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The Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town, Shantae for SSB4 (WayForward wants her in Smash)

Black-magic13

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They had said it was probably just a fan, but they'll let us know for realzies if anything pops up.
That's the thing that messes with me. She said she would remove it on Thursday I believe yet its still there. This is some mean trolling here lol.
 

Wademan94

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Snake is probably going to return, while Shantae is a little more unlikely.
I'm not so sure, from what I've seen Konami has been stiffing Nintendo lately, and pretty much the biggest reason Snake was in Brawl is because Sakurai is friends with Kojima, but he'll not longer be able to pull for him since he recently left Konami. I could be wrong about his chances though, but from my perspective it doesn't seem really likely he'll return, at least in this iteration.
 

Yellowlord

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Who knows? :3
View attachment 65214

Disregard my above post; here it is. I was having issues trying to get it in via image url.

Well guys; my project has finally been completed. Let's just say, it was difficult in some forms to make this (don't even get me started on her head). But in the end, I created something that hopefully will help in Shantae's conquest of becoming a Character. This model was done mostly in Maya, and a bit of Mudbox as well. She is based off both her Pirate's Curse and Half Genie Hero designs.
To those that might of missed my completed Project. To see it, simply click on the attachment.
 
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TheRickyWill

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I'm not so sure, from what I've seen Konami has been stiffing Nintendo lately, and pretty much the biggest reason Snake was in Brawl is because Sakurai is friends with Kojima, but he'll not longer be able to pull for him since he recently left Konami. I could be wrong about his chances though, but from my perspective it doesn't seem really likely he'll return, at least in this iteration.
Not to mention the whole "E-10" thing.

Metal Gear has reached M ratings even before Brawl.
 

Nonno Umby

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I'm not so sure, from what I've seen Konami has been stiffing Nintendo lately, and pretty much the biggest reason Snake was in Brawl is because Sakurai is friends with Kojima, but he'll not longer be able to pull for him since he recently left Konami. I could be wrong about his chances though, but from my perspective it doesn't seem really likely he'll return, at least in this iteration.
Let's been honest, almost every single TP have left Nintendo behind, even some that have rep in Smash.
-SEGA: They aren't relasing anything on their own for N platforms, and when Nintendo PAYED them for making 3 esclusive Sonic games, how it ended? With a decent game (Lost World), a mediocre one (M&S 2014, whch was going to be esclusive anyway) and one of the worst games of all time. Not only that, but they haven't helped in any way to develop Bayonetta 2 (which is a SEGA IP).
-Capcom is realising everything on every platform but Nintendo's. SFV is PS4/PC esclusive, the MegaMan HD Collection will not come out on Wii U (and only MOUNTHS after the PS4/XONE/PC relase on 3DS), and they have pubblished only 2 games for Wii I, which are ports of 3DS games. On the 3DS they are only doing Ace Attorney (since it sells only on Nintendo's) and Monster Hunter (which is here just because the 3DS is the most selling portable system. Some years ago, it was on PSP. If VITA was the nost sold, I'm sure MH wpuld be there).

So really, Konami is not different from these.

And the whole "Kojima is leaving" isn't relevant. Jiglypuff was added in Smash 64 as a joke, but it is still here. Ganondorf, Roy, Doctor Mario and Falco were added in Melee just for create a bigger roster, but theu are still here. Heck, Sonic was going to be in Melee thanks to his creator, but it was to late and he was added in Brawl, WHEN HIS CREATOR HAD LEFT THE COMPANY. It doesn't matter if the motive you were added in the firat place isn't anymore a thing, because you can return if people loves you. And looking at some fan polls, Sbake is very popular (he is even 1st in the Super Poll with more than 43.500 votes). Besides, both Konami and Kojima still wants to see Snake back.
Plus, Nintendo confirmed that TP are eligible for the Ballot, so it means they can add a TP, so why don't add a super requested character that is even the easiest to do (since he is a veteran with already establiseh moves, sound clipd, stage and is also easy to re-have the license for him, since legally it only needs a little operation for use again the Brawl one)?

Not to mention the whole "E-10" thing.

