Things I Like - The Mafia Game - Game Over

[Chaco]

How so when it’s laid out plain as day? And you can tell I’m trying to be nice about asking it and so does Laser when answering. You’re just looking for a reason to stay on me, tbqh.

 

[Chaco]

And your thought process of pushing a lesser slot to lynch just because it justifies what you want to see is blatantly anti town.

 

[fontisian]

Interesting means I thought it was important enough to note.

Yes but do you not find the lack of curiosity on my meaning from some of the players in this game...interesting?

Not really.

I was going to just say "no," but I'm worried I'm being overly rude to you here, and that's not my intention.

Chaco Take a breath, my dude.

 

[Chaco]

Interesting appeal as well Kary when you try to negate that my wagon is most likely scum driven in some facet. You try to shame me on it instead. So let’s ask the hypothetical. I get lynched and flip town, who as scum would’ve been driving the Lynch and why?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

For his Post #20. In that post, Kary is interested in two xkcd games referenced by Synchronicity in #8. But oddly not the game referenced in #13. Kary followed Sabrar’s vote but was uninterested in Sabrar’s reason for the vote.

Why should I care about one RVS vote to the same degree that I care about you constantly careening and gallivanting your way through games? Consider yourself mafially profiled.

There is no Xivii and no bessie, there is only Synchronicity. Why is it important to differentiate?

It's blatantly obvious why. You can read a player better when you know that player, and you can understand inconsistencies in play better when you can assign them to different heads. I dunno how Zen convinced you that being a cryptic, recalcitrant bugbear was a good strategy this game but I hope you snap out of it immediately.

 

[fontisian]

Whatever, Kary's probably just town.

Kary, if your main issue with Chaco is him defending Wam or avoiding voting Wam, then what you actually have here is a Wam scumread to figure out.

 

[giraffelasergun]

Vote Count 1.7

Fontisian (2): Wam, Dark Horse
Chaco (2): LaserGuy, Kary
Kary (2): Sabrar, Synchronicity
FrozenFlame (2): Malakandra, BoomFrog
Wam (2): Fontisian, FrozenFlame
Somitomi(1): Chaco

Not Voting (2): Pythag, Somitomi

With 13 Alive, it takes 7 to reach majority.
Day Ends at 5 PM CST on Friday the 11th! Live Countdown to EOD1

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

said I would get this up last night my bad, pretty busy today so I won't be able to check in until really late tonight unfortunately

Town:
1. Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)
2. Kary
9. Sabrar
11. Somitomi

Meh:
3. LaserGuy
5. Dark Horse
10. Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)
7. Pythag
8. BoomFrog

Can go:
4. Chaco
12. Malakandra
13. Wam

list is ordered from towniest to scummiest but tbh it's not a steep gradient, most people adjacent to one another could be swapped

 

[Malakandra]

In response to Malakandra's enquiry in #230:

Interesting that no one has asked for this reference except you.

The Dark Tower - Mission failure - xkcd

Thanks for answering this one. When you get the time can you answer the rest of my question in the same post?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

The points in his analysis are pretty arbitrary, yeah? Wouldn't it be easier for scum!Chaco to just assign Somi some more negative points and fewer positive ones if he really wants to vote there?

The whole exercise of rating posts is arbitrary.
Chaco going harder against somi just invites more disagreements.
Chaco being soft and appearing conflicted paints a picture that he's a townie struggling to read people and having doubts about things.

I am fascinated to hear why you injected yourself in this conversation to white-knight Chaco when your main point seems to be Chaco's points are arbitrary- i.e. could very well be fake.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Interesting appeal as well Kary when you try to negate that my wagon is most likely scum driven in some facet. You try to shame me on it instead. So let’s ask the hypothetical. I get lynched and flip town, who as scum would’ve been driving the Lynch and why?

I don't recall talking about your waggon at all so I don't see how I am trying to negate that. To the bolded:

if you flip town I think Wam is an obvious next step because he's scummy individually and seemed happy to hop on. I don't think Laser or Frozen are scum driving your elimination and I am more suspicious of people on the sidelines. Without actually seeing the votes on you I can't answer any better than that.

