Social "Time to Tip the Scales!" - Robin Social Thread

[DarkChaosGames]

Generally it's an unwritten rule (well, technically written in Melee on one of the trophies) that all characters with magical powers have strong throws.

Ness
Lucas
Mewtwo
Zelda

Robin has shown indications have having basic telekinetic powers, so I am going to assume he will have strong throws as well.

I'm a sucker for magic users and a sucker for grabs. <3 Smash.
I used to always play Link (Still consider myself good with him) but after dabbling with characters like Ness I get the feeling I'll have a lot more fun with Robin/Ness/Palutena. Robin of course will take priority over the others due to character preference.

It's a shame Lucina is a clone of Marth (because I know I will be awful with her...)

 

[Jakatsu]

Yeah tomes only seem to affect the finisher.

One thing I noticed, which in the 21 pages of this topic has already come up I'm sure, is that Tomes effect Levin sword properties as well. His forward smash in the air has dark purple effects on it, and he's holding the purple tome. It seems that the currently held tome will effect several normal moves, not just his jab.

 

[Shaya]

Zelda had a kill throw?
She could, to be quite honest. Getting grabbed by Zelda is a big no no when it's like 14 frames (90% of every melee standing grab is 6 frames) and her up smash OoS (5 frames IIRC) is realistically her replacement on said use of grabs.

 

[Hong]

I'm a sucker for magic users and a sucker for grabs. <3 Smash.
I used to always play Link (Still consider myself good with him) but after dabbling with characters like Ness I get the feeling I'll have a lot more fun with Robin/Ness/Palutena. Robin of course will take priority over the others due to character preference.

It's a shame Lucina is a clone of Marth (because I know I will be awful with her...)

Now that you mention it, I hope Ness turns out nicely this time. He was my first Smash "main" ever. I only switched to Link for 64 yeeeeears after the game came out and everyone learned how to deal with Ness.

Right now my play experience is looking great with the amount of technical characters we'll have.

Zelda had a kill throw?
She could, to be quite honest. Getting grabbed by Zelda is a big no no when it's like 14 frames.

I thought her bthrow wasn't bad in Melee,

 

[Delzethin]

Two and a half days and we're already at 21 pages. Eat your heart out, Ridley thread. >_>

I feel like Robin has air smash attacks. If that's the case then this is character is nuts.

I was both surprised and very interested by the PotD saying Robin can pull the Levin Sword out in the air. There could be some crazy mindgames with that, leaving opponents constantly wondering when the hell the Levin Sword will show up, getting more and more paranoid the further they get into kill range...

It also seems like Robin needs the Levin Sword for most of his killing ability. From what we've seen so far, the only special with really significant knockback is Thoron. A Robin player who wears out their Levin Sword too early could end up having to play defense until it can recharge.

Seems like Robin is very much not beginner-friendly. Spamming smash attacks from the get go just makes it that much harder to get kills when you need them.

Not everyone has a helpless state. ROB, Snake, and Sonic did not go helpless after their UpBs, they just fell towards the bottom while still performing actions, and Sonic's looking to have that same bit in Smash 4.

Actually, Robin's recovery sounds similar in concept to ROB's. Having control on when and how to use the move, possibly no helpless stance, both moves are have finite "fuel", and both have to be recharged in some way. If Robin could do aerials while doing Elwind it'd basically be a spiritual successor.

Hard to say just yet, since Robin flies out of the shot in the Elwind clip:

But a Snake style not-quite-freefall where Robin could still move, dodge, and use aerials seems like the tactical kind of thing they'd do.

I'm sorry I just don't think its going to happen. You gotta take into consideration other modes as well, too. I think Robin's tomes will regenerate just like the Levin Sword. I mean, what happens if we've got an adventure mode and you try doing it with one life? If we get stages that are fairly long like the SSE (I think some sort of Adventure Mode will be in the Wii U version, obviously it won't have cutscenes but a story was never ruled out, it just won't be a story mode "like SSE" with cutscene), it could be very easy to kill your tomes and permanently lose them, I just don't think its going to work that way. Tomes will probably regenerate after a set amount of time.

I agree. I hadn't even considered Adventure Mode (and a Melee-style one is still possible), and it's even more of a reason to think the tomes will regenerate like the Levin Sword.

