Team Star Fox call in Krystal for Smash!

[Draxis]

IanTheGamer Ah I see, well I like to be part of this group if you don't mind.

 

[Foxy Renegade]

Man, has it been awhile. Doubt anybody here remembers me, but I was back when we were hoping for Krystal in Wii U. I was reading through her and there were definitely a few names I recall. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed, but as it was said before her inclusion as an assist trophy is probably due to this following. The only thing I'm concerned about is if Star Fox Grand Prix comes to fruition and we get the Hail Mary of Krystal actually becoming a more popular character...will her inclusion as an assist trophy serve as the kiss of death for any sort of future DLC?

Ultimately, I guess we need to win the battle of her being possibly retconned from her Star Fox before we can win this one. It would be awesome though if we could get another petition to promote one character from assist trophy to character (especially considering their character models are already in the game). I imagine most people would jump on to the idea considering Lyn, Waluigi, Takamaru, and Krystal.

 

[KrystalRules]

First off, Holy Crap Squiggles! (~Krystal~) it has been a long time since we were part of the core Krystal for Brawl support group! (the name is no longer allowed on this forum. Lol) I know this post isn't in blue... But I don't know how to set it up from my phone. Lol

Second, I guess I'm somewhat ok-ish with Krystal being an AT. At least they used her best outfit!

 

[IanTheGamer]

Man, has it been awhile. Doubt anybody here remembers me, but I was back when we were hoping for Krystal in Wii U. I was reading through her and there were definitely a few names I recall. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed, but as it was said before her inclusion as an assist trophy is probably due to this following. The only thing I'm concerned about is if Star Fox Grand Prix comes to fruition and we get the Hail Mary of Krystal actually becoming a more popular character...will her inclusion as an assist trophy serve as the kiss of death for any sort of future DLC?

Ultimately, I guess we need to win the battle of her being possibly retconned from her Star Fox before we can win this one. It would be awesome though if we could get another petition to promote one character from assist trophy to character (especially considering their character models are already in the game). I imagine most people would jump on to the idea considering Lyn, Waluigi, Takamaru, and Krystal.

There is a precedent, Little Mac got promoted from AT in Brawl to a playable fighter in Smash 4

 

[TheCynicalCdr]

I just want to say that for anyone who's complaining about Krystal being an AT, dont. Not that this is a guarantee but considering how Little Mac started off that could mean an upgrade. I believe it's all in a matter of showing support for her still, which is highly advised doing on Twitter, Youtube, etc. Basically to show that while you're happy to see her in combat, you'd love to be able to play as her, however it was done that lead to Little Mac. Otherwise this is seriously better than nothing, in fact it confirms 100% Nintendo did not retcon her as some tried to claim (then again this was already debunked months ago in the SNES book that came out with the SNES Classic) so really this is something despite everything. As the headmaster of the Krystal Archive advised, give thanks to Sakurai on Twitter, maybe showing that idea I mentioned might help. So...

Lastly in the event this thread dies for whenever a new game comes along, I suggest joining the Krystal Archive discord. I dont know if you're still around jordansweeto but if you wanted to still be in touch with anyone who supports her, this is a good place to jump in.
discord.gg/3dCbzDN

Update
If that invite didnt work, try this one instead
https://discord.gg/gt9kf9

 

[Foxy Renegade]

Although it is a precedent, it is also an exception. An outlier to the rule. Little Mac is the only character that has received that treatment thus far (to my knowledge). I'm going to need something a little more concrete than that. Is having her as an Assist Trophy good in the short term? Yes. Krystal will get a little more popularity this way and we actually get to see her character model. I'm thinking long term, where if she gains enough popularity outside of Smash Bros. in her own franchise to warrant considering her as a character in Smash Bros, will she not be able to be considered for DLC due to her inclusion as an Assist Trophy? I get the impression that the Switch and this iteration are going to last a lot longer than Wii U's.

Don't mistake this for me not wanting Krystal in the game. I bought a Switch, two Pro Controllers, two used pairs of Joy-Cons, that are all still in the box brand new. I was waiting on this announcement before I made my final decision on whether to keep it or not. I'm still on the fence, but at least I won't keep it off the false hope Krystal will make it in down the line.

