Social "Time to Tip the Scales!" - Robin Social Thread

[Kotor]

Reminder that Luigi always wins by doing absolutely nothing
Even in Smash

Never underestimate the man in green.

"My sweet, sweet Robin..."

I had to repost this.

Runs in the family.

 

[Kenith]

I don't think any of the top tiers should be nerfed to be honest.
I think everyone else should be buffed significantly. Like, everyone should be Rosalina levels of good. It's only fair.

I wonder if I'm the only one who thinks balance should come from making everyone good rather than making the good characters bad to match the bad characters.

 

[Space Stranger]

You need to understand how Luigi operates and how to fight him. If you don't put in the work to learn the matchup, then you will be screwed. Most professionals will know how to handle Luigi and thus limit his chances at getting top 8 or 5.

Exhibit A:

Dark Pit still manages to nullify most of Luigi's grab and projectile options and he's not that high tier of a character. Luigi greatly suffers from being spaced out.

I don't think any of the top tiers should be nerfed to be honest.
I think everyone else should be buffed significantly. Like, everyone should be Rosalina levels of good. It's only fair.

I wonder if I'm the only one who thinks balance should come from making everyone good rather than making the good characters bad to match the bad characters.

This. Characters like Samus and Zelda need any buff they can get.

 

[Wintropy]

Nario [sic] is best Pittoo~ ;3

I'm just happy that Pit is as consistent as consistent can be. I just smile and nod with most of these conversations.

 

[Raziek]

I don't think any of the top tiers should be nerfed to be honest.
I think everyone else should be buffed significantly. Like, everyone should be Rosalina levels of good. It's only fair.

I wonder if I'm the only one who thinks balance should come from making everyone good rather than making the good characters bad to match the bad characters.

I say this in the nicest way possible, but you don't understand what power creep is.

This has been tried in numerous games. League of Legends, and PM 3.02 come to mind.

You can't just buff. Buffing everybody turns things into an arms-race where you buff something, then someone else needs a buff to be able to compete with their buffs, and then it just snowballs from there.

Only buffing has not, and will never, work correctly.

 

[Deleted member]

If Mewtwo's supposed to be a glass cannon archetype please give him the cannon part.

Or at least some priority or disjoints.

Also buff

As much as I hate that MU for the Grabby Penguin really needs some buffs.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't think any of the top tiers should be nerfed to be honest.
I think everyone else should be buffed significantly. Like, everyone should be Rosalina levels of good. It's only fair.

I wonder if I'm the only one who thinks balance should come from making everyone good rather than making the good characters bad to match the bad characters.

I agree with this mindset. I am in the mindset of keep the strong strong and buff the weak. I think characters like Samus and Zelda have the potential, they just need proper buffs to achieve that.

Exhibit A:

Dark Pit still manages to nullify most of Luigi's grab and projectile options and he's not that high tier of a character. Luigi greatly suffers from being spaced out.

This exactly. Characters have this potential, such as Samus with her Charge Shot and Missiles, Zero Suit Samus and her Paralyzer and side special, and even Robin with their assortment of projectiles.
You just need to space him and nullify his options. Mega Man does this excellently and he makes a "top tier" look like a complete joke.

 

[Champ Gold]

I ain't even mad about Luigi since Yoshi and Pikachu gives me the most crap.

Even then, Luigi's strengths makes him much more dangerous than most of the other top tiers but he does have major weaknesses.

I don't think any of the top tiers should be nerfed to be honest.
I think everyone else should be buffed significantly. Like, everyone should be Rosalina levels of good. It's only fair.

I wonder if I'm the only one who thinks balance should come from making everyone good rather than making the good characters bad to match the bad characters.

I always thought this but some characters need a good fixing/nerfing. Rosalina needs some major changes especially nerfing Luma and giving her atleast a few options without the star babby.

Sheik needs her damn needles nerfed and her throws to where it doesn't lead into combos as much. The characters that desperately need buffs are &.

 

[The Merc]

Wonderful model!

But the eyes, man.

The eyes.

I see them in my nightmares.

Yeah, the eyes are a little off. Also, doesn't he wear a head band?

Except Sheik.

And Zero Suit Samus.

