The Monitor Problem

[Zankoku]

Yeah, the 4:3 setting was what I was testing on.

 

[michael_li]

response time is not input lag. the number is deff a lot higher than 2ms. Also the innovation box does not output 480p. ur setup is essentially the same as plugging composite into a monitor. step it up doe

cool story bro. all i care is if it lags or not. and it doesn't so im happy

 

[crush]

cool story bro. all i care is if it lags or not. and it doesn't so im happy

it does lag. probably by more than 1 frame most of the time

 

[michael_li]

it does lag. probably by more than 1 frame most of the time

nah man, less than a frame. like [1/[(∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞)(^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^)]] of a frame lag

trust me man, i've been in this situation before.

 

[crush]

even if u play 480p on an evo monitor its gonna have half a frame of lag. u definitely have more than one frame of lag lol

 

[Zankoku]

Samsung SyncMaster 226BW is around 37ms of input delay, or roughly 2 frames.

 

[Bones0]

nah man, less than a frame. like [1/[(∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞)^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^∞^)]] of a frame lag

trust me man, i've been in this situation before.

You're missing a parenthesis.

 

[michael_li]

lol 2 frames... i donno man it feels way less than that. even though it doesnt feel that laggy, that 2 frames is huge. so the best monitors are those evo ones with half a frame input lag? im gonna start using my CRT 15inch monitor


i hear
Asus VG248QE has A 144 hz refresh rate, .7ms input lag, and 1ms response time

 

[Kadano]

Asus VG248QE has A 144 hz refresh rate, .7ms input lag, and 1ms response time

And what exactly do 144 hz for a 60 hz game (Unless you're playing on Dolphin with 2.4x speed, lol)? Those latency values only apply for 144 hz inputs. For 60 hz, total latency is about 4 ms according to prad.de (I guess that is your source too?). Which certainly is excellent, as far as I know it's the fastest LCD so far.
Still, I'm pretty sure that's all assuming native monitor resolution input (1920x1080). You can't get that from GC or Wii and I heavily doubt Nintendo will bring us Super Smash Bros. Melee U. How much time it takes to scale the image from 480p to 1080p is unfortunately not mentioned in the test.

While this is great technology, its benefits are still pretty unavailable to Melee.

These are all simple and well-known problems, but you completely ignore them. So please, lurk more before you start posting. Spreading false information does not help anybody.

 

[Massive]

Oh wow, I've had a Neoya Wii2HDMI adapter for like a year (to play Xenoblade on my 55" with no component inputs) and I never thought about testing it with one of my computer monitors.

I've got an ASUS VE247H, which are supposedly 11ms input lag rated. I might give it a go sometime in the near future and let you know how it works out.

 

[michael_li]

And what exactly do 144 hz for a 60 hz game (Unless you're playing on Dolphin with 2.4x speed, lol)? Those latency values only apply for 144 hz inputs. For 60 hz, total latency is about 4 ms according to prad.de (I guess that is your source too?). Which certainly is excellent, as far as I know it's the fastest LCD so far.
Still, I'm pretty sure that's all assuming native monitor resolution input (1920x1080). You can't get that from GC or Wii and I heavily doubt Nintendo will bring us Super Smash Bros. Melee U. How much time it takes to scale the image from 480p to 1080p is unfortunately not mentioned in the test.

While this is great technology, its benefits are still pretty unavailable to Melee.

These are all simple and well-known problems, but you completely ignore them. So please, lurk more before you start posting. Spreading false information does not help anybody.

oh buddy your a genius, smartest man i've come across on the internet.

go **** yourself.

 

[crush]

wtf kadano those are hurtful things ur saying...

there should be an add on for firefox that automatically puts all people with anime girl profile pictures on ur ignore list. That would be ****ing sick !

 

[Fizzi]

Oh wow, I've had a Neoya Wii2HDMI adapter for like a year (to play Xenoblade on my 55" with no component inputs) and I never thought about testing it with one of my computer monitors.

I've got an ASUS VE247H, which are supposedly 11ms input lag rated. I might give it a go sometime in the near future and let you know how it works out.

The problem with the Neoya adapter is that I can't think of a good way to do a split monitor test using it. The converter directly plugs into the Wii so there's no way of splitting the signal before converting.

I guess you could at least use IE's lag testing code even though it's not perfect.

 

[Kadano]

oh buddy your a genius, smartest man i've come across on the internet.

go **** yourself.

Sorry that I worded it that harsh, this was not my intention. My post preference is a personal thing that I should not enforce on others. Sorry again. (No sarcasm)

wtf kadano those are hurtful things ur saying...

there should be an add on for firefox that automatically puts all people with anime girl profile pictures on ur ignore list. That would be ****ing sick !

Thanks for telling me, I’m truly sorry I didn’t realize it when I wrote it.

I’ll refrain from posting on SWF for a few weeks or more.

 

[Bubbleman_Nsider]

I've been using an Asus VH238H in 4:3, gaming mode, which works the same as the 236 (EVO monitor). A friend of mine has a 236, and we've been using it with this converter box:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Component-V...=US_Video_Cables_Adapters&hash=item2c609de384

(It may look cheap and stuff, but it does it's job)

It's a component to HDMI converter and comes with its own power supply, so it won't depend on the Asus or Wii for power. We've been using them for tournaments and no one has complained about any input lag at all. I had a tournament yesterday, brought my Asus and the converter for the stream setup, had most players try the setup out, and they all said it was smooth and good.

There's also the Avermedia capture thing, which was shown to also do a good job, but its quite expensive.

So, doing the math:

Asus Monitors run for about $150 and $160. Component cables start at $15, the converter box can be found cheaper at Ebay, but let's say around $28. So, we're looking at the max $200 per setup.

 

[Fizzi]

I've been using an Asus VH238H in 4:3, gaming mode, which works the same as the 236 (EVO monitor). A friend of mine has a 236, and we've been using it with this converter box:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Component-V...=US_Video_Cables_Adapters&hash=item2c609de384

Thanks for the suggestion. Amazon seems to have at least 3 products that resemble this. They may be worth trying.

http://www.amazon.com/component-YPbPr-HDMI-converter-v1-3/dp/B003VJ9RP6/ (This one has awful reviews)
http://www.amazon.com/Component-YPbPr-HDMI-converter-v1-3/dp/B009EA7ZUA/
http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-Component-Digital-Audio-Converter/dp/B0034HWQ4Y/

 

[Bubbleman_Nsider]

Thanks for the suggestion. Amazon seems to have at least 3 products that resemble this. They may be worth trying.

http://www.amazon.com/component-YPbPr-HDMI-converter-v1-3/dp/B003VJ9RP6/ (This one has awful reviews)
http://www.amazon.com/Component-YPbPr-HDMI-converter-v1-3/dp/B009EA7ZUA/
http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-Component-Digital-Audio-Converter/dp/B0034HWQ4Y/

The second one is what we've been using. Its cheaper in other places. This one is pretty much the same thing.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0U00BJ7148

Also, you could find it cheaper at eBay.

This is the Asus I own.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236117

 

[Zankoku]

Yeah, VH238H is VH236H with LED backlight instead of CCFL; the delay and display technology should be the same otherwise.

This is important because the VH236H is actually discontinued so you'll only be able to find occasional old stock or used monitors of the EVO monitor model at this point.

 

[Niko_K]

Fizzi! No way man you're still around that's awesome!

 

[Fizzi]

Fizzi! No way man you're still around that's awesome!

Dude didn't you join my stream the other day lol?