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The Professor Layton for Smash Ultimate support thread! See OP for where to meet us next after the boards close. Thank you for all your support!

KirbyWorshipper2465

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True. It is interesting that games that are spookier and horror-y seem to have higher chances of getting localized - I mean, the upcoming Spike Chunsoft game AI: The Somnium Files seems to be advertised almost primarily in English, which is impressive. I don't expect any of those to work with Layton though - sure, Layton mysteries have included death, but I don't think they'll go that far haha.

Is there any character in Smash Bros who didn't have a dedicated anti-fan group at this point? The only one I can think of is Inkling, who people seemed to agree was inevitable enough that even non-Splatoon fans seemed to give up before deciding to complain...

Fan rules keep on dying at impressive rates...
Not only that, but even racier ones like the cult classic Yu-No and that one game whose title I can't recall, but was actually initially barred by Sony's California branch and got accepted by Nintendo. I suppose those with adult material are an easier sell for people.

Well, there's plenty of characters that haven't been hated on in mass yet, and they're generally ones that don't get noticed as much as Waluigi, Geno, Isaac, Shantae, et al. The Konami/Hudson side alone has mostly everyone that's not Bomberman being completely ignored for the most part. I'm not kidding, even Mario-related characters that can be seen as guarantees for Smash 6 haven't gotten haters yet.

At this rate I wouldn't be surprised if we eventually get more creative real stretch fan rules like "a third-party series can't debut with a second unique fighter at the same time" and "the third-party can only get in if they are a high-seller". Those people will always find a way to move the goalpost somehow.
 
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Curious Villager

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"the third-party can only get in if they are a high-seller".
Well good thing we won't have to worry about that since the Layton series already outsold some of the third parties already in the game.
Though that probably still won't stop some people from calling the series too "niche" for Smash....
 

fogbadge

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Well good thing we won't have to worry about that since the Layton series already outsold some of the third parties already in the game.
Though that probably still won't stop some people from calling the series too "niche" for Smash....
and yet theyre perfectly willing to jump on whatever bandwagon comes along nect
 

amageish

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Not only that, but even racier ones like the cult classic Yu-No and that one game whose title I can't recall, but was actually initially barred by Sony's California branch and got accepted by Nintendo. I suppose those with adult material are an easier sell for people.
Yeah, I was kind of ignoring stuff that have more adult content, as they don't directly compete with Layton in the same way I would consider a horror puzzle VN to do. They have, uh, other purposes that Layton does not.

Well good thing we won't have to worry about that since the Layton series already outsold some of the third parties already in the game.
Though that probably still won't stop some people from calling the series too "niche" for Smash....
Ah, yes, one of the flagship non-Nintendo franchises for the best-selling Nintendo console of all time. It's super duper niche.
 

Curious Villager

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In any case, every VN has to stand out in some way to attract buyers, so in a sense they are competing with each other.
I guess that probably goes for any genre, really.

I suppose horror based VN's probably work better on platforms like Youtube since they help garner more reactions from the player and entertains the viewer more.

On an unrelated note, has anyone ever done any speedruns for the Layton games before? I mean I suppose their a tad more linear and you're probably spending more time skipping through text and memorizing puzzles and all.

Then again, there is a small community that have done speedruns on on rails games like Pokemon Snap so yeah...
 

fogbadge

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I guess that probably goes for any genre, really.

I suppose horror based VN's probably work better on platforms like Youtube since they help garner more reactions from the player and entertains the viewer more.

On an unrelated note, has anyone ever done any speedruns for the Layton games before? I mean I suppose their a tad more linear and you're probably spending more time skipping through text and memorizing puzzles and all.

Then again, there is a small community that have done speedruns on on rails games like Pokemon Snap so yeah...
thinking of doing one yourself?
 

Curious Villager

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thinking of doing one yourself?
I don't think I have the tools to do a speedrun so I don't think I can unfortunately.

You could probably pitch the idea at a speedrunning community. I think it might be interesting to see done if it hasn't yet.