How so when it’s laid out plain as day? And you can tell I’m trying to be nice about asking it and so does Laser when answering. You’re just looking for a reason to stay on me, tbqh.

And your thought process of pushing a lesser slot to lynch just because it justifies what you want to see is blatantly anti town.

If these are addressed to me it is completely unclear what you're responding to.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Kary, if your main issue with Chaco is him defending Wam or avoiding voting Wam, then what you actually have here is a Wam scumread to figure out.

I think I know better than you what my reads are, actually.

Speaking of reads, how are yours coming along?

 

[Chaco]

I don't recall talking about your waggon at all so I don't see how I am trying to negate that. To the bolded:

if you flip town I think Wam is an obvious next step because he's scummy individually and seemed happy to hop on. I don't think Laser or Frozen are scum driving your elimination and I am more suspicious of people on the sidelines. Without actually seeing the votes on you I can't answer any better than that.




If these are addressed to me it is completely unclear what you're responding to.

So what I can’t seem to grasp here is how my town flip leads to a Wam lynch next? When you just said yourself he’s likely potato town correct? You’re not making any linear sense. And who are these supposed outliers that you’re suspicious of, because it’s not obvious sans your recent interest in Synchronicity.

Your approach to Wam’s slot is uncharacteristic for anyone with any experience. If you can tell from the get go that I’m asking if he’s just not a good mafia player, and trying to ask people he has played with if that’s the case, you’re trying to turn it into some TMI protection of Wam from my slot (low hanging fruit) and then in the same breath turn around and say you’d lynch him next. You say Wam right now because you’d happily push that lynch, as well as mine and wash your hands from the back up comments of he could be potato town. Seems like that’s making the most sense to me of why you’re heading this direction. One foot in and one foot out.

 

[somitomi]

I figured I'd be alone in this. the big synchro post I appreciated because it seemed to have a lot of thought in it.
It also let me sit and think, whereas other posts it becomes easy to skim. That's what I thought about it.
Plus I don't know if Besvii is muddying waters because there are not specific waters to muddy currently.

What do you mean by there being no "speficif waters"?

This post is fine until the last part. It’s almost altruistic when it’s obvious Boom is joking.

What do you mean by "altruistic"?

Besides this post being very hard to understand from formatting, I’m starting to see some parallels here. Subtle misspelled words, wording jumbled, etc. Could be indicative of phone usage or what I think is more likely is that they are struggling to acclimate and understand this game.

Yeah, wam is pretty suss, but how is spelling and formatting ever alignment indicative? That's seriously the easiest thing to do consistently regardless of alignment and you acknowledge that it could be explained by phone posting. I personally think it's just down to wam not being familiar with the user interface, just like how he didn't know how to tag people.
I feel like you're reading too much into things in some places. Same with your analysis of FrozenFlame's progression on Gorf, which is actually fairly straigtforward if you disregard intervening posts that don't mention Gorf.

bro this comes off insanely defensive and like a "wahhhhhh stop talking to me" type response

fwiw Gorf is generally a more "heated" player so defensiveness from the slot is def to be expected and generally comes off null for me when reading gorf but him being this defensive so early definitely pings a bit for me,

everyones a pipe hittin HBC homie till the HBC comes for you

Unvote: Chaco
Vote: Gorf

/bottom of P10, I have to go now, so reads later in the evening.

 

[Chaco]

I think I know better than you what my reads are, actually.

Speaking of reads, how are yours coming along?

Passive aggressive at Fonti trying to defuse, why the reactivity here?

 

[Chaco]

somitomi By altruistic I mean faked concern. It has no real inflection at all.

And nah I don’t think so regarding FF, his progression on Gorf didn’t make sense.Which alludes you not having him sorted and slightly waffling because he knows how Gorf plays and then the later comment of asking if he was trying to pocket us? Waaaay out of time frame lends to that as well.

