Why was Roy created? Suggestions to balance his character.

[halu102]

Why was Roy created? And what could make him better?

Honestly I don't see why the producers of Smash went in the direction they did with Roy. He could've even been intended as the "novel" or "joke" version of Marth. Like Dan is to Ryu and Ken in streetfighter.

Overall, the common perception of his character is someone who is "stronger" than Marth. If it was like this, they should've given Roy more reach since it's a given that Roy is slower than Marth. But this doesn't seem feasible since Roy's actual stature is much smaller than Marth.

My suggestion for Roy, if he were to remain in the subsequent Smash titles would be to increase Roy's speed to make up for his sweetspotting and reach. I feel that would be an appropriate improvement without making him god-like. This could come in the form of running or the reduction in the amount of frames for certain moves.

What suggestions would you feel appropriate to make Roy a noteworthy character.

 

[doom dragon 105]

#1. Marth is gay

#2. Roy just fine the way he his but it would be noce if his sweet spot was better but besides that hes fine i like his shuffle game and he looks a whole lot better then marth and most characters in the game and his speed id just fine.

#3. ken is cool *and Ken in streetfighter* (street fighter ken)

 

[TedBoosley]

#1. Marth is gay

#2. Roy just fine the way he his but it would be noce if his sweet spot was better but besides that hes fine i like his shuffle game and he looks a whole lot better then marth and most characters in the game and his speed id just fine.

#3. ken is cool *and Ken in streetfighter* (street fighter ken)

Yeah, I'd like to see Roy combo Peach across the stage and end with a spike from 0%.

And the reason that Roy exists is because SSBM wasn't balanced for Smashboards, it was balanced for random noobs playing 4-man FFAs on Hyrule Temple with items turned on. In a game without such concepts as spacing, frequent grabbing, and various other things we assume out of every player, ROY IS BETTER THAN MARTH.

Also, I doubt Roy will even be in SSBB, unfortunately, so there's no really no point in trying to balance him, especially since we have no idea what the game will be like from a competitive standpoint.

 

[HoshiPuri]

Roy is perfectly fine. Making him better is just making him another Marth.

Things I personally like about Roy:
He actually has a very strong forward smash
His Down Tilt sends your opponents up leading to more shuffling!
His U-air rocks! Fall in love juggling with this attack!
His Up B can be propelled forward more than 3 times farther than Marth's
His Up B can 1 hit KO Kirby, Jigglies, Pichus, and Game and Watches depending on stages.

Things I don't like about Roy:
When I try to aerial B, I end up falling in the bottom of the stage. Look at Neo in that one "Neo vs Marth" at Battle Field!
You can't aerial guard your opponents
His grabs suck!
His B. Noobs think this is the best attack in the game. WRONG. When the heck do you get the chance to hit this baby on them!

 

[exarch]

uh... wtf, roy's not fine because he can't compete on higher levels >_>

Give him the stun time of jiggs. Numbero Uno of what I want for his character. He'd be darn good if he had that. Or at least, he'd be able to compete.

I'd also like to see him put out a little more damage. Don't increase his knockback... but increase the damage he does with his aerials.

Seriously if you just changed his stun time, I think he'd be a downright useable character. His biggest problem is that EVERYONE IN THE GAME combos him RIDICULOUSLY well.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Exarch is very right, hes too easy to combo

 

[5150]

some things:

1. whoever said roy is fine dont post for a while ok
2. whoever puts their location as somewhere vague because they are scared of the internet should not be here
3. wrong. hes just as easy to combo as shiek. all combos that work on roy work on shiek and vice versa. the only exception si that roy cant get waveshined endlessly (but you can still do shine, wd, jab).

now, the big problem with roy is this:

all of his moves have very VERY particular uses. (aka they can only be used in very specific situations)

if you look at characters like fox, falco, and shiek, they all have moves that are effective throughout the match. roy doesn't have that. he has fsmash maybe, but compare that to shiek's grab, falco's dair, or fox's shine and you will realise how bad roy is.

other things bad with roy:

1. his moves do awful damage.
2. his cg isn't even that great
3. his combos only work at specific percents and on specific characters
4. alot of his moves are near unusable

 

[pdk]

simple, roy is a fusion of marth and chuck norris

 

[sagemoon]

5150 you know you kinda just flamed yourself when you said.
"2. whoever puts their location as somewhere vague because they are scared of the internet should not be here"
Casue your location says "east coast"

Anyways i disagree with whoever said roys B attack is horrible. Although you are rarely going to get the fully charged B move off, it is still a good move w/o charging. Roy does have a ariel edge guard game its just crap cause of his weight.