I think Curious Village is probably the shortest entry in the series so that might work as a test run. The games have at least three progress walls to where you need to solve a certain amount of puzzles before you can progress so you will probably have to plan a route of the minimum amount of puzzles you need to solve and probably which ones you can solve very quickly. At least as far as any% runs go.

That might help give a bit of a shake up to how you play the games since you will probably have to think about whether you will solve a puzzle that is closer by but requires a lot of steps to solve (such as a sliding puzzle) or ones that are a bit further away from where you need to be, but has a lot of puzzles that you can solve near instantly. (or you could probably have Granny Riddleton's shack collect as many of them as possible and solve them that way whenever you pass by her location)

The series doesn't have much RNG, I think the only puzzle that has something like that with multiple solutions is that one scale puzzle in Curious Village but I don't remember if that one was a mandatory or optional puzzle. Other than that, it might work out. Only thing left is to see which language has the shortest amount of text to skim through.
 
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fogbadge

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I don't think I have the tools to do a speedrun so I don't think I can unfortunately.

You could probably pitch the idea at a speedrunning community. I think it might be interesting to see done if it hasn't yet.

I think Curious Village is probably the shortest entry in the series so that might work as a test run. The games have at least three progress walls to where you need to solve a certain amount of puzzles before you can progress so you will probably have to plan a route of the minimum amount of puzzles you need to solve and probably which ones you can solve very quickly. At least as far as any% runs go.

That might help give a bit of a shake up to how you play the games since you will probably have to think about whether you will solve a puzzle that is closer by but requires a lot of steps to solve (such as a sliding puzzle) or ones that are a bit further away from where you need to be, but has a lot of puzzles that you can solve near instantly. (or you could probably have Granny Riddleton's shack collect as many of them as possible and solve them that way whenever you pass by her location)

The series doesn't have much RNG, I think the only puzzle that has something like that with multiple solutions is that one scale puzzle in Curious Village but I don't remember if that one was a mandatory or optional puzzle. Other than that, it might work out. Only thing left is to see which language has the shortest amount of text to skim through.
it would be interesting to see a layton speed run, though theyd miss out on a lot
 

Curious Villager

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it would be interesting to see a layton speed run, though theyd miss out on a lot
There are any% brackets and 100% brackets so its up to them really. Plus I'm sure they played through the full game entirely first in order to know how to approach the games.

Anyway, according to speedrun.com people have tried to speedrun the Layton games apparently.
Not too many results mind you, but every game does have at least one record in place. There is even a Discord group dedicated to speedrunning the Layton games, which is quite interesting to know. Hopefully the community for it will grow over time.
 
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fogbadge

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There are any% brackets and 100% brackets so its up to them really. Plus I'm sure they played through the full game entirely first in order to know how to approach the games.

Anyway, according to speedrun.com people have tried to speedrun the Layton games apparently.
Not too many results mind you, but every game does have at least one record in place. There is even a Discord group dedicated to speedrunning the Layton games, which is quite interesting to know. Hopefully the community for it will grow over time.
i was meaning story and music, a shame of a thing to miss out on
 

Curious Villager

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i was meaning story and music, a shame of a thing to miss out on
I mean if somebody speedruns a game, they likely already know about the story and music. I doubt people just speedrun games just for the heck of it or anything. Especially since they need to know where they need to go and how to progress as efficiently as possible. If they go at it blind then that will only slow them down.
 

fogbadge

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I mean if somebody speedruns a game, they likely already know about the story and music. I doubt people just speedrun games just for the heck of it or anything. Especially since they need to know where they need to go and how to progress as efficiently as possible. If they go at it blind then that will only slow them down.
i suppose, speed runs have always seemed strange to me as i like to take me time and enjoy even if ive played it many times before
 

Curious Villager

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So I just had a passing thought pop up. But how about they did something like Megaman or Pit and have Layton have some special lines happen whenever he gets KO'd or he KO's someone?

Like whenever he KO's someone, the puzzle correct jingle will play instead of the usual character KO sound, and Layton could probably speak out one of his puzzle solving lines mid match like Wii Fit Trainer does, such as "Every puzzle has an answer!"

