up throw

[Lovage 805]

fox's best throw - what can YOU do out of uthrow
*the following is vs. spacies probably at low percent

up smash
up air
back air
double shine (on the ground)
shine back air (on the ground)
shine back air
re-grab
utilt

add more

 

[RaynEX]

dtilt
fsmash (with d.i.)
dsmash (near an edge)
SH dair re-grab
SH dair -> thunders/waveshine
Fair->grab


One I've been trying out is fair->reverse utilt. I try to be as creative as possible so my playing doesn't get repetitive and boring.

 

[Lovage 805]

oh and how could we forget the KDJ

uthrow grounded shine wavedash back, running usmash on the missed tech
OR
uthrow grounded shine wavedash back, jab reset -> ???

thats the lovage

 

[RaynEX]

Uthrow->shine->wavedashback->shine again->chase and usmash

 

[Lovage 805]

hmm sounds ****
is that with perfect wave dash or bad di or both?

SEE this thread has good discussion lol

 

[KosukeKGA]

I'm a fan of the U-Tilt, myself! I use it too much sometimes, though...

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

Does shffl uair work at 0%? I can only get it to work starting at 10%. Maybe im timing it wrong

shine->tech chase is fun aswell, my friend used to do that to me in fawks dittos

umm shine-fair? lol (doubt that works on humans)

you can also uthrow->jab->regrab, not really any point in doing that (on spacies) tho lol (you can just regrab)


if you're against falcon you do uthrow->waveshine->jab or another shine. It's not escapeable until after the jab/second shine cuz they wont touch the ground inbetween (if you're fast enough) (it combos in training mode btw)
they can get out through di:ing down and away i think but noone does that (since noone knows that touching the ground cancels the shines hitstun)

So you can do uthrow->waveshine->jab->regrab if they're not expecting it. or waveshine->jab->chase their roll if you think they're gonna roll. And uthrow->waveshine->shine ***** as a low % edgeguard/shinespike set-up

I think it is possible to do uthrow->waveshine->turnaround utilt and have it combo btw (on falcon). I've gotten uthrow->waveshine->ftilt to combo, and ftilt and utilt are just as fast, so it should work... It's really hard if it's possible though


BTW a **** combo against all fast fallers at 40%ish percent, if you're fairly close to the edge.... Uthrow->utilt, and if they don't DI the utilt (they often won't to avoid getting regrabbed)... CHARGE AN FSMASH (yes it combos! utilt hitstun is to good lol) and hit them off stage, then proceed to edgeguard


unrelated to the topic: how do you change colors on your name? >.>

 

[4% APR]

I go for the chaingrab pretty much everytime. It's a lot more reliable than trying to combo I think

 

[RaynEX]

I go for the chaingrab pretty much everytime. It's a lot more reliable than trying to combo I think

You're turning into m2k. CGing is what makes Fox dittos slow.

Even in tourny I wouldn't do that till death. Its just plain boring.

Agreed everyone?

 

[everlasting yayuhzz]

<_< I'll do that **** if they do it first.

Or...if it's a Falco. **** Falco.

 

[de_gLory^]

<_< I'll do that **** if they do it first.

Or...if it's a Falco. **** Falco.

qft man, falco sucks balls xDD

i like to do also grab -> utilt (only if they r not di'ng) -> nair -> nair -> dash attack -> fsmash/ shine


also a very nice already said choice is the kdj

but chaingrab+usmash ***** 2...

at zero percent i do ALWAYS uthrow -> usmash -> jab reset -> regrab -> usmash -> nair or smth like that (against ff)

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

I always CG if it's FD (even in friendlies, im an ******* lol)
on other stages I usmash or uair or some other combo, or platform tech-chase if it's on a platform
if you hate it so much you can just ban FD in fox dittos lol

 

[Lovage 805]

cg is so noob
uthrow is like the most versatile move ever why would you choose to do the most boring option

 

[JonaDiaper]

I go for the chaingrab pretty much everytime. It's a lot more reliable than trying to combo I think

maybe your just bad at combo'ing, or maybe you just really wanna win. chaingrabbing is for people that like to have boring gay matches. or they just have no other way to win. sure it takes skill, but i think making your own comboes and reacting to peoples DI is much more fun and it look better then up throwing until you up smash

 

[Lovage 805]

^ tru


cging takes out all creativity with fox, brawl status

 

[RaynEX]

cg is so noob
uthrow is like the most versatile move ever why would you choose to do the most boring option

QFT.

I said I wouldn't use it in Fox dittos. Vs. Falco is a different story. He usually does 60 or death out of a single hit, and Fox needs to answer back. CGing vs. Falco is like Fox's version of pillar - except its easier. I encourage all Fox's to cg Falco, otherwise that match-up becomes *****-hard.

I was getting ***** by lambchopz it friendlies at event 52 when I didn't kill him out of a single grab or do some combo-edge-guard. I had to be gay back, because he'd kill me off a shine usually. I started cging and my whole foxy world came together.

 

[Lovage 805]

yea cging is kinda legit vs. falco....but i dunno i still dont like it

 

[RaynEX]

good luck beating eggm, chopz or any other good falco then. ^_^

 

[JonaDiaper]

you can just shine gay them. thats like 50 times easier.

 

[ArcNatural]

you can just shine gay them. thats like 50 times easier.

From a throw too.

 

[Lovage 805]

****er i dont WANNA beat eggm or chops

first i gotta beat larry lurr lol

oh wait socal joke nvm

 

[replicate]

SHUT THE FFUKC up lovage

complaining about fox gay



you can upthrow a falcon at like 30% and just crossup bair and utilt him until he dies

 

[Da Shuffla]

I usually go for the CG> Utilt juggle. Didn't know you could do this much. Don't these other combos require A LOT of prediction?