I dont think roys moveset should be changed at all but if his wieght was similar to marths hed be a decent char.

 

[5150]

5150 you know you kinda just flamed yourself when you said.
"2. whoever puts their location as somewhere vague because they are scared of the internet should not be here"
Casue your location says "east coast"

it's called a joke. *sigh*

I dont think roys moveset should be changed at all but if his wieght was similar to marths hed be a decent char.

and that's why i pray every night before i go to bed that people like you don't ever get the opportunity to balance a game.

 

[sagemoon]

yea w/e, you're arrogant. Lets not flame on this baord though. Its just my opinion.

Heres my reasons to back up my opinion though. Less weight = more time to recover, roys ariel edgeguard would be a lot better, also it gives more time to stall attacks or in some cases maybe even have 2 in a short hop. But its not like im gonna actually balance the characters so theres no point to even argue it. If you wanna flame me at least back up your arguement.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Sagemoon, leave 5150 alone in his flames, its what he needs to stay alive..geez, didn't you know 5150 is a troll that must use flames to prolong his unholy existance?

Roy was made just to throw in another FL character..and probably to make noobs go "Wow, what a forward smash!"

...the only way you could truely make roy good was be to make his f-smash lagless and spam-able as fox's shine.

And 5150, roy is far easier to combo, I've comboed roy to deal with mario easily, sheik, no...and in marth's f-air chains, its far easier to keep a roy comboed than it is sheik.

 

[5150]

yea w/e, you're arrogant. Lets not flame on this baord though. Its just my opinion.

Heres my reasons to back up my opinion though. Less weight = more time to recover, roys ariel edgeguard would be a lot better, also it gives more time to stall attacks or in some cases maybe even have 2 in a short hop. But its not like im gonna actually balance the characters so theres no point to even argue it. If you wanna flame me at least back up your arguement.

thats not true at all. samus is 3rd or 4th heaviest in teh game but she can escape **** super fast with nair. sotp posting

And 5150, roy is far easier to combo, I've comboed roy to deal with mario easily, sheik, no...and in marth's f-air chains, its far easier to keep a roy comboed than it is sheik.

its in general *******. also, if you comboed a roy to death with mario that means he didn't DI, at ALL, rofl. so that means your not playing anyone who can DI, congrats.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

5150, your trolling attempts won't work on me!

And no, not in general either, roy is much easier to combo.

And you're very wrong, my friends can DI quite well and so can I.

 

[sagemoon]

uhh samus is one of the lightest characters in the game, at least shes lighter than roy, fox, falco, bowser, Dk (a lot more other chars im too lazy to find and point out). And thebluedeath is right, i can do a 0 to death combo on a roy as a marth but i cant on a shiek. Dont try that whole "the ppl you play with suck" because I play with the best in WA. But go ahead try to say WA sucks it will just show you how arrogant you are. So yea im still waiting for you to backup your argument with valid reasons.

 

[Zankoku]

I think there's a problem with the current terms. Samus is indeed a very heavy character - she just doesn't seem that way because she also has very low gravity. Keep in mind, weight only applies to the amount of knockback from getting hit - Falco falls faster than Captain Falcon, but Captain Falcon is without a doubt heavier.

 

[cF=)]

Sagemoon you are ********, Samus is extremely floaty but one of the most heavy character in the game. Go jump off a bridge with concrete at the bottom if you still don't understand this because you clearly make the (wrong) assumption of thinking weight = falling speed.

5150 is not a troll, he holds the truth much more than you guys.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Sagemoon, I have to REALLY disagree on samus being light lol...shes actually quite heavy.

And CF, 5150 is a huge troll, hes a massive troll, hes the biggest troll of them all...even he knows that...its what makes him proud and well known.

