Theory about Marth Mains and how they progress.

[_Kadaj_]

Marth main #1

I guess my progress is going well, I get alot better every tourny than most would after about 5 or 6

 

[ChaosKnight]

Maybe a list should be added?

haha do you want me to put the names under each marth main #

yea that way we could see how we can help each marth main

seems mostly the 2

 

[Tennet]

I kinda fit in between 1&2

Played A LOT of melee but never went to any tourneys.

I guess I'll consider myself #2

I feel i'm progressing pretty well...
Even when I didn't play for a while and just lurked I still managed to catch up to my friends.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Marth main #1 here.

My game actually took off soon after Brawl's release with the help of EL and the rest of the Marth boards. I think my game stagnated around November of last year, and I think I improved a little more at HERB last weekend.

I'm thinking that my Melee experience+my matches vs Chu and Chillin when they came to Jubilee in August last year gave me an awesome jump start for my Marth, but the infrequent opportunities to play someone better than me has hurt me more than anything else. I plan on applying more of my prediction principles that I use/have used in Melee this summer when I do a bit of traveling and hopefully continuing to grow.

I guess this answered your question....I dunno lol.

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

Marth #2 for me.
This helped and hurt.
Helped:
I learned short hopping timing in melee (which as I understand it is not so sensitive in brawl) and that made my brawl game worlds better than it would have been had I started with it. I learned some edgeguarding techniques and such from melee and found some of them applicable in brawl.
Hurt:
I was very discouraged with how slow my marth in brawl was. Though I could react better in the new game, I think it hurt my marth overall. I spent time mastering shffling and lag cancelling, all for waste come brawl. I could not use most of my locks, juggles and combos (such as the one I'd hoped would become my signature combo made impossible by brawl [dashing a --> db 1 --> SH --> fair --> lag cancel --> ftilt --> b/fsmash, or something like that]).
All these said, I would conclude that melee hurt my marth, the game was totally different and i had to break many habits that were useful in melee.

 

[Pr0phetic]

For some reason even though I couldn't wavedash and L-Cancel in Brawl, I wasn't to sadden/angered by it. Maybe its just me, but is sure did help with my Marth's SH and quickly adjusting to his moveset. What really bit me in the *** was his SB, but its all good now :]

 

[WinjaSauce]

I'd be #2-3. I played a little bit of melee, and have a concept of how to do advance techs. I could do some, like wavedashing.. but, i started playing a lot with the release of brawl, and i think that melee could've definitely helped refine my game. ;( i missed out.

 

[Scott!]

I'm a #3. I did play Melee a lot, but never at any sort of advanced level. I've never wavedashed. I did play against a tournament-goer once with my Marth, and beat him a few times, but I don't know how seriously he was trying.

In Brawl, I've advanced fairly slowly. Not going to tourneys would do that. I've been to 2, and one was held at my school. And while they were fun and good learning experiences, it's far from enough to really grow a lot. I just play against my roommate, who also reads up here, more than me I might add. I know all the basic concepts of Marth, but I just haven't learned how to use them properly in action. I also have a mental block against DS OOS; I just have a lot of trouble using a move that leaves one so vulnerable, even though if I do it right, it won't matter. I know this, and yet... I fail. Whatever; I'm getting better, and that's what matters in Brawl.

 

[GPEternity]

I'm about 2.5, I played melee Marth and i knew about AT's. I had SHFFL down and CC and i could WD but no consecutively and not on instinct. i never bothered to attempt JC Grabs.

Playing melee helped develope fundemental ideas that carried over into brawl, things like:

Don't roll excessively
Don't spam laggy moves
Don't be predictable by doing the same thing all the time unless its guaranteed
Be patient, watch your opponent and learn what they like to do then compensate
If your opponent is in the air above you and/or off the stage, feel free to do terrible things to their buttcracks.

of course as a transitioning player you realize there are things that don't work anymore.

-Even thinking about attempting one of marth's many comboes in melee is a terrible idea. Fair -> Fair doesn't even work half the time if they buffer into a shield.
-Similar to the first, follow-ups rely more on prediction and guessing rather than quick fingers and reaction timing.
-I loved Marth's fsmash in melee because of its epic reach and good power/damage. I punished with it, I comboed into it, sometimes i just threw it out at random when my opponent was in range. I love marth's fsmash. Issue here is that in brawl marth's fsmash is horrible untippered and doesn't outrange 99% of all other physical attacks anymore. the really depressing part is half the time i follow up an attack with fsmash, it just barely misses. oh how i wish brawl marth's sword was just 2 inches longer. like my ***** but lets not go there today.
-The part about doing bad things to people you send into the air and off stage still sort of applies...... wait who the eff is this.....? what the!?!?!?!?!...................... metaknight!?!?!?.

 

[Mazaloth]

So I have played melee to a very high level and for me im going to assume that most of you played Melee at one point before you played brawl... but some just picked smash when brawl came out..

My theory for Marth mains and how they progress is based on if you ever played melee or at least played some melee(to at least learn advance tactics.) ... i know there are some marth mains that just started playing at brawls release...here is a question to the ones that just started at brawl .....
do you think that not playing melee slows down your progression???

I for one think melee ....... and how far i got into it helped me greatly with my marth..


do you guys consider it to hinder your progression or make it better because that way you don't have memories of how you used to play in melee??

i think that progression would greatly increase if you played melee but thats just my theory...

here are some categories -- Look at which one you fall into and answer accordingly


Marth Main #1 -- Played melee to a great Extent actually did very well in there own regions-- how do you feel you are progressing

Marth Main #2 - Played melee to a lesser extent but at least learned advance tactics .. ----how do you feel you are progressing?

