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Tournament discussion (Georgia Brawl)

Purple

Hi guys!
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
10,383
Location
Duluth, Georgia
What do you guys see that we lack in Georgia when it comes to tourneys?

Usually tourneys are extremely hyped and people are willing to actually bring setups of stream and laptops to events in order to make events seem bigger and more cosmetic.

That's the main thing i see, what else have you guys noticed?
 

bigman40

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
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Just another day.
I'm hoping to get GA on the map for bigger tourneys. I know that everyone would want it to happen, and I got some people that would come on certain requirements. I might be at college, but I'll be doing what I can to help and set **** up for GA.

Can we get anyone that has experience running major tourneys, players that would like to travel, and of the sort? I want to hear what you guys have to say.
 

GTR!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Messages
392
Location
Hiram, GA
I think a big problem in georgia is that people dont have a want to get better at Smash Brother.

Either they dont feel like they can beat MK or snake or falco or wario etc and complain about their problems intead of going to the person they lost to or asking for tips so that next time they play they will improve. Also not until recently no one in GA has wnated to get better at Melee because they felt like they were so far behind in the metagame and stuff that it would be hard to catch up.

So basically from what ive seen people just want to quit the game and not come to tourneys instead of try and get better and have fun with people they like hanging out with. Thats just what i have observed from my 4 months of competative brawl. So feel free to correct me if i am mistaken.
 

T3h Albino

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Messages
3,160
Location
Snellville GA
oh u mad?

10umads?

now that we have scatz being mad covered (smirk). Anyhow GA has a lot of untouched players in other places. I can't tell you how many players ive seen in chats and on aib who have never heard of waba and don't know GA actually has tournaments. We need to reach out to these players and get them to be active in the community. I mean brawl is still a thriving game with lots of competition im sure if people knew where the tournaments were they'd be willing to go to them.
 

The Alpha Gundam

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 2, 2006
Messages
2,759
Location
(Columbus,Ga)
What do you guys see that we lack in Georgia when it comes to tourneys?

Usually tourneys are extremely hyped and people are willing to actually bring setups of stream and laptops to events in order to make events seem bigger and more cosmetic.

That's the main thing i see, what else have you guys noticed?
Lack of motivation
 

VietGeek

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
8,133
quit QQing and get better. Don't quit
what if i quit to play a better game?

i can attest to this...since i too am a donator...

what ga DOES have is a bunch of scrubs who suck at X game but are still willing to put money in the pot.

hence donator.

there's also a lack of mk in the brawl top 8. =<
 

T3h Albino

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Messages
3,160
Location
Snellville GA
well viet g
i may not win every tourney or hell even place top 5 every tourney but im always getting better. Just because you enter a tournament knowing you probably won't win doesn't mean you shouldn't enter. With eveyr tournament ive been to i've gotten better, and will continue to get better until i start winning. You shouldn't quit because "oh im not gonna do well all im doing is giving my money away" thats scrub mentality. You should try your best to beat everyone you can and try your best to get better at the game you're playing. With the lack of techskill this game requires it usually isn't about what you're doing wrong but mroeso what your opponent is doing right.
 

thegreatkazoo

Smash Master
Joined
May 31, 2009
Messages
3,128
Location
Atlanta, GA
I think a big problem in georgia is that people dont have a want to get better at Smash Brother.

Either they dont feel like they can beat MK or snake or falco or wario etc and complain about their problems intead of going to the person they lost to or asking for tips so that next time they play they will improve. Also not until recently no one in GA has wnated to get better at Melee because they felt like they were so far behind in the metagame and stuff that it would be hard to catch up.

So basically from what ive seen people just want to quit the game and not come to tourneys instead of try and get better and have fun with people they like hanging out with. Thats just what i have observed from my 4 months of competative brawl. So feel free to correct me if i am mistaken.
Hello, hasn't anybody noticed me?:confused:

Not to toot my own horn, but I have been wanting to step up my level of play for about two months and still no one has reached out.

If you ask me, we need to network to newbs--such as myself--a lot better.
 

bigman40

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
3,859
Location
Just another day.
Hello, hasn't anybody noticed me?:confused:

Not to toot my own horn, but I have been wanting to step up my level of play for about two months and still no one has reached out.

