The Burning Digimon Dinosaur - Agumon for Smash - Digimon Survive 2020

[Graizen]

Brave is not Agumon's crest. Courage is Agumon's crest. Brave is just the shield and the japanese digivolution theme music but I don't think that there's actually a distinction between the two in japanese so... Mistranslation?

WarGreymon use the "Brave Tornado" as well.

And in several games the Crest of Courage is called "The Brave Crest"

If you want to give a codename to a character, BRAVE is Perfect for Agumon and his evolutions.

 

[ryuu seika]

I thought it was "Great Tornado"? Regardless, though, I don't disagree that it's a perfect codename for him. I was on my way to say as much when I stumbled upon your last post.

 

[fogbadge]

I thought it was "Great Tornado"? Regardless, though, I don't disagree that it's a perfect codename for him. I was on my way to say as much when I stumbled upon your last post.

i think even in the original version its gone by a few names

i know it as mega claw

 

[Prince Koopa Jr]

Believe it was also called Grey tornado

 

[HenryWong122]

It's called Terra Tornado/Great Tornado/Mega Claw in Digimon Adventure Episode 39, Nova Force in Episode 43, Terra Force in Epsiode 45, Ultra Tornado in Digimon Battle Chronicle, Great Tornado St-560 and it was renamed Brave Tornado in the Japanese version of the Anime. Apparently the Extra Agumon that evolves into Omnimon has a floating ability, like Yoshi, so that would be useful in Smash.

 

[ThyCheshireCat]

(Is it bad that my main reason for wanting Agumon is so Machiendramon can be a potential boss?)

 

[Graizen]

(Is it bad that my main reason for wanting Agumon is so Machiendramon can be a potential boss?)

No kkkk

I want his Boss Music so much!

 

[Prince Koopa Jr]

(Is it bad that my main reason for wanting Agumon is so Machiendramon can be a potential boss?)

Not at all, Machinedramon would make a great boss.

 

[ryuu seika]

It's called Terra Tornado/Great Tornado/Mega Claw in Digimon Adventure Episode 39, Nova Force in Episode 43, Terra Force in Epsiode 45, Ultra Tornado in Digimon Battle Chronicle, Great Tornado St-560 and it was renamed Brave Tornado in the Japanese version of the Anime. Apparently the Extra Agumon that evolves into Omnimon has a floating ability, like Yoshi, so that would be useful in Smash.

Terra Force is a different move from Mega Claw and from Great Tornado as well, though the latter has apparently been named the former on occassion. He also has "War Driver" in his less canon moveset from Rumble Arena 2, for what it's worth.
And why have floating Agumon EX when we could have burst Agumon from Savers? It's not like they didn't use a minor plot point to pull winged Guilmon out of their ass for Allstar Rumble.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Terra Force is a different move from Mega Claw and from Great Tornado as well, though the latter has apparently been named the former on occassion. He also has "War Driver" in his less canon moveset from Rumble Arena 2, for what it's worth.
And why have floating Agumon EX when we could have burst Agumon from Savers? It's not like they didn't use a minor plot point to pull winged Guilmon out of their *** for Allstar Rumble.

Do you mean the spoiler thing for the Up B or Final Smash? It might work as a simple Up B. It's safe to say the Final Smash being Wargreymon might work best, assuming we're using the Adventure-style Agumon(as the Savers one is very different, though to be fair, GeoGreymon is very similar to regular Greymon. RizeGreymon resembles MetalGreymon in concept, but has very clear differences. And ShineGreymon is extremely different in comparison, just again, similar in concept). I mean, if you use Savers' Agumon obviously ShineGreymon or ShineGreymon Burst Mode makes more sense. Either way, he can Double Warp Digivolve(depending the language, this or Warp Shinka). If you add the others, just keep it as part of the cutscene, him immediately going into Burst, hopefully with the appropriate music from the anime blaring(either Data Squad or Damon's version of the Burst Evolution, depending the language) as he brings down the pain with his twin swords. So kind of like the Ganon Final Smash, but more sword-focused. Not sure how to make it fast enough to be streamlined, though.

