

If your thought are based on PM you have to think about it.
they literally have 4 years of balancing..

What is there to think about? The Smash 4 team is not going to be committed for anywhere near that long or have the same kind of meta game experience to pull from when making decisions. Lets not forget a good portion of the developers are Namco employees. Highly probable that they'll move onto internal projects soon after release. Given project Sora was never established as a permanent arm of Nintendo, I wouldn't expect much different to happen on their end ether.

 

[TimeSmash]

Imo it makes me not appreciate Brawl anymore. I was ecstatic when it came out. But others complained because of changes made, because they wanted another melee, and Brawl then became less popular. Brawl is a fun time with friends, that's what it should be. Project M is a huge complaint about the game.

I actually really see where you're coming from on this. Since I play mostly competitively now, I forget how fun it is to forget all about tecchskill and whatever, ecause honestly playing with items on Very High and on crazy stages like WarioWare is super fun in its own right, and also is a comptetive game in its own right And then there's the whole Melee vs. Brawl arguments that really split the community. Thank God that's over with haha. I appreciate all the Smash games thus far, and even give credit to things like Super Smash Flash and Super Smash Land. But I don't view PM as a complaint per se, I view it as an answer to what so many people wanted--astractly, you could view PM as the Brawl so many people in the competitive community wanted: A fast game like Melee with new characters and techniques. I think a PM 2.0 would e made similar to this thought, maye.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

People can make it if they want, I don't think it would need necessarily but if people wanted to do it I'm not one to stop them.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

What is there to think about? The Smash 4 team is not going to be committed for anywhere near that long or have the same kind of meta game experience to pull from when making decisions. Lets not forget a good portion of the developers are Namco employees. Highly probable that they'll move onto internal projects soon after release. Given project Sora was never established as a permanent arm of Nintendo, I wouldn't expect much different to happen on their end ether.

Ah you missed my point. No worries. what i was meaning that the only reason PM did a better job balancing is because they had 4 years.
Don't you remember how broken zelda was in 2.0?
was not amusing.

 

[Celestis]

I don't think it will happen. I think the PM team will just focus on they game they have and leave smash 4 alone.

 

[JV5Chris]

i was meaning that the only reason PM did a better job balancing is because they had 4 years.

Only reason? So recruiting knowledgeable players in the scene and experts at each character had nothing to do with it? Gathering and applying hands on feedback from the competitive audience is something the the PM team have demonstrated works and the Smash 4 devs could really stand to do more of. It's even more of a lost opportunity at this stage in development now that the team has a limited window of being fully assembled.

As far as the time-frame goes, it's not at all an apt comparison given people work on PM in their leisure, not as a job.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

Only reason? So recruiting knowledgeable players in the scene and experts at each character had nothing to do with it? Gathering and applying hands on feedback from the competitive audience is something the the PM team have demonstrated works and the Smash 4 devs could really stand to do more of. It's even more of a lost opportunity at this stage in development now that the team has a limited window of being fully assembled.

As far as the time-frame goes, it's not at all an apt comparison given people work on PM in their leisure, not as a job.

Look all im saying is that they had time.
This at least if sakurai makes terrible mistake like MK or Fox he could fix it.

 

[Empyrean]

They had time, and the best players for each character (the likes of Mango and such). Namco (or Sakurai, whoever is in charge of balance, but please let it be Namco) could only dream of finding half the issues linked to balance with no high-level competitive players around. I can guaranty you, if the developers were to take a look at the game 6 months after release, they'll see stuff happening that they never intended to be possible, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Here's hoping that they at least take care of all the obvious stuff that even playtesters could point out before release. And in the event that something balance-breaking is discovered post-release (like wobbling, Brawl IC chaingrabs, MK, grab-release bull****, etc.), they can hopefully work on patches to fix them accordingly.

 

[D-idara]

They had time, and the best players for each character (the likes of Mango and such). Namco (or Sakurai, whoever is in charge of balance, but please let it be Namco) could only dream of finding half the issues linked to balance with no high-level competitive players around. I can guaranty you, if the developers were to take a look at the game 6 months after release, they'll see stuff happening that they never intended to be possible, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Here's hoping that they at least take care of all the obvious stuff that even playtesters could point out before release. And in the event that something balance-breaking is discovered post-release (like wobbling, Brawl IC chaingrabs, MK, grab-release bull****, etc.), they can hopefully work on patches to fix them accordingly.

Let's hope they also patch things like wavedash.

 

[Senario]

Let's hope they also patch things like wavedash.

Wavedash is not a glitch. It is maintaining momentum, physics. It is also a big part of quite a few fighting games. One of the biggest ones being Marvel Vs Capcom.

 

[Vkrm]

Let's hope they also patch things like wavedash.

If they had patched it out of melee nobody would be playing it anymore.

 

[JV5Chris]

I would hate to see patching used to specifically stop unintentional emergent gameplay. What a boring future that would be for the tittle.

 

[FalKoopa]

Considering my main draws to Project M were Mewtwo. Roy and the alt costumes, I wouldn't mind it.

 

[D-idara]

I would hate to see patching used to specifically stop unintentional emergent gameplay. What a boring future that would be for the tittle.

CORE MECHANICS, For Glory, No Glitches.

 

[Road Death Wheel]

Considering my main draws to Project M were Mewtwo. Roy and the alt costumes, I wouldn't mind it.

well we at least got alt costumes.