Metal Gear has reached M ratings even before Brawl.
Lol what? This is the most superficial argument used against Snake.
1) ERSB isn't the only rating system in the world. CERO (Japan) and PEGI (Europe) are important as ERSB. And you know what? They have rated Smash 4 exactly as Brawl.
2) You probably ahven't read trough ERSB' Brawl rating. They only state as reasons for the T rate were cartoon violence and crude homur. Nothing signals Snake in any means. It was rated higher probably due of Wario realist farts, realistic look and Master Hand's blood.
3)It doesn't matter for the rating fron where the contents are from, but what they do in the game. Indeed, we already have trophies of M rated games (like Fatal Frame) in Smash 4. Plus, MG: GB was rated E, and MGS:pW was T.
4)Sakurai revealed back in Brawl days that Snake's moveset was carefully chosed for both rappresent MG and being Kif Friendly, so no guns etc.vas a resoult, Snake moveset isn't any more violent than any other characters (maybe just the D-grab, but they can change it to be more similar to MGS:pW/V where he slash on the floor the guy).
 

GoldLiger

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^(The above poster above the above one)You also forgot something in your little explanation. Snake hasn't been on a console level game since Gamecube right with the Twin Snakes game. Kojima was literally the ONLY person that allowed Snake to be in Brawl. While Sonic is easy to explain, he HAS been on Nintendo consoles since Sega got out of the console making business and became a 3rd party.

While Snake would probably make it back. His chances without Kojima being in Konami is slim to none. At best he will be a costume for the Mii Gunner.

Which is why as of now Shantae has better chances then Snake to be a character DLC. Because WayForward has literally been up helping the development of Santae's potential movesets and taking workload of Sakurai's shoulders. Which is great for him. Let's see if other developers/publisher's does the same thing.
 

TheRickyWill

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Wayforward is one of the last few 3rd party companies that legitimately care about Nintendo, even before the ballot.

Now that it's open, everyone and their freaking grandmother loves them.

(Even Artix Games, the studio behind AdventureQuest, wants a spot. lel)

Let's been honest, almost every single TP have left Nintendo behind, even some that have rep in Smash.
-SEGA: They aren't relasing anything on their own for N platforms, and when Nintendo PAYED them for making 3 esclusive Sonic games, how it ended? With a decent game (Lost World), a mediocre one (M&S 2014, whch was going to be esclusive anyway) and one of the worst games of all time. Not only that, but they haven't helped in any way to develop Bayonetta 2 (which is a SEGA IP).
-Capcom is realising everything on every platform but Nintendo's. SFV is PS4/PC esclusive, the MegaMan HD Collection will not come out on Wii U (and only MOUNTHS after the PS4/XONE/PC relase on 3DS), and they have pubblished only 2 games for Wii I, which are ports of 3DS games. On the 3DS they are only doing Ace Attorney (since it sells only on Nintendo's) and Monster Hunter (which is here just because the 3DS is the most selling portable system. Some years ago, it was on PSP. If VITA was the nost sold, I'm sure MH wpuld be there).

So really, Konami is not different from these.

And the whole "Kojima is leaving" isn't relevant. Jiglypuff was added in Smash 64 as a joke, but it is still here. Ganondorf, Roy, Doctor Mario and Falco were added in Melee just for create a bigger roster, but theu are still here. Heck, Sonic was going to be in Melee thanks to his creator, but it was to late and he was added in Brawl, WHEN HIS CREATOR HAD LEFT THE COMPANY. It doesn't matter if the motive you were added in the firat place isn't anymore a thing, because you can return if people loves you. And looking at some fan polls, Sbake is very popular (he is even 1st in the Super Poll with more than 43.500 votes). Besides, both Konami and Kojima still wants to see Snake back.
Plus, Nintendo confirmed that TP are eligible for the Ballot, so it means they can add a TP, so why don't add a super requested character that is even the easiest to do (since he is a veteran with already establiseh moves, sound clipd, stage and is also easy to re-have the license for him, since legally it only needs a little operation for use again the Brawl one)?


