Utah Thread - Dead thread is dead

[TheGrifBaller]

when do we have weeklies ? just ask`n don`t be hate`n

 

[BillNyeTheSamusGuy]

tues in provo and wed intaylorsville

more specific info is in the first post

 

[Casture]

I'm all for college crew battles. We could also just do it by regions: Logan, SLC, Orem/Provo, Southern Utah.

 

[adlp]

^^^^^^^

yes

 

[TheGrifBaller]

tues in provo and wed intaylorsville

more specific info is in the first post

cool bro. k ill be sure to get info on dis tourney so i can bring the mario on (and others as well just so you know )
i be getting dis paper

 

[Support.]

cool bro. k ill be sure to get info on dis tourney so i can bring the mario on (and others as well just so you know )
i be getting dis paper

Since when does Grif type like a uneducated black kid?

 

[TheGrifBaller]

Since when does Grif type like a uneducated black kid?

ha ha support u to funny man i just think that it is easier to talk like dis so you can all no what i be talking bout and then be dun k

 

[Support.]

ha ha support u to funny man i just think that it is easier to talk like dis so you can all no what i be talking bout and then be dun k

Im pretty sure we all can understand proper english lol.

But you do you I guess.

 

[TheGrifBaller]

sure i`ll keep that in mind boss

 

[Z'zgashi]

Please, PLEASE dont have a buy in for the Amateur Bracket. Please, it doesnt solve anything and only causes more problems. The only time Amateur Brackets have a buy in is at Regionals/Nationals because they have like 100+ competitive players there that want to play matches against other good players, so the Amateur Bracket is still full of solid players. The point of an Amateur bracket isnt to allow people a second chance at the money, its to allow newer players and players who got eliminated to have more matches, and if we want to give them more matches, we shouldnt make them pay for more, they'll feel cheated. Also, Amateur bracket DEFINITELY shouldnt have prizes, as it incentives High level, but not top level players, to throw pools so that they get their money back. Plus, not having prizes shows those players who took top placings in Amateur that theyre JUST short of Pro bracket, where they CAN get prizes, and it makes them want to get better since theyre so close.

Trust me on this, we DO NOT want prizes for Amateur bracket, and we DEFINITELY DO NOT want a second buy in. Only type of prizes Amateur bracket should be getting would be if we had merch or gift cards to give away to winners and/or a raffle type dealio.

 

[Support.]

You wouldn't have to pay again to play in amateur bracket(or at least from wHt I understand)

And it seems like we are at a split with buy ins or not, so why not just do trial and error? It seems to be the only probable thing to do....

 

[Death Arcana]

if you wanted amateur brackets to have pay out
they would have to pay again,
because they would get no part of the total pot
that goes to the pro bracket,
their incentive is the chance to get more real matches in
not to mention friendlies they get

 

[Reptile (Kira)]

Here's a take on the amateur bracket from a would-be amateur.

The biggest thing keeping me from most events (IE weeklies and the Comic-Con tourney) is money. It's tough to pay $10 a week for this guy-with-no-job-guy, especially since I've gotta pay for a mission in a couple months. So I mostly come to free tourneys, or ones with lower entry fees (The Neumont tourney was good for that).

So with the free amateur brackets, I could still come and gauge my skill against others, and train a bit, without risking money I don't have. And once I start doing well there, I would feel more comfortable paying the money for the real deal.

So, tldr:
1. Amateur bracket is a good idea
2. They should be free buy-ins, but still set in a tourney-style competition.
3. ?
4. Profit!

 

[Support.]

Hmm, I had a different idea I guess. People pay for just AM brackets then there is a cut for pro bracket so that way the people that are paying for pro brackets gets more money (out of respect) so both parties still get money and no one has to pay twice. (If that makes sense probably doesnt but eh, whatever)

 

[Death Arcana]

Here's a take on the amateur bracket from a would-be amateur.

The biggest thing keeping me from most events (IE weeklies and the Comic-Con tourney) is money. It's tough to pay $10 a week for this guy-with-no-job-guy, especially since I've gotta pay for a mission in a couple months. So I mostly come to free tourneys, or ones with lower entry fees (The Neumont tourney was good for that).

So with the free amateur brackets, I could still come and gauge my skill against others, and train a bit, without risking money I don't have. And once I start doing well there, I would feel more comfortable paying the money for the real deal.

So, tldr:
1. Amateur bracket is a good idea
2. They should be free buy-ins, but still set in a tourney-style competition.
3. ?
4. Profit!

ma dude you're not the only one without the moneyz haha
the main reason i don't go to weeklies is cause they cost more then
our monthlies. so **** that
they've been dwindling in attendance because of that so no one wins more than like 18$ anyway
weeklies is a bad idea imo
people just stop going to them
don't take that last statement as an order
it was a generalization that people stop going after awhile

 

[Tsuteto]

ma dude you're not the only one without the moneyz haha
the main reason i don't go to weeklies is cause they cost more then
our monthlies. so **** that
they've been dwindling in attendance because of that so no one wins more than like 18$ anyway
weeklies is a bad idea imo
people just stop going to them

WOW Devon. Really? You JUST decided to pull that **** on the community? Seriously bro, **** off. Don't mind you in person but this attitude is bull.