Likewise if he gets KO'd, the puzzle incorrect jingle will play instead and Layton would utter out another quote in disappointment such as "I must have overlooked something..."

I thought that might be one way to incorporate the puzzle solving sections in the games in someway. Besides probably his screen KO being him doing his puzzle incorrect pose and his puzzle correct pose being used in his victory screen and all.
 
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fogbadge

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So I just had a passing thought pop up. But how about they did something like Megaman or Pit and have Layton have some special lines happen whenever he gets KO'd or he KO's someone?

Like whenever he KO's someone, the puzzle correct jingle will play instead of the usual character KO sound, and Layton could probably speak out one of his puzzle solving lines mid match like Wii Fit Trainer does, such as "Every puzzle has an answer!"

Likewise if he gets KO'd, the puzzle incorrect jingle will play instead and Layton would utter out another quote in disappointment such as "I must have overlooked something..."

I thought that might be one way to incorporate the puzzle solving sections in the games in someway. Besides probably his screen KO being him doing his puzzle incorrect pose and his puzzle correct pose being used in his victory screen and all.
thatd be nice touch
 

Curious Villager

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Most of it is about other games, but Gamexplain posted a video of Gamescon which featured new games coming to the Switch such as the Layton Mystery Journey port.
Nice to see GameXplain feature the game.

Apparently this game doesn't have touch support in Handheld mode, hopefully that isn't true because that will probably make certain puzzles more annoying to do....
 
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amageish

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Most of it is about other games, but Gamexplain posted a video of Gamescon which featured new games coming to the Switch such as the Layton Mystery Journey port.
GameXplain's Layton coverage confuses me. They covered when Mystery Journey and Curious Village for Switch were leaked, then never mentioned when they were, you know, announced. It's nice to see them covering it to some extent though.
 

Curious Villager

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GameXplain's Layton coverage confuses me. They covered when Mystery Journey and Curious Village for Switch were leaked, then never mentioned when they were, you know, announced. It's nice to see them covering it to some extent though.
Now that you mention it, that is quite odd. They acknowlede the series whenever a rumour or leak related to it pops up, but don't do much whenever a game actually gets announced.

I guess I can kind of understand when they didn't cover the mobile remasters since they mainly cover Nintendo related news. But still.

Isn't one of them a fan of the Layton series too?
 
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amageish

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Now that you mention it, that is quite odd. They acknowlede the series whenever a rumour or leak related to it pops up, but don't do much whenever a game actually gets announced.

I guess I can kind of understand when they didn't cover the mobile remasters since they mainly cover Nintendo related news. But still.

Isn't one of them a fan of the Layton series too?
Yeah. They also did some coverage of Mystery Journey way back when it was Lady Layton, but then never covered its name change or release.

Derrick is a fan of the series, I believe, yeah.
 

Curious Villager

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Yeah. They also did some coverage of Mystery Journey way back when it was Lady Layton, but then never covered its name change or release.

Derrick is a fan of the series, I believe, yeah.
I see, I guess that makes sense, hopefully they will cover the next entry a bit better whenever that gets announced.

Also, can I just take a moment to mention how happy I am that at least one big Youtuber finally acknowledged Eternal Diva as one of the few great videogame movies?

 
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amageish

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I see, I guess that makes sense, hopefully they will cover the next entry a bit better whenever that gets announced.

Also, can I just take a moment to mention how happy I am that at least one big Youtuber finally acknowledged Eternal Diva as one of the few great videogame movies?
I mean, they have more critics now, so I wouldn't be surprised if they had at least one of their contract workers review Mystery Journey Deluxe.

HUZZAH! It's always nice to see that movie get come attention.

Also, completely farcical speculation time, because why not awkwardly force Layton into fitting a "leak"!

As you may have heard, a Japanese twitter user has claimed to know Nintendo things and "leaked" Hero with a variety of skins, but no female hero skins, and a Labo VR mode. They are now claiming to know of a female character with a projectile weapon who "looks like she is from a fighting game," apparently having a friend who saw the game in development but didn't recognize the character.

