The Kirby Matchup Thread

[OrientalAmazing]

Hmm he's probably whining about the f-throw into solar beam mixup which is honestly kinda busted

 

[Kneato]

Matchup from 's Perspective (+3 has Kirby winning)

+3:
+2:
+1:
0:
-1:

-2:
-3:

What do you guys think? Anything wildly inaccurate?

This is for updating the (outdated) community matchup chart.

 

[OrientalAmazing]

Matchup from 's Perspective (+3 has Kirby winning)

+3:
+2:
+1:
0:
-1:

-2:
-3:

What do you guys think? Anything wildly inaccurate?

This is for updating the (outdated) community matchup chart.

IDK why but for me Charizard destroys Kirbs

Bowser makes sense

 

[FreeGamer]

bowser is not remotely that free lmao

 

[Anime]

Coming into this thread to say the Kirby Wario mu is close to even, maybe slightly in Kirby's favor. And this is coming from a Wario with way to much experience in the mu. I remember seeing early posts about the mu saying it was bad for Kirby. Also, shout outs to Shenanigan , I see you creeping.

 

[Tobb99]

I don't think Bowser is that free. Kirby is light and dies easily from some hits. A bit similar to Puff, which is a favorable MU for Bowser.

 

[Shenanigan]

Definitely agree with Anime on the Wario matchup. Also that matchup chart is hilariously bad. I don't have time to help fix it currently, but whoever made that must have been on drugs for several matchups

 

[eideeiit]

It's "community made"
Which means anyone can contribute no credenrials asked afaik.

 

[Kneato]

Definitely agree with Anime on the Wario matchup. Also that matchup chart is hilariously bad. I don't have time to help fix it currently, but whoever made that must have been on drugs for several matchups

Hence why I'm putting the effort into going to every single matchup thread, asking opinions, and gathering it into usable data.

So far I have that Bowser should be at most +2 and that Wario is 0. What else.

 

[Certix_]

In my opinion, ganon should be 0, he has an easy time getting hits/kills through his walling/burst movement that Kirby doesn't have a direct answer to or the physical traits to deal with it. He can also hit low outside his jab/grab.
Ness should be +1. Yes we gimp hard, but so does everyone. His onstage disjoint beats our aerials out when colliding. Our crouch provides no useful whiff punishes. But we do have an easier time comboing/finishing.
Falcon should be -1, while he completely outspeeds us and can obliterate us in the air, our short stature and crouch limit his viable neutral tools enough to where we can get hits>combos>kills almost as often as he does. Our aerial moves also can get him before his start up. However we need a bit more to start combos and finish him off.
Other matchups I believe are different, but have no write up on:
Bowser +2 or +1
Toon link -3
DK -1
ROB 0
Samus -1
Diddy -2
Marth 0


Others I either agree with or don't have an opinion on yet.

 

[Shenanigan]

Matchup from 's Perspective (+3 has Kirby winning)

+3:
+2:
+1:
0:
-1:

-2:
-3:

What do you guys think? Anything wildly inaccurate?

This is for updating the (outdated) community matchup chart.

This is what my personal matchup chart would look like (disclaimer: I am not experienced in all matchups and do not claim to know everything about any of them):

+3:
+2:
+1:
0:
-1:

-2:
-3:

Changes I'm confident in:

+1 -> -3 This is easily one of Kirby's three hardest matchups. Kirby has no answer to Marth's speed, disjoint, or kill power. Marth would probably still win this matchup if his only two moves were down tilt and fair because they beat every single one of Kirby's ground / air options respectively. A lot of people like to say Kirby's crouch is good against Marth, but any competent player is just going to down tilt you until you do something else.

-2 -> -3 I think this is Kirby's hardest matchup personally. Sure if you get him offstage you have a pretty good chance of gimping him, but you shouldn't ever manage that against a good fox player. Kirby's punish game on fox is surprisingly poor unless there's something I'm just completely missing. Fox hits like a truck, and it takes ~1 - 2 combos before Kirby is at the kill percent for up throw -> up air.

-1 -> -3 This matchup is soul crushing. You can't gimp him, you can't down throw tech chase him, you can barely combo him. His down tilt combos at low percents and out right kills and higher percents. He has an unreasonable amount of kill setups (bair -> fair, up throw -> fair / nair, down air -> up smash / nair, etc...). Since he's already in this thread, Anime can confirm how bad this matchup is.