If you ask me, we need to network to newbs--such as myself--a lot better.
You were the one that talked about bringing a stream for commentating and such. Then I saw you saying that you'd be out of town. Kinda can't do anything when you not around lol. Either way, we need to get people wanting to play with other people, and make them want to get better. Hell, the people that don't post and live in GA, we need to get them to start talking with us so we can actually get to do things and setup stuff.

The less you guys communicate, the less stuff we can do, and the more complaining and quitting we get, the worse off GA is gonna end up. If you have a legit reason to quit, then w/e, but don't quit for lame reasons. You don't see the Melee scene doing that kind of ****.
 

thegreatkazoo

Smash Master
Joined
May 31, 2009
Messages
3,128
Location
Atlanta, GA
You were the one that talked about bringing a stream for commentating and such. Then I saw you saying that you'd be out of town. Kinda can't do anything when you not around lol. Either way, we need to get people wanting to play with other people, and make them want to get better. Hell, the people that don't post and live in GA, we need to get them to start talking with us so we can actually get to do things and setup stuff.

The less you guys communicate, the less stuff we can do, and the more complaining and quitting we get, the worse off GA is gonna end up. If you have a legit reason to quit, then w/e, but don't quit for lame reasons. You don't see the Melee scene doing that kind of ****.
Duly noted, and my apologies for getting my dates wrong, I had to move out of my apartment on Sunday so that's why I wasn't at SEB.

However, I would like to go to the WABA on the 15th-16th. I will have a TV and recording setup there. I will be back in town (for me, this is Midtown Atlanta). But every time I ask for a ride, no one takes up my offer (even when I offer to pay). What gives? :confused:
 

bigman40

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
3,859
Location
Just another day.
Duly noted, and my apologies for getting my dates wrong, I had to move out of my apartment on Sunday so that's why I wasn't at SEB.

However, I would like to go to the WABA on the 15th-16th. I will have a TV and recording setup there. I will be back in town (for me, this is Midtown Atlanta). But every time I ask for a ride, no one takes up my offer (even when I offer to pay). What gives? :confused:
Now that reason, I do not know. Normally, people that drive are willing to pick up others if they pay for gas. Do you know how to ride Marta Keep trying, or ask someone that lives relatively close to you, or drives near you when going to waba. I'm pretty sure they'll come get you.
 

Purple

Hi guys!
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
10,383
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Duluth, Georgia
lounis (dentedglass) from what i seen is usually the designated driver for events like waba weeklies, but because of work he hasn't been able to reach these weeklies himself.

While this is gentlemen's club, i feel that i'm going to call a mod out on you alby and vietg. i for one want the ga community to get better, and personally i feel people like me and scatz are one of the few people actually willing to do something about it, i'm goign to be renting out a spot in a month or two for a smash tourney just to get some experience in being a TO.

Thegreatkazoo - i personally think your stream would be greatly appreciated, if peopel can see what's going on down in ga, they can see thgat we actually have a community down here XD.

I was discussing with bigman crews with everyone, i originally was thinking of doing three man crews, but i would say maybe 7 on 7 or something like that, everyone puts 5 dollars in and play it out?

vietg - at one point, desu was a donator for melee tourneys, just as biglou and kismet2 were donators to desu's money fest. Hell, dyno and diablo were donators to fullmetal and tim, tim's still up there, but teams are slowly getting better o_o
 

Rayku

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 21, 2004
Messages
1,832
Location
Minot, ND
Crew Battle? Serious crew battle and not some **** no one wants to play through?

Count me in.

For some reason, whenever a "large" tournament is advertised in GA, no one ends up coming unless it's for Melee. I wonder why that is...

However, OoS is starting to come to Waba monthlies. Namely AL.
 

Player-3

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Messages
8,994
Location
Georgia
well fine
]:

im up for crews, as long as the snakes are on my team

snake snake snaaaaakeeeee
 

GTR!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Messages
392
Location
Hiram, GA
Crew Battle? Serious crew battle and not some **** no one wants to play through?

Count me in.

For some reason, whenever a "large" tournament is advertised in GA, no one ends up coming unless it's for Melee. I wonder why that is...

However, OoS is starting to come to Waba monthlies. Namely AL.
This is true, and the waba monthly attendance is getting pretty large i mean if a monthly for brawl had a 50+ attendance that wouldnt suprise me one bit. We just need more tourneys like that.