This leak is very vague, with "projectile weapon" being up to interpretation (though I believe it was specified to be "like a hammer or boomerang") and it not being clear if "looks like she's from a fighting game" mean the person recognized her as a fighting game character but couldn't recall the name or that the character just generally looks like a design that could hypothetically be from a fighting game. Naturally, this has led to a lot of speculation.

Kasumi from Dead or Alive has been pretty commonly speculated, in spite of lack of projectile weapon. Colette from the Tales franchise is also pretty commonly speculated, in spite of not being from a fighting game (and also the fact she'd probably be a tag-team character with Lloyd and one would expect the leaker would have seen Lloyd too and also mentioned that). The most common character who meets all of the requirements I've seen discussed is Nakoruru from Samurai Shodown, who has a literal bird as a flying weapon and is from a fighting game, but she isn't exactly a likely character from a "SNK has mascot characters who would probably take priority" PoV.

But you know who else could be fitted into this role? Katrielle! With a more puzzle-focused moveset, it seems very probably a Layton character would have a projectile weapon - throwing version tools from puzzles. Kat also kind of looks like a fighting game character if you think of more stylized fighters like Skullgirls. I think it would be possible to see her and think she's just a trick fighter from an unique fighting game.

Kat and Hershel sharing a slot with one as a skin for the other would also make some sense to me, as it seems DLC likes having fancy alternate costumes and they do share general skills - especially if the moveset wasn't centered around Hershel's fencing. Plus, it would promote the upcoming Mystery Journey port in the west and one imagines Kat and Hershel will be working together in the upcoming title, so it would fit for promoting that as well.

Now, do I actually believe this is the true meaning Uh, not really... I don't know if I even put any stock in the leak in the first place, as it seems that a DQ hero and labo VR are relatively easy things to guess, with the only unique thing being guessing hero lacking female alts. But, like, it is a way to make Layton leaked and at least follows some degree of Smash-logic? Idk. Thoughts?
 

Curious Villager

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I mean, they have more critics now, so I wouldn't be surprised if they had at least one of their contract workers review Mystery Journey Deluxe.

HUZZAH! It's always nice to see that movie get come attention.

Also, completely farcical speculation time, because why not awkwardly force Layton into fitting a "leak"!

As you may have heard, a Japanese twitter user has claimed to know Nintendo things and "leaked" Hero with a variety of skins, but no female hero skins, and a Labo VR mode. They are now claiming to know of a female character with a projectile weapon who "looks like she is from a fighting game," apparently having a friend who saw the game in development but didn't recognize the character.

This leak is very vague, with "projectile weapon" being up to interpretation (though I believe it was specified to be "like a hammer or boomerang") and it not being clear if "looks like she's from a fighting game" mean the person recognized her as a fighting game character but couldn't recall the name or that the character just generally looks like a design that could hypothetically be from a fighting game. Naturally, this has led to a lot of speculation.

Kasumi from Dead or Alive has been pretty commonly speculated, in spite of lack of projectile weapon. Colette from the Tales franchise is also pretty commonly speculated, in spite of not being from a fighting game (and also the fact she'd probably be a tag-team character with Lloyd and one would expect the leaker would have seen Lloyd too and also mentioned that). The most common character who meets all of the requirements I've seen discussed is Nakoruru from Samurai Shodown, who has a literal bird as a flying weapon and is from a fighting game, but she isn't exactly a likely character from a "SNK has mascot characters who would probably take priority" PoV.

But you know who else could be fitted into this role? Katrielle! With a more puzzle-focused moveset, it seems very probably a Layton character would have a projectile weapon - throwing version tools from puzzles. Kat also kind of looks like a fighting game character if you think of more stylized fighters like Skullgirls. I think it would be possible to see her and think she's just a trick fighter from an unique fighting game.

Kat and Hershel sharing a slot with one as a skin for the other would also make some sense to me, as it seems DLC likes having fancy alternate costumes and they do share general skills - especially if the moveset wasn't centered around Hershel's fencing. Plus, it would promote the upcoming Mystery Journey port in the west and one imagines Kat and Hershel will be working together in the upcoming title, so it would fit for promoting that as well.