-2 -> 0 I think Wario has better kill power with things like down air -> up air / fart and down tilt -> up air / fart, but Kirby has an easier time racking up damage. Down feels particularly strong in this matchup - I regularly rack up 50+ percent once i get a grab (shoutouts to Anime again). Also once you steal Wario's bite (which you always should) this matchup bacomes +1 because racking up 30% off a fast command grab is completely unreasonable.

All other changes were made based off of gut feeling / personal opinion, and I'd have to think a little more before I elaborate on them.

 

[Hi I'm Urban]

I feel that the fox match up isn't nearly as bad as people make it seem. My biggest concern in that match up is if he counter picks a large stage and runs away, lasering and fishing for grabs. Tech chasing spacies is fairly easy and offers for some great punishes on fox. I think a lot of people try to play patiently and worry too much about percent in the match up. What I try to do is stay close to fox and space with SH fair to down tilt or grab, that or cross up nair to up tilt or grab. Basically I like to pressure fox so that he cant space me out and try to get him off stage to edge guard him, building percent is important but fox beats you in neutral and on the ground. But he cant contest you off stage as well. It's definitely favorable for fox but Marth, G&W, and I would argue Toon Link do better against Kirby. At least, from my experience playing these characters.

 

[OrientalAmazing]

bowser is not remotely that free lmao

Actually now that I think about it you're right, plus I'll take your word for it ;P

Ok lets talk... Falco.

Pretty much this mu is easy money for kirby. He can negate pretty much all of Falco's approach options including his notorious d-air which is really good for him, plus he can b-air and u-tilt falco for what seems to be an eternity, tech chases for days, f-tilt kills falco in pretty much everyway. This is clearly a top 3 matchup for kirby maybe even the best if i do say so myself.

Also using the absorb ability on falco is extremely good because not only do you have lasers but the whole no lag landing frames thing is really niche for kirby.

You can use down smash and down air to gimp falco's extremely predictable up b recovery, the only option he has here is side b which hard counters like 90% of kirby's edgeguard options, ive tried to dair and bair many side b recoverys and it ends up doing the clashing move circles but he then proceeds to pass straight through me but luckly due to the clashes moat of the time the meteor hitboxes dissapear.

I'd say this matchup is a 30:70 kirbs favor.

Too farfetched or just about right?

 

[OrientalAmazing]

Ok lets talk... Falco.

Pretty much this mu is easy money for kirby. He can negate pretty much all of Falco's approach options including his notorious d-air which is really good for him, plus he can b-air and u-tilt falco for what seems to be an eternity, tech chases for days, f-tilt kills falco in pretty much everyway. This is clearly a top 3 matchup for kirby maybe even the best if i do say so myself.

Also using the absorb ability on falco is extremely good because not only do you have lasers but the whole no lag landing frames thing is really niche for kirby.

You can use down smash and down air to gimp falco's extremely predictable up b recovery, the only option he has here is side b which hard counters like 90% of kirby's edgeguard options, ive tried to dair and bair many side b recoverys and it ends up doing the clashing move circles but he then proceeds to pass straight through me but luckly due to the clashes moat of the time the meteor hitboxes dissapear.

I'd say this matchup is a 30:70 kirbs favor.

Too farfetched or just about right?

EDIT: i hate accidental double posts

 

[Shenanigan]

You can use down smash and down air to gimp falco's extremely predictable up b recovery, the only option he has here is side b which hard counters like 90% of kirby's edgeguard options, ive tried to dair and bair many side b recoverys and it ends up doing the clashing move circles but he then proceeds to pass straight through me but luckly due to the clashes moat of the time the meteor hitboxes dissapear

Aerial earlier and you won't have this problem

 

[OrientalAmazing]

Ok so lemme give my 2 cents on the wario matchup (the post you are about to read is a copy+paste of a post I made to respond to urbans question of is wario vs kirbs bad for kirby)

Hmm, never faced a wario. Did play him though, you should refrain direct approach since he is godly at punishing that. Try to space aerials and don't get chomped/grabbed. I actually don't know if kirby gets any benefits from the chomp ability but i'll suppose it's like wario's. Use it to your advantage and if you see a side b either retreat, powershield if you're gutsy or f-air to counter like said above. Kirby is a very light character so you better keep an exact distance away from him or he will waft fearless. D-air into U-air is unpractical for wario since he would generally save up that combo for a waft instead of an u-air but be wary cause it does exist and both the dair into uair and dair into waft are good mixups. In this case you should:

A) Tech (can you you tech grounded meteors?)

