Social The Gates of Hell: Bayonetta Social Thread

[glasses]

Does anyone have advice on how to deal with Kirby? The dude is small and the bread and butter combos out of sideB+kick don't connect well because he's too light and floaty. It's even worse when he uses your guns to stuff your approach.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Personally I prefer that notation to begin with.

We can make it standard for this board if we use it long enough

 

[deepseadiva]

Can't believe I actually read "Bayonettas neutral is bad".

Bayonetta doesn't even HAVE a neutral either she's shooting guns, or she's taking damage/recovering loooooool

 

[Ghidorah14]

So, how everyone's online record looking? I ask because I hope you're all getting online and practicing against human opponents, especially when it comes to those "wicked" combos that, so far, work just fine on the training dummy (protip: everything works on the training dummy).

I've logged in 137 fights, with 77 wins and 60 losses (the corrin matchup is some BS), clocking in at 5 hours and 11 mins (online only)

 

[Kurri ★]

So I think I hit a wall, although I blame it more on my lack of skill in general rather than solely on Bayonetta. Guess it's time for me to actually start using Anther's Ladder instead of For Glory (or go to Versus Gaming Center, but that costs money).

So, how everyone's online record looking? I ask because I hope you're all getting online and practicing against human opponents, especially when it comes to those "wicked" combos that, so far, work just fine on the training dummy (protip: everything works on the training dummy).

I've logged in 137 fights, with 77 wins and 60 losses (the corrin matchup is some BS), clocking in at 5 hours and 11 mins (online only)

Pretty sure I've logged at least 100 games myself, but pretty sure less than half were wins >.> That said, they were fun games even if I lost.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

Do you have any examples? I've been trying to find as much as I can.

We have a combo thread that's filled with stupid combos.
Alone her uSpecial > ABK > uSpecial > ABK > uAir.
Only the first ABK requires a soft read to land, everything after that is guaranteed and it kills at 60.
That's hella stupid, especially in regards to bayo having like 4 ways to initiate the combo.

 

[Spelt]

https://twitter.com/wimper_wario/status/695894974877937664

Not sure if bad DI or what but... this is hilarious either way.

The bad part is though if 0-deaths become super prevalent she's most definitely going to be nerfed, which is fine if they're just trying to remove the 0-death combos but anything they do in that vein could end up hurting her in other unintentional ways.

 

[ぱみゅ]

So I think I hit a wall, although I blame it more on my lack of skill in general rather than solely on Bayonetta. Guess it's time for me to actually start using Anther's Ladder instead of For Glory (or go to Versus Gaming Center, but that costs money).

Physical experience beats netplay by a landslide.
You may not always go, but getting first-hand experience is gold. You may even take tips from other players, which is frosting on the cake.

Also, Bae with lag is terrible.

 

[Ghidorah14]

Can I just say how much I love forcing people to approach with this character? It's just so satisfying to shoot a campy cloud with dtilt or neutralB and force them to attack just so I can hit 'em with a big punish.

"Oh, you're just gonna stand there and charge limit? Here, have 10% on the house."

You really dont have to approach against many characters. I think this will end up being a big part of bayo's gameplan; harrass from a distance, force them to come to you, and then punish them hard! Not to mention, her movement options will make her hell to catch if she decides to really stay on the defensive.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

We Guilty Gear now? Oh ****. She be AMAZING in Guilty Gear.

This notation is normal in most fighting games.
Every 8-way fighting game uses them as well, like Tekken and Soul Calibur.

 

[SameOldG]

Anyone use Neutral B + air dodge for momentum stalls/fake out for witch time?

 

[Kurri ★]

Physical experience beats netplay by a landslide.
You may not always go, but getting first-hand experience is gold. You may even take tips from other players, which is frosting on the cake.

Also, Bae with lag is terrible.

That's true, but need to get the money and time first, so it'll be a bit before I actually head down there. Definitely will at some point. Tired of getting my inputs eaten because lag.