Lol what? This is the most superficial argument used against Snake.
1) ERSB isn't the only rating system in the world. CERO (Japan) and PEGI (Europe) are important as ERSB. And you know what? They have rated Smash 4 exactly as Brawl.
2) You probably ahven't read trough ERSB' Brawl rating. They only state as reasons for the T rate were cartoon violence and crude homur. Nothing signals Snake in any means. It was rated higher probably due of Wario realist farts, realistic look and Master Hand's blood.
3)It doesn't matter for the rating fron where the contents are from, but what they do in the game. Indeed, we already have trophies of M rated games (like Fatal Frame) in Smash 4. Plus, MG: GB was rated E, and MGS:pW was T.
4)Sakurai revealed back in Brawl days that Snake's moveset was carefully chosed for both rappresent MG and being Kif Friendly, so no guns etc.vas a resoult, Snake moveset isn't any more violent than any other characters (maybe just the D-grab, but they can change it to be more similar to MGS:pW/V where he slash on the floor the guy).
I should probably do my research next time I before open my mouth. ( - .-)"
 

TheRickyWill

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I want Shantae less for her being an indie rep and a girl and more for Wayforward's overall dedication to Nintendo. Even before Shantae, Wayforward has made well-recieved original titles that launched on Nintendo Platforms: Like Xtreme Sports for the Game Boy Color. After Shantae, Wayforward made more original titles, like Mighty Flip Champs, Switch Force, and Milky Way (which needs a sequel), and LIT, which launched on the Wii and DSi, and became some of the best downloadable titles on those systems.

And parties in and affiliated with Nintendo LOVED them. Nintendo Power absolutely adored Shantae, as far as giving Risky's Revenge Multi-Issue coverage, making Pirate's Curse a cover story, and putting the GBC original on their top 100 games list on their final issue.

Not to mention that Shantae has actually appeared in a Nintendo-made game, along with Commander Video! Remember Warioware D.I.Y? Matt Bozon had a spot on the "Big Name Games" list, represented by a cute Shantae microgame he made.
 
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Nonno Umby

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^(The above poster above the above one)You also forgot something in your little explanation. Snake hasn't been on a console level game since Gamecube right with the Twin Snakes game. Kojima was literally the ONLY person that allowed Snake to be in Brawl. While Sonic is easy to explain, he HAS been on Nintendo consoles since Sega got out of the console making business and became a 3rd party.

While Snake would probably make it back. His chances without Kojima being in Konami is slim to none. At best he will be a costume for the Mii Gunner.

Which is why as of now Shantae has better chances then Snake to be a character DLC. Because WayForward has literally been up helping the development of Santae's potential movesets and taking workload of Sakurai's shoulders. Which is great for him. Let's see if other developers/publisher's does the same thing.
Are you serious? Are you really saying that snake haven't got a big console game since TTS? Well you're wrong sir. You 've forgot MGS 3D on the 3DS, which is as big as TTS (Nintendo even made a bundle 3DS + that game). And what about Pac-Man, Ryu and Mega Man?
The first have only The Ghostly Adventures, and Sakurai would have prefered to cut the character instead to base even just the design on that abonination.
The second hasn't got anything big since SFII on the SNES, but if you consider the PORT of SFIV (a PS360 game), then you must consider the remake of one of the best masterpiece in gaming.
The latter isn't relevant since N64 days. Sure, he got those WiiWare games, but that weren't "big console games".
Kojima may have been the reason for him joining Brawl, but now he isn't necessary. Now he can come back normally as a normal veteran due to his (gigantic) fan-request. Remember that future DLC will be "fan-service", so most requested characters will have the best shot, and this is why Snake is more likely thab Shantae. Besides, what are you sying at the end is that Shantae is more likely beause Wayforwars have almost created a moveset for her? Well Snake have already a complete moveset, plus getting his license is more easier than getting Shantae's (since it can be developed from Brawl's).
Wayforward is one of the last few 3rd party companies that legitimately care about Nintendo, even before the ballot.

Now that it's open, everyone and their freaking grandmother loves them.

(Even Artix Games, the studio behind AdventureQuest, wants a spot. lel)



I should probably do my research next time I before open my mouth. ( - .-)"
It's not really about "caring", but more "where I will make more money?". While developing a big retail game on Wii U is a suicide, digital-only indie games have a very good market on Wii U. This s why Wayforward have developed a lot on Nintendo, because it is a great place for indie, just like Steam and PSNetwork (where Wayforward have also relased some games).



But now returning on our favourite half-genie, I don't really care anymore about what peopke write on Gamefaqs or Reddit. Most of post there are just useless made from people who will never do a costructive discussion like the one I've just done about Snake.
 