 

[sagemoon]

what i meant by light was like fall speed and jumping, As you guys said more floaty. Sorry for the misconception lol. But yea what i mean is to make roy more floaty. Which i guess changes my whole point on what changes should be made to roy.

Anyways lets get back on topic. I'll restate my opinion using correct terms. I think roy would be a decent character if he was more floaty.

oh and thanks for correcting me so i dont make the mistake again.

 

[5150]

uhh samus is one of the lightest characters in the game, at least shes lighter than roy, fox, falco, bowser, Dk (a lot more other chars im too lazy to find and point out). And thebluedeath is right, i can do a 0 to death combo on a roy as a marth but i cant on a shiek. Dont try that whole "the ppl you play with suck" because I play with the best in WA. But go ahead try to say WA sucks it will just show you how arrogant you are. So yea im still waiting for you to backup your argument with valid reasons.

rofl. you need to learn the game or research quickly cuz u look loike a huge noob.

5150, your trolling attempts won't work on me!

And no, not in general either, roy is much easier to combo.

And you're very wrong, my friends can DI quite well and so can I.

also rofl. you cant' DI.

 

[Zankoku]

Anyways lets get back on topic. I'll restate my opinion using correct terms. I think roy would be a decent character if he was more floaty.

Oh HELL no. That floaty bull**** is why I hate using Marth.

 

[5150]

if roy was more floaty, then he'd have absolutely 0 combos compared to like the 1.5 combos he has now.

thank god you people don't balance games rofl, you are *******.

 

[Sky2042]

Oh HELL no. That floaty bull**** is why I hate using Marth.

Aye.

I don't think there's much at all to improve Roy, except knock some of his lagtime off. Other than that, we're either: a, gimping him in some unforeseen fashion, or b, turning him into Marth.

 

[doom dragon 105]

Roy is perfectly fine. Making him better is just making him another Marth.

Things I personally like about Roy:
He actually has a very strong forward smash
His Down Tilt sends your opponents up leading to more shuffling!
His U-air rocks! Fall in love juggling with this attack!
His Up B can be propelled forward more than 3 times farther than Marth's
His Up B can 1 hit KO Kirby, Jigglies, Pichus, and Game and Watches depending on stages.

Things I don't like about Roy:
When I try to aerial B, I end up falling in the bottom of the stage. Look at Neo in that one "Neo vs Marth" at Battle Field!
You can't aerial guard your opponents
His grabs suck!
His B. Noobs think this is the best attack in the game. WRONG. When the heck do you get the chance to hit this baby on them!

yea right his grabs are one of his better features

 

[NES n00b]

Even though 5150 will troll me for my n00bness, I will give suggestions. Roy's moves should not be so easily DIed. He either needs a better recovery or more weight (or both). Also, the concept of having a sweetspot in the center is ********. Even though this is suppose to differentiate Marth from Roy, the sweetspot location almost entirely destroys the purpose of the range Roy has. Stop making his combos cruddy and give him slightly more know back to at least keep some sort of combo going. Do more damage in all attacks!!!!

The only way to help Roy is to scrap the concept of Roy that the developers were trying to make.

5150 on a different account flame below.

 

[-BLaze-]

i can do a 0 to death combo on a roy as a marth

lol, I'd like to see your marth attempt it on my roy

 

[DelxDoom]

:O he needs a laser

Overall, when Marth sourspots, it's still a great attack and will **** the enemy.
When Roy does really anything, nothing really happens...
so they need to fix that? idk.

 

[Zankoku]

the sweetspot location almost entirely destroys the purpose of the range Roy has

And the tip of Marth's sword dealing the most damage and knockback makes total sense?

Consider for a moment what hurts more when someone's slashing at you with a sword - the very tip, or the entire blade?

 

[NES n00b]

And the tip of Marth's sword dealing the most damage and knockback makes total sense?

Consider for a moment what hurts more when someone's slashing at you with a sword - the very tip, or the entire blade?

True, but why have the range if all but the center of the blade does nothing? He can have a sweetspot in the middle of his sword, but he needs to be able to still do some damage without sweetspotting the center. Seriously, Marth can do more damage and combos without sweetspotting. What does Roy have. . . . .?

 

[Zankoku]

I can't believe you're asking this, but..