As for the reaching out the people who arent connected with the smash scene yet, I really am trying to get people into smash in my area. There arent too many who play but i have 4-5 who are decent at the game who i am trying to get ready to come to tourneys but like i said earlier and the main point im trying to make is that it takes a lot of time because we as a community dont want to bring in people who are new and fresh but then cut them down im a tournament and make them never wnat to come bakc you know?
 

Gerbil

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 22, 2006
Messages
2,651
Location
Columbus, GA
Lack of motivation
This.

Also to note is a fact that many of the older uh... "generation" of players are moving on with other things ya know? Myself included in that group. I like Smash, and it was fun, but for a while now I don't see myself returning on a regular basis. School and GF and possibly work soon are just too much to worry about rather than a video game.

More on the motivation thing. Somehow those active need to figure out a way to incite motivation. It comes to my mind with my experience (I've been tourny gaming since '03) that when people start to lose over and over, they get discouraged and eventually quit. Other people try to come on the scene, get beaten just once, and then realize that it's "too difficult" to catch up so they don't even bother.

So there are just a couple of problems you guys could address.
 

Purple

Hi guys!
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Mar 26, 2009
Messages
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Location
Duluth, Georgia
This.

Also to note is a fact that many of the older uh... "generation" of players are moving on with other things ya know? Myself included in that group. I like Smash, and it was fun, but for a while now I don't see myself returning on a regular basis. School and GF and possibly work soon are just too much to worry about rather than a video game.

More on the motivation thing. Somehow those active need to figure out a way to incite motivation. It comes to my mind with my experience (I've been tourny gaming since '03) that when people start to lose over and over, they get discouraged and eventually quit. Other people try to come on the scene, get beaten just once, and then realize that it's "too difficult" to catch up so they don't even bother.

So there are just a couple of problems you guys could address.
you can't incite motivation, no one motivated me to bring up this thread, that's something i looked to myself for, and felt that i enjoy this game enough to not see it die out over bull****, plus seeing people like larry do tournaments and take money out of their pocket for the community makes me want to do it as well.

No one mains luigi because of biglou going up to them and talking about luigi, they see his luigi do what it does best, ****, and people are inspired by that. We need people to step up to the plate and make things happen in our community, and honestly, no one steps up to the plate for melee either, they just have more rare occasions than we do (i.e GAwes).

another thing, i'm not talking about the community in this thread, i'm talking about our tournaments, what else do we need at our tournaments. Like streaming our matches, recording more of our matches, etc.
 

GA Peach

Smash Lord
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Nov 6, 2005
Messages
1,122
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CHUG! CHUG! CHUG!
This.

Also to note is a fact that many of the older uh... "generation" of players are moving on with other things ya know? Myself included in that group. I like Smash, and it was fun, but for a while now I don't see myself returning on a regular basis. School and GF and possibly work soon are just too much to worry about rather than a video game.
More on the motivation thing. Somehow those active need to figure out a way to incite motivation. It comes to my mind with my experience (I've been tourny gaming since '03) that when people start to lose over and over, they get discouraged and eventually quit. Other people try to come on the scene, get beaten just once, and then realize that it's "too difficult" to catch up so they don't even bother.

So there are just a couple of problems you guys could address.
what a lame *** excuse. not to put just Gerbil on blast, because i like ya Gerbil, but this is not really a valid excuse. do you know how many people in the SRK community are married with kids? a bunch. a big example is JasonL. for those of you who know who Jason is, that man is married, has a daughter and a full-time job. yet, he is a national level SC4 player and is one of the state's best in SF4 and competent in many other games. it comes down to this; if you want to do something, you'll find a way. if you don't, then you won't. all there is to it. people are just weak and will find excuses not to try and do things.
 

OmniOstrich

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Messages
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Location
Raleigh, NC
The best thing for the NC scene has been crews/rivalries and a central location.

The two biggest smash communities in NC are about an hour apart (greensboro and Raleigh) but Chapel Hill is between them. Shortening everyones drive to 30min helps a lot, hence billfests being huge 40-50 singles entrant events.

After all the old melee players retired/didnt like brawl there was little rivalry in NC and things got quiet for a while. When my crewmates started trash talking like crazy on the boards and scheduled a $5/person crew battle at a billfest it got huge turnout, and the entire tournament stopped to watch the event. Ever since then the amount of tournaments hosted and overall attendance has increased.

We also have been doing a pretty good job of inviting new players to events and carpooling to make sure everyone gets there.

Just a few tips from a once small community.
 