 

[IanTheGamer]

We could technically get Krystal as DLC even if it means her Assault weaponry and not the Staff

 

[Foxy Renegade]

We could technically get Krystal as DLC even if it means her Assault weaponry and not the Staff

I don't know if that'd be quite as fun though. I'm hoping they just support Ultimate long enough that if Grand Prix releases maybe it will give her enough time to gain some more steam. It's possible she could be removed as an assist trophy and promoted to a character during this iteration, but we've never seen it before. Though this game will probably be the most supported over its predecessors, so only time will tell.

 

[IanTheGamer]

I don't know if that'd be quite as fun though. I'm hoping they just support Ultimate long enough that if Grand Prix releases maybe it will give her enough time to gain some more steam. It's possible she could be removed as an assist trophy and promoted to a character during this iteration, but we've never seen it before. Though this game will probably be the most supported over its predecessors, so only time will tell.

Even if it isn't GP, but is a Star Fox game like Lylat System, it would help her significantly

 

[Draxis]

You know TheCynicalCdr it best to ignore her haters as they will say just about anything that she is gone completely ever since Zero because they think it a reboot and obviously they are not going get that in their head so arguing with them is pointless. As Mr.K said Nintendo never erase or remove their characters entirely. (Been in the Krystal discord since March so I see the text you guys type, hiding in the shadow as always heh).

 

[SiddShidds]

my condolences for you Krystal guys. I found Krystal's AT appearance to be bittersweet. Yeah, she's deconfirmed but, at least she got promoted and did not fall off the face of the earth in Sakurai's eyes!

 

[RPGTobias]

But on the bright side, it's awesome that we actually get to see Adventures Krystal again in any form at all. We may be out of luck until the next game but at least we're headed in the right direction. (This also opens easier doors for modding opportunities with her.)

 

[jordansweeto]

I know that there's mixed reactions with this but I for one was very happy and excited to see Krystal at all in this new Smash Bros game!
We all know that her chances were definitely more on the lower side due to the state of the Star Fox series right now so an assist trophy is actually fairly fortunate for us fans in the grand scheme I would think! If Krystal ever makes it into Smash in the future it will be after the Star Fox series finds it's footing again and has her return again. We need to play the long-term game here.

It was mentioned before in this thread but I agree that we should all thank Sakurai and Nintendo for putting her in the game as an AT! While we're at it be sure to keep the support for her inclusion as a playable character in the future alive! I personally feel like her chances of becoming playable in future games (not DLC for Ultimate) has shot up quite a bit!
I'm confident that Waluigi will make the jump to playable like Little Mac did, if there is enough continued support she WILL get there too.
Ridley is the PERFECT case for this!! If there is enough fan demand it will more than likely happen!!

Long story short, this is really great for Krystal and only proves that we should be MORE vocal than ever in regards to her support for both Smash and her own Star Fox series! I'm very happy!

 

[Flavius]

tbh The fact that we've gotten this far and accomplished this much despite the startling lack of presence from our blue vixen is admirable. I know it's definitely not what we had in mind for Krystal and Smash, but I'm appreciative that Sakurai is acknowledging the character and her fans. The future looks a lot less bleak my friends.

 

[Blackwolf666]

Didn’t even realize Krystal was an AT until just now. Well, I’m surprisingly fine with that. I suppose I just wanted her in smash bros period.

 

[Gagnetar]

I mean realistically yea we did pretty well, How many characters who haven't been relevant for 10 years with dwindling popularity made it into smash brothers above a trophy or cameo? not to mention assist trophies have been buffed and now more than Lyn can actually kill people, that's why you get a point for killing them, which I weirdly saw on 4chan before they announced it, I mean in the like 10 seconds she showed up she was able to kill a player, so that's sorta a double "win" I've mostly seen fans emboldened by her assist trophy appearence because before people really thought she wasn't supported by nintendo, It's a lot harder to say that when she makes a decent appearence in the biggest smash game ever, and it's solely due to her dedicated fanbase, As it looks like the character was cobbled together, clearly an upscaled, poly-enhanced adventures model and what looks like a completely new staff, and recycled (assault amusingly) voice lines, they seemed pretty pressed to make anything other than getting every character in the game. We know now what Emily ment by "Ultimate" smash roster. I doubt it's possible to receive a trophy upgrade in the same game and I wouldn't suggest counting on it, but it's a possibility if Grand Prix has her. Because It's going to be quite some time before we get another smash. All in all, it could have been a worse turn out for sure.