And Ness.

And Mario.

Luigi is overrated~ ;3

Luigi beats Mario in everything.

As for Sonic, it may just be due to his own particular style, one which my particular style of Sonic handles well with any character he uses other than Falco.

I love Sonic's play style. His just so fun. Also, You GOTTA GO FAST!!!

 

[Wintropy]

Yeah, the eyes are a little off. Also, doesn't he wear a head band?

Nyet.

Luigi beats Mario in everything.

Except Smash~ ;3

 

[Kotor]

I just had to share this here.

 

[Milo AKA Papa]

The characters that desperately need buffs are .

Hasn't Falco been getting buffed every single patch? I don't think he really needs them right now. From what I've seen and hear, he's getting very good. I don't think he needs anymore. I don't really agree with Marth either. I mean, yeah, he's not Melee or Brawl Marth, sure, but I personally think he's doing fine in smash 4 right now. He's good at what he does as he is now. :L

 

[Soul.]

bruh y'all talking about mr. down throw aka this man ain't taking **** from my boy unfortunately

 

[Kenith]

I say this in the nicest way possible, but you don't understand what power creep is.

This has been tried in numerous games. League of Legends, and PM 3.02 come to mind.

You can't just buff. Buffing everybody turns things into an arms-race where you buff something, then someone else needs a buff to be able to compete with their buffs, and then it just snowballs from there.

Only buffing has not, and will never, work correctly.

That's not quite what I mean.
What I mean is that every character should have something that says "oh, this is really good! This is a huge strength for this character!"
That's how it should be balanced, especially if Smash Bros. is all about making each character stand out.
I understand there will still be characters that are worse than some, but to me Smash 4 feels like they didn't know what strengths to give characters, only weaknesses. With a few exceptions, of course.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Except Smash~ ;3

Riiiiiiiiight.

 

[The Merc]

Nyet.

Nyet?

Except Smash~ ;3

Uh

Spoiler: I beg to differ

Yeah I know tier list mean nothing but still, Weggie number 1 :3

 

[Neoleo21]

That's not quite what I mean.
What I mean is that every character should have something that says "oh, this is really good! This is a huge strength for this character!"
That's how it should be balanced, especially if Smash Bros. is all about making each character stand out.
I understand there will still be characters that are worse than some, but to me Smash 4 feels like they didn't know what strengths to give characters, only weaknesses. With a few exceptions, of course.

Those exceptions being customs? But otherwise I'm Inclined to agree, Default Smash 4 is a little too homogenized in my opinion.

 

[Zantetsugun]

I just had to share this here.

GEDDAN!!!!!

 

[Kenith]

I always thought this but some characters need a good fixing/nerfing. Rosalina needs some major changes especially nerfing Luma and giving her atleast a few options without the star babby.

Sheik needs her damn needles nerfed and her throws to where it doesn't lead into combos as much. The characters that desperately need buffs are &.

Rosalina can stand on her own, though, is the issue.
Without Luma, she's still pretty good. Whereas Olimar, without his three Pikmin, is absolutely the worst character in the game.
I think instead of making Rosalina really terrible it's better to balance this by making Olimar decent with no Pikmin.

 

[Wintropy]

Nyet?

No. :3

Yeah I know tier list mean nothing but still, Weggie number 1 :3

Still reckon Mario beats him in this game. ;3

 

[The Merc]

No. :3

What?!

What does Nyet mean?

Still reckon Mario beats him in this game. ;3

Probable, but Luigi still number 1

 

[Deleted member]

Luigi doesn't have a Meaty Punch Fair so he's worse than Mario and Doc by default.

Luigi can't dunk.

 

[The Merc]

Luigi doesn't have a Meaty Punch Fair so he's worse than Mario and Doc by default.

Luigi can't dunk.

But Luigi can SHORYUKEN!!!!

 

[Soul.]

If you want to style with Luigi, there's down throw to Up B.
I don't see him as an issue myself but maybe that's because he beats

 

[Mr. Johan]

I hit Luigi away while he's in shield, and think that maybe the character isn't so bad after all.