 

[Chaco]

somitomi And my God you’re making me spell it blatantly out, it is not alignment indicative but player indicative. I’m asking if it’s phone typos or if they struggle with spelling and such, which would lend to probably the lack of mafia experience as well. Do you see the overall theme yet of what I’m asking yet regarding Wam?

 

[fontisian]

The whole exercise of rating posts is arbitrary.
Chaco going harder against somi just invites more disagreements.
Chaco being soft and appearing conflicted paints a picture that he's a townie struggling to read people and having doubts about things.

I am fascinated to hear why you injected yourself in this conversation to white-knight Chaco when your main point seems to be Chaco's points are arbitrary- i.e. could very well be fake.

Arbitrary doesn't mean fake. I also don't think the rest of Chaco's play can be remotely described as soft. I think if you go over Chaco's points about Somi again, you'll find that the assignment of positive or negative values was what's arbitrary, not the logic itself. His vote came from feels, and that negative feeling about Somi is evident throughout the post.

I believe in fostering unity between town and breaking up unproductive pushes.


And my reads are developing nicely, thanks for asking.

 

[LaserGuy]

Frozen , can you explain how fonti/Gorf is top Town?

For his Post #20. In that post, Kary is interested in two xkcd games referenced by Synchronicity in #8. But oddly not the game referenced in #13. Kary followed Sabrar’s vote but was uninterested in Sabrar’s reason for the vote.

I find it interesting that in #41 somitomi asked for clarification on Post #8, but not for #13 (somitomi did not play The Dark Tower).

Your vote is based on someone not caring about a three (four?) year old game reference in RVS?

I'm not sure about Xivii, but I'm getting the same feeling about you that I had in SS and I regretted not pursuing it more aggressively.

Vote: Synchronicity

LaserGuy There are a lot of reasons.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

can you link me to the pythag post you're referencing here?

im actually surprised you’re taking this stance.
I viewed it similarly to gorf and wasn’t about to try to “yeet” someone who hadn’t posted, so boom was the choice.
Regardless, A tied wagon is much more interesting from my perspective.

why? a tied wagon is an extremely boring gamestate unless both wagons are L-1. Tied wagons are one of the most "stable" gamestates in a plurality lynch ruleset. If the two frontrunners are tied, you're actually in a position to no lynch if deadline hits. Imbalanced gamestates are far more interesting, what makes you think tied wagons are?

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

you're missing the point by demanding an example. there could be tons of explanations for why Chaco decided to highlight his vote as an "equality" vote. I wanted him to genuinely explain what he was thinking. his answer was that he wasn't and it was a joke, and his diction in doing so did not convey genuineness. its 100% a gut/tone read. me asking that question was focused on eliciting a response that I could gauge for fabrication, there wasn't a particular explanation that I had sorted as more convincing vs. less convincing. its all about the diction

if chaco "passed" I would have gone back to mala because I liked having high octane wagons early, it was the whole reason I RVS voted mala in the first place

I don't like this answer and I like the fact that syncho was grilling him for it. Not only is it largely a non answer but you're telling me that you would have found it not suspicious if he didn't answer your question? I feel like that's never my thought process when I ask qs

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I really like chaco's vote on somi it helps solidify my town read on him. Somi in general is a slot that I feel like too many people wrote off as town because they cracked one joke.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

said I would get this up last night my bad, pretty busy today so I won't be able to check in until really late tonight unfortunately

Town:
1. Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)
2. Kary
9. Sabrar
11. Somitomi

Meh:
3. LaserGuy
5. Dark Horse
10. Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)
7. Pythag
8. BoomFrog

Can go:
4. Chaco
12. Malakandra
13. Wam

list is ordered from towniest to scummiest but tbh it's not a steep gradient, most people adjacent to one another could be swapped

This town list is really bizarre to me. Imma need you to elaborate on your Fonti/Kary/Somi reads because I really don't see how those are 3/4 of your strongest town reads.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Kary a couple of questions:

Do you think scum!wam would pivot to bussing scum!chaco as hard as he did?