Gerbil

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 22, 2006
Messages
2,651
Location
Columbus, GA
Heh I know my john is weak, but I put it out there as one of the many possibilities on an overall list. I mean, let's think of a couple of other players that disappear without real reason for a long time.

Remember Blake? I have no idea what the hell happened to him after.... Devotion?

Ares has made one or two random appearances the past year, but isn't seen for his own reasons.

Where's Chewie?

Alpha has quit like... 3 times LOL.



Not that any of them/us/me have/don't have valid excuses or not, the point I want across in the thread is that people DO come up with reasons not to play, and it's the community's job to incite motivation and excitement as reasons to continue playing and to introduce new players to the scenes.


To address Perv's reply about tournies as a whole:

Overall tournament "improvement" would keep the tournaments alive and have people more willing to return. Part of that is maximizing all your resources. People like tournaments that run smooth and have more to offer. You brought up Live Stream, and you're right, a Live Stream would definitely attract attention for viewers, and thus potential new participants. Other little "perks" could be a large venue, housing, multiple day tournaments, high cash output for prizes, etc etc.

I always see entry fees at like... 5$ and then the first place ends up being only 40$. That player won their gas money back, congrats.

Definitely bigger money is something to consider. When people host bi-weeklies, I used to think "cool, they'll take a cut from the pot, and put it toward something that rocks later down the line like the Innsomnia series." Maybe I just havn't read enough of the boards, but I don't see much of that going on. If it IS going on, then someone needs to hold their bigass tourny with a large pot lol.

Offer OOS incentive. Some tournaments like to offer some sort of OOS pot or something. Most of GA's past Melee tournaments were supported by OOS for a good while. If they are to keep supporting GA tournies, then there has to be a reason to actually show up.

Part of what made my tournaments successful in both Halo and Melee (successful being 50 people at the least every time for Melee, roughly 20 or so for my weekly Halo tournies) was that my venue was large, had good T.V.s, had space to move around, bathrooms (though not the greatest LOL, and I think Marty would remember this due to his Worst Bathroom Ever video), and hell, my venue had a cafe. We stocked all sorts of snacks and foods and drinks, and there were several good places to eat within a 1 minute walking distance. Even my final tournament I held at my college, I gave the thread a map and a list of everything going down. It was very effective

Good advertising also drags people out. Hype can only go so far. If you're going to hype a tournament, it needs to live up to that hype, otherwise it will flop. If you advertise a tourny to have 20+ T.V.s for play, MAKE SURE THEY ARE THERE lol. If you say you'll have drinks and food on hand for sale, make sure it's there. Reflex's Melee tournament in AL said he would have pizza, hotdogs, and sodas/water throughout the day. He provided, and tons of people loved it and showed up to it.

Location of tournaments is important. In fact, DIVERSE locations is important. One thing I noticed with you Brawlers, MOST of your stuff focuses around Waba. Waba is cool and all, but without large tournaments spreading out, you will eventually discourage the weaker players from traveling so far every time for one tournament. Melee was partially successful because we had tournies running throughout the Atlanta area, Columbus, and Conyers. I also remeber some in Peachtree City too.

As I get more food for thought, I'll post more on my opinions. I hope this gives insight to potential problems (and I don't think I addressed everything or even the right things, but there you have it.)

And in no way was I bashing anyone in this post. :)
 

T3h Albino

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Messages
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Snellville GA
Like I said ~RTG~ is down to accept all crew battles 7v7 5v5 3v3 any of them. Anyway i'd be down to go to your tournament jamaal *shrug* just don't suck pl0x ;B. Getting the people who live far away to go to tourneys is a major issue. I know about 10 people who live in far away area's that love smash but just can't seem to get to tourneys. Some of them are kids who's parents aren't really willing to drive 2hours for smash. Problem?
 

Purple

Hi guys!
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
10,383
Location
Duluth, Georgia
Like I said ~RTG~ is down to accept all crew battles 7v7 5v5 3v3 any of them. Anyway i'd be down to go to your tournament jamaal *shrug* just don't suck pl0x ;B. Getting the people who live far away to go to tourneys is a major issue. I know about 10 people who live in far away area's that love smash but just can't seem to get to tourneys. Some of them are kids who's parents aren't really willing to drive 2hours for smash. Problem?
no, it's not a problem.

I want you to realize JUST how much time in advance this tournament has been set down, 85+ days in advance starting tomorrow. Practically every job in existance can call out that far in advance and be in no risk of getting fired.

