What characters can Marth chaingrab?

[TedBoosley]

Also cactuar can do 1,000 damage with one attack. True story.

 

[Randizzle]

reading over everything again, i'm realizing that there is a communication problem between aesir and myself and possibly others. First off, yes, the utilt DOES work at 32%, but I disagree that fox easily DIs out of it. I believe that fox can still be regrabbed with a dash grab even with DI from the utilt. I'll test this some more in the future. However, I've found that I have been able to regrab with or without the utilt at that percent due to the fact that marth's grab outranges shine and the fact that you can often grab them before they are able to shine. The choice of whether to utilt or just regrab is pretty intuitive, and basically depends on fox's DI. 29% however, is too low of a percent to do utilt if you're expecting to get the right knockback for a regrab. I personally find 29% to be a much more difficult percent than 32 to figure out since that's the point where fox can probably most easily shine and jump, but without being hit by utilt in such a way that pops him up for a regrab. This is where the pivot grab comes in since it can put you in range for a safer grab at that percent. I tested this playing against a fox yesterday, so I know for a fact that this definitely works.

Now, the miscommunication lies in the earlier post where aesir says that Fox can escape by jumping out a shining. Perhaps you meant only if the marth messes up, but to me i got the impression that it meant that marth's chaingrab/utilts/aerials/etc ends at that point. Either way, I'm going to say that marth still has the ability to definitely combo fox with a combination or grabs (and utilts when necessary) to well beyond 32.

phew, done with that wall of text. man, i need something to do at work. i've just been on smashboards too much these last two days >_<

 

[Aesir]

I'm pretty sure they can Jump out even if you dash grab. but uptilting, they can DI out of it, I've uptilted and they've gone straight up and to high for me to get anything out of it except for chaining uairs into a nair and edge guarding.

 

[Randizzle]

now, if they go straight up with utilt, i'm pretty sure you can do another utilt (especially if they do it at 32% + damage from utilt). Or (correct me if i'm wrong), straight up might even set them up for a tipper fsmash at that point.

I typically don't try using uairs until around 70 or so.

 

[mood4food77]

you can utilt chain them after 32 but you cannot regrab them, unless you're m2k

 

[Randizzle]

you can utilt chain them after 32 but you cannot regrab them, unless you're m2k

explain the "unless you're m2k"

granted, it gets more difficult and you really need to know how to read DI. But I've played enough Fox players to know for certain it's possible.

edit: what's the point of even regrabbing if the fox is DIing into a chain or utilts? utilts add up damage quicker and they set up for KO moves or at least a good edgeguard, especially if the fox DIs in such a way that he is getting chained by multiple utilts.

edit2: i just noticed the topic creator's question was already answered a long time ago, and had nothing to do with falco/fox.

 

[Aesir]

I think what he's saying is, when they DI the uptilt, and you can't stand still and regrab you have to move, and whether you can re-grab or not is very dependant on how they DI'd.

also uptilt at 70? that makes no sense what so ever. >_>

 

[Randizzle]

it says uAIR. no, i don't utilt at 70. but around 70, uairs start juggling quite nicely.

the moving to regrab is exactly what i'm saying you have to do, so i don't see the problem here.

still not a single double post.. editting ftw!

 

[Aesir]

I didn't see that, I dunno I'll try it but usually I just string uairs into a finisher or something. >_> I'm to lazy to do the 0-death chain grab.

 

[knightpraetor]

ok, so basically from this thread i've learned htat grab outranges shine..makes sense...i've always believed that...so i just need to start the grab a little out of range..will also help techchasing if i use max range on grabs more..i don't usually think of marth's incredible grab range.

on the other hand..even a regrab till 36, i'm pretty certain the fox can still di the uptilt to get out..it's not a guaranteed get out..but you have to tech chase...i think what the fox does is DI in and down to touch down faster.. i think if they just DI in you can often regrab..this is just my 2 cents..i appreciate all the discussion though

one thing i have a lot of trouble with is understanding the later part post -50 with full di...i guess wavetilts and then fairs.

Upairs are a godsend on no di at high damage though..it's basically death for them if they try that.

 

[Aesir]

milktea: so chris told me it's 32 percent. . .
milktea: returned at 12:35:46 AM.
Aesir: for?
Aesir: the DI thing
Aesir: so 32 its escapable?
milktea: yea

>_>

 

[Randizzle]

escapable from regrab or utilt then regrab? specify what you mean. The utilt adds some more percent so you can't say it's 32, since somewhere in the 40s and it has a knockback (if DId straight up) that sets fox up into other stuff. If you're merely saying that straight up DI from the utilt that hits after 32 (which would be 40 something percent), then i'd be willing to believe it's possible to jump out if marth doesn't follow through with something else. However, it most easily sets them up for other attacks.

There's seriously no point in arguing this. I'm pretty sure we both have an idea of what we're saying, but we're not undertsanding each other. THe fact of the matter is that marth can definitely combo fox well past 32 even if you claim a regrab isn't used afterward. The chaingrab+comboing should never be a memorized list of percents, but just improvised reading of DI. You regrab when you see an opening, utilt when you can pop them up, uair when they're too high percent, and fsmash if you see a tipper. It's just simple as that. If you insist on debating the percents, just ask m2k about what marth does to Fox given each scenario of DI at 32+% after a uthrow.

 

[SCOTU]

What do you think the grab hit is for? making sure they aren't at 32%...

 

[Aesir]

^ its after 32 that you can't regrab, not at 32. >_>

 

[SCOTU]

I'm pretty sure it's at like 34-35 that you can be guaranteed to hit w/ a tippered utilt (which you can regrab off of). 32% is just a weird point where the non-pivot regrab stops to work, and the utilt will hit at the hilt, hitting them away. i used to abuse this, but if the marth knows it, they can either pivot grab, or just hit them twice.