Regular Wargreymon might sound better for speed at this point. The question is whether to use the original Warp Evolution style, which is using all character models as they literally beam into each other, or digivolving through multiple eggs. I think the eggs might be better due to being more known to all the audience. Though the official Digimon Adventure games used the beam effect.

 

[Graizen]

This is realy good! THANK YOU!

 

[HenryWong122]

Digimon has a slight timing problem.

Digimon History: 1997-1998

• Summer 1997 - One-shot manga "C'mon Digimon" released
• June 26, 1997 - Digital Monster pet released by Bandai (Japan)
• December 1997 - Digital Monster (V.2) released (Japan)

 

[Graizen]

Digimon has a slight timing problem.

Digimon History: 1997-1998

• Summer 1997 - One-shot manga "C'mon Digimon" released
• June 26, 1997 - Digital Monster pet released by Bandai (Japan)
• December 1997 - Digital Monster (V.2) released (Japan)

C'mon Digimon gave the idea for the Tamagotchi, but was not showed to the public until Digimon V-Tamers 01 Started.

 

[RileyXY1]

Digimon has a slight timing problem.

Digimon History: 1997-1998

• Summer 1997 - One-shot manga "C'mon Digimon" released
• June 26, 1997 - Digital Monster pet released by Bandai (Japan)
• December 1997 - Digital Monster (V.2) released (Japan)

The actual date for C'mon Digimon's release is August 18, 1997. The first Digimon V-Pets predate it by almost 2 months.

 

[HenryWong122]

The actual date for C'mon Digimon's release is August 18, 1997. The first Digimon V-Pets predate it by almost 2 months.

How in the Sam Hill do you know that?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

That said, the C'mon Digimon one-shot was more to promote the series. It still was created specifically to be a Tamagotchi style game first and foremost. It's like saying Lucario isn't a game character because he technically appeared in the anime first. He was meant for the games first and foremost.

Agumon is blatantly intended as a game character. A similar example is that the Wreck-It Ralph game demo got released before the movie. It may be a demo, but that's his actual official debut outside of commercials. He's still a cartoon character cause that's what he was made for.

 

[RileyXY1]

How in the Sam Hill do you know that?

You posted links to Wikimon, where the information is.

 

[fogbadge]

That said, the C'mon Digimon one-shot was more to promote the series. It still was created specifically to be a Tamagotchi style game first and foremost. It's like saying Lucario isn't a game character because he technically appeared in the anime first. He was meant for the games first and foremost.

Agumon is blatantly intended as a game character. A similar example is that the Wreck-It Ralph game demo got released before the movie. It may be a demo, but that's his actual official debut outside of commercials. He's still a cartoon character cause that's what he was made for.

like with toon link whos was made for wind waker but four swords came out first and i believe a similar thing happened wit yo-kai watch where the manga actually came out before the game

 

[RileyXY1]

Spoiler

"Brave's" stats have been datamined. "Brave" is a tad shorter than Luigi, pretty nimble, and he slides when he turns around. Also, "Brave" does not wall jump.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

like with toon link whos was made for wind waker but four swords came out first and i believe a similar thing happened wit yo-kai watch where the manga actually came out before the game

R.O.B.'s another good example. He's meant strictly for video games in itself.

Ironically Captain N isn't a video game character, despite the point of the show and comic. Though at least it's lightly referenced twice in Palutena's Guidance. I don't think he'll ever appear, even as a MIi costume or spirit, until he gets a video game appearance. If you look at all the anime references/etc(that are very blatant, instead of just hard to tell if you don't know your cartoon history). they're all still characters that have had some kind of game appearance. Ash has Pokemon Puzzle League. In a twist, this is US only, so Satoshi technically never had a game appearance, but they're literally the same character, so that wouldn't matter. To be honest, I'm unsure if Ash-Greninja would've made an appearance in Ultimate if it weren't for the ORAS Demo itself. That said, it's pretty much like Goku's Super Saiyan form. How can you not have it?

