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Right off the bat, T-block claimed miller status. That's fine, except... There already was a miller, who then counterclaimed. Also he was pointing towards a No Lynch.
It would've been fine if he said he was trying for a gambit here, but he did not. It took Kantrip claiming terrorist and threatening to bomb him for T-block to claim his gambit.
get outta here. i never actually advocated a NL. also, i retracted my miller claim because despite my efforts, D1 was turning into TB or RR, which was clearly anti-town. kantrip's threats had nothing to do with it because i didn't even believe his role in the first place. you are either misconstruing the events of this game in order to procure some semblance of a "case" against me, or you just don't have the facts straight in your head. and i think the facts have been pretty clear tbh.
Which T-block then writes off as WIFOM. Because there is nothing else to which he could write it off to make it look townie. Kantrip was dead-on right here, claiming normal miller and not alluding to PR's would've been so much better than WIFOM. It might be WIFOM, but it is far from in his favor. Calling it like he put it is .
His whole intent was to ride out the miller claim, which has INFINITE benefits as scum and barely any as town.
again, if i were to claim miller as an actual miller, i would have done the same thing. whether you disagree with how good of an idea it is is irrelevant - fact is, that's what i believe. if you think i'm bsing, i'd be happy to discuss it with you postgame.
as an aside, if i were scum looking for protection from being copped by fakeclaiming miller, what benefit do i gain from refusing to confirm whether i'm a PR? couldn't i just say i'm just miller and be done with it?
This combined with his glaring inactivity (and yes I've seen you view the thread more than enough!!!) and us still having no idea really of his stances in D2, other than wanting to lynch me, make me want to lynch T-block badly.
My gut just says his miller claim doesn't add up and I know I'm not the only one.
The points that I find really bad are, essentially, anything relating to finding Asdioh worse off than before. Your points really hold, like, no weight yo.
no, i'm not miller. but if RR were scum, he wouldn't know that.
i mean... i guess it's possible that he called that i was faking it (given his expressing his suspicions of it for how i presented it and such), but RR doesn't have the balls to do that. he's town =\
Sorry to have a side-note but this game feels REALLY hollow for a game that's 38 pages long.
*live updated*
So based on meta, you believe RR is town? Hmmmm maybe I'm looking at things wrong and probably need to refresh myself on RR.
Also I didn't say that at all TB. I said at the time of my switch to JM to now there were juicier people to go after like RR haha. However I don't feel like voting you and if JM is back on the table, deffo going there before an AA lynch which is based purely off inactivity and nullness in my book.
Sorry to have a side-note but this game feels REALLY hollow for a game that's 38 pages long.
*live updated*
So based on meta, you believe RR is town? Hmmmm maybe I'm looking at things wrong and probably need to refresh myself on RR.
Also I didn't say that at all TB. I said at the time of my switch to JM to now there were juicier people to go after like RR haha. However I don't feel like voting you and if JM is back on the table, deffo going there before an AA lynch which is based purely off inactivity and nullness in my book.
Bolded is probably why I'm having such a hard time understanding as I usually do when people get a tad dense because combined with the fact I can be ditzy a lot haha.
I'd like uhm...hmm....er....well...about that.
I can't really think of anyone before JM. I have like RR has a suspicion and Rajam is a clustermess i am trying to figure out. Gorf is town due to vig claim, I don't really think he is indy. Ghebbers is town and Same with Asdioh just on a more lesser note. TB is leaning town and then I think that's everyone. Well there is AA who is flat out null with nothing to go and could deffo be scum.
Basically it goes like this atm: JM>AA/RR>Rajam>TB>Asdioh>Gheb>Gorf>J
So it seems that kind of helped me put my vote into perspective for toDay haha so thank you very much for that question TB! xD
Gorf -> Reasons match his role and actions based on his claim
JM -> Already asked
Asdioh -> mmm I have Asdioh as town so that's why I'm not really questioning him too much, but I think I can do the same question since he was a key vote when deciding either Kantrip or Sokr/WL
Asdioh, how did you weight Kantrip "guessing" WL's role when deciding on D1's lynch?