Then I get Dash Grabbed 3 Luigis away, Faired 3 Luigis away, and Frame 2 "it clanks with Robin's" Jabbed, and contemplate why Sakurai and Namco released this abomination into the wild.

 

[Deleted member]

If you want to style with Luigi, there's down throw to Up B.
I don't see him as an issue myself but maybe that's because he beats

I never go for that combo. When I try... I miss and even get punished badly for it. ;-;

As for the matchup, some Luigis have cited that it's a tricky one overall. I like to say it's even... but I can't say for sure.
I actually fought this Pikachu and he mashed down B to escape my combo with Luigi. He almost succeeded, which frightened me.

 

[Ffamran]

Hasn't Falco been getting buffed every single patch? I don't think he really needs them right now. From what I've seen and hear, he's getting very good. I don't think he needs anymore. I don't really agree with Marth either. I mean, yeah, he's not Melee or Brawl Marth, sure, but I personally think he's doing fine in smash 4 right now. He's good at what he does as he is now. :L

Hello, welcome to the daily Falco rant. Your time shall be wasted reading this starting... now.

You mean patch 1.0.4 which fixed his Fair landing hitbox and made it do 5% and "made Blaster fire faster"? I seriously have no idea what that even meant... Should ask Lavani or someone to record it... Patch 1.0.8 was his only major patch which only made his air game better by making his Uair faster by 3 frames, lose a sourspot, and have angles changed, Nair autolink for the looping hits so people don't fall out and have larger hitboxes and always launches his opponent in front of him, Dair no longer spikes grounded opponents, but sends them up at an 80 degree angle and the spike hitbox stays 1 frame longer, and Fair faster by 2 frames, the looping hits refresh 2 frames faster, do 1% more damage, have 7 frames less of landing lag - 32 to 25 -, and the landing hit have more knockback. In return, Uair does 1% less, does less knockback, Nair does 1% less, the Fair landing hit does 2% less, and Falco Phantasm is 1 frame slower - thanks, it's like when Side Smash became 1 frame slower from Brawl to Smash 4 because frame 16 wasn't slow enough.

Outside of that... no other patches have done anything significant to him. Up Smash has better hitboxes and lasts a bit longer - the second hit used to be frame 13-20, but is now 12-21 - and rapid jab transitions 1 frame faster, but is still not a true combo from jab 2, so characters like Luigi can just mash buttons and punish him for attempting to use an option almost everyone has. Falco's changes are more like quality of life stuff. Uair being faster and more like ZSS's means he can combo and rack up damage faster which he could in the past, but at a slower and less guaranteed rate at low percents. Funny enough, his Uair used to be stronger than Rosalina's and is still just as strong despite doing less damage and less knockback, but he doesn't have that vertical range she has and Falco has to be precise since he falls quickly. Fair being faster means Falco is can time it easier... That's pretty much it. Fair's still the same godplayer edgeguard move he has, but it'd be the same for Pikachu and Sonic if they could dip as low as he can. Nair connecting better is probably his biggest change since it means he can lock you into at most, 11% and control where he sends you. Everything else is more or less Falco and people picking him up are the same people who picked up Meta Knight, Wii Fit Trainer, and Kirby because they have function slightly better. It's not like Ike, Marth, and Lucina who had major game-changing changes to their tools.

Of all the changes they didn't do, it was change his Blaster end lag. To make it worse, all of Fox's Blaster have 3 less frames of end lag. This includes his default Blaster which pretty much overshadows Falco's Burst Blaster in every way now because Burst Blaster used to have less end lag, but now it's the same as Fox's default Blaster. Should I mention that Fox's default Blaster covers about 85% of FD while Falco's Burst Blaster only covers 67.5%? Impact Blaster, the one-shot-only Falco Blaster or 64 Fox Blaster has the same end lag as Fox's default now at 40 frames while Falco's has 59 frames. It does 1% less than Falco's, but it still cause people to flinch while having 10% less range than Falco's which covers 75%. Let's also remind everyone how Robin, the Pits, and Greninja - his was more of startup change that affected his end lag - had end lag changes to their main projectiles in patch 1.1.0. There's a point where people calling a projectile a Falco laser becomes really, really ironic.

