Tafokints and Omni Discuss Tensions Between the Melee and Smash 4 Community

With ESAM's inclusion for voting in the Smash Summit 2, tensions have been rising between the Melee and Smash 4 community. While ESAM has made his case to get into Smash Summit 2 here, the issues with the community are still rising. Including recent events where commentators better known for one game or the other have come under fire, it is creating a serious issue. Two respected members of the Smash community, Tafokints and Omni, have both provided their opinions on this matter. We have presented both of these perspectives side by side for viewing and discussion. Give them a watch!

Omni: The Melee Community Rant | Tafo Talks: Are We Alienating Ourselves?

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Both of these community members have very different styles of discussion but share somewhat similar thoughts. What do you, the readers, think? How should the community address these feelings going forward? Start a civil discussion in the comments below and stay tuned to Smashboards for information on future community issues and debates.

 

Also, Munomario777, did you read my most recent reply to you in this thread?

 

Nerf buff complaints happen in every game that can be patched, this is nothing new and really what new gen competitive games will be like. Happens in League/Dota/SF5/smash etc. IT's nothing new to stuff that happens now. If Melee was patchable it would happen there as well. Looking at PRs and other things yeah I do think 4 is the most balanced in terms of results. That or PM but I don't keep up with PM enough to make that judgement call.

Honestly I can't remember a recent release of an FGC game til 08' came out. There probably were games that came out but for the life of me I can't recall them outside of MvC2, SF3 and maybe guilty gear?

So maybe that was a dead period til SF4 and other games started to rise up and hit it big again. I don't think the play the latest game mentality was at fault with this at all, when frankly I can't recall anything being big during that period. FGC is the biggest right now if anything.

I agree some of the love may not be rooted in the mechanics entirely, for me it certainly is and I know others who are similar.

The ****ting on Brawl is a lot of people getting into smash now and not really being there. Even if they were and some do now, people change in opinions and thoughts. There is no 180 in design, making a game a bit more aggressive is not embracing, "Let's make it melee"

For all you know it could have no relation to melee at all when shield changes and characters, mostly at the lower end of the tier list, were improved in speed and frame data.

They care how the game plays clearly, even people in other games have issues with games they love like PM people having the millionth L-Canceling debate.

It isn't necessarily true that games that get patches have people aski g for balance changes/bans. Take cs go. It gets updated all the time, and nobody complains about balance issues.

 

It isn't necessarily true that games that get patches have people aski g for balance changes/bans. Take cs go. It gets updated all the time, and nobody complains about balance issues.

You will still see it in lots of online communities even in balanced games because you can complain about something and maybe get results.

Might be less prominent in others but trust me, the League and Dota complaining is far worse than any balance complaints I've heard in smash.

 

THIS. EVERYONE NEEDS THIS KIND OF MIND. I don't get why people argue over this simple thought. Just stay with your community and respect other community. No need to get mad over the fact the other community is almost your level.

Yeah... It could be losing spots in events or something. I dunno.

 

There are a lot of smart comments and a lot of really dumb ones. I don't feel like going through all of them because that would make this post huge and likely not read (it is already 4 pages in), but I'll say this:

Pretending ESAM is anything less than a top 10 Samus is absurd (I'd have to go through the list again, but HugS, Plup, Duck, and... Westballz [ : ^ ) actually there may be a European Samus, I dunno] are the only 4 players I can think of who definitely have a better Samus, so he could even be top 5?)

ESAM has beaten Armada in PM with his Samus, so he definitely has an understand of how high-level Smash works, and he is top 100 for a reason. If we are trying to send only the absolute best players, then no, ESAM should not go (Duck would be better for a Samus rep of course), but we're trying to send people who will generate some hype and be cool to watch. ESAM has very crisp missile cancels and while I normally just watch vods of major Melee events, I would try to make time to stream the event if ESAM was in it, and I have heard some Smash 4 players say they'd consider tuning in to watch ESAM.

If the point of the ballot is to maximize viewership, unless people boycott because ESAM gets in (which would be rather absurd), he is in probably a better choice than the rest of the candidates, even if he is not quite as good at Melee (and if he grinds, who knows where he'll be when the event happens...?)

 

There are a lot of smart comments and a lot of really dumb ones. I don't feel like going through all of them because that would make this post huge and likely not read (it is already 4 pages in), but I'll say this:

Pretending ESAM is anything less than a top 10 Samus is absurd (I'd have to go through the list again, but HugS, Plup, Duck, and... Westballz [ : ^ ) actually there may be a European Samus, I dunno] are the only 4 players I can think of who definitely have a better Samus, so he could even be top 5?)

ESAM has beaten Armada in PM with his Samus, so he definitely has an understand of how high-level Smash works, and he is top 100 for a reason. If we are trying to send only the absolute best players, then no, ESAM should not go (Duck would be better for a Samus rep of course), but we're trying to send people who will generate some hype and be cool to watch. ESAM has very crisp missile cancels and while I normally just watch vods of major Melee events, I would try to make time to stream the event if ESAM was in it, and I have heard some Smash 4 players say they'd consider tuning in to watch ESAM.

If the point of the ballot is to maximize viewership, unless people boycott because ESAM gets in (which would be rather absurd), he is in probably a better choice than the rest of the candidates, even if he is not quite as good at Melee (and if he grinds, who knows where he'll be when the event happens...?)

I only worry that seeing ESAM lose could turn ESAM fans off the game.