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Manic Rykker

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For me it's a bit of both.

For one, I already know how unique Shantae is, and how awesome she would be as a character.

However, there is this funny idea that if the character is indie or thirdparty, their chances instantly drop down to "slim, or nonexistent"... I seriously don't get what people have against third parties/indies...


At this point, it's not about the contracts... sure, Sakurai and the team have to go through some work to get these characters in... but if this really mattered... Why do we have Sonic? Why do we have Megaman? Why do we have Pacman, and now, Ryu? And no, it's not just because of the fact "the latter companies were partnered with Nintendo". It's because they saw past the bias, and saw them for their potential in the game, and as icons in gaming.


In regards to why people have such a hate against these sort of characters, I do believe I have an idea.

For one, some might just have a hate for the company in question for why they don't like indies or third parties. I mean looking at the likes of Microsoft, or Activision, we can see why.. However that doesn't change the fact that some of the characters singled out could make great fighters. (Banjo & Kazooie may be a hostage under the corporate scum, however they have a lot of history with Nintendo's N64 era, and have a great moveset pool. Crash and Spyro may be stuck being hogged by Activision, but they too would make for interesting fighters.. at least in their classic forms... which we know Sakurai would go for, considering pacman.. and while they don't really have history with Nintendo, they are still icons, nevertheless.(Unless you count the ports of the latter.. "meh" titles.))

In some cases, it's just a hate for these types of characters. They have this idea that these characters could "steal the slot" of the character they think is deserving... the fact they aren't owned by Nintendo makes them even more sore. It's the main reason why people get so flustered when these characters get campaigned. They have this irrational fear that 3rd parties/indies will dominate over the first parties... which just isn't true. For one, the roster is constantly changing, and constantly growing. I'm pretty sure there will always be more 1st parties than 3rd parties and indies... but does that REALLY have to mean that the latter has to be poorly represented due to biased thinking?... Sure, it was a Nintendo all-star celebration way back when.... However, it isn't any more. That changed when Sonic joined Brawl. At this point, it's not just a Nintendo all-stars type of celebration (which was great, don't get me wrong.)... It's a gaming all-stars celebration. (Which is even better in my opinion.).. Gaming icons from ALL OVER can get in on the action at this point, and fight amongst the gaming stars.


All this said, this is often why we see many first parties not get as much drag as thirdparty and indie campaigns. They are owned by Nintendo, so it doesn't matter as much.. (There are some contractions flung at them every now and then, but it's not nearly as much as you see thrown at 3rd parties and indies...)... which to me, is just biased, and absolutely sad.

-------------------------------

As a side note, going into opinion mode for a second... (What I'm about to say is strictly opinion, and shouldn't be taken offensively. I have nothing against the group in this topic.)

For me, I don't really necessarily have a hate for veterans returning as DLC myself. I just prefer the concept of newcomers personally. New blood. I'd love to see some familiar faces getting to get back in the game, but I'd much prefer some new faces, with new material. (And so far, in terms of DLC, we have three veterans, outnumbering the single newcomer... which is fine for now but....)

...Really, I'd just like to see this stuff as an opportunity for more newcomers to make their way into the game. It's not that I don't like a character, and it's not that I think they lack potential. That's just my personal hope, and personal opinion... I'll be fine if more of these guys come back, but if we get few newcomers out of this, I'll personally see it as a wasted opportunity.
 
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Solo Bolo

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Kinda sucks, but it's to be expected.

Her games are well-received and just need some more exposure. And despite the colorful atmosphere, the games provide lots of challenge, so any metroidvania fan should get lots of enjoyment out of the series.

Only thought of it now, but Shantae enemies would make wonderful Smash Run enemies. Mermaids, with attacks from Pirate's Curse and HGH, scorpions, ghosts from Pirate's Curse, zombies from Pirate's Curse...

Though I guess they wouldn't huh...
 

SuaveChaser

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The amount of hate on shantae in that reddit thread is annoying and people saying she is fan service -_-. Play the games man.
 

Manic Rykker

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The amount of hate on shantae in that reddit thread is annoying and people saying she is fan service -_-. Play the games man.
Aww they're saying she's fan service? How nice of them to better our campaign :D

( "From now until the end, it is going to be fan service" - Sakurai, 2015... Sorry, had to do it XD )
 

SuaveChaser

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"Whenever I look at gameplay of Shantae there's always skimpy clad women with shiny wet skin and sprites with jiggling breasts.