 

[Mr_Kreep3r]

I need a Bayo discord invite can anyone pm me the link?

Edit: NVM

 

[Wolfie557]

So, how everyone's online record looking? I ask because I hope you're all getting online and practicing against human opponents, especially when it comes to those "wicked" combos that, so far, work just fine on the training dummy (protip: everything works on the training dummy).

I've logged in 137 fights, with 77 wins and 60 losses (the corrin matchup is some BS), clocking in at 5 hours and 11 mins (online only)

Like 400 matches. 40% win rate. Blame the first 200 or so cos at first I had about 25% win rate since Smash4 is my first Smash. I'm better than I used to be which is nice.

My ajm is to reach 55% eventually but going up/down a little requires a lot of matches lol.

Yes I'm crazy.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly, Bayonetta's on of my favourite characters already. Waaaay too fun

 

[Kurri ★]

Bayonetta is like playing Marvel, but actually having fun at the same time.

jk Marvel is fun

 

[jordanm43444]

Bayonetta feels like she belongs in an anime fighting game. Which is just PERFECT for me since I love those so much <333333

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Bayonetta feels like she belongs in an anime fighting game. Which is just PERFECT for me since I love those so much <333333

We have enough anime swordsman so we already have it

 

[jordanm43444]

We have enough anime swordsman so we already have it

Har.

Nah but really lot of things remind me of things from BB/Persona/XRD

 

[Big-Cat]

This notation is normal in most fighting games.
Every 8-way fighting game uses them as well, like Tekken and Soul Calibur.

Street Fighter and Western Tekken do not.

 

[Kenith]

This notation is normal in most fighting games.
Every 8-way fighting game uses them as well, like Tekken and Soul Calibur.

Speaking of Soulcalibur, Bayonetta as a guest character for the next Soulcalibur game (if there is one) would be AMAZING.
She'd be a perfect fit.

And there's already a connection as Mari Shimazaki did some costumes for SCV.

 

[Sensane]

Does anyone have advice on how to deal with Kirby? The dude is small and the bread and butter combos out of sideB+kick don't connect well because he's too light and floaty. It's even worse when he uses your guns to stuff your approach.

I personally wouldn't even bother with fighting short characters as Bayo. She has too many moves that require tall people. I guess d-tilt would work as a combo starter.

 

[Big-Cat]

Villager is going to prove difficult for Bayonetta I think.

 

[ProtoManDan]

Dunno if this was posted somewhere else already, but she was used in a tourney yesterday :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lltghndsB_Y

Edit: She ended up winning! Here's a few more videos of the tourney:

Grand Finals : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VgMVJAXxrM
Losers Semis : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0Cjc2i8Bv4

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Listening to her Forward Throw Easter Egg, I can really admire Hellena's VA work. She can nail accents just right. She also did this with Zorin in Hellsing Ultimate, in which I didn't like the character, but damn, that was good voice work

 

[Sensane]

I do wish that she'd say "yours is the face only a mother could love, and one that I could never forget" or "don't mess with a witch".

 

[Big-Cat]

Listening to her Forward Throw Easter Egg, I can really admire Hellena's VA work. She can nail accents just right. She also did this with Zorin in Hellsing Ultimate, in which I didn't like the character, but damn, that was good voice work

I know her as Yomiko Readman.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I do wish that she'd say "yours is the face only a mother could love, and one that I could never forget" or "don't mess with a witch".

"Don't mess with a witch" would just be a half assed "Don't **** with a witch".
I would have liked it though if Bayo's long taunt with Bayo 1 costume would have been the Bayo 1 audio instead of the Bayo 2 one.

 

[TTTTTsd]

I like this character like....a lot. I can't use her worth a damn, but I just do.

Feels like a ZSS-esque character except not unfair (that is to say, not stupidly ridiculous, just ridiculous) to play as or against in my experience (mostly online). Like, she was REALLY carefully balanced but she's still very, very strong. It also helps that she has a learning curve so you can really differentiate her good players from her bad ones. I mean I love ZSS but playing Bayo gives me that same feeling except it's way more fun and just feels better in most every conceivable way when I manage to do competently.