 

[fogbadge]

R.O.B.'s another good example. He's meant strictly for video games in itself.

Ironically Captain N isn't a video game character, despite the point of the show and comic. Though at least it's lightly referenced twice in Palutena's Guidance. I don't think he'll ever appear, even as a MIi costume or spirit, until he gets a video game appearance. If you look at all the anime references/etc(that are very blatant, instead of just hard to tell if you don't know your cartoon history). they're all still characters that have had some kind of game appearance. Ash has Pokemon Puzzle League. In a twist, this is US only, so Satoshi technically never had a game appearance, but they're literally the same character, so that wouldn't matter. To be honest, I'm unsure if Ash-Greninja would've made an appearance in Ultimate if it weren't for the ORAS Demo itself. That said, it's pretty much like Goku's Super Saiyan form. How can you not have it?

exactly agumon does technically originate from a video game and from a franchise that started out as a video game which puts him in the same boat as pikachu

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

exactly agumon does technically originate from a video game and from a franchise that started out as a video game which puts him in the same boat as pikachu

Literally. He even has alternate designs. Though he actually beyond completely different ones like the lego variations. Pikachu surprisingly has nothing more than alt costumes at best, no different from stuff like SnowAgumon. Gameplay-wise, Pikachu doesn't really much change it up. No different types. His moveset evolved, but that's not the same thing.

I'm wondering if they'll make an actual different Pikachu at some point. I don't remember if ones like Pikachu Libre even have a very different movepool. But to be fair, Pokemon isn't a "recolor makes a new character" like Yokai Watch, Digimon, and stuff like Dragon Quest do(hell, Monster Rancher I think does that too).

 

[fogbadge]

Literally. He even has alternate designs. Though he actually beyond completely different ones like the lego variations. Pikachu surprisingly has nothing more than alt costumes at best, no different from stuff like SnowAgumon. Gameplay-wise, Pikachu doesn't really much change it up. No different types. His moveset evolved, but that's not the same thing.

I'm wondering if they'll make an actual different Pikachu at some point. I don't remember if ones like Pikachu Libre even have a very different movepool. But to be fair, Pokemon isn't a "recolor makes a new character" like Yokai Watch, Digimon, and stuff like Dragon Quest do(hell, Monster Rancher I think does that too).

just means agumon has plenty of echo potential, well maybe not if we're sticking with video game ones

do you mean in pokemon itself? cause you never know there could be an regional variant pikachu somewhere down the line

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

just means agumon has plenty of echo potential, well maybe not if we're sticking with video game ones

do you mean in pokemon itself? cause you never know there could be an regional variant pikachu somewhere down the line

I mean Pikachu having a palette swapped monster or near identical race created as a parallel to it. In the same way the Agumons are, but more importantly, something akin to ToyAgumon.

...But yeah, does Libre/etc. have a different moveset? I know the types are the same(I honestly think a good way to branch them out is give them an appropriate secondary type).

 

[fogbadge]

I mean Pikachu having a palette swapped monster or near identical race created as a parallel to it. In the same way the Agumons are, but more importantly, something akin to ToyAgumon.

...But yeah, does Libre/etc. have a different moveset? I know the types are the same(I honestly think a good way to branch them out is give them an appropriate secondary type).

well we do get a new electric rodent every gen so theyre parallels (at least thats the way i see it) a regional variant would be as close as wed get to a variation as different as toyagumon

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

well we do get a new electric rodent every gen so theyre parallels (at least thats the way i see it) a regional variant would be as close as wed get to a variation as different as toyagumon

Not in the same way. They aren't a different Pikachu. They're just a similar role. It's more like how Guilmon is for Agumon. That's what ones like Pichu/etc. are.