Kantrip -> town
T-block -> Went after Kantrip to ensure a lynch, after Asdioh took the decision early
Red Ryu -> Same as T-block
Others: July went inactive even before Sokr replaced out, mentos was inactive and we know now is town, and me + Gheb had reasons to go against WL. Not sure about aa but I guess the vote is ok and I'll check later how he decided upon that vote.
I think there is something else important to consider I'm remembering now: Asdioh took the decision of going against Kantrip when the votes were basically divided between him and WL. I wonder how dead-set were the votes/reasons in that moment that basically no one was willing to shift. I'll check that later but any help reviewing that would be appreciated. Important stuff to check regarding that moment would be:
- Why Asdioh had to make the decision. Who passed that responsibility on him, and if that "pass" was scummy or justified
- We know now both Kantrip and Sokr/WL were town. Scum had two choices:
1° lynching WL would get rid of an eventual BP role
2° lynching Kantrip would provoke a 1-2 combo for lynching WL next Day since Kantrip said his "guessing" on WL's role was a gambit
Imo reason 2° is more "telling" since scum would've just lynched "BP" WL D2 "for free". Hence my main lynch candidates for toDay are July 1st, then JM 2nd but only if July's lynch isn't going to happen. On a far 3rd place is aa which I need to do a reread to check his flow of reasoning/actions
you think scum would have chosen to lynch kantrip, because it would have led to a "free" lynch on the BP the following Day?
i'm not sure i follow... if that was the goal of scum, and D1 was already down to WL and Kantrip anyways, why not lynch WL instead and get the lynch that way?
Bolded is probably why I'm having such a hard time understanding as I usually do when people get a tad dense because combined with the fact I can be ditzy a lot haha.
I'd like uhm...hmm....er....well...about that.
I can't really think of anyone before JM. I have like RR has a suspicion and Rajam is a clustermess i am trying to figure out. Gorf is town due to vig claim, I don't really think he is indy. Ghebbers is town and Same with Asdioh just on a more lesser note. TB is leaning town and then I think that's everyone. Well there is AA who is flat out null with nothing to go and could deffo be scum.
Basically it goes like this atm: JM>AA/RR>Rajam>TB>Asdioh>Gheb>Gorf>J
So it seems that kind of helped me put my vote into perspective for toDay haha so thank you very much for that question TB! xD
We have three VT's flipped, me, and a miller claim with 12 players in the game. With 9 players alive on D2, I'm thinking we may be dealing with 2 scum. Call me crazy or nah? I'm only discussing this cuz I'm thinking of it now and I know you niggz are at the comp.
We have three VT's flipped, me, and a miller claim with 12 players in the game. With 9 players alive on D2, I'm thinking we may be dealing with 2 scum. Call me crazy or nah? I'm only discussing this cuz I'm thinking of it now and I know you niggz are at the comp.
If we only have 2 scum, that'd make things a lot less chaotic with toDay's ordeals. However, if it is 2 mafia, then I do consider Indy in play and the biggest person that looks indy in that scenario is yourself Gorf due to you claiming a killing role. =P
3 mafia does seem a tad unlikely with events and would make the game a little wonky with balancing unless town does seem to have a few good PRs left.
I mean I guess an indy non killing may be possible, but that'd still ultimately be tough on town. Think about it; assuming the indy isn't survivor, it'd probz be a damn good informative that could easily be town. Marker seems hella unlikely, and if there's an SK... no. UNLESS that indy's a survivor (which would suck the d***), I'm looking at 2 maf 10 town.
Going from my perspective, and a general perspective, I think an SK + a regular NK mechanics with the 3 VT flips plus the miller claim would be brutal to town. Two NK's a Night, assuming both hit town, combined with 2 town lynches can put town to lylo by D3 which would be douchebag modding.
J said:
So Gorf you are ruling out indy completely due to the flips *sans an Indy Survivor*?
Making me consider the possibility of a survivor even more... Maybe like BP if anything, but I don't see an indy with any active ability to balance for the time being.
Gheb is extremely open this game w.r.t. reads and also isn't afraid to be sticking his neck out against slots that town seem dead-set on. He has no need to halt the JM wagon as scum and continue to scum-hunt on my slot or your slot (almost simultaneously). GhebScum just doesn't do this at all and I've played with that monster enough to know how to quell it. I just cannot find scum motivation in his posts and no reason to call him scum. The only qualm I find myself is his lack of explanation but that's his biggest null-tell.