 

[RascalTheCharizard]

Oh and fire tome jab seems interesting. I wonder if you would be able to change tomes without firing a move. Like say you short hop -> B Right for fire tome, but before it goes off you fast fall and that stops the animation. Then you now have Fire tome for jabs. Same thing in manipulating which tome you have out to mix up your combos and possibly launch direction. Fire = forward ofc.

That would be amazing. If you could do that and it didn't count as a spell-use people would be screaming OP every which way lol. But if the only non-special move that is affected by tome is jab, then it really wouldn't be.

 

[Shaya]

I thought her bthrow wasn't bad in Melee,

You're probably completely right. It's just unlike every other kill throw in the game, I suppose it just never gets seen/worried about.
People moan and groan about Ness backthrowing you, he comes with a standard grab and grab set ups. People moan and groan about all the Project M characters with kill throws. Squirtle would be high tier in Brawl if it wasn't for fatigue due to his kill grab even remained being grab released by everyone into kill moves.

There's also characters like Charizard who doesn't have a "competitive kill throw", but if you don't DI it properly it can kill crazy low (like, Charizard's "kill throw" [IIRC down throw] will actually be lived for longer with good DI than his back throw).

Marth apparently has kill throws in Smash 4, so who knows the standard in this game, but I definitely think there's a solid chance (power of magic) that he'll have really strong throws, but he may end up not even having a grab (which unfortunately would relegate Robin to low/bottom tier most likely)

 

[Luminario]

I gotta say with the whole durability thing and if Robin completely loses her recovery after a few uses of up B she might be demoted to 'character I play once or twice on a whim' which I really sad cause I was really looking forward to kicking ass with pigtails and tomes.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I gotta say with the whole durability thing and if Robin completely loses her recovery after a few uses of up B she might be demoted to 'character I play once or twice on a whim' which I really sad cause I was really looking forward to kicking *** with pigtails and tomes.

Which, again, is why I believe Robin's tomes regenerate after a few seconds. You need to carefully balance things out. At the same time Robin appears to have an awesome recovery and doesn't appear to go into a freefall (although that remains to be seen).

 

[Hydde]

Which, again, is why I believe Robin's tomes regenerate after a few seconds. You need to carefully balance things out. At the same time Robin appears to have an awesome recovery and doesn't appear to go into a freefall (although that remains to be seen).

Lets hope he doesnt turn into the new "Poketrainer" with a system that depletes his power and forces him to change his style fo play because of turning weaker and weaker.

 

[mimgrim]

I'm mimgrim. I like video games.

Herp a derp derp.

Ok ok fine.

The username's mimgrim. You can call mim, Grim, Memo, mimmy, Grimmy, mimmygrimmy, Grimmim, mom, momgrom, mimbo, mimbojet, or anything else you might want to call me. My real name is pretty easy to figure out if you were to think about what 2 of my fave characters in all of video games are (Joshua from TWEWY and Joshua from FE, and them being my faves has more to do with then just their personality, though that plays a big part too lol).

Smash 64 was easily my first Smash game, I was easily playing that game at the age of 2 or 3 lol. I didn't get Melee till well after it's release, same goes for Brawl. This was all back when I didn't really pay attention to gaming stuff even though I loved to play games. I've slowly been getting into the competitive scene since last year, which was the reason for me joining this site, but San Antonio is kinda in a hibernating mode until Smash 4 (the Melee players host things often enough, but they are always at inconvenient times for me and the Brawl player are kinda erratic on when they host stuff), currently San Japan is happening over here but I am too broke for that and won't be able to participate in the Smash tournaments. Hopefully next year, and that will most likely end up being my first con ever.

Technically speaking I first learned about Fire Emblem through Melee, but I never even knew what games Marth and Roy were from till way later. I consider my first glimpse of Fire Emblem to be through a Nintendo Power magazine that was doing a big RPG blowout preview of Sands of Destruction, Phantasy Star 0, Ragnarok DS, and Fire Emblem Shadow Dragon, Valkyrie Profile: Covenant of the Plume, Dragon Quest V, Arc Rise Fantasia, and Avalon Code. At one point or another I have owned all of these games, some of them I am glad I sold other I miss deeply. The ones I still have to this day are Sands of Destruction and Fire Emblem Shadow Dragon, which was my very first FE game and I have been hooked ever since. I have been searching for Covenant of the Plume again, but it is really hard to find. I would still be on the look out of PS0 again, but with WiFi shut down, and lack of compatible WiFi, it seems pointless which was the main reason I sold was because of lack of compatible WiFi after I moved from Houston. I'll also keep an eye out for DQV and Ragnarok DS but they aren't as big of a deal.