 

[fogbadge]

Not in the same way. They aren't a different Pikachu. They're just a similar role. It's more like how Guilmon is for Agumon. That's what ones like Pichu/etc. are.

well then a theoretical region variant is closest we'll get, or cosplay pikachu as she has that black mark on her tail, as you said a simple colour variation is not enough to make a new pokemon as far as game freak is concerned

though i wouldnt put it past sakurai to have "shiny pikachu" as an echo

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

well then a theoretical region variant is closest we'll get, or cosplay pikachu as she has that black mark on her tail, as you said a simple colour variation is not enough to make a new pokemon as far as game freak is concerned

though i wouldnt put it past sakurai to have "shiny pikachu" as an echo

I think she(or he) would need more than just the color alone. Shiny Pikachu has an alt already. Cause an Echo also need some kind of stand-out factor. Libre could become one, though.

 

[fogbadge]

I think she(or he) would need more than just the color alone. Shiny Pikachu has an alt already. Cause an Echo also need some kind of stand-out factor. Libre could become one, though.

i was joking, any of the cosplay pikachu's outfits could be an echo with one special swapped out for the move that costume knows

lets face it though the things that separate the echoes are barely anything other than visual from what ive heard theres a slight difference on the belmonts' down specials and thats it

 

[Prince Koopa Jr]

Echos are merely an aesthetic difference

 

[fogbadge]

Echos are merely an aesthetic difference

well no some do have more than that not much but still something

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

i was joking, any of the cosplay pikachu's outfits could be an echo with one special swapped out for the move that costume knows

lets face it though the things that separate the echoes are barely anything other than visual from what ive heard theres a slight difference on the belmonts' down specials and thats it

They're minor gameplay differences. But also use the same exact body build. They're basically upgraded costumes, but also can have even more gameplay differences if it's easy to do. Chrom is able to use a variation of Ike's Up B, to some degree. Though we don't know how easy it it was. The speculation is that he could only use that move because Ike had the same body build as Chrom/Roy. In Ken's case, they put a bit more work into him.

It also implies that they can still have bigger moveset differences. Ken threw a wrench into our thoughts. Having same body type is the most essential for sure.

We also don't see odd ones like Black Knight, so stuff like armor that could be detached from the models when it came to the actual moveset(so are just extra aesthetics, if you will) might not be possible. as shown by how hard it was for Meta Ridley to work. That extra armor is still extra models, which while they don't affect hitboxes, they are still difficult to program without issues. This is why Meta Ridley was not selectable in the demo. Keep in mind the game itself still has tons of lag and before the final release, we had a ton of graphical issues, as not everyone was looking presentable. Basically, characters who fit the body type but have full armor are likely difficult to program without constant issues. In fact, I'm betting this is part of why Mewtwo never got his Armor for any alt. The other is TPC not saying yes. It also doesn't help that he was either in a game that was rushed or was already having more important things to work on, like making him from scratch for 4.

 

[fogbadge]

They're minor gameplay differences. But also use the same exact body build. They're basically upgraded costumes, but also can have even more gameplay differences if it's easy to do. Chrom is able to use a variation of Ike's Up B, to some degree. Though we don't know how easy it it was. The speculation is that he could only use that move because Ike had the same body build as Chrom/Roy. In Ken's case, they put a bit more work into him.

It also implies that they can still have bigger moveset differences. Ken threw a wrench into our thoughts. Having same body type is the most essential for sure.

We also don't see odd ones like Black Knight, so stuff like armor that could be detached from the models when it came to the actual moveset(so are just extra aesthetics, if you will) might not be possible. as shown by how hard it was for Meta Ridley to work. That extra armor is still extra models, which while they don't affect hitboxes, they are still difficult to program without issues. This is why Meta Ridley was not selectable in the demo. Keep in mind the game itself still has tons of lag and before the final release, we had a ton of graphical issues, as not everyone was looking presentable. Basically, characters who fit the body type but have full armor are likely difficult to program without constant issues. In fact, I'm betting this is part of why Mewtwo never got his Armor for any alt. The other is TPC not saying yes. It also doesn't help that he was either in a game that was rushed or was already having more important things to work on, like making him from scratch for 4.

yeah echoes seems to fit whatever sakurai wants, also seems that theyre more willing to put more effort in some characters than others

mewtwo's armour is probably due to the fact that its from the anime more than anything else

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

As far as likely character echoes go, actual characters with an established distinct identity like Ms. Pac-Man are the best fit, compared to "Pikachu with a new hat" (no offense to fans of those).