I'll keep playing her to try and figure it out, so to speak, I think she's really good but her learning curve will inevitably make her player base small but SUPER dedicated (this is only a good thing, by the by.)

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I like this character like....a lot. I can't use her worth a damn, but I just do.

Feels like a ZSS-esque character except not unfair (that is to say, not stupidly ridiculous, just ridiculous) to play as or against in my experience (mostly online). Like, she was REALLY carefully balanced but she's still very, very strong. It also helps that she has a learning curve so you can really differentiate her good players from her bad ones. I mean I love ZSS but playing Bayo gives me that same feeling except it's way more fun and just feels better in most every conceivable way when I manage to do competently.

I'll keep playing her to try and figure it out, so to speak, I think she's really good but her learning curve will inevitably make her player base small but SUPER dedicated (this is only a good thing, by the by.)

Honestly, as a ZSS main since launch and having over 20h into Bayo so far, Bayo has a much MUCH bigger bull**** potential than ZSS has.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Honestly, as a ZSS main since launch and having over 20h into Bayo so far, Bayo has a much MUCH bigger bull**** potential than ZSS has so far.

I think the learning curve tends to sate that feeling with me, if it makes any sense. I think if you have to put in noticeable work (which I think Bayo does have to do, I don't believe anything she gets would be what I consider free, based on this game and my prior background) I have a wider bull**** tolerance towards it.

Might just be my opinion but she doesn't really feel like a character you can just play and do well with, so if she has crazy ass **** that takes some work and creativity then I'm all for it, honestly.

The character I main (Cloud) has a lot of dumb stuff that you don't really have to put in a ton of work with, he just happens to be fun. From experience I can say Bayo is not quite like that, not really comparable at all.

I just find her to be very intuitively and carefully balanced compared to most of the other top tier characters in this game and it's refreshing. She was designed to be good but they put a lot of meaningful thought into it (IMO)

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I think the learning curve tends to sate that feeling with me, if it makes any sense. I think if you have to put in noticeable work (which I think Bayo does have to do, I don't believe anything she gets would be what I consider free, based on this game and my prior background) I have a wider bull**** tolerance towards it.

Might just be my opinion but she doesn't really feel like a character you can just play and do well with, so if she has crazy *** **** that takes some work and creativity then I'm all for it, honestly.

The character I main (Cloud) has a lot of dumb stuff that you don't really have to put in a ton of work with, he just happens to be fun. From experience I can say Bayo is not quite like that, not really comparable at all.

I just find her to be very intuitively and carefully balanced compared to most of the other top tier characters in this game and it's refreshing. She was designed to be good but they put a lot of meaningful thought into it (IMO)

On a basic level I would absolutely agree with you. Comparing her uAir and bAir with those of ZSS for example clearly show that they thought about those moves. Her mediocre speed and attrocious dodges stand in sharp contrast to her great mobility with sSpecial and uSpecial recovery options and of course Witch Time.

The thing that bugs me right now are the following: How good are her long ass combos in a tourney setting, and how easy is it to get kills with WT once people figure out optimal punishes?

This will basically determine if she will end up being a solid high tier or broken.

 

[TTTTTsd]

On a basic level I would absolutely agree with you. Comparing her uAir and bAir with those of ZSS for example clearly show that they thought about those moves. Her mediocre speed and attrocious dodges stand in sharp contrast to her great mobility with sSpecial and uSpecial recovery options and of course Witch Time.

The thing that bugs me right now are the following: How good are her long *** combos in a tourney setting, and how easy is it to get kills with WT once people figure out optimal punishes?

This will basically determine if she will end up being a solid high tier or broken.

I'm inclined to agree. We need to give this sorta thing time, but I feel like over time she won't really be "broken", so to speak. She'll take some time to really develop beyond the basic stuff, there's just so much more to look for.

