Social The Dog Opens a Can of Whoopass: Duck Hunt Social Thread

[Reila]

Or you could all quit being stubborn and concede that we have three retro newcomers, in Little Mac, Pac-Man and Megaman. :D

 

[TheAnvil]

Or you could all quit being stubborn and concede that we have three retro newcomers, in Little Mac, Pac-Man and Megaman. :D

Did you intend to make a bad post or could you just not help it?

 

[Vann Accessible]

Why is this a thing every single time? Sigh. Ok.

Punch-Out!, Megaman, and Pac-Man were iconic 1980's pop culture institutions. Megaman specifically uses NES sound effects and Pac-Man disregards his mordern appearance and uses '80s Namco arcade sprites as items. Okay, Mac is modernized, but the facts stand, he had one game in the past 20 years as opposed to the arcade/NES games. Am I to believe that just because they had a few games between them in the past few years, these characters are not retro?

If you want an ABSENTEE retro character, that's something else entirely.

BTW: I support Duck Hunt Dog. I just find it funny that people cry "we have no retro characters" as a justification to include him. We have several retro newcomers. We don't have any villains yet. How about shoehorning Duck Hunt Dog in for a villain spot?

I mean, he does laugh at you and all.... That isn't very nice.

 

[ErenJager]

Retro is some what subjective on these forums.
By that I mean user's definitions vary person to person.
Ultimately the only persons definition that matters is Sakurai, as he is the ultimate deciding factor.
We may eventually find out what he considers retro, but for now it's debatable, but shouldn't be argued viciously.

Here's the definition


ret·ro
adjective \ˈre-(ˌ)trō\
: looking like or relating to styles or fashions from the past


Full Definition of RETRO
: relating to, reviving, or being the styles and especially the fashions of the past : fashionably nostalgic or old-fashioned<a retro look>


Based on that definition, someone could conclude that pac-man and mac are retro.
However Sakurai has the final judgement.

 

[Reila]

Technically most characters in Smash are retro, including Pac-Man, Mega Man, Mario, Link, Samus and others.

The problem here is that when people speculate about a retro character for Smash, they are clearly talking about characters who don't get games anymore, like Ice Climbers and Pit (before Brawl), so Mega Man, Little Mac and Pac-Man do not count as retro characters. Mega Man 9 and 10 are recent games, Pac-Man got a new game recently and Punch Out!! Wii is still fresh.

This Vann person above knows this, yet he comes here with the clear purpose of trolling the people who are speculating about the retro newcomer. I really hate people like that. If you don't want to contribute with the debate/speculation, then why even bother posting?

 

[Juliusaurus]

I think Pac-Man, Mega Man, and Little Mac could very well be the only "retro reps" that end up playable. Little Mac himself in particular is doing quite a bit to represent the very original arcade Punch-Out even, so it's not all about the recent Wii game. And of course, Mega Man and Pac-Man are doing quite a lot to represent their earlier retro selves (the entirety of retro Namco in Pac-Man's case)... So, I do think there's already enough there to not include another retro character.

But if they wanted to include one more, man oh man, the Duck Hunt dog would be it. He's still the most recognizable retro character from Nintendo not yet playable (well, okay, maybe Balloon Fighter, but I bet you old school gamers remember the dog more than they do him).

 

[ErenJager]

My definition of retro is arcade/ 8bit era/ nes/ super nes. Also the character hasn't had a game since that era.

However I don't think that every one on these forums views retro the same way. When people view other users talking about retro it's fair to give them the benefit of the doubt that they don't "clearly" share the same view as us.

I think they bring a valid counter point to the table when they speculate that there could already be retro's included.

As we don't know for sure what Sakurai considers retro.

It's possible he's only posting to cause a flame war, as a support thread is intended to SUPPORT a character not to detract from a character.

The best approach is to ignore these users as you're either giving them what they want and falling for the bait, or just being over sensitive to someone with a different opinion.

 

[Reila]

But if they wanted to include one more, man oh man, the Duck Hunt dog would be it.

One more? They still need to include the first one.

 

[ErenJager]

One more? They still need to include the first one.

Until Sakurai clarifies these are or aren't the retro reps, it's all a matter of opinions on both sides, and shouldn't be argued as facts, on both sides.

 

[Juliusaurus]

One more? They still need to include the first one.

Eeeeh, it's hard for me not to count Little Mac when so much attention is going towards the arcade Punch-Out game, but sure, he's a revived character on Wii so he's not completely "retro", or as Vann put it, an absentee retro.