Now, do I actually believe this is the true meaning Uh, not really... I don't know if I even put any stock in the leak in the first place, as it seems that a DQ hero and labo VR are relatively easy things to guess, with the only unique thing being guessing hero lacking female alts. But, like, it is a way to make Layton leaked and at least follows some degree of Smash-logic? Idk. Thoughts?
Wasn't that "female fighting game character" leak already debunked, or at least very unreliable?

I've got a silly little theory too. You know how there where a number of mii costumes removed between Smash 4 and Ultimate? most of them where third party mii costumes, however a few other first party costumes didn't quite make it too. One of them was a ribbon mii hat in Smash 4, only to oddly get cut in Smash Ultimate. The closest substitute there is of it is the Lip's wig which also has a ribbon but with a ponytail along with it.

There was another first party mii hat in Smash 4 that was cut during the transition to Ultimate and that was a mini top hat.
70px-Mii_Mini_Top_Hat.jpg

What if they where going to replace that with a mii costume based of Katrielle with a wig and mini top hat based on hers instead?

Most likely doesn't mean anything, but still a curious little thing I found out when recreating some mii's based off other Layton characters. At least the Lip's wig suits Flora very well and even better than the old ribbon did. If Layton isn't in, then I'm kind of sad that they cut the mini top hat since it would have been perfect for my Katrielle mii...
 
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amageish

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Wasn't that "female fighting game character" leak already debunked, or at least very unreliable?
It's very unreliable, as the person could easily have just, you know, guessed stuff and posted it to Twitter as speculation.

I've got a silly little theory too. You know how there where a number of mii costumes removed between Smash 4 and Ultimate? most of them where third party mii costumes, however a few other first party costumes didn't quite make it too. One of them was a ribbon mii hat in Smash 4, only to oddly get cut in Smash Ultimate. The closest substitute there is of it is the Lip's wig which also has a ribbon but with a ponytail along with it.

There was another first party mii hat in Smash 4 that was cut during the transition to Ultimate and that was a mini top hat. View attachment 235695
What if they where going to replace that with a mii costume based of Katrielle with a wig and mini top hat based on hers instead?

Most likely doesn't mean anything, but still a curious little thing I found out when recreating some mii's based off other Layton characters. At least the Lip's wig suits Flora very well and even better than the old ribbon did. If Layton isn't in, then I'm kind of sad that they cut the mini top hat since it would have been perfect for my Katrielle mii...
Huh. Interesting points. Weird, but interesting. A Kat mii costume would join the set of costumes I purchased for sure!
 

AmphabulouSnake

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katrielle and Hershel have VERY different body proportions though, can't possibly work as a costume or an echo fighter...
Despite it being a good way to promote Layton's Mystery Journey I don't think she'll be playable in Smash :/
The only Layton echo I can see is Adult Luke but we're not even sure if they'll release echo fighters alongside their dlc counterpart
Katrielle may get a mii costume though (or just a spirit who knows)
 
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Curious Villager

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I think a mii costume is probably Katrielle's best bet as far as her inclusion goes (besides stuff like Spirits and cameo's in Layton's stage/Final Smash). She's way too different from the Prof as far as height and proportions go,
Also I don't know how I'd feel about her getting Alph'd since it would probably mean she'd do things like step out of the Layton mobile instead of her own bike for her stage entrance and whatnot.

I don't know if they would necessarily want to promote LMJ's Switch port, especially considering the fact the game has already been out in Japan since last year. It would probably be more in regards to gaining more interest for the series whenever the next mainline entry comes out for the Switch, or to reintroduce new players towards the HD remasters who may or may not be coming to the Switch as well.

Speaking of which, when is Level-5 going to reveal Lost Future HD in Japan?
 

amageish

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Given the standards Smash has taken for making characters who are different similar, I don't think Kat/Prof is impossible as you make it sound, as the main issues really are his hat making him taller then her and her torso shape being different then his - which I feel could be tinkered with without too wonky hitboxes. But, yeah, it is more likely they'd just put him in and she'll cameo in his final Smash, as those tend be as full of fanservice as possible.