 

All I see is MELEE COMMUNITY IS FULL OF ELITISTS etc. when in actuality everyone is chill and you're letting internet trolls get to you. We criticize esam, we don't hate him. People did give tk a lot of crap for his commentary, but most of it came from internet trolls living under a bridge. I personally hate smash4. Like I'd rather play brawl on half speed all items on hanenbow. It feels off, clunky, and the game is inherently defensive. In melee it's fast, but a variety of playstyles work. I like 64 because it's fairly similar to melee, and the same(for the most part) with pm.

 

All I see is MELEE COMMUNITY IS FULL OF ELITISTS etc. when in actuality everyone is chill and you're letting internet trolls get to you. We criticize esam, we don't hate him. People did give tk a lot of crap for his commentary, but most of it came from internet trolls living under a bridge. I personally hate smash4. Like I'd rather play brawl on half speed all items on hanenbow. It feels off, clunky, and the game is inherently defensive. In melee it's fast, but a variety of playstyles work. I like 64 because it's fairly similar to melee, and the same(for the most part) with pm.

BUT MELEE IS LITERALLY THE MOST TOXIC GAMING COMMUNITY EVER DON'T YOU KNOW

 

I only worry that seeing ESAM lose could turn ESAM fans off the game.

That's actually a very valid concern, but given the way people have reacted to him being potentially allowed, I think some people would be aware he's no favorite going in.

And given his recent performances, we're kinda used to it... : ^ ) ()

 

Everyone knows people who play trash4 can't be good at melee. Look at M2K

 

I used to play so much sm4sh. But, after I started playing melee, I couldn't go back. I don't hate sm4sh, and I don't hate the community. Why can't we just play the games we like and leave the other ones alone?

 

All I need to know is by comparing the titles.

THE MELEE COMMUNITY RANT vs Tafo Talks: Are we Alienating Ourselves?

The clickbait should give you all you need to know, my dudes.

 

You are one of the few reasonable people in this thread
You should just know, it's really never too late to learn Melee!

Considering how little time I find to train Sm4sh... it is safe to say I would never get the hang of melee.

 

PM is more balanced, better graphics, etc. and it is more similar to Melee than 4 and Brawl, but I'd argue it's still slower than Melee. Also, PM has been dealt a blow by the fact that it exists in a legal gray area.

How is it slower than Melee? I only ever played Falco and Fox on PM, but they felt exactly the same as in Melee to me, aside from the obvious character changes.

 

How is it slower than Melee? I only ever played Falco and Fox on PM, but they felt exactly the same as in Melee to me, aside from the obvious character changes.

Idk, It feels pretty different to me. Granted I havent played that much PM, but enough to get a feel for it (and I've played hundreds of hours of Melee).

 

All I need to know is by comparing the titles.

THE MELEE COMMUNITY RANT vs Tafo Talks: Are we Alienating Ourselves?

The clickbait should give you all you need to know, my dudes.

Having seen both videos, I can confirm that the titles are accurate representations of how mature the videos are. Omni as usual spreading unneeded hate.

 

Idk, It feels pretty different to me. Granted I havent played that much PM, but enough to get a feel for it (and I've played hundreds of hours of Melee).

I think it's still as fast, but some inputs are a bit easier, which isn't a good or bad thing.

 

I guess any criticism is considered hate now.

that already shows thatyou didn't get the points addressed in the video

and is VERY comparable to the console wars with the xbox fanboys vs literally, everything else with the xbox side being comparable to the melee's (toxic-half) group, and the other communities being comparable to anything else.

critisism is ok, but crap like "EFF YOU, you don't play only melee u little scrub m8" sh*T going on in the community needs to end, if it doesn't, the smash community as a whole will only get more and more divided and the toxicity will continue

 

and with my distaste for the negative wars that go on in some communities, makes me hope and wish that said communities collapse due to their own internal wars...

 

and with my distaste for the negative wars that go on in some communities, makes me hope and wish that said communities collapse due to their own internal wars...
View attachment 103055 View attachment 103056

LOOOOL. So I disagree with what you are saying, but I found something really funny in the picture you posted. It says 9001 oz

 

LOOOOL. So I disagree with what you are saying, but I found something really funny in the picture you posted. It says 9001 oz

lol, i didn't notice the 9001 in the pic, that makes the pic 1000x better

 

Both communities are at fault, the melee community didn't start anything when brawl came out. When brawl came out they started calling the game outdated and that they need to switch over. Also with evo, melee was in it before brawl even came out, and smash 4 was in it because melee did well. People are mad about esam going to smash summit because only 6 spots are available for voting and the person who is most deserving should go. Esam going is taking the spot from someone who wants to expand in melee and ESam doesn't want to expand in melee, he wants to expand in smash 4. Not to mention hes not as good as anyone else entering so he's probably going to go 2-0.

The melee community says tr4sh, but they say it just as much as smash 4 players say that melee players cheat and use glitches and use terminologies like wave-cheating and fun-cancelling.

Also the smash 4 community is toxic to their own communites, They complain a lot like when they complained about diddy and luigi and zss and rosaline and shiek and now bayanetta, they complained about their entire top tier list instead of using a top tier character and try to get nintendo to try to get a ban. You don't see the melee community complaining about fox being op. The smash 4 community Also can never agree on anything, they can't decide custom on or off, mii or no mii, 2 player team or 4 player team, 2 stock or 3 stock.

 

THIS. EVERYONE NEEDS THIS KIND OF MIND. I don't get why people argue over this simple thought. Just stay with your community and respect other community. No need to get mad over the fact the other community is almost your level.

THIS. EVERYONE NEEDS THIS KIND OF MIND. I don't get why people argue over this simple thought. Just stay with your community and respect other community. No need to get mad over the fact the other community is almost your level.

lmao I love how you say that after public shaming me at a local for playing melee.

****ing hypocrite