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

yeah echoes seems to fit whatever sakurai wants, also seems that theyre more willing to put more effort in some characters than others

mewtwo's armour is probably due to the fact that its from the anime more than anything else

I doubt it. Mewtwo's movesset is Anime-based to some degree, Lucario is pretty much all anime, it inspired Pikachu and Jigglypuff's moveset to some degree(namely the specials, though I think it's more Kirby worked out well with giving her her most popular design and abilities. She was added due to anime popularity, after all).

Sakurai has no qualms referencing the Pokemon anime at all. That kind of armor, however, takes a lotto properly design without it falling apart during intensely laggy battles. Combined with TPC being very stingy, and it was not feasible as is. It's a popular Mewtwo design, but why would they want to promote an old movie? It only would've made sense during Melee.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I doubt it. Mewtwo's movesset is Anime-based to some degree, Lucario is pretty much all anime, it inspired Pikachu and Jigglypuff's moveset to some degree(namely the specials, though I think it's more Kirby worked out well with giving her her most popular design and abilities. She was added due to anime popularity, after all).

Sakurai has no qualms referencing the Pokemon anime at all. That kind of armor, however, takes a lotto properly design without it falling apart during intensely laggy battles. Combined with TPC being very stingy, and it was not feasible as is. It's a popular Mewtwo design, but why would they want to promote an old movie? It only would've made sense during Melee.

Given that, do you think the familiar Team Rocket group has a chance to arrive as a newcomer next time? Seeing as they've made a comeback in Pokémon Let's Go.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Given that, do you think the familiar Team Rocket group has a chance to arrive as a newcomer next time? Seeing as they've made a comeback in Pokémon Let's Go.

Probably not. Though it does help Meowth a bit, having two models per character onscreen is even harder. Nobody has more than two max as is. I'd love them in, though. I don't think they fall under how Lucario was made for the games. I think they were made for the anime and Yellow added them in as its own thing. That said, they could become Spirits.

I know I've mentioned Captain N before, who is in a similar position, but he's only been referenced as much as Ash is.

My guess is those who were more meant strictly for the anime won't get more than cameos. Those meant more for the games will. Ash-Greninja is what I'd consider a cameo, to be clear.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Probably not. Though it does help Meowth a bit, having two models per character onscreen is even harder. Nobody has more than two max as is. I'd love them in, though. I don't think they fall under how Lucario was made for the games. I think they were made for the anime and Yellow added them in as its own thing. That said, they could become Spirits.

I know I've mentioned Captain N before, who is in a similar position, but he's only been referenced as much as Ash is.

My guess is those who were more meant strictly for the anime won't get more than cameos. Those meant more for the games will. Ash-Greninja is what I'd consider a cameo, to be clear.

At any rate, the closest we'd ever get to having Captain N in Smash is 9-Volt, who could handily fit the role of a supergamer that can reference many Nintendo games and products. That is if he can get in someday, that is.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

At any rate, the closest we'd ever get to having Captain N in Smash is 9-Volt, who could handily fit the role of a supergamer that can reference many Nintendo games and products. That is if he can get in someday, that is.

Nah, Duck Hunt. We got the dog. We got the human in the BG. The duck is kind of irrelevant, though, in this comparison. Unless you want her(?) to be Gameboy?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Nah, Duck Hunt. We got the dog. We got the human in the BG. The duck is kind of irrelevant, though, in this comparison. Unless you want her(?) to be Gameboy?

Hmm, fair enough.

All that leaves in terms of Nintendo-related characters made mainly for non-game things is Nester, whose closest equivalent is Lark. Even if no one from Pilotwings will be playable at all, they could have at least gave them spirits.