But if we look at Melee and Brawl, both games introduced/revived TWO retro characters. Melee had Ice Climber and Mr. Game & Watch and Brawl had Pit and R.O.B.. Brawl also had Sonic, and his stage was also based on retro Sonic the Hedgehog, so if we're counting Mega Man and Pac-Man as retro reps, might as well count Sonic too. So sure, we don't have a completely retro character in the same way we had them in Melee or Brawl, but I still wouldn't be surprised if nothing came of it this time around.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Or you could all quit being stubborn and concede that we have three retro newcomers, in Little Mac, Pac-Man and Megaman. :D

Just replace the AVGN with Duck Hunt Dog (or any of his supporters) and the dog with you.

 

[pupNapoleon]

It does not really matter what the flat out definition of retro is here, particularly since we are translating from another language anyway.

The point of Sakurai's former point about "retro characters" is that he likes to unearth old games and bring light to characters that many people may not have taken notice of, giving them a new life and added personality, and of course, a new fan base. Therefore, we can determine retro, in this sense, to mean old characters from games seemingly forgotten (or at least not heard from in a long time).

What we need to consider is that he may be doing this through AT's in this game, as evident in the likes of the most recent Takamaru and Prince Sable(?) messages to the audience, in which Sakurai added a sheer level of respect and beauty in expressing who the characters are and stating how much he enjoys their unique attributes. Even the translations showed a high level of adoration for these characters.

 

[Vann Accessible]

Just replace the AVGN with Duck Hunt Dog (or any of his supporters) and the dog with you.

Um... I support Duck Hunt Dog. And why would you shoot me with a Zapper? Should I shoot myself because I support DHD? My head hurts.

I was merely making the case we do have retro newcomers, but I'll concede that it is all subjective. But it isn't trolling. JESUS, you people get bent out of shape over nothing. Especially you Reila. I mean, what is this?

This Vann person above knows this, yet he comes here with the clear purpose of trolling the people who are speculating about the retro newcomer. I really hate people like that. If you don't want to contribute with the debate/speculation, then why even bother posting?

I offered an observation and you accuse me of trolling. You also don't understand the meaning of "debate" if one cannot offer an opinion without being attacked for it. You HATE me? Well, sorry. You can disagree, but don't hate. I don't hate you. I'm sure you're a lovely person.

Anyway, back on topic.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

It does not really matter what the flat out definition of retro is here, particularly since we are translating from another language anyway.

The point of Sakurai's former point about "retro characters" is that he likes to unearth old games and bring light to characters that many people may not have taken notice of, giving them a new life and added personality, and of course, a new fan base. Therefore, we can determine retro, in this sense, to mean old characters from games seemingly forgotten (or at least not heard from in a long time).

What we need to consider is that he may be doing this through AT's in this game, as evident in the likes of the most recent Takamaru and Prince Sable(?) messages to the audience, in which Sakurai added a sheer level of respect and beauty in expressing who the characters are and stating how much he enjoys their unique attributes. Even the translations showed a high level of adoration for these characters.

This also could be taken in account to other games like the Sega Superstars/Sonic & Sega All Stars games. While most Sega fanboys would whine about Ristar being a flagman in Transformed, they can at least be happy that he's been given some attention unlike the green bug in my avatar (who was rejected from the first game for being too obscure).

Um... I support Duck Hunt Dog. And why would you shoot me with a Zapper? Should I shoot myself because I support DHD? My head hurts.

I was merely making the case we do have retro newcomers. It isn't trolling. JESUS, you people get bent out of shape over nothing. Especially you Reila. I mean, what is this?

Relax, I'm on your side of the story. I was simply poking fun at how people were reacting to your earlier statement.

 

[ErenJager]

Some users won't perceive "retro character" and "old forgotten character" as the same thing.

Some users use these terms interchangeably and others not.

This mixed with the matter of opinion, no clear definition outlined by sakurai, shades of grey, and user bias lead to flame wars, so everything is important to understand and to think about before you post because it leads to flaming and being off topic.

I think too often users with polar opposite opinions are labeled as trolls or inciting a flame war.
When you gotta think the person retaliating or responding to the "alleged troll" is simply very sensitive or over reacting to someone who just doesn't share the same state of mind.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Wth all these retros getting deconfirmed. I'm positive duck hunt dog will be playable now.

 

[Arcadenik]

Wth all these retros getting deconfirmed. I'm positive duck hunt dog will be playable now.

As much as I want to believe it, let's try to not count the ducks before they hatch...

 

[pupNapoleon]

As much as I want to believe it, let's try to not count the ducks before they hatch...

Only up to three ducks, and in a non random order.

 

[TheAnvil]

Why is this a thing every single time? Sigh. Ok.

Punch-Out!, Megaman, and Pac-Man were iconic 1980's pop culture institutions. Megaman specifically uses NES sound effects and Pac-Man disregards his mordern appearance and uses '80s Namco arcade sprites as items. Okay, Mac is modernized, but the facts stand, he had one game in the past 20 years as opposed to the arcade/NES games. Am I to believe that just because they had a few games between them in the past few years, these characters are not retro?