 

[jahkzheng]

Feels silly to say... but I really want to see more of this AT in action. She looks great and I'm hearing now that she does good damage and has recognizable voice lines. See, that's what makes this easier to accept as an outcome, aside from the fact that we all knew our odds.. this AT treatment is good.

I wonder if smash taunt stage dialogue makes a come back in Lylat. It's not obviously going to since they've changed similar things in the past, but if it stays as it's been since Brawl then Krystal will maintain her smash taunt dialogue and have an AT, which could be funny/weird if they happen at once. But in terms of non playable characters, she'll have more character on display than just about anyone else. Any more without being a playable character and she'd be a stage fixture too, lol. Although, characters like Viridi might have more dialogue but unless she got an upgrade too, she doesn't appear as an animated model anywhere.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I had already given up hope before, but it's still a sad day to see her not make the cut.

My condolences.

 

[Draxis]

Well on the bright side we get to have some good screen shot of Krystal and the SF characters to make it seem like she interacting with them so that good and moding is a thing so modder can make her playable like how they did with Waluigi.

Also it possible that she might appear in that Starlink game but I wouldn't count on it tho.

 

[SDFox]

No chance we can all send letters to Sakurai saying something like, "please reconsider" or something lol. Ah, this has yet to sink in for me

 

[IanTheGamer]

No chance we can all send letters to Sakurai saying something like, "please reconsider" or something lol. Ah, this has yet to sink in for me

That if anything will only get Krystal playable in the next Smash game

 

[Gagnetar]

Feels silly to say... but I really want to see more of this AT in action. She looks great and I'm hearing now that she does good damage and has recognizable voice lines. See, that's what makes this easier to accept as an outcome, aside from the fact that we all knew our odds.. this AT treatment is good.

I wonder if smash taunt stage dialogue makes a come back in Lylat. It's not obviously going to since they've changed similar things in the past, but if it stays as it's been since Brawl then Krystal will maintain her smash taunt dialogue and have an AT, which could be funny/weird if they happen at once. But in terms of non playable characters, she'll have more character on display than just about anyone else. Any more without being a playable character and she'd be a stage fixture too, lol. Although, characters like Viridi might have more dialogue but unless she got an upgrade too, she doesn't appear as an animated model anywhere.

as of the making of this post you can view the twitch VOD, you may want to download it if you want to keep watching it as I don't know if the treehouse is actually on youtube https://www.twitch.tv/videos/272419858?t=03h29m24s It shows her in activated and used from the assist trophy, most of the assist trophies seem pretty good, but her's is pretty competent, sure it's not quite as good as persay Lyn but Krystal has many more chances to actually hit the opponent, she seems to have two different attacks, and she can perform one of them in the air. She appears to fire the Freeze Blast for a ranged attack/aerial then a staff flurry attack for Melee, which seems to KO pretty nicely. her voice lines are from Starfox Assault, namely her in stage taunt and her victory quote. Also Lylat Cruise is in the game, I don't see the point in cutting it just because she's an assist trophy.

 

[Demented Dex]

Such a bittersweet feeling I have. This bit of news definitely struck a blow to my determination, but I'm so glad that Sakurai and his team showed Krystal some notable love, whereas some of the more influential Star Fox developers didn't (but if they did, they have yet to show it). And while I don't mean to point fingers, I wonder if Sakurai himself wanted Krystal playable and the higher-ups at Nintendo were against it. Sounds a bit strange but I wouldn't rule it out.


Also: I know this is pretty out-there too, but I had this scenario in my head in which Sakurai was fooling us all along in regards to Krystal's status in the game. Imagine her actually being unlockable in the final product, but revealed at E3 as an AT to gather info on the public's reception of her. After all, the game is still in development, and Sakurai is quite a trickster.

 

[SDFox]

can we change this thread into a modding krystal into smash 5 thread?

 

[IanTheGamer]

Such a bittersweet feeling I have. This bit of news definitely struck a blow to my determination, but I'm so glad that Sakurai and his team showed Krystal some notable love, whereas some of the more influential Star Fox developers didn't (but if they did, they have yet to show it). And while I don't mean to point fingers, I wonder if Sakurai himself wanted Krystal playable and the higher-ups at Nintendo were against it. Sounds a bit strange but I wouldn't rule it out.


