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Up-b Cancel Frame and Hitbox Data (complete with gifs, and now OoS data)

Discussion in 'Doctor Mario' started by schmooblidon, Nov 18, 2014.

  1. schmooblidon

    schmooblidon
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    Smash Journeyman

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Messages:
    481
    There are two methods to perform an up-b cancel. From standardtoaster's hitbox guide:

    Method 1:

    Frame 3: forward
    Frame 4: back
    Dr. Mario will end up facing back

    Method 2:

    Frame 2: anywhere but full forward
    Frame 3: back
    Frame 4: anywhere but back,
    diagonals included (upback, downback)

    Method 1:


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/MinorSeriousKakarikis

    0 -
    1 - up+b
    2 -
    3 - forward
    (hitbox)
    4 - back (move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag)
    5 -
    .
    .
    .
    34 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)

    With hitlag


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/VainVibrantArabianhorse

    You have to hit forward on frame 3, but have 3 frames during hitlag to start pressing back. You must be pressing back on frame 7

    0 -
    1 - up+b
    2 -
    3 - forward
    (hitbox)
    4 - | (window to start holding back) (hitlag)
    5 - | (hitlag)
    6 - | (hitlag)
    7 - | must be pressing back - move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag
    8 -
    .
    .
    .
    37 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)

    Method 2:


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/SpiritedGentleGhostshrimp

    0 -
    1 - up+b
    2 - anywhere but full forward
    3 - back
    (hitbox)
    4 - anywhere but back (move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag)
    5 -
    .
    .
    .
    34 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)

    With hitlag


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/EmbellishedSpotlessHarborseal

    You have to hit back on frame 3, but have 3 frames during hitlag to move the stick anywhere but back, so:

    0 -
    1 - up+b
    2 - anywhere but full forward
    3 - back
    (hitbox)
    4 - | (window for anywhere but back) (hitlag)
    5 - | (hitlag)
    6 - | (hitlag)
    7 - | must be anywhere but back - move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag
    8 -
    .
    .
    .
    37 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)


    Edit: The gifs have somewhere down the line been a tad messed up. They are still accurate but the initial wait frame is shown 3 times before the first frame of the up-b starts, and the ending wait frame has gone. Where it says LANDINGFALLSPECIAL 28.13 in the top right, that is the very last frame of lag, and the next is a wait frame.


    Out of Shield:

    Fatest:


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/EllipticalEquatorialBullfrog

    (using method 2 with hitlag)
    0 - Shielding
    1 - Shield + Up
    (goes into jumpsquat)
    2 - Up + B
    3 - anywhere but full forward
    4 - back
    (hitbox)
    5 - | (window for anywhere but back) (hitlag)
    6 - | (hitlag)
    7 - | (hitlag)
    8 - | must be anywhere but back - move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag
    9 -
    .
    .
    .
    38 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)

    Slowest:


    Direct link for better control of frames - http://gfycat.com/ShamefulInsecureDevilfish

    (using method 2 with hitlag)
    0 - Shielding
    1 - Shield + Up
    (goes into jumpsquat)
    2 - (jumpsquat)
    3 - (jumpsquat)
    4 - (jumpsquat)
    5 - (first frame airbourne)
    6 - Up + B
    7 - anywhere but full forward
    8 - back
    (hitbox)
    9 - | (window for anywhere but back) (hitlag)
    10 - | (hitlag)
    11 - | (hitlag)
    12 - | must be anywhere but back - move cancels and you are in speciallandinglag
    13 -
    .
    .
    .
    42 - Back to wait
    (can now move/attack)

    (note: you can actually up+b cancel after the second frame airbourne if you short hop, but irl you will be holding up and will fullhop)

    quick thought: why have I never seen a randall lag canceled up-b cancel? it would be the ultimate humiliation to someone trying to be saved by him, and then you could easily combo it into any aerial.
     
    #1 schmooblidon, Nov 18, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2014
  2. RVKYS

    RVKYS
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    Smash Apprentice

    Joined:
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    111
    Location:
    Provo, UT
    easily the sickest character-specific AT in the game.
     
  3. Mr.Lemon

    Mr.Lemon
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    Smash Journeyman

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2010
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    Stoneham MA
    oh my godlike
     
  4. schmooblidon

    schmooblidon
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    Smash Journeyman

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Messages:
    481
    I'm glad you like. I am going to do another frame data post on all doc's more precise AT. On my list is, upair aerial interrupt, platform warp, platform warp with aerial, ptp, dash attack to ledge, ledge getup attack cape glitch. If theres anything you can think of let me know.
     
    Mr.Lemon likes this.
  5. Shibbypod

    Shibbypod
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    BIM

    Joined:
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    Location:
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    About time someone stepped it up and brought this frame data out. Thank you! Very useful, and presented nicely.
     
    #5 Shibbypod, Nov 20, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2014
  6. Shibbypod

    Shibbypod
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    BIM

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Midland
    Maybe there is frame data for things like how soon you need to press B after you jump to full hop, Pill, waveland/aerial, or things similar. I am just curious about windows like that.
     
    #6 Shibbypod, Nov 20, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2014
  7. schmooblidon

    schmooblidon
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    Smash Journeyman

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    Literally seconds away from posting the MEGATHREAD hehe, version 1, that I've been working on. It's open to suggestions too, so keep em coming.
     
  8. jihaeng29

    jihaeng29
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    Smash Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2015
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    14
    Location:
    Canada
    So for method 1, do you need to return the control stick to neutral after inputting back? Also does back mean exactly 90` and 270` positions (depending on what direction you are facing) or is there a window of angles?
     
  9. schmooblidon

    schmooblidon
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    Smash Journeyman

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Messages:
    481
    After frame 4, none of your inputs matter, as that is the frame that upb cancels. So no, you do not need to return to neutral after hitting back.

    Back and Forward do not necessarily need to be 90 or 270, and just need to be past the X deadzone. Hold up and whilst standing roll the stick towards left or right, at the point that you start walking is pretty much the point where forward/back is read for this tech.
     
  10. JipC

    JipC
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  11. Hobs_

    Hobs_
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    Smash Journeyman

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    Why isn't it knocking the other Doc back in that clip?
     
  12. JipC

    JipC
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    Smash Journeyman

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    20XX hack pack, set invincibility by pressing X+Up
     
  13. Hobs_

    Hobs_
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    Smash Journeyman

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    Oh good, thought I was going insane.
     
  14. Superw0rri0

    Superw0rri0
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    Smash Ace

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    Felt like teasing you.... I actually did it 5 times but the 5th got cut off in editing
    To be honest it took me like 5 minutes to get this right XD

     
    #14 Superw0rri0, Feb 11, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2016

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