Everyone else: Thanks for the input thus far. Glad to see a lot of interest, and doing free amateur brackets to start with is seeming like the way to go. I'll do what I can to appease that.

 

[Death Arcana]

hahah what the **** did i do??
i just stated my opinion
and you can't deny how much the attendance of the weeklies have been lately
i heard it from multiple people that the cost is just too much for this weekly stuff
tane,billnye,me,rocky,etc
i always been against weeklies ever since forever
it detracts from real monthly tourneys
i edited what i said since you seem to take it out of context
i NEVER said to stop going to weeklies that statement was a generalization
of what happens when you have weeklies so often
"People just stop going"

 

[Tsuteto]

hahah what the **** did i do??
i just stated my opinion
and you can't deny how much the attendance of the weeklies have been lately
i heard it from multiple people that the cost is just too much for this weekly stuff
tane,billnye,me,rocky,etc
i always been against weeklies ever since forever
it detracts from real monthly tourneys

Then how about, oh, you know, giving a factual statement of people's opinions like you just did rather than just saying they shouldn't happen. It's usually the way to go rather than saying "it's stupid people should stop going". Other people enjoy the weeklies. Pricing can change, but I won't if no one speaks up about it.

Again, community aspect. Give input, I'll work with what is available, like not doing a lesser entry fee for amateur brackets

 

[Death Arcana]

now your putting words in my mouth
did i say they were stupid? no
i said they were unnecessary

and it goes without saying
it sucks when you show up to a weekly and you are the only one there
or if someone wants to play someone else but they didn't show to that weekly

 

[Jekyll]

FWIW, I agree with everything Z'z said above. A buy-in for the amateur bracket would work against the more important points of having the amateur bracket. If people want to feel like they're playing for a prize in the amateur bracket, just give the winner a refund of the venue/tournament fee.

Also, I miss u guize

 

[BillNyeTheSamusGuy]

Why does it matter about the buy in? Money isn't what is determining attendance. Pumpinz, Snap, Roguay, all have gone to the weeklies and they live in north utah. The second tourney I went to was in Ogden. I mentioned it before but people will pay lots of money to play this game.

Taking money out from the pot isn't an issue either. So 1st place makes a little less? School is back in session, if the byu page is any indication there are a ton of college smash players who aren't quite at the competitive level but think they play pretty well. If we could cater to them (and increase attendance) then it would compensate for splitting the pot further.

Or we can have the same 8 people that show up at our smaller events get bopped by the same 3 people and the payouts will continue to be "$18" as stated earlier. Y'know, if we decide that's better than upsetting the small pool of people who take events.

Growing the scene will take an investment. If we don't invest with attendance because of some perceived lack of value (devon...), we can at least sacrifice a couple bucks to show newer players what competing is.

If we don't risk it all we're doing is saying we're doing something different while not actually doing anything different.

(btw attendance is going down on the weeklies because... everyone thinks attendance is going down on the weeklies. If everyone who thought it wasn't worth it to go, went anyways, we would suddenly have a pretty fair turn out.)

my last comment got buried at the end of the page so I'm tagging you @ Tsuteto

 

[Pumpinz]

net threw his match at neumont and rigged the bracket against me someone ban him

Nah man Net told me he his DK was legit better than his marth. That match was 100% real you just salty bruh.

when pumpkinz had a fest

That hurts.....

 

[Death Arcana]

if you don't think money is an issue with attendance
you are delusional
thats a lot of gas
and frontrunner isn't cheap either
weeklies were for the local scene
why hasn't layton gotten theirs yet?
and why the **** is there no melee in slc
and no brawl in provo

 

[net1234]

who sucks at brawl and wants to teach me to play brawl? school is hosting a tourney and ima take sum superscrub money

 

[ElectricCitrus]

and no brawl in provo

This. I've been working on getting Brawl players involved because I know a ton--fairly scrubby mindm but they don't have anywhere to go for it outside of some of the stuff I run.

Speaking of which I run free weeklies and so far we've had pretty solid attendance (around 15), granted we're doing them at a game store on the same night said store hosts Pokemon stuff but I honestly was surprised when I came on here and saw weeklies cost money. :I


That said I think what also might be dropping attendance is that tuesday is kind of an odd day. Not just for smash, but just in general I've found trying to do stuff tuesday nights hasn't worked out the best. (Keeping in mind this was with DnD and have fun trying to wrangle together people to play DnD despite everyone saying how much they want to play DnD #gmproblems).

 

[BillNyeTheSamusGuy]

if you don't think money is an issue with attendance
you are delusional
thats a lot of gas

It is a lot of gas, but a lot of our scene pays it anyway. Positing that less money equals more attendance is, at the very least, flawed; considering our biggest events also are our most expensive: comic con, fan x, salt fest. I bet Tsu has even more data on this because he's run a lot of tournaments at different price points and those points don't show a correlation with attendance.