From the top of my head, Marth, Lucina, Zelda, and Ike were patched more frequently than other characters. I think they were affected by all the character-changing patches. Falco's more in line with what Robin, Dr. Mario, Charizard, Bowser, and Link where there were changes in some of the patches.

 

[SkarmNightmare (Brett)]

I was having one of those microwave dinners, and as I'm opening the box, I see my linguine is covered in a sheet of ice :T

I say this in the nicest way possible, but you don't understand what power creep is.

This has been tried in numerous games. League of Legends, and PM 3.02 come to mind.

You can't just buff. Buffing everybody turns things into an arms-race where you buff something, then someone else needs a buff to be able to compete with their buffs, and then it just snowballs from there.

Only buffing has not, and will never, work correctly.

Maybe don't make s****y characters in the first place

 

[Soul.]

I never go for that combo. When I try... I miss and even get punished badly for it. ;-;

As for the matchup, some Luigis have cited that it's a tricky one overall. I like to say it's even... but I can't say for sure.
I actually fought this Pikachu and he mashed down B to escape my combo with Luigi. He almost succeeded, which frightened me.

I know, it's weird. I've heard that if a patient, defensive Pikachu plays the MU that way they'll probably have a shot at winning.
Even so, I'd rather use a fraudulent or

 

[ARGHETH]

Maybe don't make s****y characters in the first place

That would require Sakurai to know the future...
Seriously though, it's not that easy to know how a character will play out in the competitive scene when you have nothing to base it off of.

 

[smokebomb12]

I am at a boot camp and some girl asks me what I am playing, I'm a nice guy and I respond with simply Smash bros 3Ds. Then for some reason she says "I never asked you", and walks away... And she is gonna be in ALL my school classes. I am the only one who brought a Hot spot as well, and she has the guts to ask for the password. I don't even know what the hell to do.

 

[Devil May Plop]

I was having one of those microwave dinners, and as I'm opening the box, I see my linguine is covered in a sheet of ice :T

That happens to me so much. I don't think steaks are supposed to be frozen when leaving the microwave!

 

[~Skelly~]

Looks like I joined the ranks of purple usernames (how and when did I get pranked?).

I hit Luigi away while he's in shield, and think that maybe the character isn't so bad after all.

Then I get Dash Grabbed 3 Luigis away, Faired 3 Luigis away, and Frame 2 "it clanks with Robin's" Jabbed, and contemplate why Sakurai and Namco released this abomination into the wild.

Apparently to make your smash experience miserable and mine all the more satisfying.

 

[Casey Chase]

I am the only one who brought a Hot spot as well, and she has the guts to ask for the password. I don't even know what the hell to do.

tell her no

 

[Deleted member]

I am at a boot camp and some girl asks me what I am playing, I'm a nice guy and I respond with simply Smash bros 3Ds. Then for some reason she says "I never asked you", and walks away... And she is gonna be in ALL my school classes. I am the only one who brought a Hot spot as well, and she has the guts to ask for the password. I don't even know what the hell to do.

Tsundere has a crush obv.

 

[~Skelly~]

Tsundere has a crush obv.

B...Baka! Its not like she likes him or anything! (this quote was gonna happen)

 

[Raziek]

Looks like I joined the ranks of purple usernames (how and when did I get pranked?).

Apparently to make your smash experience miserable and mine all the more satisfying.

Sorry to break it to you, but it's pink.

Purple is for the Backroomers from Melee/Brawl. (Like me)

Unfortunately the mod Red overrides it.

 

[Pazzo.]

Looks like I joined the ranks of purple usernames (how and when did I get pranked?).

Apparently to make your smash experience miserable and mine all the more satisfying.

All these crazy premiums running around.

They'll do anything.

 

[SkarmNightmare (Brett)]

That happens to me so much. I don't think steaks are supposed to be frozen when leaving the microwave!

I didn't even microwave it yet, there was just a sheet of ice under the film.

 

[~Skelly~]

Sorry to break it to you, but it's pink.

Purple is for the Backroomers from Melee/Brawl. (Like me)

Unfortunately the mod Red overrides it.

Ah. Yeah, you're right. They're both in the same color spectrum, so I got kinda confused. Still have no idea how or when I got pranked, though.