No one should have an excuse to make enough money to get a ride with someone, asking their parents to go out on a weekend for an outing planned many months in advance, almost everyone should be legit to go.

As for OoS, the farther away from GA we go , the bigger the expectancy needs to be. For example, in order for someone from southern SC to come here, they probably would want maybe 40 entrants, basically a waba monthly. however from texas to get here, they would want maybe 100.

This is my opinion for the tourney that i'm setting up, we need to first advertise this to the georgia community and get people willing to come, so we have a nice hefty list of people, willing to come to a tourney, with that list, we advertise to bordering states, with those states interested, we go to other states once again, and that's how big tournaments are formed :). Chances are this one won't exactly flub, but won't be as big as i'm anticipating, especially on the first shot.

Also alby, i would appreciate you not bad mouthing my tourney already :mad:

@gerbil - while i'm surprisingly not going to write a wall, but i'm taking everything you said into high consideration, what should i offer to OoS? and while i have my own venue, i'm interested in the venue that you were discussing, how much did it cost to rent it out?
 

Gerbil

Smash Champion
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Apr 22, 2006
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Columbus, GA
@gerbil - while i'm surprisingly not going to write a wall, but i'm taking everything you said into high consideration, what should i offer to OoS? and while i have my own venue, i'm interested in the venue that you were discussing, how much did it cost to rent it out?
My venue is shut down; I was routing my tournaments through a LAN center here in Columbus. They only required a 5$ door fee that noone had a problem paying and the LAN center knew they would also make money off of their cafe. It was a win/win for them to let me host with their building. I used it for 3 years. My second venue was actually my own college campus, and because I am part of an organization, I was able to rent out a conference room (hefty size actually) at no charge to the players. Reflex used a venue across the river in Phenix City Alabama, and if I have it right, he paid 50$ to rent it out, and then spent maybe 100$ on food/drinks. I can't remember if he charged a door fee or not, but if he did, the door fee certainly covered rental fee and food.

During The Greatest Melee Tournament Ever Since Brawl Came Out (long name I know) Prac asked a friend to help hook him up with a church as a venue. The venue was surprisingly large enough, had a shower and fully functional restrooms, and tons of places to sleep.

A venue can be easy to come by if you know where to look and know people that could help: churches, gymnasiums, possibly colleges/high schools, LAN centers, warehouses, etc. Some people have even used their large basements as venues lol, and they worked out perfectly for the most part.

As far as OOS incentive, this is where I don't really know how to explain. I never offered up any additional OOS pot like Smash Aid (I think) or other large tournaments. Someone like Marty (GAPeach) or GAWes would know way more on how that works.

Now, what you COULD potentially offer OOS (and this will take some work) is the idea of Bi-Weeklies at first, keeping a small % of the pot aside, and putting it into a future pot of a larger tournament. One of the greatest series I can give an example of is the Innsomnia Series (INN). PrinceZane hosted Bi-Weeklies and kept a % of the pot from each of those tournaments. When he announced the major tournaments and told exactly how much money EXTRA was going into the pot (a couple hundred dollars actually) people were immediately interested in going. I went to INNV where players like Darkrain and Forward showed up because there was a lot of money up for grabs.

The essence of that is, good players will see that there is a LOT of money up for the winner, and then they'll see that the rules are to their liking, and that makes them willing to go. It makes sense, I mean, what kind of pro would let a 500$ first place prize go to a scrub if the pro only lives 3 hours away? Either he's comfortable or sick lol, cause I would go if I knew I had a shot at winning. It works similar for lesser skilled players; they see a ton of money is up for grabs, and they want a piece of it. Maybe not get first, but they want third or fourth if they can.

: )
 

Purple

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Duluth, Georgia
well gerbil on that note, if people can find a nice venue for me to use i would greatly appreciate it :laugh:. the idea of having stacking pots would be a great idea actually. So i'm going to try that for the halloween bash.

I think we shoudl hype our tourneys to other states and have representatives for it. would anyone try that?
 

Purple

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Duluth, Georgia

GA Peach

Smash Lord
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Nov 6, 2005
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CHUG! CHUG! CHUG!
Gerbil, offering OOS extra money is all that it is. if someone from OOS wins, we add money to the pot and give it to them. simple as that. :) stuff like that usually nets OOS players fast.

also, WOW, albino. get a ****ed ride with someone else. you have plenty of people in that area that play... <_<
 
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