If you want an ABSENTEE retro character, that's something else entirely.

BTW: I support Duck Hunt Dog. I just find it funny that people cry "we have no retro characters" as a justification to include him. We have several retro newcomers. We don't have any villains yet. How about shoehorning Duck Hunt Dog in for a villain spot?

I mean, he does laugh at you and all.... That isn't very nice.

Yeah, except Little Mac's design is completely based off of his extremely recent game. If you consider him to be the retro rep, then Mario, DK, and pretty much every other character is retro.

Megaman games are still being made to this (well not quite) day, and so are Pac Man. And is irrelevant to this discussion due to not even being Nintendo.

The "token" retro characters have always been referring to long-forgotten characters IE Rob, Pit, Ice Climbers. Pit has now lost his retro status.

 

[Zzuxon]

*um excuse me?*
WHY I AM NOT ON THE SUPPORT LIST?

 

[Vann Accessible]

Relax, I'm on your side of the story. I was simply poking fun at how people were reacting to your earlier statement.

I was being a little defensive. It was not intendended to be aimed in your direction. Thanks for sticking up for me.


------------

Now, I know many of us want the ducks incorporated into DHD's moveset. But, if we follow the logic that "if a character has been in a game somewhat recently, then they are no longer retro" then in turn, the ducks are not retro because they appeared in Wii Play.

So in conclusion:

Dog = Retro
Ducks = Not Retro

Therefore....








The Duck Hunt Dog was the second shooter on the grassy knoll!

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I think Pac-Man, Mega Man, and Little Mac could very well be the only "retro reps"

Now unless you mean't the newcomer category

Mr game and watch

(Watch the whole pac-man trailer this is at the ending.)


Also the ice climbers and R.O.B would like a word with you. (Those 2 including game and watch are very likely to be back.)

 

[Juliusaurus]

Yes, I meant of the newcomers.

True, Little Mac, Mega Man, and Pac-Man have all had games more recently (some more recent than others, but still, in modern times, you could say), so I guess they can't match up to the same level as Ice Climbers or Pit when they first appeared in Smash.

 

[moneyfrenzy]

Imagine this:

A villian trailer filled with all the veteran villians and also having King K. Rool, Ridley, and Mewtwo. They all had a giant battle and a fantastic trailer. You think it is over, it cuts to a black screen saying "SUPER SMASH BROS FOR WII. U and 3DS" just then, they do the same thing that they did with mega man with the challenger approaching banner, it goes to the same mountain that megaman was on, and all the villains looking up just like the rest of the cast did in the megaman trailer. You see duck hunt dog up there laughing and it cuts to black.

(btw add me to supporters)

 

[Bedoop]

You see duck hunt dog up there laughing and it cuts to black.

(btw add me to supporters)

"Dangit, Fido! Get off that montain! You could fall!"

 

[EricTheGamerman]

He'd be an odd addition that I'd have to say to believe, but seeing him included would be absolutely hilarious and pretty cool at the same time depending on how well done he is. He's perhaps the biggest potential stretch for a new inclusion, but that's never stopped Sakurai before and would make for a very different character in the game. So I'm in support of him, if for nothing else than to make him my level-1 punching bag from time to time for his crazy laughs that I remember hearing at such a young age and making me so angry.

 

[domokl]

Imagine this:

A villian trailer filled with all the veteran villians and also having King K. Rool, Ridley, and Mewtwo. They all had a giant battle and a fantastic trailer. You think it is over, it cuts to a black screen saying "SUPER SMASH BROS FOR WII. U and 3DS" just then, they do the same thing that they did with mega man with the challenger approaching banner, it goes to the same mountain that megaman was on, and all the villains looking up just like the rest of the cast did in the megaman trailer. You see duck hunt dog up there laughing and it cuts to black.

(btw add me to supporters)

duck hunt dog needs to be a a part of the villian trailer lol. that devious laughing and most people would think hes a villian anyway just from that lol.

 

[Arcadenik]

Whew! Duck Hunt Dog still lives!

It is blatantly obvious Sakurai loves Kid Icarus Uprising. But you know what? Maybe it might help Duck Hunt Dog... this is how I see it, Uprising is a shoot 'em up game... and so is Duck Hunt... maybe Sakurai might give Duck Hunt Dog a playstyle that involves lots of aiming and shooting like Uprising. Thoughts?

 

[Yams]

Whew! Duck Hunt Dog still lives!

It is blatantly obvious Sakurai loves Kid Icarus Uprising. But you know what? Maybe it might help Duck Hunt Dog... this is how I see it, Uprising is a shoot 'em up game... and so is Duck Hunt... maybe Sakurai might give Duck Hunt Dog a playstyle that involves lots of aiming and shooting like Uprising. Thoughts?