What does Roy have?
Fire.

 

[halu102]

Good suggestions so far, especially Exarch's suggestion about stun time.

Now about the wieght problem. Isn't Roy the same weight as Marth (probably wrong on this, go ahead and flame)? I also don't see how Roy could weigh that much more since his stature is smaller than Marth. Only reason would be his armor, and I doubt that'll skyrocket his weight, like how Samus' weight is due to her alien suit. But in the end it'll only apply to crouch cancelling (too tired to think of what else is affected by weight)

Now that I think about it, I think the peple who made Roy may have been trying to mirror him as close as possible to his Fire Emblem (RPG) stats. The stats could've reflected some sort of character with high strength, lower range, and.... whatever.

 

[Zankoku]

Roy is definitely lighter than Marth. He falls faster, though, so he's harder to KO over the top, but he gets sent farther horizontally and because of his higher gravity and worse recovery he has a harder time living from that.

 

[NES n00b]

I can't believe you're asking this, but..

What does Roy have?
Fire.

Rofl, you know what I mean.

 

[doom dragon 105]

some things:

1. whoever said roy is fine dont post for a while ok
2. whoever puts their location as somewhere vague because they are scared of the internet should not be here
3. wrong. hes just as easy to combo as shiek. all combos that work on roy work on shiek and vice versa. the only exception si that roy cant get waveshined endlessly (but you can still do shine, wd, jab).

now, the big problem with roy is this:

all of his moves have very VERY particular uses. (aka they can only be used in very specific situations)

if you look at characters like fox, falco, and shiek, they all have moves that are effective throughout the match. roy doesn't have that. he has fsmash maybe, but compare that to shiek's grab, falco's dair, or fox's shine and you will realise how bad roy is.

other things bad with roy:

1. his moves do awful damage.
2. his cg isn't even that great
3. his combos only work at specific percents and on specific characters
4. alot of his moves are near unusable

your right but roy is fun to play the way he is

 

[Mister Moo]

Hmm, there's really only one semi-good thing about Roy. That's Flare Blade. If you KO the opponent with another attack, IMMEDIATELY start charging. The opponent would see you and try to attack. If it's slow, that's lovely. If it's fast, it's NOT so lovely - you'd need perfect reflexes to ace that one. If a fully charged Flare Blade hits, POW! ...Then, you repeat this step.



However, this attack has one con that concerns me. The recoil. It's not much, but...

 

[technomancer]

5150 is pretty accurate with that list.

Sheik can escape more combos with jumps because she is heavier, making her harder to combo at high percents. Roy is also easier to combo than Sheik because his frame is most similar to Marth's, while Sheik is a skinny *****.

Also Roy's recovery blows, that's why I stopped using him.


At above poster: THAT WILL NEVER WORK

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Thanks technomancer for saying what I said in your third sentence.

 

[theONEjanitor]

Roy is a fine character.
The fact that you all can't win with him says more about you than him.
Roy has very quick shffls, and very nice combo potential due to his low knockback.
His f-smash is basically god-like.
HIS SIDE-B is basically god-like.
he has GREAT grab range, thus GREAT chaingrab potential.
his sword is exactly the same length as marth's.
he's faster and weaker than marth, i'm not sure why everyone thinks he's the opposite. Most of his moves have longer windown lag than marth, maybe that why people think he's slower. With L-canceling, this is rarely a set back though.
the main drawback of roy is that he really cant recover that well. but neither can ganon, falco, or c.falcon, and their all high tier.

Roy basically forces you to use mindgames.
The character himself is fine. If you suck at mindgames, and need a cheese character to make up for it, thats your fault.

 

[Private Zulen]

It hasn't been said that Roy's inclusion in Brawl was to ***** out Fire Emblem 6, which had just been released in Japan. He will probably not return, and neither will Marth most likely.

Marth is a girly, prince, who I could very well see wearing a dress and kissing other men. His squeaky voice and flamboyant poses are the only reason I would want to use Roy over Marth. Still, though, that kind of thinking makes you a Narutard weeaboo.

*sigh*

 

[darE::to::Dream]

What does grab range have to do with chaingrab potential? It's all about the trajectory of the throw.