I honestly don't care all that much about the characters that make it into Smash 4. Yes, not even Robin.I started posting in the Robin thread because I found Robin to be the most likely new FE rep and found Chrom to be very unlikely. The reason I don't care about characters all that much is because I know none of the characters I want and like the most would never get in. So I only focus on playstyle and general feel of them (how fun they are for me to play).

If I had to pick a fave character for Smash though, it would probably be Bowser. This is mainly for nostalgic purposes. As I really dislike how Nintendo started portraying Bowser even since the first Paper Mario. Super Mario RPG LotS is by far my fave incarnation of Bowser and is why I have to say he is my favorite character in the game. He seemed like and acted like a dumb brute in the game, though not to the extent he does now, yet he had surprisingly deep moments and was actually smarter then he seemed, which is no longer the case. I love the memory of what I grew up with of Bowser, but I'm really not a fan of his present incarnations.

Ermmm, I dunno what else to say. I also like books. I use to be really deep into Yugioh. I'm 18. Going on to my last year of high school. And other shtako lol.

 

[Hong]

For all the Fire Emblem fans, I recommend giving this a listen if you'll be around for the next half-hour or so. It's a nice piece that combines many of the wonderful pre-Awakening tracks heard throughout Fire Emblem's history. 12:30 is my favourite part, where it goes into the recruitment themes. Such nostalgia.

 

[Luminario]

Which, again, is why I believe Robin's tomes regenerate after a few seconds. You need to carefully balance things out. At the same time Robin appears to have an awesome recovery and doesn't appear to go into a freefall (although that remains to be seen).

It's almost definitely going to regenerate after a few seconds but the fact that the durability system even exist is going to make me groan a LOT while playing as her. I know it's very Fire Emblem style but that is certainly a part of the game i would be thankful to see let go in Smash. Christ I'm actually feeling more excited to play girl Marth than Robin right now (that'll probably change in a few days or something)

 

[Xuan Wu]

For all the Fire Emblem fans, I recommend giving this a listen if you'll be around for the next half-hour or so. It's a nice piece that combines many of the wonderful pre-Awakening tracks heard throughout Fire Emblem's history. 12:30 is my favourite part, where it goes into the recruitment themes. Such nostalgia.

Nice, which brings this to mind...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zqHexels-8

How many of you have a favorite rendition of the main FE theme? Mine would be the arranged version of Fire Emblem 4.

^-^

 

[Raziek]

Solid list, Mim. I'm actually playing through Sands of Destruction for the first time, currently.

 

[Unicorn]

Nice, which brings this to mind...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zqHexels-8

How many of you have a favorite rendition of the main FE theme? Mine would be the arranged version of Fire Emblem 4.

^-^

I love the Opera one from Brawl, just so I can sing along with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVlE8u6Hhp8

...Gods I'm such a nerd.

 

[mimgrim]

Solid list, Mim. I'm actually playing through Sands of Destruction for the first time, currently.

Sands of Destruction is easily my 2nd fave DS game. Right after The World Ends With You. The graphics are nostalgic, the game-play is fun and unique, the story is great (it has a really nice blend of humor, seriousness, lightheartedness, and darkheartedness), the characters are engaging. The only problem is that it is pretty easy, but still extremely fun.

 

[Hong]

Nice, which brings this to mind...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zqHexels-8

How many of you have a favorite rendition of the main FE theme? Mine would be the arranged version of Fire Emblem 4.

^-^

I am a huge Gaiden nerd, so that one is my favourite. Since it's not the true theme, I'll go with the arranged version of FE4 as well.

Edit - I retract that statement. I'll go with the Melee remix.

 

[RascalTheCharizard]

http://smashboards.com/threads/why-masahiro-sakurai-chose-robin.361455/

I also implemented the system used in FE:A, in which tomes break after overuse. Likewise, I included a similar system for the Levin Sword, which breaks after a certain number of uses. However, both the tomes and the Levin Sword will quickly regenerate after a set period of time.