Also: I know this is pretty out-there too, but I had this scenario in my head in which Sakurai was fooling us all along in regards to Krystal's status in the game. Imagine her actually being unlockable in the final product, but revealed at E3 as an AT to gather info on the public's reception of her. After all, the game is still in development, and Sakurai is quite a trickster.

That seems awfully reckless of Sakurai,

 

[Demented Dex]

That seems awfully reckless of Sakurai,

I was just spilling my feelings a bit. Don't give it too much thought.

 

[IanTheGamer]

I was just spilling my feelings a bit. Don't give it too much thought.

Sakurai is not that crazy

I am not sure if I can go down the hype rollercoaster again for the next Smash, knowing that crushing disappointment is once again a possibility

 

[PF9]

Looking back I think Brawl was her best chance to join the fight and Wolf was chosen instead.

 

[ArcaneKitsune]

I’m gonna be honest here and say I’m still salty about Krystal being in Ultimate as an Assist Trophy. I’m still trying to wrap my mind around why the decision was made to make Krystal an AT in the first place and not a playable fighter. I feel like Sakurai dropped the ball on newcomers this time round(I’m not saying a playable Ridley is a bad thing mind you). It just feels like Sakurai gave into “Fan Demand” at the beginning development stages of Ultimate and said “ “F” it let’s just bring back all the fighters from the previous games that were cut then add Inklings, Daisy, & Ridley and lets call it day. Also let’s make eleven new ATs for the game and make sure Krystal is one of them.”. I’m not saying this what happened, but I feel as though it went down in similar fashion to this. Nonetheless, I’ll take her current status as an Assist Trophy as another small victory on her path to the “Major Leagues” of Super Smash Bros. known as “Playable Fighter Status”.

Also I came across this while surfing the internet for anymore juicy information on SSB Ultimate. I’m taking it with a “grain of salt” as of right now considering how silly it is, but you’ll never what will happen. “A small ripple can gain momentum and build a current that insurmountable.”

 

[TheRandomCities4]

Perhaps the thing that sucks most about this scenario is that Krystal as DLC is pretty much out of the question, unless they're willing to either retcon the AT or have both her as an AT AND playable character--but that sounds absurd.

However, the only other option was that she would have not been shown at all (assuming she wasn't an AT). While this may have hypothetically boded better for her inclusion (seeing as how Wolf was already brought back), if she wasn't included then she likely wouldn't have become an AT at all. This situation would have allowed DLC to still be on the table as an option, but we would have been left with another familiar issue:

Sure having a character disconfirmed sucks, and having one disconfirmed in the era of DLC sucks even more, but not having ANY information on a character (AT or otherwise) until the game is released is probably worse yet. We've gone through that third possibility TWICE: Brawl and Sm4sh. At least this time we don't have to deal with the seemingly-endless wait (the Sm4sh era was especially awful due to the wait for DLC in addition to the game itself).

EDIT: that third option is an experience I'm fearing K. Rool fans (myself included) may have to endure again as well.

 

[IanTheGamer]

I’m gonna be honest here and say I’m still salty about Krystal being in Ultimate as an Assist Trophy. I’m still trying to wrap my mind around why the decision was made to make Krystal an AT in the first place and not a playable fighter. I feel like Sakurai dropped the ball on newcomers this time round(I’m not saying a playable Ridley is a bad thing mind you). It just feels like Sakurai gave into “Fan Demand” at the beginning development stages of Ultimate and said “ “F” it let’s just bring back all the fighters from the previous games that were cut then add Inklings, Daisy, & Ridley and lets call it day. Also let’s make eleven new ATs for the game and make sure Krystal is one of them.”. I’m not saying this what happened, but I feel as though it went down in similar fashion to this. Nonetheless, I’ll take her current status as an Assist Trophy as another small victory on her path to the “Major Leagues” of Super Smash Bros. known as “Playable Fighter Status”.

Also I came across this while surfing the internet for anymore juicy information on SSB Ultimate. I’m taking it with a “grain of salt” as of right now considering how silly it is, but you’ll never what will happen. “A small ripple can gain momentum and build a current that insurmountable.”

Dude I doubt that will work, Sakurai doesn't listen to petitions normally, but eh, it's worth a shot, I suppose.

 

[ArcaneKitsune]

Dude I doubt that will work, Sakurai doesn't listen to petitions normally, but eh, it's worth a shot, I suppose.