Marth Main #3 - Did not play Melee at all and picked up the game at brawl..
-------How do you feel you are progressing?


post your answers and which category you consider yourself in... and Theorize about how to improve your progression..:******:

Because of the drastic differences to Melee-> Brawl, it didn't help. Marth's metagame is entirely different and I can't say that it helped.
I hate Brawl, and that is not something I am ashamed to admit, the only thing that keeps me going is the fact that video games has a impact on the psychological factors of those who play, not to mention the impacts on gaming influence other aspects of gamer lives.
The whole theory is flawed because of the differences between Melee Marth and Brawl Marth. Not to mention the physics and technical skill.

 

[ChaosKnight]

did i ever mention that you had to main melee marth xD lol you didnt have to my theory is that if you played melee at all did it help ?? o.0


Marth Main #1s

Kadaj

Chaosknight

Dr.Peepee

Marth Main #2s
VGSteve

Rukkiko

BacklashMarth

BBoyindo

Jimnymebob

AlMoStLeGeNdArY

Teneban

BengalsRZ

Nightshine

magikguy

BanjoKazooiePro

StaFu

ViCTORiOUSViC

Punishment Divine

Rave925

Drews0

Tennet

Thunder Of Zeus

GPEternity

Marth Main #3s
WinjaSauce

Scott!

Vitamin_x

S.O.L.I.D.

Kishin

Steel_Samurai

JunkInTheTrunk

VietGeek

 

[DJMirror]

i'm doing this right now
Started in Brawl then went to melee now trying to play both games, how is that helping my progress on both games

 

[The Marth]

Number 2.5 too XD

I played melee for about two years and then kind of stopped. The game was amazing and I had great fun playing Marth and eating the CPU's ^_^

Then I saw a vid of ken playing marth. what a suprise. Wavedashing and the other AT's amazed me, so I decided to learn myself up on them. I wouldn't say that I played competitevley, but I do know how to utilize Wavedashing and stuff. Brawl came out and the first thing I tried to do was wavedash even tho I knew it didn't exist. Oh well.

Melee introduced me to the character and some nifty stuff that still is in brawl like shieldgrabbing (hardcorest thing evarrr!1!!) and DI. So I'd say Melee was very useful and a good intro,

 

[Pierce7d]

I guess I'm number two. I'm really honored to be considered such a high level Marth actually, because I got into competative Melee two years ago (barely 16 years old), and I was a HUGE Ken Fanboy. I didn't know how to access the scene, and I didn't know any good players near me who I could practice with. I was slowly becoming a passable Melee player, but I was still pretty pitiful. Still, I enjoyed the scene, and playing my favorite game at a higher competative level, so I stuck around knowing Brawl would come and balance the playing field a bit.

Now, in Brawl, I STUDIED really, really hard. I helped contribute to the developing metagame along side Steel, and others whose post counts inflated on Brawl's release. We just came here every day after school and through the summer trying to flesh out Marth's Metagame, and as a really diligent work force of n00bs, we all advanced together under EL, since he was good at Melee and had superior knowledge of fighting game mechanics that greatly helped us proceed in the right direction.

I emulated P.C. Chris' style of patient and passive punishment for a while, and then I started borrowing things from M2k, being calculatively aggressive. Emblem Lord's teachings correlated to the style I borrowed from P.C. but I noticed that M2k was victorious with other strategies, and I also tried that way. Expanding both my offense and defense, I continued building my knowledge pool about the game, and stayed up to date on everything. Still, though I was becoming a recognizable player locally, I was still a big copycat with no real style to call my own. I was completely incomparable with top players nationally, and had no idea what made people like Neo and Roy_R so darn good.

Late last year, Steel told me Neo was training him. It took a while before I finally established my own relationship with Neo though. EL had stopped playing Brawl as much, and due to this, I surpassed him. Having no guidance, I finally turned to Neo, and was able to get a better picture of Marth at top level play.

Now, I suppose I've "grown up" a bit, and I finally have my own style. It's built up of many things I've learned from different players over the past year, but it's definitely unique. Steel once made me smile when he said, "You're so weird, even you can't copy what you do."

I think the real key with becoming a high level player is understanding your limits, and reading defensive tactics (patience). I think, all the study I did, learning about IASA frames from EL, and learning exactly what auto-cancelling and an invincible UpB meant really helped me expand my mind as a player. To get better, you need to:
A) Be able to read dodges, AND PUNISH THEM APPROPRIATELY.
B) Be able to understand how fast your character can potentially be, without swinging at a dodging opponent.
C) Consider ALL of your options, even some that seem completely unlikely to be useful.
D) Learn how to utilize other options than blocking options, as they slow you down, and actually leave you vulnerable.

For example: one might not expect walking or dashing away from their opponent at point blank range to be such a good idea, but frequently I do this, and my opponent whiffs a grab, which enables me to Fsmash or Dancing Blade. Simple things like this will turn you from a low level player to mid level, or mid level to top. It all comes down to expanding your mind to realize what you are capable of, especially from a neutral position.

 

[phi1ny3]

#2 here, I learned about the competitive scene far too late to ever really get into it. But I learned all the **** and ***** my friends.

Anyways, basic melee knowledge did a lot to help me, though I wouldn't consider it a pivotal factor in my improvement.

I completely agree, it does help a bit, and imo not jumping in all the way is beneficial, although to this day I haven't completely kicked the habit of attempting to JCG, and it just turns into a SH nair in Brawl, lol.