Well there we have it folks. The regeneration is time-based. I do find it intriguing that Sakurai says tomes break from "overuse" whilst the Levin Sword specifically breaks after a "certain number of uses". I think the theory that using higher-levels of Thunder magic will make the tome break faster than just using regular Thunder sounds even more plausible than before.

 

[Baws]

You're probably completely right. It's just unlike every other kill throw in the game, I suppose it just never gets seen/worried about.
People moan and groan about Ness backthrowing you, he comes with a standard grab and grab set ups. People moan and groan about all the Project M characters with kill throws. Squirtle would be high tier in Brawl if it wasn't for fatigue due to his kill grab even remained being grab released by everyone into kill moves.

There's also characters like Charizard who doesn't have a "competitive kill throw", but if you don't DI it properly it can kill crazy low (like, Charizard's "kill throw" [IIRC down throw] will actually be lived for longer with good DI than his back throw).

Marth apparently has kill throws in Smash 4, so who knows the standard in this game, but I definitely think there's a solid chance (power of magic) that he'll have really strong throws, but he may end up not even having a grab (which unfortunately would relegate Robin to low/bottom tier most likely)

It doesn't matter to me if Robin is bottom tier. I've mained Link since 64 and I have no problem boarding that train again. I mean for me, better Robin be low tier than top tier, so that I don't see Robins EVERYWHERE online, because I certainly do plan to main him. I don't ever expect to play on the level of top tournament players anyway, and unless you're in that range of skill tiers don't really make much difference.

 

[Hong]

I also implemented the system used in FE:A, in which tomes break after overuse. Likewise, I included a similar system for the Levin Sword, which breaks after a certain number of uses. However, both the tomes and the Levin Sword will quickly regenerate after a set period of time.

This is good to hear/read.

 

[Shaya]

Yeah makes sense it wouldn't be as steep as Pokemon Trainer
Hopefully it still isn't detrimental.

Bronze Sword is still going to be OP y'know.

Also it's pure speculation that Robin would randomly not have a standard grab. Grab games have been pretty important for every Fire Emblem character thus far (who knows in smash 4 though), so Sakurai doing that would be 'off standard', unlike Zelda characters which all have like 10+ frame/horrible grabs (and is really a lot of the reason why they're low tier, haha). Just in general, not having the same level of access to the best out of shield option in the game (or other things like Peach's randomly horrible air dodge) usually critically hurt those characters who would probably otherwise be considerably better without those cruxes.

 

[Hong]

Please, please, pleeeeeeease express this with some kind of visible indication.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Yeah, I knew it would be, but its nice its confirmed. Yes, I do believe that higher level magic will break the tome faster. Although in FE these things don't regenerate, they still need to be converted into Smash formula to work, so they have to regenerate.

Some people may not like the breaking mechanic, but I think its a good idea. It means you need to balance using your tomes.


A visual cue would be nice... I hope we can see it. Like, maybe, above Robin's HUD show which weapon or tome is currently active, have it flash when its almost dead, then have it disappear (or have a X over it). When it regenerates the X will flash until it indicates its back again. Hopefully Robin does have a HUD, otherwise it'll probably just start flashing on the tome itself when its out and almost dead.

 

[ToothiestAura]

I also like that Robin was given a magical Combo Finisher. I wanted him to have a magic based combo as I had one in my moveset, but this one that varies (presumedly) seems way better than my idea.

 

[mimgrim]

I think Robin is the first newcomer where we have gotten so much information about in such a little time spread.

 

[TitanTeaTime]

Honestly, I think the timing of the regeneration is going to be about 8-12 seconds. Quick enough to not be too bothersome, but long enough to take advantage of. Say, when you run out of your Elwind, you don't have recovery for a brief time.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Recovery tome is broken?

Don't get hit.

 

[Hong]

Yeah makes sense it wouldn't be as steep as Pokemon Trainer
Hopefully it still isn't detrimental.

Bronze Sword is still going to be OP y'know.

Also it's pure speculation that Robin would randomly not have a standard grab. Grab games have been pretty important for every Fire Emblem character thus far (who knows in smash 4 though), so Sakurai doing that would be 'off standard', unlike Zelda characters which all have like 10+ frame/horrible grabs (and is really a lot of the reason why they're low tier, haha). Just in general, not having the same level of access to the best out of shield option in the game (or other things like Peach's randomly horrible air dodge) usually critically hurt those characters who would probably otherwise be considerably better without those cruxes.