What made you start to townread FF?

Why did you like synchro's #365 if you later voted them for "bringing up old rvs stuff"?

 

[fontisian]

said I would get this up last night my bad, pretty busy today so I won't be able to check in until really late tonight unfortunately

Town:
1. Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)
2. Kary
9. Sabrar
11. Somitomi

Meh:
3. LaserGuy
5. Dark Horse
10. Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)
7. Pythag
8. BoomFrog

Can go:
4. Chaco
12. Malakandra
13. Wam

list is ordered from towniest to scummiest but tbh it's not a steep gradient, most people adjacent to one another could be swapped

You should consider hashing out your Somi read with Chaco. Might be helpful for both of you.

I'd appreciate it if you could walk me through the Sabrar read.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Fonti do chaco's cases end up changing your read on him?

 

[fontisian]

This town list is really bizarre to me. Imma need you to elaborate on your Fonti/Kary/Somi reads because I really don't see how those are 3/4 of your strongest town reads.

After Frozen answers, I'd like you to talk about your read on me, please.

Feel free to do it before Frozen answers if you want.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Answer my question about chaco first

 

[fontisian]

Fonti do chaco's cases end up changing your read on him?

Eh?

Not the cases, really, though they helped. It was more how he talked to me. Like, when he popped in to clarify that he was /not/ Omgusing Laser, while you were saying his Omgus was towny.

 

[fontisian]

Vote: Laserguy

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

#HBC | Dark Horse theres a big difference between chaco captioning his vote has an "equality" vote and Pythag merely commenting that he disagrees with my perspective that even wagons are a boring gamestate. Pythag is just expressing a difference in opinion about a relatively subjective take on what is stable/boring vs. volatile/exciting gamestate, I felt that Chaco was trying to mask an attempt to set up two equally possible early lynch options by making and argumentum ad temperantium type appeal

I don't like this answer and I like the fact that syncho was grilling him for it. Not only is it largely a non answer but you're telling me that you would have found it not suspicious if he didn't answer your question? I feel like that's never my thought process when I ask qs

I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I said "if chaco passed." I meant if chaco passed the "test" in terms of giving a genuine explanation for why he mentioned equality. I don't mean "passed" as in ignored the inquiry and just moved on. Had chaco not responded at all to the question my vote would absolutely had continued to stay on him

Frozen , can you explain how fonti/Gorf is top Town?

imo there's a 0% chance that scum!fonti sticks her neck out for me when I had already voted their slot and I was by no means impervious to attack. I somehow doubt scum!fonti has any real interest in pocketing me vs. other slots so fonti's willingness to offer a town read on me and suggest pressure should go elsewhere seems like a genuine effort to sort me and prevent TvTs

You should consider hashing out your Somi read with Chaco. Might be helpful for both of you.

I'd appreciate it if you could walk me through the Sabrar read.

for some reason I feel like given how the game has progressed so far, scum!Sabrar would be trying a lot harder to have a stronger grip on the wheel if that makes sense? he's been very content to stay in the background, though I don't think I've ever played with scum!sabrar so maybe I'm missing some meta here that would suggest scum!sabrar is more passive in his approach? I also feel like scum!sabrar probably wouldve sunk his teeth into me a little deeper early on when I had fewer slots townreading me. comes off as the silent scumhunter who's just waiting for the scum to slip and then pounce suddenly

 

[Sabrar]

Sabrar Im interested in how you would discern FF’s motivation here. It’s to sloppy for scum imo, and the feeling of struggling as town made sense to me. Since it doesn’t to you, what would you attribute the waffling to? ie stance on Gorf, etc

I've learned a long time ago that people don't think like I do and I can't guess their thought process. Therefore I'm not concerned about why FF would make that case with any alignment.

Do you have any reads? Or are you just biding your time to vote Wam at end of Day?