But I think she's off to what I would consider a pretty fair start. I really want to see Bayo vs. like, really competent DI among other things, and we'll probably eventually see it. But as of right now I think she's pretty fair despite being really really good. I'd lab it out myself but I don't have a friend who would come over to like....test DI during this, and my execution is quite frankly terrible with Bayo right now and I really need to work on that....

What I really think will be a big draw for Bayo is, IMO, her edgeguarding abilities. THAT is where I think I'd like to see her meta go because she can just go out as far as she wants (basically) and her aerials are very well suited for edgeguarding (That Nair <3 I knew it was gonna be good when I saw it used in the preview)

The big combos I think will probably be solely for damage as I imagine DI can change a lot of kill confirms but again, we'll have to see. I just think edgeguarding looks to be like something she'll be able to do quite well.

 

[apparently fuz]

On a basic level I would absolutely agree with you. Comparing her uAir and bAir with those of ZSS for example clearly show that they thought about those moves. Her mediocre speed and attrocious dodges stand in sharp contrast to her great mobility with sSpecial and uSpecial recovery options and of course Witch Time.

The thing that bugs me right now are the following: How good are her long *** combos in a tourney setting, and how easy is it to get kills with WT once people figure out optimal punishes?

This will basically determine if she will end up being a solid high tier or broken.

It's probably more how valid they are, in addition to the 0-deaths that you see in training mode. There's a drastic difference between what you see in training mode and what you actually see in-game. I guess we'll need to wait and see.

 

[Wolfie557]

Honestly, as a ZSS main since launch and having over 20h into Bayo so far, Bayo has a much MUCH bigger bull**** potential than ZSS has.

ZSS & Bayo mains forever. <3
+Rosa & DDD in my case.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

It's probably more how valid they are, in addition to the 0-deaths that you see in training mode. There's a drastic difference between what you see in training mode and what you actually see in-game. I guess we'll need to wait and see.

Well yeah that's my point. We already know that everything with fAir can most likely be DI'd for example.
I've pulled off a few good combos against half decent people though. I think most of her uSpecial > ABK combos are true for example. On the other hand, ZSS has one of those too.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Well yeah that's my point. We already know that everything with fAir can most likely be DI'd for example.
I've pulled off a few good combos against half decent people though. I think most of her uSpecial > ABK combos are true for example. On the other hand, ZSS has one of those too.

I like her prospects in tournament because even if she can't get the kill confirms off of combos, the damage is still nice and always welcomed. A lot of characters would love to have her conversions even just for the damage.

But I think what I'm really gonna practice is edgeguarding because the potential is there and man is it scary. She basically has like, 3-4 jumps offstage with her aerials the way they are....very good for this. Gonna practice it and stuff.

 

[Tobi_Whatever]

I like her prospects in tournament because even if she can't get the kill confirms off of combos, the damage is still nice and always welcomed. A lot of characters would love to have her conversions even just for the damage.

But I think what I'm really gonna practice is edgeguarding because the potential is there and man is it scary. She basically has like, 3-4 jumps offstage with her aerials the way they are....very good for this. Gonna practice it and stuff.

Speaking of offstage, yesterday I managed to spike a friend with dAir offstage and when I uSpecial'd to get back to the ledge, I hit him back up with it. Made me feel tricked.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Speaking of offstage, yesterday I managed to spike a friend with dAir offstage and when I uSpecial'd to get back to the ledge, I hit him back up with it. Made me feel tricked.

Yeah just like....every aerial she has is really good for edgeguarding (except Bair I think that's just a good punish Bair if you really need it).

I also think stuff like DI up and out, or down and out might be annoying for Witch Twist depending on % and the character it hits. It's why I think Bayo will really hate shorter characters because of reasons.

 

[Big-Cat]

I think practical Bayonetta combos are going to be only a handful of hits but still pretty strong. Now, that doesn't mean we can't find reset setups.