 

[Shai Hulud]

You're turning into m2k. CGing is what makes Fox dittos slow.

Even in tourny I wouldn't do that till death. Its just plain boring.

Agreed everyone?

I'm pretty sure you can't CG Fox / Falco anywhere close to death...unless they keep DIing away like a noob. With no DI they can shine out relatively early...don't remember exactly when but I'm thinking 40 - 50 ish. I usually just play it safe and usmash if they don't DI once they're in the upper 30s.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

If you utilt around 40-50ish you can keep the cg going if they di the utilt. If they don't di the utilt you can shffl an uair and combo that into another arial, and that's like 70-80 dmg
or you could charge an fsmash (it actually combos) and get them off the stage and proceed to edgeguard

but yhea you cant 0-death cg them

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Rest?

...

 

[Shai Hulud]

If you utilt around 40-50ish you can keep the cg going if they di the utilt. If they don't di the utilt you can shffl an uair and combo that into another arial, and that's like 70-80 dmg
or you could charge an fsmash (it actually combos) and get them off the stage and proceed to edgeguard

but yhea you cant 0-death cg them

Seems a lot of times the utilt / usmash will get smash DI'd to where you can't follow up. At least that seems to happen to me a lot. I can almost never go 0 - death.

Anybody know what % you can do SHFFL uair from no DI?

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

Anybody know what % you can do SHFFL uair from no DI?

It will combo until atleast 40-50% (the utilt has massive hitstun). if you utilt at a higher % you could just fj uair, or fj bair and edgeguard
if you meant the earliest % idk

I never had that problem w/ the utilt. unless you utilt at a unnecessarily early % it should work
i can almost never follow up a di'd usmash though, i almost never use it in combos. I dont even think it's possible to follow up a correctly di'd usmash, but I may be wrong

 

[4% APR]

maybe your just bad at combo'ing, or maybe you just really wanna win. chaingrabbing is for people that like to have boring gay matches. or they just have no other way to win. sure it takes skill, but i think making your own comboes and reacting to peoples DI is much more fun and it look better then up throwing until you up smash

friendlies are another story. I don't just cg 0-death in friendlies but if money is on the line I don't see any reason not to be as gay as possible

 

[soap]

friendlies are another story. I don't just cg 0-death in friendlies but if money is on the line I don't see any reason not to be as gay as possible

if there are other reliable combo options id rather do that because to me its easier to just start a quick combo than to repeatedly follow DI and regrab, its just more chances that i mess up and they escape.

 

[Ryan-K]

plus usmash does a ridiculous amount of damage

 

[RaynEX]

If I get a grab on Fox its usually death. They can shine out at exactly 55% with no d.i. when it comes to Fox's chain-grab.

What you do is get them up to around 50, then utilt. They'll most likely d.i. this. You follow the d.i. with a full hop nair or bair and FF to either another grab or usmash. If you get the grab, you charge an usmash and their stock disappears.

Its not that simple, but I was giving you an example of how easy it is to kill using CG. To play this game at the top level, you NEED to kill out of grabs.

 

[4% APR]

if there are other reliable combo options id rather do that because to me its easier to just start a quick combo than to repeatedly follow DI and regrab, its just more chances that i mess up and they escape.

I guess it just comes down to personal preference. A fox is probably gonna kill from a grab no matter what he chooses to do. It's just easier for me to re-grab than to follow a combo

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

If you get the grab, you charge an usmash and their stock disappears.

Sadly this won't kill in PAL **** you ntsc foxes and your overpowered usmash

 

[RaynEX]

won't charged usmashes kill other spacies in excesses of 100%? How about uthrow->uair after 105%?

That stuff kills in NTSC without any hassle. Usmash kills marth at 70% usually if you get the drill and waveshine into it. Uair kills Sheik if you grab her anywhere afer 85%.

Is that all the same or?

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

Uair is the same, usmash is weaker

So my kills in fox dittos (and vs falco) are usually uthrow uair if I didn't get an edgeguard off. Actually most of my kills are uthrow uair (unless it's against a char that uthrow uair doesn't work against)

A fresh usmash won't kill marth until 90% on FD here (no DI). im so jealous off the ntsc usmash lol >.>
(and marth is even slightly lighter in PAL i've heard, not sure tho and i dunno how big the difference is if it's true. i havent played ntsc enough to say)

EDIT: After a few more tests, you CAN kill a fox with uthrow->charged usmash on FD at atleast 90%, BUT if they DI correctly (which they will) they won't die. And beyond that (ie percentages where a charged usmash would kill even if they di'd correctly), they can jump away from uthrow to charged usmash. So on FD it won't work on a player who knows what he's doing
That said, it can work as ko combo on stages like green greens and maybe YS (even they di correctly)

 

[Cactuar]

good luck beating eggm, chopz or any other good falco then. ^_^

I do this all the time without CG.

To play this game at the top level, you NEED to kill out of grabs.

Psssshhhhhh.

 

[RaynEX]

You're Cactus though. Thats a whole other story.

: /

 

[Cactuar]

Hahaha. True.

 

[Ryan-K]

(and marth is even slightly lighter in PAL i've heard, not sure tho and i dunno how big the difference is if it's true. i havent played ntsc enough to say)

the most significant difference is that marth doesn't fall from shine in ntsc, doesn't he fall from shine in pal as in he can tech it?