Yeah. That's what I was thinking. Fire Emblem characters have had such good grabs for some reason.

I mean, being a ranged character who doesn't have a tether grab already makes Robin awesome. Being a Link and Samus main, I've grown so accustomed to NOT hitting the Z button if I can avoid it. I hope Elwind is a valid OOS option for defensive purposes. Even just not putting Robin into free-fall would sell me on the idea.

 

[Shaya]

Inb4 Down B/Nosferatu is a counter move,
Inb4 Elwind is a fantastic Dragon Punch
Inb4 other things.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Still sulking not only in GameFaqs I see.

As for the Final Smash, it should be called the Chrombo.

Wombo Chrombo

 

[Hong]

Inversely, people who played characters with absolutely abysmal recoveries are not much better off.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Recovery tome is broken?

Don't get hit.

Exactly, I don't see the problem here. Now that's strategy! You need to focus on managing your assets, like in any Fire Emblem game. The difference is your tomes and sword will regenerate, but you still need to be careful and not leave yourself vulnerable.

 

[FalKoopa]

Yeah, some visual indication of the Tomes getting depleted would be nice.

Though if there is no indication, and I suddenly find myself in trouble, I'd probably be right at home with it. That's often how I end up in Fire Emblem. (>_<)

 

[Mr. KoopaTurtle]

It's amazing learning about Sakurai decision processes for choosing characters. I respect this man. I can imagine it being such a tough decision to choose a rep for a franchise, but I'm glad he chose Robin over Chrom. He has the most exciting and strategic moveset to date.

 

[Hong]

I hope Nosferatu functions like other command grabs.

Down+B: Nosferatu
Purple-black smog in the shape of a snake appears right in front of Robin when this move is used. If your opponent is hit by it, he or she will be "cursed" by the spell. When a cursed opponent is hit, Robin's health meter will recover. What's also interesting is that if the cursed opponent is struck from the back, the amount of health Robin recovers will be larger.

I'm not sure how literal the "hit" part is. Both Robin and Palutena were locked in-place during the trailer, so likely it should function like similar abilities. That said, rules in Smash Bros are broken all the time.

 

[Banjodorf]

...I'm so glad we finally have a Fire Emblem character who's down-B isn't Counter.

(We all know Chrom's would've been.)

And the funny thing is that Lucina still couldn't learn Counter, (I think. Isn't it Warrior only, and that's a male class?) and Robin is literally the only playable FE character that can at some point learn Counter, and he doesn't have it. (Halle-****ing-luiah.) I just find it kinda funny, and neat.

 

[Shaya]

Looks awesome.

 

[TechPowah]

Man, all these people hating on PKMN Trainer's stamina mechanic because it kept them from staying as one Pokemon when they weren't even supposed to use him like that. PT players are supposed to use all 3 Pokemon as a single, cohesive team, as PT represents the gameplay itself of Pokemon (similar to how Robin's weapon decay ammo reflects Fire Emblem's actual gameplay in comparison to Marth/Roy/Ike/Lucina.) As a PKMN Trainer co-main in Brawl, it makes me sad.

I hope Robin's color alts change up the face and hair like Villager's does. It would especially make everyone happy if they could use a Robin that was as close as it can be to their in-Awakening Robin (provided you didn't just use the defaults like I probably will now that the defaults are stuck in my mind thanks to Smash Bros.)

 

[JaidynReiman]

Man, all these people hating on PKMN Trainer's stamina mechanic because it kept them from staying as one Pokemon when they weren't even supposed to use him like that. PT players are supposed to use all 3 Pokemon as a single team, as PT represents the gameplay itself of Pokemon (similar to how Robin's weapon decay ammo reflects Fire Emblem's actual gameplay in comparison to Marth/Roy/Ike/Lucina.) As a PKMN Trainer co-main in Brawl, it makes me sad.

I hope Robin's color alts change up the face and hair like Villager's does. It would especially make everyone happy if they could use a Robin that was as close as it can be to their in-Awakening Robin (provided you didn't just use the defaults like I probably will now that the defaults are stuck in my mind thanks to Smash Bros.)

We'll probably have plenty of recolors and a few hairstyles, but not too many.