I hope DHD uses the zapper in some form, but I wouldn't like a full moveset based around it, simply because I think he could do so much more.

 

[SethTheMage]

Y'know, I didn't give it much thought until the Vaanrose/Ninka leak, but I would be totally fine with Duck Hunt Dog on the roster. He has the potential to be a very quirky character, he is super iconic and a great retro character, and he has by far the best potential for trolling with his infamous laugh. While I want other characters before him (namely Dixie Kong and K. Rool), I would love to see him make the cut in addition to them.

 

[Arcadenik]

I hope DHD uses the zapper in some form, but I wouldn't like a full moveset based around it, simply because I think he could do so much more.

Yes... I want him to use the ducks and clay pigeons in addition to the NES Zapper. They would add some variety to his moveset.

I would be surprised if Sakurai somehow incorporated elements from Hogan's Alley and Wild Gunman to Duck Hunt Dog's moveset.

 

[smashkirby]

Say guys, is DHD relevant in Japan? Because I don't see much mention of him there.

 

[Kind Dedede]

Say guys, is DHD relevant in Japan? Because I don't see much mention of him there.

I'm sure if you're not a 15 year old school girl with heaving breasts or takamaru, you won't get much notice.

 

[TheAnvil]

I hope DHD uses the zapper in some form, but I wouldn't like a full moveset based around it, simply because I think he could do so much more.

I absolutely love your sig. Did you do those sprites yourself?

I can only name like 6 or 7 of the characters though .

 

[Juliusaurus]

Say guys, is DHD relevant in Japan? Because I don't see much mention of him there.

Does it matter? What should matter is how integral the character/game/franchise is or was to Nintendo... And I'm pretty sure Duck Hunt is one of Nintendo's major milestone games, even in Japan (though of course, it's most popular in the US where it was included with the NES alongside Super Mario Bros... But still, internationally popular game).

 

[Yams]

I absolutely love your sig. Did you do those sprites yourself?

I can only name like 6 or 7 of the characters though .

Thanks, I wish I could say I did

 

[Kind Dedede]

Does it matter? What should matter is how integral the character/game/franchise is or was to Nintendo... And I'm pretty Duck Hunt is one of Nintendo's major milestone games, even in Japan (though of course, it's most popular in the US where it was included with the NES alongside Super Mario Bros... But still, internationally popular game).

Ridley is non existent in Japan.

 

[BridgesWithTurtles]

I'd get behind Duck Hunt Dog being playable, but for me, it's mandatory that his moveset incorporate ducks as his co-stars. Duck Hunt has always been as much about the ducks as it is about the dog, to me anyway. I mean, it was the ducks that got a trophy in Melee, not the dog. Those simple little avian sprites are as iconic and recognizable as the dog himself. I think that his moveset should heavily focus on using the ducks in an almost meta sort of fashion, with the ducks being portrayed as willing helpers that the dog exploits as weapons.

"Dog and Ducks" or "Hound and Ducks" would be possible names for this playable entity.

 

[Arcadenik]

I strongly believe that Duck Hunt Dog needs to have ducks in his moveset too.

If we got a character who is a dog... but he doesn't use anything from Duck Hunt like ducks, clay pigeons, and the NES Zapper in his moveset... instead, he fights like a generic dog... that's underwhelming and slightly disappointing and people would say I'm ungrateful for having these feelings when I got the Duck Hunt Dog in the first place. I feel that Duck Hunt Dog needs to have these three specific elements in his moveset to properly represent Duck Hunt.

Oh, and his laugh absolutely must be his taunt. No questions asked.

 

[Juliusaurus]

I'd get behind Duck Hunt Dog being playable, but for me, it's mandatory that his moveset incorporate ducks as his co-stars. Duck Hunt has always been as much about the ducks as it is about the dog, to me anyway. I mean, it was the ducks that got a trophy in Melee, not the dog. Those simple little avian sprites are as iconic and recognizable as the dog himself. I think that his moveset should heavily focus on using the ducks in an almost meta sort of fashion, with the ducks being portrayed as willing helpers that the dog exploits as weapons.

"Dog and Ducks" or "Hound and Ducks" would be possible names for this playable entity.

Yeah, I see it similarly to Captain Olimar as well, as in, the real star of Pikmin are the Pikmin and not Captain Olimar. Not that I'd want the dog to play anywhere near the same as Captain Olimar, but I would like him to use ducks extensively, even if they appeared and disappeared as he'd use them (or fly off instead of disappear, whatever). I figure the dog is cartoony enough where that sort of thing is acceptable, and I mean cartoony, like western animation Looney Tunes style cartoony. We don't really have a character like that so far.