And, yeah, I'd bet on some news about something Layton at TGS. Level-5 likes it there.
 

AEMehr

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You may have heard of the rumor suggesting that the next fighter would be a female that is "not demanded" and would "confuse and disappoint a lot of people".

Now many people are tryina say it is Tracer because of other things being in play, but I thought of the funny concept that the next fighter could actually be Katrielle. Someone is definitely not highly requested (especially compared to her father anyways), would confuse people (why her over the professor??), and can definitely disappoint depending on who you are.

The entire fighter trailer could start off as the Agency gets a letter addressed to Hershel, who may still be missing at the time, so she decides to go in his stead. Much to the dismay of Ernest and Sherl as they continue to tell her to literally not steal Hershel's invitation throughout the video.

And then Layton with a Pipe is added as a Mii Swordfighter outfit.


I rest my case.
 

Curious Villager

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You may have heard of the rumor suggesting that the next fighter would be a female that is "not demanded" and would "confuse and disappoint a lot of people".

Now many people are tryina say it is Tracer because of other things being in play, but I thought of the funny concept that the next fighter could actually be Katrielle. Someone is definitely not highly requested (especially compared to her father anyways), would confuse people (why her over the professor??), and can definitely disappoint depending on who you are.

The entire fighter trailer could start off as the Agency gets a letter addressed to Hershel, who may still be missing at the time, so she decides to go in his stead. Much to the dismay of Ernest and Sherl as they continue to tell her to literally not steal Hershel's invitation throughout the video.

And then Layton with a Pipe is added as a Mii Swordfighter outfit.


I rest my case.
Yeah I unironically had a similar thought pop up when that rumour sprung up.
Katrielle making it in over Layton would definitely confuse and probably anger a lot of fans since her game in general has a love/hate relationship with the Layton fandom. And getting Kat over her father would be like getting Apollo over Phoenix.

Though despite all that, I think I'd rather have Katrielle over Tracer eitherway...
 

fogbadge

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You may have heard of the rumor suggesting that the next fighter would be a female that is "not demanded" and would "confuse and disappoint a lot of people".

Now many people are tryina say it is Tracer because of other things being in play, but I thought of the funny concept that the next fighter could actually be Katrielle. Someone is definitely not highly requested (especially compared to her father anyways), would confuse people (why her over the professor??), and can definitely disappoint depending on who you are.

The entire fighter trailer could start off as the Agency gets a letter addressed to Hershel, who may still be missing at the time, so she decides to go in his stead. Much to the dismay of Ernest and Sherl as they continue to tell her to literally not steal Hershel's invitation throughout the video.

And then Layton with a Pipe is added as a Mii Swordfighter outfit.


I rest my case.
well it is just a rumour and thus far all the dlc choices have been very popular characters, for smash and/or in general, so it wouldnt make to much sense for it to be kat as that seems to going in the opposite direction of what they want to do with dlc

also lets face what character wouldnt confuse or disappoint at least one person
 

AEMehr

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well it is just a rumour and thus far all the dlc choices have been very popular characters, for smash and/or in general, so it wouldnt make to much sense for it to be kat as that seems to going in the opposite direction of what they want to do with dlc

also lets face what character wouldnt confuse or disappoint at least one person
exactly

she would confuse and disappoint a lot of people because shes not very popular or her dad, that's the point if me even thinking of such a funny situation.

you think all if her alts would be various outfits like the inklings? Or maybe she could wear her outfit based on the professor as a couple sorta like how Joker has two uniform outfits haha.
 

fogbadge

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exactly

she would confuse and disappoint a lot of people because shes not very popular or her dad, that's the point if me even thinking of such a funny situation.

you think all if her alts would be various outfits like the inklings? Or maybe she could wear her outfit based on the professor as a couple sorta like how Joker has two uniform outfits haha.
well its not impossible, but does this rumour have anything going for it?
 

AEMehr

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well its not impossible, but does this rumour have anything going for it?
it doesnt, just suggested a date for a Nintendo direct

I'm just commenting on how funny it would be if the scenario it was depicting was this
 
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