Makes me think there's a darker side to Shantaes popularity." -_- like really? People act like the shantae games aren't fun.
 
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B.H. and DD

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I wish Sakurai visited this thread because I think having Shantae is a brilliant idea and I don't really see a downside. I really hope between the ballot, the endless support from fans and Way Forward, the benefits, the potential sales, her upcoming game, and her awesome character design/moveset potential she gets in. Sakurai and the team have to notice her by now... hopefully.
 
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Manic Rykker

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"Whenever I look at gameplay of Shantae there's always skimpy clad women with shiny wet skin and sprites with jiggling breasts.

Makes me think there's a darker side to Shantaes popularity." -_- like really? People act like the shantae games aren't fun.
They just haven't seen them or played them. They never will honestly. If they did that, what they actually see might cloud the false headcanon they had for the character they hate,and see how adorable and modest her personality is, and make them actually like her... and we know that's a terrible thing.
 

TheRickyWill

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"Whenever I look at gameplay of Shantae there's always skimpy clad women with shiny wet skin and sprites with jiggling breasts.

Makes me think there's a darker side to Shantaes popularity." -_- like really? People act like the shantae games aren't fun.
Everyone always talks trash about franchises starring girls that isn't Portal, Mirror's Edge, or Metroid nowadays because they saw some videos or fanart and are convinced it's perverted.

Why do you think Skullgirls is so underrated? Why do you think people are convinced Touhou Project is just another peice of weeaboo waifu trash, even though every single character is well dressed, powerful, and are very interesting in terms of origin?

All just because they refuse to take time out to PLAY THE FREAKING GAMES.
 
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Damenshi

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Everyone always talks trash about franchises starring girls that isn't Portal, Mirror's Edge, or Metroid nowadays because they saw some videos or fanart and are convinced it's perverted.

Why do you think Skullgirls is so underrated? Why do you think people are convinced Touhou Project is just another peice of weeaboo waifu trash, even though every single character is well dressed, powerful, and are very interesting in terms of origin?

All just because they refuse to take time out to PLAY THE FREAKING GAMES.
I know that a "like" would have sufficed just fine, but thank you for that nugget of wisdom/insight. (-^-^-)

It's just that this subject hits me really close to home, due to the fact that my own brother has pretty much that exact viewpoint. I mean, I can respect another's opinion and all, but it gets quite irritating when no matter how hard you try, they just won't stop referring to Wayforward as a "fan service company". Ugh... -_-

Personal feelings and rants aside, hatred toward almost anything is to be expected with so many differences of opinion. It sucks, it really does, but the stubborn will remain just that.

With that in mind, it's great to see just as much, if not more, love for such a deserving character and franchise. Reminds me that there is indeed hope. XD
 
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Damenshi

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I believe that they are afraid of possibly liking Shantae if they play her games, so they make dumb excuses to make their "knowledge" right.
Perhaps they're afraid of being seen as "weird" for liking a game that had been previously "established" as "fan-service" by the "community"?

...Just a thought. I have no idea if that made any sense, though.
 
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TheRickyWill

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I know that a "like" would have sufficed just fine, but thank you for that nugget of wisdom/insight. (-^-^-)

It's just that this subject hits me really close to home, due to the fact that my own brother has pretty much that exact viewpoint. I mean, I can respect another's opinion and all, but it gets quite irritating when no matter how hard you try, they just won't stop referring to Wayforward as a "fan service company". Ugh... -_-

Personal feelings and rants aside, hatred toward almost anything is to be expected with so many differences of opinion. It sucks, it really does, but the stubborn will remain just that.

With that in mind, it's great to see just as much, if not more, love for such a deserving character and franchise. Reminds me that there is indeed hope. XD
Despite what people say, Pirate's Curse is the only Shantae game with "fanservice". Even then: It's minor, and isn't shameless about it. It usually ends up leading to a joke, not to mention the game even makes fun of itself for it. (The "I can't, because of my temper and outlandish outfit" line comes to mind.).

At least it has a reason to be there. And hey, it could be a LOT worse. Looks at Dead or Alive: Beach Volleyball.
 