 

[net1234]

fest at rjs 2522 horsshoe circle. shoes off enter through the side door. only consume substances with rj outside. **** off the pool table park in the street

 

[Meleeruler]

Jekyll we miss you too man

 

[Reptile (Kira)]

I'm fine with paying $10, $20 for an event I know will be big (such as Neumont or Salt Fest) but $10 a week, for 8-man tourneys? I'm not ready to pay that much, even if there were more people there.

 

[Z'zgashi]

It is a lot of gas, but a lot of our scene pays it anyway. Positing that less money equals more attendance is, at the very least, flawed; considering our biggest events also are our most expensive: comic con, fan x, salt fest. I bet Tsu has even more data on this because he's run a lot of tournaments at different price points and those points don't show a correlation with attendance.

A lot of people do, yes, but there is also a large number of people not going because they dont have the money to. Not everyone is in the same position, and asking for more money from them wont bring thosepeople out, especially when a large majority of newcomers from smash 4 will be high scool/college kids with either no job or small income.

Back when I was a TO, i was short almost always on money to enter my own stuff and would end up money matching someone for the $5 to enter before I started. Only reason that worked for me was cuz apparently i was decent enough back then to beat people, but i can guarantee you none of these people will be practiced enough to do that.

 

[Tomacawk]

*peeks head from around corner*
back in my day you had to improve and deal with losing to play more matches. $1 moneymatch the better players to get your practice if you're not satisfied from the tourny itself. if you want it go get it scrublords nobody will hold your hand
*scuttles back to illinois*

 

[ElectricCitrus]

See while I'm more than willing to get bodied by better players and try to learn, not everyone is and if we want a larger scene we can't assume all newbs will feel the same way. :/

 

[Death Arcana]

who sucks at brawl and wants to teach me to play brawl? school is hosting a tourney and ima take sum superscrub money

you don't go to school net
its ok cocaine's a hell of a drug

I'm fine with paying $10, $20 for an event I know will be big (such as Neumont or Salt Fest) but $10 a week, for 8-man tourneys? I'm not ready to pay that much, even if there were more people there.

THISSSSS

 

[MassProducedWaffles]

As I said before ill start going to the taylorsville weekly if they had melee, along with 2-4 other people

 

[Baky]

I disappeared from the real world for a week playing terraria.

Anyways, someone said something about updating the stats thread? And when are we getting full results for SLCC or did I miss it?

Also, I love the idea of an amateur bracket. I'm the University of Utah Smash club "guy" and will be going full-steam ahead with the release of the Smash 4 game. IMO our University clubs are our scene's most important assets for long-term growth.

 

[Roguay]

I disappeared from the real world for a week playing terraria.

ayee thats my jam

 

[ElectricCitrus]

So what I'm figuring is the consensus of things we need to do:
-Use our university and local groups to our advantage
-Find some way to incentivize amateurs to consistently compete
-Be open, and not snarky about the events we are doing. Again there's no reason facebook events and pages for the scene need to be private. :/ I'm guilty of this, but I'll be changing that shortly.

 

[devo_]

So where are these weeklies held? I'm in provo and id love to play melee, PM, or sm4sh!

 

[Tomacawk]

See while I'm more than willing to get bodied by better players and try to learn, not everyone is and if we want a larger scene we can't assume all newbs will feel the same way. :/

it's a competitive game. at what point do you stop caving in to the demands of newer players? they have no stake in the scene. They were not here keeping it alive in the 2000's. They were never paying entry fees, bringing the setups, pushing the spirit of the competition. Now they are here in big numbers because they want to be a part of what we have. So why are we catering so hard to the people that have given us nothing? We don't need to do anything else to make them stay. the community is incredible and the tournament experience is a chance to push yourself.

Saying that we should cater so hard to these newer players to improve the scene and drive up attendance makes no sense to me. That is not how we got to where we are and we don't need to incentivize people any further imo. If they don't see the value in spending their time and money at these tournaments, seeing how they can apply hard work, patience, and practice to better themselves, and build friendships that will no doubt transcend their "normal life" companions, then they aren't the kind of people worth keeping around anyway.

edit-don't get me wrong, i'm all for making changes and i get that you can never improve without making changes. but running these extra brackets strain an already very tight schedule for bigger tournaments. I don't see anyway to implement this without taking away from the experience. It also segregates the "noobs" from the "pros" which intensifies this idea that "they are pro and unlike us". mingling everybody together really makes you see we're all just normal ****in' doods, the only difference is some of us are willing to work hard and pursue what we want to do. I've been inspired a LOT by the pro players I've met and come to call friends, in many ways beyond smash. Why take that away from the newer players, usually younger people at that?

 

[ElectricCitrus]

I'm not saying we should cater hardcore to new players, don't make a mountain out of a molehill. I'm just saying we need to find ways to mitigate losing players who get flustered after one bad tournament showing and end up dropping out of the scene or complaining about it.

Granted a case could be made for players like this being toxic for the scene, and I'd agree but as of now we need to build our numbers before we start tackling other issues. :/

EDIT: Just read your part about being inspired by playing Pros, and I totally agree with this. I think everyone gets inspired. The problem is there are some pro players who might not be as willing to assist newer players.

But that speaks to an issue of inclusiveness which imo I've never had a problem with here in the utah scene.