Gorf's theory that he purposes on JM is an intriguing one considering my main point against him was going with whatever anyone else wanted yesterDay.
I'll be damned if another survivor reeks this game. The last time I dealt with one was Inception mafia where the Indy Survivor caused me to lose my game as Mafia and won for town. T_______T
Survivor are anti-town factions but they don't really harm anyone besides like picking a side to fight for.
OK, so I'm reading stuff from about p. 19 onwards [when Laundry replaced in] and look at the lynch scenario in particular and sum up what players were thinking at that time ...
T-Block:
Advocated a Rajam / WLSokr team. Looks bad in restrospect for that and for his confirmed fake claim but I need to put that in context with other players' thoughts. And I should also check his reads on others to see what he's doing. Not much coming from @D2, definitely somebody I'd investigate if he hasn't been yet. Potentially a D2 lynch as well.
#798
#805
#818
#821 pushing for Kantrip bombing WL
He only actually votes WL @865 though
#862 contains quite a horrible response to Rajam
#973 this post smells =/
#1011
#1060
#1090
#1098
#1099 Generally supporting Kantrip staying alive over WL [sometimes straight up desperately so]. Overall a lot of scummy behavior in all of this imo
Well it's just some notes on players and I'm starting with the ones that haven't been talked about very much. Not all my notes on the post #s are to be taken at face value but I find them worth noting anyway because they all reflect a rather clear stance.
Also I'm not going to deliver all content for everybody to get the whole game spoonfed by me. It's not like I'm alone responsible for the slow-down of this game. I mean most of the people aren't doing **** right now.
The main thing that makes me question JM scum is that like everybody has been on his *** toDay and I don't think scum has any need to win cred by bussing somebody.
collapse tags contain quotes of his posts against me. note how vague the "points" he makes in the beginning are. general statements like "this smells", "this is a bad response", and he has ignored my requests for elaboration. others (RR) have even stated they don't see how some of those posts are bad, and he ignores that too. he says he likes his vote on me even more after rajam's reasoning, even though rajam's reasoning suggests that scum lies elsewhere. he wants to see my claim to evaluate whether he wants to lynch me, but just a few posts later he's sure that i'm going to be the lynch.
gheb doesn't have reasoning for finding me scum. he's not even consistent with his own actions in his push against me. instead, it seems he intends to bully his way to my lynch.
Most stances in that post seem conformistic. Not that can actually make a case based on this, nor do I think it's straigth-up scummy ... I just don't like it, it looks unlike you and for the amount of what you posted it does very little to actually move this game forwards.
I have no town read on JM.
I want those who have a town read on him - or at least a not-scum read - to speak up asap.
Bussing means throwing your own scummate under the bus.
Like everybody openly suspected you toDay. Scum is not in a situation where bussing helps them.
Thus atm I don't think you're scum.
and this reasoning is so absurdly bad that i find it hard to believe it is sincerely coming from gheb.
the two centres of attention, kantrip and WL, were lynched and killed before D2. JM had already been receiving some attention D1. a couple of townies (me and gorf) come out strong against JM. all of a sudden, JM is the most likely lynch. are his scumbuddies really going to risk defending him when it is virtually impossible to see town motivation behind his play, especially when it is very possible that he will end up being the lynch? i don't buy that gheb is honestly willing to clear JM off of this.
plus, look at how early he sets up this whole point by asking anyone who didn't think he was scum to speak up. it just feels so contrived and is stated like such an obvious trap.
Also people seriously need to gtfo with all that "I have no problem with XY, why lynch him?" BS. If you have a better suggestion then be vocal about it. Most of you guys are so clueless in this game ... none of you have a back-up plan in case your preferred lynch doesn't happen and you all seem to tunnel one player for hardly any reason other than POE based on halfassed reads.
so, things i want to see from gheb:
-actual reasoning behind wanting my lynch
-an explanation of how much my miller claim play and my inactivity factor into his wanting my lynch
-an explanation of why rajam's post made him like his vote on me even more
-a defense of his town stance on JM
.