Or

B)DI

But that still leaves the question unanswered. But personally I think kirbs loses.

Well that's just the opinion from a past wario main.

 

[Anime]

Back again. You can't tech the dair when you get hit while standing, and you can't DI out of it because of Wario's air mobility. And up-air is better a lot of the time, because of how early it kills kirby in that combo and you can just save the waft. So don't get dair'd.

 

[OrientalAmazing]

Back again. You can't tech the dair when you get hit while standing, and you can't DI out of it because of Wario's air mobility. And up-air is better a lot of the time, because of how early it kills kirby in that combo and you can just save the waft. So don't get dair'd.

Rough D: Also thanks for clearing up the dair into uair/waft thing :D

40:60 Wario's favor probs

 

[Anime]

Rough D: Also thanks for clearing up the dair into uair/waft thing :D

40:60 Wario's favor probs

Lol, you're pretty confident on a mu you don't know much about. Guess I haven't said in detail what messes up Wario in the mu. Kirby's fair, bair and nair beat out most of wario's bnb options, because the slight disjoint kirby has beats out wario's lack of reach. Nair in particular is rough to get around, because of how fast it comes out and the way it covers his body. Also, kirby's version of bite is way better than wario's. Wario's bite is a small hitbox in his head, kirby's is a giant disjoint covering his whole body and then some. And he can mash to get more damage like in brawl. There is a lot more little stuff going on in the mu, but that's mainly what frustrates wario. He makes up for it in kill power, so it's about even.

 

[FreeGamer]

Wario's weaving and B-Air laugh at Kirby. 60-40 sounds right.

 

[Anime]

Kirby nair beats out bair. Weaving don't fix that.

 

[FreeGamer]

sure about that fam? i would lab it, but no friends

 

[Anime]

sure about that fam? i would lab it, but no friends

Yeah, Wario's hurtbox extends with his fist on his back air, and it has no disjoint, so it'll lose against any sort of disjoint, like every one of wario's aerials except up-air. For Wario, kirby may as well be gannon for how hard he is to get in on, lol. I've come down on a kirby with a dair and gotten hit out of it by a bair, when I was directly above him. It's kind of silly.

 

[OrientalAmazing]

Yeah, Wario's hurtbox extends with his fist on his back air, and it has no disjoint, so it'll lose against any sort of disjoint, like every one of wario's aerials except up-air. For Wario, kirby may as well be gannon for how hard he is to get in on, lol. I've come down on a kirby with a dair and gotten hit out of it by a bair, when I was directly above him. It's kind of silly.

Wait FreeGamer after some thinking anime is right kirbs does have an advantage. I mean like the only 2 things I have to say is chomp and disjoints.

45:55 Kirbys favor

 

[1FD]

my wolf lost to a kirby in a tourney fest thing
Such hard camping back and forth and the kirbycamp won the contest
feels like it would be even until supertop level play
a smart kirby is a jerk that just sits around it seems

 

[FreeGamer]

I still think Wario's superior mobility and kill power make him a headache for Kirby. As for Wolf, I have absolutely 0 experience in that matchup. LOL

 

[sealedinterface]

Maybe it's because I suck, but I can't seem to approach Falco...at all. He's a constant wall of hitboxes with no opportunities to punish. From afar I can duck under his lasers, but then he approaches, and I'm already dead from all the SHFFL'ed dairs and shines. If I forget to DI the first shine, he can KO me with another one from his extremely high second jump. I watched a few Kirby vs Falco matches, and the Kirby seems to have a lot higher airspeed than I have in P:M 3.6. Did they nerf Kirby's air speed in 3.6?

Also, why is this thread pinned if all the matchup spoilers are empty?

 

[eideeiit]

You move faster after a doublejump if you do an aerial I think. Maybe that's it?

 

[Shenanigan]

You move faster after a doublejump if you do an aerial I think. Maybe that's it?

Doing in aerial immediately after a double jump (4 frames?) instantly gives you max horizontal air velocity I'm pretty sure

 

[Mechaglacier]

Could anyone teach me the mew2-kirby MU