SegaNintendoUbisoft

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I'll admit, when I discovered Shantae, I thought she was little miss fan-service, until I played the games and saw how great of a character she was. You can't judge a book by it's cover.
 

B.H. and DD

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I'll admit, when I discovered Shantae, I thought she was little miss fan-service, until I played the games and saw how great of a character she was. You can't judge a book by it's cover.
I honestly did too. But I really got to know her and her games and now I love her.
 

TheRickyWill

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I'll admit, when I discovered Shantae, I thought she was little miss fan-service, until I played the games and saw how great of a character she was. You can't judge a book by it's cover.
I discovered her through Nintendo Power (RIP) when they started to cover Risky's Revenge. The game and the history of the franchise was quite interesting.

Also, your icon is amazing. To the reaction image folder you go...
 

SegaNintendoUbisoft

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I discovered her through Nintendo Power (RIP) when they started to cover Risky's Revenge. The game and the history of the franchise was quite interesting.

Also, your icon is amazing. To the reaction image folder you go...
That's actually how I discovered her too.

Thank you. :)
 

conTAgi0n

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I replied in that thread lol.

The reason we are seeing so much more Shantae hate recently is that her popularity has been growing so much, so in some perverse way it's a good sign. Now that more and more people are acknowledging her as a top tier contender, those who support other characters instead are seeing her as more of a threat, and reacting accordingly.

This thread also exemplifies why I think when it comes to campaigning for Shantae, we should heavily downplay sex appeal and fan service (which I don't care for myself anyway lol). Fan service leads a lot more people to dismiss Shantae than it leads to vote for her, and it is one of the arguments that her detractors throw at her.

By the way, does anyone know of a good "vote for Shantae" graphic I could use in my signature? I'm terrible in the graphics department, so I was thinking maybe I would just make my signature "#VoteForShantae", but a graphic would be more effective.
 

B.H. and DD

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I replied in that thread lol.

The reason we are seeing so much more Shantae hate recently is that her popularity has been growing so much, so in some perverse way it's a good sign. Now that more and more people are acknowledging her as a top tier contender, those who support other characters instead are seeing her as more of a threat, and reacting accordingly.

This thread also exemplifies why I think when it comes to campaigning for Shantae, we should heavily downplay sex appeal and fan service (which I don't care for myself anyway lol). Fan service leads a lot more people to dismiss Shantae than it leads to vote for her, and it is one of the arguments that her detractors throw at her.

By the way, does anyone know of a good "vote for Shantae" graphic I could use in my signature? I'm terrible in the graphics department, so I was thinking maybe I would just make my signature "#VoteForShantae", but a graphic would be more effective.
I've also noticed that on Gamefaqs when I mention Shantae there's a lot less hostility and more people are willing to accept her as a possible contender. It all happend AFTER K. Rool became a costume. Maybe people are being a lot more open minded now that his chances are a lot more slim than before. IDK, maybe I'm REALLY over thinking this but it's something that I've noticed recently.
 

Guybrush20X6

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Thinking about Shantae, if she does have her transformations they'd probably be only for certain specials as the 3DS couldn't handle full transformations. You know, Shantae disappears in cloud of smoke, Monkey Shantae appears, attack, back to normal.
 

Wademan94

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Thinking about Shantae, if she does have her transformations they'd probably be only for certain specials as the 3DS couldn't handle full transformations. You know, Shantae disappears in cloud of smoke, Monkey Shantae appears, attack, back to normal.
That's what I was more or less going with for my own moveset ideas, I only have her transformations for her Neutral Special (plays out just like in Risky's Revenge), her Smash attacks, and by extension her Up Special (Harpy)
 

TheRickyWill

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Thinking about Shantae, if she does have her transformations they'd probably be only for certain specials as the 3DS couldn't handle full transformations. You know, Shantae disappears in cloud of smoke, Monkey Shantae appears, attack, back to normal.
I was thinking the exact same thing, actually.
 

Guybrush20X6

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If you look closely at the Ganon Final Smash in Brawl you can actually see that Gaonondorf himself is shrunk to invisibility while Ganon is a totally different entity. Amazing what a cloud of purple smoke hides. Also if you moveset hack Sonic you can see the "curled up" state is a seperate model/effect that's only visisble at certain times.

So there are workarounds available.
 
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