You’re probably right, but it doesn’t stop them from trying. I myself have not signed it yet as I don’t see anything happening in response to said petitions.

 

[jordansweeto]

I was watching over some of the Krystal footage they showed off in the Treehouse and correct me if I'm wrong but does Krystal perform an air dodge at 21:54? It doesn't look like her typical air attack (you can see it best if you show the speed of the video down)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpjFpt-7k_Y&t=1305s

Just thought it was a little odd and worth pointing out. If it is an air dodge would this be the first time an Assist Trophy has ever had this ability?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I was watching over some of the Krystal footage they showed off in the Treehouse and correct me if I'm wrong but does Krystal perform an air dodge at 21:54? It doesn't look like her typical air attack (you can see it best if you show the speed of the video down)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpjFpt-7k_Y&t=1305s

Just thought it was a little odd and worth pointing out. If it is an air dodge would this be the first time an Assist Trophy has ever had this ability?

oh wow, that does seem to be an air dodge. That's probably just the way the new assists behave, like I imagine knuckles will do the same. Still though it's crazy she really looks like a playable character, I wonder if that was ever something in the works with how much detail this has. Either way she looks cool, isn't this the first time we've ever actually seen her using her staff too?

 

[IanTheGamer]

oh wow, that does seem to be an air dodge. That's probably just the way the new assists behave, like I imagine knuckles will do the same. Still though it's crazy she really looks like a playable character, I wonder if that was ever something in the works with how much detail this has. Either way she looks cool, isn't this the first time we've ever actually seen her using her staff too?

My theory was that Krystal was planned to be playable but was made into an AT midway through development due to resource and time limitations

 

[StormC]

Although it is a precedent, it is also an exception. An outlier to the rule. Little Mac is the only character that has received that treatment thus far (to my knowledge). I'm going to need something a little more concrete than that. Is having her as an Assist Trophy good in the short term? Yes. Krystal will get a little more popularity this way and we actually get to see her character model. I'm thinking long term, where if she gains enough popularity outside of Smash Bros. in her own franchise to warrant considering her as a character in Smash Bros, will she not be able to be considered for DLC due to her inclusion as an Assist Trophy? I get the impression that the Switch and this iteration are going to last a lot longer than Wii U's.

Don't mistake this for me not wanting Krystal in the game. I bought a Switch, two Pro Controllers, two used pairs of Joy-Cons, that are all still in the box brand new. I was waiting on this announcement before I made my final decision on whether to keep it or not. I'm still on the fence, but at least I won't keep it off the false hope Krystal will make it in down the line.

Charizard was originally a Pokeball Pokemon.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Wow, not going to lie, but the Krystal AT looks great. Ice Blast and close-quarters attacks with the Staff. Honestly, the fact that she uses the staff in her attacks is my biggest takeaway from this. Really shows that they've listened to us, and I really don't think she would've made it in as an AT at all if it weren't for the community behind her.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

Well if all the past fighters and stages return, then maybe all the previous Assist Trophies could return? And if we have all previous Assist Trophies, maybe we could see both a playable Little Mac and an AT Mac. And if Little Mac becomes both a playable character and an Assist Trophy in the same game, there could be hope for Krystal, right? And Dedede was floating in the background of the Dream Land 64 stage even in the Wii U version where he was playable. We don't have to give up hope yet.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Well if all the past fighters and stages return, then maybe all the previous Assist Trophies could return? And if we have all previous Assist Trophies, maybe we could see both a playable Little Mac and an AT Mac. And if Little Mac becomes both a playable character and an Assist Trophy in the same game, there could be hope for Krystal, right? And Dedede was floating in the background of the Dream Land 64 stage even in the Wii U version where he was playable. We don't have to give up hope yet.

Yeah, I'm not trying to relive the ridley trauma, I think it's best we let it go and be glad she got more than a trophy. By this point I'm just hoping she shows up in the next star fox game, I'm guessing grand prix was fake then at least though so thank god for that.

There could be hope for DLC but that'll likely depend on her inclusion in the next star fox tbh

 

[PF9]

As I said earlier, Brawl was probably her best chance to debut as playable. I never was a big fan of Wolf being playable since it meant a second character playing like Fox. I thought Krystal would have been more worthy as a third SF rep in Brawl than Wolf, and unlike Wolf would probably not have been cut from SSB4.

Maybe Sakurai's successor in creating a Smash game will be more kind to Krystal's fans.