I don't have reads as such. Whatever I saw that deserved my attention and wasn't already addressed by others I mentioned in thread. I also have some notes, the correctness of which I constantly question. And yes, I am biding my time but not necessarily to vote wam. Though it can easily come to that given the current state of affairs.

 

[Sabrar]

I don't think I've ever played with scum!sabrar so maybe I'm missing some meta here that would suggest scum!sabrar is more passive in his approach?

I'm sad that you didn't care to look back to Crossover even after I quoted it (in another context) in #190. I was scum there.

 

[fontisian]

#HBC | Dark Horse theres a big difference between chaco captioning his vote has an "equality" vote and Pythag merely commenting that he disagrees with my perspective that even wagons are a boring gamestate. Pythag is just expressing a difference in opinion about a relatively subjective take on what is stable/boring vs. volatile/exciting gamestate, I felt that Chaco was trying to mask an attempt to set up two equally possible early lynch options by making and argumentum ad temperantium type appeal

I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I said "if chaco passed." I meant if chaco passed the "test" in terms of giving a genuine explanation for why he mentioned equality. I don't mean "passed" as in ignored the inquiry and just moved on. Had chaco not responded at all to the question my vote would absolutely had continued to stay on him

imo there's a 0% chance that scum!fonti sticks her neck out for me when I had already voted their slot and I was by no means impervious to attack. I somehow doubt scum!fonti has any real interest in pocketing me vs. other slots so fonti's willingness to offer a town read on me and suggest pressure should go elsewhere seems like a genuine effort to sort me and prevent TvTs

for some reason I feel like given how the game has progressed so far, scum!Sabrar would be trying a lot harder to have a stronger grip on the wheel if that makes sense? he's been very content to stay in the background, though I don't think I've ever played with scum!sabrar so maybe I'm missing some meta here that would suggest scum!sabrar is more passive in his approach? I also feel like scum!sabrar probably wouldve sunk his teeth into me a little deeper early on when I had fewer slots townreading me. comes off as the silent scumhunter who's just waiting for the scum to slip and then pounce suddenly

If you, me and Chaco are all town, why would scum!Sabrar need to get a firmer grip on the game? Iirc, in sumting, he was content to let town bury itself.

 

[fontisian]

I've learned a long time ago that people don't think like I do and I can't guess their thought process. Therefore I'm not concerned about why FF would make that case with any alignment.


I don't have reads as such. Whatever I saw that deserved my attention and wasn't already addressed by others I mentioned in thread. I also have some notes, the correctness of which I constantly question. And yes, I am biding my time but not necessarily to vote wam. Though it can easily come to that given the current state of affairs.

I do like him admitting he doesn't have normal reads though.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

If you, me and Chaco are all town, why would scum!Sabrar need to get a firmer grip on the game? Iirc, in sumting, he was content to let town bury itself.

this is 100% on point and was my only reservation on my town read of him

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

I'm sad that you didn't care to look back to Crossover even after I quoted it (in another context) in #190. I was scum there.

gonna be honest man I really don't like putting my time into re-reading old games, unless theres something in an old game that someone can specifically point me to to check out in order to better understand a meta point being made, its just not on my short list of how to spend my time. re-reading entire only games just gives too little bang for your buck imo

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

re-reading entire*** old games just gives too little bang for your buck imo

 

[Chaco]

If you, me and Chaco are all town, why would scum!Sabrar need to get a firmer grip on the game? Iirc, in sumting, he was content to let town bury itself.

I think this tracks well, and Sabrars content has been town driven to me.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Eh?

Not the cases, really, though they helped. It was more how he talked to me. Like, when he popped in to clarify that he was /not/ Omgusing Laser, while you were saying his Omgus was towny.

Yeah I guess I can see that.

As for my read on you: I thought gorf was ridiculously scummy. Unlike some of the other slots who switched off of you as soon as gorf replaced out I want to see you "earn" your way out of the ditch that gorf dug before switching off. Pushes on chaco and wam weren't exactly groundbreaking which is why I've been staying on

Vote: Laserguy

But this I'm interested in